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[DnD 4E Discussion] Staff Fighter and Pyromancer essentials builds released on time!

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Posts

  • DenadaDenada Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I've always interpreted it as starting with two free infusions, then recharging them with surges during short rests. I never even thought of the alternate interpretation during all the times I read the class description.

    Denada on
  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Goes back to what I asked Squints, "How do you create a healing infusion". We know healing surges recharge them, but the text doesn't say it needs healing surges to create them and by RAW that means they are free. The debate moves to the always fun area of RAI shortly after that.

    Aegeri on
    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Denada wrote: »
    I've always interpreted it as starting with two free infusions, then recharging them with surges during short rests. I never even thought of the alternate interpretation during all the times I read the class description.
    This.

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • SnowdownSnowdown Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Aegof wrote: »
    In Worldship that class is... the artificer. The controller is a hybrid druid|invoker, who, as it happens, had no surges left going into the fight they're in right now. Both strikers are melee fighters and of course the defender needs his surges for not dying.

    Also, not that there's an artificer in my game, but if there were, the "Squishies" are always getting themselves jacked up.......mage and invoker. So they won't have spare surges anyway.

    Back to WorldShip, Thaggok has effectively 12 surges....11 surges, and 1 surge from dwarven armor.

    So, you should be able to take 1 per fight from him or so. to balance out the surges a bit.....spread them out a little, etc.

    Snowdown on
  • ChanusChanus Sugoi! ^_____^Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    smeej wrote: »
    Denada wrote: »
    I've always interpreted it as starting with two free infusions, then recharging them with surges during short rests. I never even thought of the alternate interpretation during all the times I read the class description.
    This.

    Hippies with your "everything should be freeeee, maaaaaan" mentalities!

    :wink:

    Chanus on
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  • SquintsSquints Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    The nice thing about the artificer is that he can use his healing power to give a +1 AC bonus until the end of the encounter, or the target can use a free action to end the bonus and get surge+3 THP.

    Unfortunately, in our campaign, many attacks seem to be against our FORT. I think?

    Squints on
  • AegofAegof Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I've been attacking non-AC defenses with impunity, yeah. I think Will's been my favorite, actually.

    Aegof on
    I'm providing ambience.
  • SquintsSquints Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Keep in mind this is not a referendum on your campaign, Aegof. ;) It's more of a situation where perhaps a different leader class would be more useful. But Tordek is also insane, which helps when other party members are inflicted with insanity.

    Squints on
  • AegofAegof Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    pfft. I set out to make a string of hard encounters. You're here asking for help making Tordek better. I take that as a sign that I did what I set out to do.

    Aegof on
    I'm providing ambience.
  • SnowdownSnowdown Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Aegof wrote: »
    pfft. I set out to make a string of hard encounters. You're here asking for help making Tordek better. I take that as a sign that I did what I set out to do.

    Oh, you definitely made a string of hard encounters. I've been enjoying them quite a bit.

    And we've been pretty messed up after each of them, save 1 I think.

    Snowdown on
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Squints wrote: »
    It would make sense if they were free, it would suck to start every extended rest already down 2 surges. :(
    The thing about the Artificer's heals is that, unlike every other leader healing power, you don't expend the surge during combat. Plus you can "swap" surges around so that the power you recharged with one of the wizard's weedy 8HP surge can heal the fighter 15+ HP...even Lay on Hands will only let you work that the other way.

    Plus there's the aforementioned two completely free heals you get without having anyone expend a surge at all...

    Mr_Rose on
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  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Plus things that increase surge value don't work :(

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    The real strength of the Artificer comes from Resistive Formula (I think... the one that gives oodles of THP) and the Paragon tier feat that lets y ou double the targets of it. That's a potent combo of sweet proactive healing.

    Terrendos on
  • ravensmuseravensmuse Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    So. Last night we almost finished up Slaying Stone.

    I'm...not quite sure how I feel about the adventure. It's supposed to be better, but I guess sitting on the player side of things made me feel differently? In that I guess I don't know where GM was bouncing off of us and where he was running straight from the book.

    Mostly, I didn't really feel challenged. We weren't an optimized party in the least - there's a reason we call ourselves Team Special - but we didn't really seem to hit any problems.

    This was our party:

    Human Swordmage turned Warlord (GM allowed us to switch classes as we got a feel for things)
    Halfