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[World of Darkness] Paradox buys White Wolf - Maybe not dead

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  • ArchonexArchonex No hard feelings, right? Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Fortunately, there's been no indication that they're taking the "Okay you're naked with <other player> please describe to me how you fuck." route thus far.


    I think it's a bit early to decry the game as being an abomination to the franchise. I mean, all we have to go on are some notes some guy jotted down and a CGI trailer.

    Archonex on
  • DelphinidaesDelphinidaes FFXIV: Delphi Kisaragi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Archonex wrote: »
    Fortunately, there's been no indication that they're taking the "Okay you're naked with <other player> please describe to me how you fuck." route thus far.


    I think it's a bit early to decry the game as being an abomination to the franchise. I mean, all we have to go on are some notes some guy jotted down and a CGI trailer.

    The first thing you learn about games is that it is NEVER too early to decry a game as an abomination on the franchise.

    A fair amount of people like to take the "I will believe this game sucks and if it doesn't I will be happy, if it does then it will have achieved my expectations" approach to game anticipation.

    Delphinidaes on
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  • ArchonexArchonex No hard feelings, right? Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I just don't see where the complaints are coming from.


    The notes sound like they're taking the backstory as to how the vamp side of things work in the WoD tabletop game and are trying to directly transfer it to a video game. Which sounds fucking fantastic if they manage to pull it off. It's like a modern MUD with territory control and social aspects, rather then the themepark games that have been populating the genre for years, now.

    Ironically, WoD is one of the few tabletop games where this is actually feasibly doable. Played right, it's less a hack and slash game, and more a cerebral, social game, with bits of incredibly gory/horrific violence mixed in when things reach the breaking point.


    Hell, I could probably get a few months fun out of carving out my own little kingdom like the vamps in Bloodlines seem to be busy doing.



    Being negative by default can easily generate an echo chamber effect, where everyone just bitches about the game, no matter what happens. I say review the game by it's merits as they come to light, rather then assuming it will blow ass and give orphan children cancer. But that's just my opinion.

    Archonex on
  • FiarynFiaryn Omnicidal Madman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Archonex wrote: »
    Fortunately, there's been no indication that they're taking the "Okay you're naked with <other player> please describe to me how you fuck." route thus far.

    Okay, consider for a moment that the other two MMORPGs touted for their ability to customize the players appearance to a vast degree (City of Heroes/Villains and Champions Online) are also festering hives of cyber sex and yiffing. And those are games that have no real stated objective of catering to roleplay or social elements!

    Do you honestly and truly think that this game isn't going to attract that crowd in droves?

    Fiaryn on
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  • ArchonexArchonex No hard feelings, right? Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Fiaryn wrote: »
    Archonex wrote: »
    Fortunately, there's been no indication that they're taking the "Okay you're naked with <other player> please describe to me how you fuck." route thus far.

    Okay, consider for a moment that the other two MMORPGs touted for their ability to customize the players appearance to a vast degree (City of Heroes/Villains and Champions Online) are also festering hives of cyber sex and yiffing. And those are games that have no real stated objective of catering to roleplay or social elements!

    Do you honestly and truly think that this game isn't going to attract that crowd in droves?

    Yeah, it probably will. But both City of Heroes and Champions Online have those parts of the population contained to one or two out of the way zones. It's not like they're a festering plague on the game (Well, at least, not a visible one.).


    Hell, given the apparent popularity of the Virtue server, i'd say that the RPers are probably one of the big reasons why CoH is still going strong and is still putting out regular content updates. NCSoft has to be pulling in a crapton of money from all the subscriptions.

    Archonex on
  • DelphinidaesDelphinidaes FFXIV: Delphi Kisaragi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Archonex wrote: »
    I just don't see where the complaints are coming from.


    The notes sound like they're taking the backstory as to how the vamp side of things work in the WoD tabletop game and are trying to directly transfer it to a video game. Which sounds fucking fantastic if they manage to pull it off. It's like a modern MUD with territory control and social aspects, rather then the themepark games that have been populating the genre for years, now.

    Ironically, WoD is one of the few tabletop games where this is actually feasibly doable. Played right, it's less a hack and slash game, and more a cerebral, social game, with bits of incredibly gory/horrific violence mixed in when things reach the breaking point.


    Hell, I could probably get a few months fun out of carving out my own little kingdom like the vamps in Bloodlines seem to be busy doing.



    Being negative by default can easily generate an echo chamber effect, where everyone just bitches about the game, no matter what happens. I say review the game by it's merits as they come to light, rather then assuming it will blow ass and give orphan children cancer. But that's just my opinion.

    I agree with you and take a more optimistic approach to games on the horizon. Just saying that there are two sides of the coin.

    One side will sing praises for the game regardless of how it turns out. The other will crap all over it regardless of how it turns out.

    There is that thin line around the coin though....it's small but it's a happy place.

    Delphinidaes on
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  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    It sounds like they're ripping the pvp/territory control system from EvE and promising a whole bunch of other stuff on top of that.

    So...iterating on what they have and making wild promises about all the other stuff their game will have. That sounds like every mmo ever developed.

    Couple things,

    Casual play + perma death....I don't see how that's going to work.


    -They confirmed that the game will not be combat intensive (unless you choose as such). Knowing, influencing the correct people is arguable more important than being the biggest brawler.

    PvP game with factions and territory/resource control? How is that not going to end up being combat intensive? Perma-death might limit this (to throw away characters doing all the fighting).


    -They will not be catering to immaturity in the game, however, they would like to see these types of offenses policed by players, rather than in-game mechanics.

    I seem to remember certain designers of UO wishing the same thing but there was no incentive for players to police bad behavior in game. Not unless you liked repeatedly bashing your head against a brick wall. Maybe CCP has a game design/incentive in mind to make it happen though. I remain skeptical.

    -They confirmed that the game will definitely contain gay clubs. This is an excellent angle to cater to the gay and lesbian audience.

    This was a stupid statement to make. If you want to cater to people interested in video games(gay or not) make a good game.

    Poketpixie on
  • FiarynFiaryn Omnicidal Madman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Archonex wrote: »
    Fiaryn wrote: »
    Archonex wrote: »
    Fortunately, there's been no indication that they're taking the "Okay you're naked with <other player> please describe to me how you fuck." route thus far.

    Okay, consider for a moment that the other two MMORPGs touted for their ability to customize the players appearance to a vast degree (City of Heroes/Villains and Champions Online) are also festering hives of cyber sex and yiffing. And those are games that have no real stated objective of catering to roleplay or social elements!

    Do you honestly and truly think that this game isn't going to attract that crowd in droves?

    Yeah, it probably will. But both City of Heroes and Champions Online have those parts of the population contained to one or two out of the way zones. It's not like they're a festering plague on the game (Well, at least, not a visible one.).


    Hell, given the apparent popularity of the Virtue server, i'd say that the RPers are probably one of the big reasons why CoH is still going strong and is still putting out regular content updates. NCSoft has to be pulling in a crapton of money from all the subscriptions.

    I agree on both points. But to the former issue, that's because social elements are not a core facet of CoX. If it does end up being a focus of World of Darkness, the problem will most likely be more pronounced.

    Fiaryn on
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  • ArchonexArchonex No hard feelings, right? Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Just some general ideas, but there's a few ways to allow for casual/permadeath play.


    You can set a cut-off line where someone enters into a permadeathable state. If they voluntarily go past it while progressing their character, they risk death.

    How they do that is the tricky part, however. Doing something like becoming a vamp making you permadeathable might be one way, and would encourage vampire characters to be the sneaky assholes the canon has them being if IDing a vampire isn't easy, but it might piss off a good portion of the community who are just there to play their LARP character.

    Maybe they could have it so that elder ranked vampires are perma-deathable.

    An elder is hellaciously powerful, so there has so to be some sort of downside to that power, otherwise, everyone will eventually be able to walk around the streets of the city/where-ever the fuck they are with impunity, popping large crowds of people like pimples by boiling their blood.

    That would force them to take a much more social role. Managing their territory, sending out new vamp players to handle affairs, and only showing up at the really serious fights.


    But then, this is all theory-crafting, so it's rather pointless.

    Archonex on
  • FiarynFiaryn Omnicidal Madman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I honestly doubt Perma-Death is going to happen at all. More likely there'll be some sort of clone-back up function from EVE lored away as "Well you just went into torpor" and if you lack TORPORBUX then you are weakened and lose stat points or something.

    Fiaryn on
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  • ArchonexArchonex No hard feelings, right? Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Fiaryn wrote: »
    I honestly doubt Perma-Death is going to happen at all. More likely there'll be some sort of clone-back up function from EVE lored away as "Well you just went into torpor" and if you lack TORPORBUX then you are weakened and lose a Discipline dot or something.

    Yeah, in all honesty I figure that too. Didn't they mention something about torpor and cloning your character in those notes?


    Edit: Yes they did.
    Notes wrote:
    Torpor as a clone-type mechanic as a backup.

    Archonex on
  • pardzhpardzh Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah I don't necessarily understand the whole gay clubs thing.

    WoD is so niche that I doubt any gay people that like it would be all, "DAMN, NO GAY CLUBS? I SURE LOVE THE WORLD OF DARKNESS BUT THAT'S JUST UNACCEPTABLE." Or the other scenario, gay people that aren't interested in Vampire all of the sudden playing a game they don't really have an interest in just to... be digitally gay as well?

    In the end it seems like you're just making it really easy for people to be homophobic, griefing assholes.

    pardzh on
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  • Caveman PawsCaveman Paws Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    pardzh wrote: »
    Yeah I don't necessarily understand the whole gay clubs thing.

    WoD is so niche that I doubt any gay people that like it would be all, "DAMN, NO GAY CLUBS? I SURE LOVE THE WORLD OF DARKNESS BUT THAT'S JUST UNACCEPTABLE." Or the other scenario, gay people that aren't interested in Vampire all of the sudden playing a game they don't really have an interest in just to... be digitally gay as well?

    In the end it seems like you're just making it really easy for people to be homophobic, griefing assholes.

    I wonder if maybe they did some polls and found a higher than average % of homosexual WW fans. Otherwise I am not sure why the "gay club" point was brought up like it was. Or am I so secretly homophobic that I am taking the mention of gay clubs in this mmo as a much bigger deal than it actually is? Or do I just over think every little thing about this game based on the less than a page worth of info we have on it? :)

    Anyway, I think we all know by now via personal experience that any MMO will attract "those people" (whoever you want that to refer to works) and a WoD MMO is going to attract "those people" in droves. The result will be the same as it is elsewhere: We will play over here while they play over there in private rooms. Once in a while the two groups interact, screensaves/vids are made and hilarity/ew grossness ensues. Lather,rinse,repeat.

    Caveman Paws on
  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    The only reason they would have to make that statement is some misguided attempt to try and broaden their market appeal.

    What are they going to add next? A pool area to try to get lifeguards to play? Maybe they can add garbage trucks so the sanitation workers will feel at home too. Don't forget the poor people! This game will probably have some slum areas so they should be interested, you know, because it has slums.

    It's a ridiculous selling point that has nothing to do with the game. They'd be better served trying to hook the Twilight fans into playing(ugh..just don't add sparklies please).

    Poketpixie on
  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I hope that, like everyone is suspecting, that isn't a feature list, because it sounds like they'll be trying to do way too much in fields that have failed every time they've happened before.. Doesn't instill me in confidence.

    And yes, we all know how shitty and terrible wow is with it's repetitive quests. Can we move on please instead of bringing that up like it means something.

    WoW has repetitive quests because they provide enough framework to give players small goals to accomplish, without having them just mindlessly farm.

    EDIT: I mean, yes they have downsides, but I'm getting tired of developers complaining about it. Find a successful alternative before you badmouth it, otherwise you just look petty.

    Undead Scottsman on
  • BasilBasil Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Nein. We will be hammering that point into the ground until we accidentally start a land war in asia.

    Basil on
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  • ComahawkComahawk Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I think you guys are reading too far into the Gay/Lesbian community thing, from the sounds of it, it was brought up and CCP/WW took note of that. I can't think of any other MMO that caters to that group, so it may actually work out of the game in the end.

    And really, if you want to use the argument of "They will just get gay bashed!", consider that there is already that risk in the real world with them coming out. If they don't want to identify themselves as homosexuals, they likely will not, otherwise they will just put up with other people's stupidity as they usually have to. On top of that, I'm fairly certain they will just ignore anyone who wants to be an idiot and harass them about their sexual preference.

    Comahawk on
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    edited September 2010
    White Wolf never shied away from homosexual themes. Vampires in general are very androgenous at times.

    So the dev house saying that they aren't going to whitewash that part of the game and world out is an interesting footnote and worth mentioning.

    syndalis on
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  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I look at it as going

    "Instead of censoring any reference to alternative sexuality, we'll openly support GLBT stuff even going as far to have gay/lesbian bars"

    Undead Scottsman on
  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I look at it as going

    "Instead of censoring any reference to alternative sexuality, we'll openly support GLBT stuff even going as far to have gay/lesbian bars"

    Which is cool...why didn't they just say that though? /shrug

    Anyway, I'm interested in hearing more about how they're going to pull off some of the other stuff they've mentioned.

    Poketpixie on
  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    syndalis wrote: »
    White Wolf never shied away from homosexual themes. Vampires in general are very androgenous at times.

    So the dev house saying that they aren't going to whitewash that part of the game and world out is an interesting footnote and worth mentioning.

    As a gay player who is interested in the game, I very much appreciate that they deliberately mentioned GLBT players and that we aren't being left out. Because frankly, other than the occasional nerd-bait pseudo-lesbian character we are left out as a matter of course.

    If it bothers people that we were mentioned, too fucking bad.

    Regina Fong on
  • ComahawkComahawk Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Poketpixie wrote: »
    I look at it as going

    "Instead of censoring any reference to alternative sexuality, we'll openly support GLBT stuff even going as far to have gay/lesbian bars"

    Which is cool...why didn't they just say that though? /shrug

    Anyway, I'm interested in hearing more about how they're going to pull off some of the other stuff they've mentioned.

    They didn't really say anything, besides that the game will have gay and lesbian clubs. People are reading into this too much, and taking JA's notes as confirmed features. I believe it was already mentioned that it was more of a collection of what was brought up during the panel.

    Comahawk on
  • MrVyngaardMrVyngaard Live From New Etoile Straight Outta SosariaRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Poketpixie wrote: »
    PvP game with factions and territory/resource control? How is that not going to end up being combat intensive? Perma-death might limit this (to throw away characters doing all the fighting).

    Could have an element of social/financial control of zones. I don't need to personally go to your haven and beat your face in with Potence 5; I just need a condemnation notice from the city for the building you're sleeping in during the day. The wrecking/excavation crew(all ghouled) with the help of sunlight might take care of the rest.

    The above wouldn't necessarily be impossible in a game with sufficiently social avenues to accquiring and holding power. Just HOW they would implement such a thing I'm not certain, but I'm willing to bet CCP might be able to pull it off.

    MrVyngaard on
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  • PoketpixiePoketpixie Siege Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    syndalis wrote: »
    White Wolf never shied away from homosexual themes. Vampires in general are very androgenous at times.

    So the dev house saying that they aren't going to whitewash that part of the game and world out is an interesting footnote and worth mentioning.

    As a gay player who is interested in the game, I very much appreciate that they deliberately mentioned GLBT players and that we aren't being left out. Because frankly, other than the occasional nerd-bait pseudo-lesbian character we are left out as a matter of course.

    If it bothers people that we were mentioned, too fucking bad.

    I apologize if I came across as being overly hostile cause I'm not. I just thought it was a strange selling point for a video game is all. Anyways...droppin' it.

    Poketpixie on
  • Edith_Bagot-DixEdith_Bagot-Dix Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    If you are going to have a game where nightclubs (The Rack, to use the parlance) play as huge a role as they do in the average Vampire game, then having LGBTQ nightclubs should be par for the course. A lot of the Vampire games I've played have taken place almost entirely in nightclubs, or at least had them as a major theme. I would go so far as to say that doing all the clubs well and reaching the right blend of idealization and realism is key. I wouldn't want to spend a game hanging out in an MMO version of most of the nightclubs in my city, but similarly the nightclubs shouldn't be so unrealistic that it makes me wonder if the designer has ever been to one.

    I made the comment about "Hate Crimes Online" because I wouldn't want to see a situation where a group of assholes decides they're going to target people playing gay characters or patronizing gay clubs, but at the same time acknowledge that, unfortunately it probably will happen and it's tough to deal with well. Simply dealing with the fact that, yes, gay people exist and have clubs they sometimes like to go to in mature and respectful way would be a huge step forward from how a lot of the gaming industry ("OMG, you're from FORT GAY?!?! BANNED!") has behaved.

    Edith_Bagot-Dix on


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  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Poketpixie wrote: »
    syndalis wrote: »
    White Wolf never shied away from homosexual themes. Vampires in general are very androgenous at times.

    So the dev house saying that they aren't going to whitewash that part of the game and world out is an interesting footnote and worth mentioning.

    As a gay player who is interested in the game, I very much appreciate that they deliberately mentioned GLBT players and that we aren't being left out. Because frankly, other than the occasional nerd-bait pseudo-lesbian character we are left out as a matter of course.

    If it bothers people that we were mentioned, too fucking bad.

    I apologize if I came across as being overly hostile cause I'm not. I just thought it was a strange selling point for a video game is all. Anyways...droppin' it.

    Eh, no harm done. Might seem like a strange selling point to you, but I'm betting they have some marketing folks who either have some experience targeting gay consumers, or have at least done their homework on the subject, because gay consumers really do respond to being directly marketed to.

    Regina Fong on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Don't Requiem's good parts consist of the mechanics?


    And I hope Achilli's wish list comes to fruition, though that's a lot to hope for.
    historical Masquerade characters

    :D

    Yay Beckett.

    cj iwakura on
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  • Caveman PawsCaveman Paws Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Incentive for policing "problem" players: much like the actual game, you are not permitted to destroy other vampires unless delegated to by the Prince of the city. I have no clue how this would be implemented but if someone goes on a griefing rampage (breaks the traditions) then they are targeted for staking/destruction/imprisonment/etc.

    Rewards for hunting down and bringing in the target alive/staked.

    Caveman Paws on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    If a PC can become a Prince, he better become hard as hell to kill, or else there'll be coups every hour.

    cj iwakura on
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  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Generally the prince has the support of the Primogen council, as well as the Sheriff, Keeper and so forth. So anyone gunning for the Prince who hasn't lined up all the appropriate support in advance is suicidal.

    And if someone is able to line up all the appropriate support, and those people did not immediately turn around and sell him out to the Prince/Sheriff the instant he was out of earshot, then the Prince was done anyway.

    I don't know how you make that work mechanically in an MMO, but that's how it should work in theory.

    -edit-

    Also, my memory is fuzzy so forgive me if I am remembering wrong, but doesn't everyone take a drink when presented to the Prince for the first time? It's difficult (though obviously not impossible) to actively plot against someone you're on step one with. That should be easy enough to work out mechanically, for each step bound you get penalties for attacking (other than in self defense) the person, and at step three you simply can't initiate combat with that person.

    Regina Fong on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah, in any good LARP(much like the setting), a Prince without the proper support will be gone and forgotten in a fortnight. If the MMO can make that possible, more power to them.


    Much like the source material, it's better if that role ISN'T handled by NPCs.

    cj iwakura on
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  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I played a Prince in a LARP for a decent while, I wouldn't have been bitter about being taken out by a Kindred plot, but of course I was removed by the people playing werewolves, who were inexplicably hanging out around a bunch of vampires. I think they had like, one Primogen in their pocket. But of course they're werewolves so no one can actually do anything when they decide to run the show.

    Regina Fong on
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Bears The Name FreedomRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Highest I ever got was Malkavian Primogen.


    Character died two hours later. :P

    cj iwakura on
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  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    cj iwakura wrote: »
    Highest I ever got was Malkavian Primogen.


    Character died two hours later. :P

    I didn't actually get killed, I just got told by the Ventrue Primogen that i was no longer Prince, and she happened to have the werewolf pack with her when I was informed of this. I was furious, both in and out of character, and the Ventrue player realized this so our characters went behind closed doors to discuss things, and one of the werewolf players promptly went into the umbra, walked through the door, and then popped out of the umbra (God mode, I swear to God). At that point even the Ventrue chick was pretty irate, and I bowed out of the game taking several other players with me. It was like, two years before I was on speaking terms with the head storyteller again, and I was never again on speaking terms with the storyteller who was in charge of the werewolves.

    Regina Fong on
  • ComahawkComahawk Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I had a Rank 3 Get of Fenris Ahroun... I made the character when I was a teenager, so he came off as whiny and self absorbed, that gradually shifted to self confident and arrogant.

    Which when I finally realized how to properly run a character (I loved combat, what can I say?), I decided to keep going with that idea, and he was really fun to run. Eventually turned into a hardened tool of death, who was bitter and angry all of the time and in general was unpleasant to be around, especially for normal people, with a Rage of 8.

    My shining moment was when we partially ran the apocalypse storyline, within three rounds he dropped 3 or 4 BSDs, I think my ST got a little annoyed by that.

    Comahawk on
  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I don't have anything against werewolf games, I just hate it when player character werewolves are mixed into a vampire game. It's stupid. My experiences with it are the reason I'm so happy this game is going to be vampire only.

    Regina Fong on
  • ComahawkComahawk Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I don't have anything against werewolf games, I just hate it when player character werewolves are mixed into a vampire game. It's stupid. My experiences with it are the reason I'm so happy this game is going to be vampire only.

    The previously mentioned character hated vampires, his mentor having been killed by an elder Tzimisce. He knew about their politics a bit better than most (through RP), but hated them none-the-less. At one point he did attempt to take out a vampire PC, a Ventrue, but promptly got told to sleep. Woke up later feeling like an idiot.

    But yeah, for the most part, Werewolves in Vampire games do not mix. IRC games often had the two interact, but in general a good ST would not let it get too mixed, otherwise you end up with situations like yours.

    Comahawk on
  • Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Things were actually fairly decent until the fateful day the storytellers got together and decided to lift the cap on the number of mage and werewolf players in game.

    And by decent, I mean that there was an actual vampire game. How the mages and werewolves (in particular) justified their presence to themselves from a roleplaying standpoint I have no fucking clue.

    My Changeling LARP was so much better than any of the vampire LARPs I played in anyway. When you stick to one character type you end up with a much more focused storyline, and it becomes far easier to entertain all the players.

    Regina Fong on
  • Chases Street DemonsChases Street Demons Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I don't have anything against werewolf games, I just hate it when player character werewolves are mixed into a vampire game. It's stupid. My experiences with it are the reason I'm so happy this game is going to be vampire only.

    It's very difficult to find a way to legitmately merge a OWoD Werewolf PC with a Vampire PC group unless the Werewolf's got some excellent backstory. Being a BSD is a good start in most cases but that Wyrm thing tends to make them really unstable - bad from a meta standpoint. Most of the tribes just don't have a way to play nice with the vamps.

    It actually felt easier in the Dark Ages setting, since more of the world was in flux and certain groups had much more sway, or some of the tribes hadn't developed in a certain direction.

    I can see why they chose not to try and mix and match in the basic setting here, but my inner Galliard is weeping. :)

    Chases Street Demons on
    "Sometimes things aren't complicated," I said. "You just have to be willing to accept the absolute corruption of everybody involved."

  • Caveman PawsCaveman Paws Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Ya social/political didn't mix well in W:tA. I had a Silver Fang Ahroun who took power over the tribe but since I think most of the players were also teenagers it was just a horrible, repetative (and poorly rationalized) series of scenes until I stepped down.

    So, yeah, no wolves allowed = yay.

    Caveman Paws on
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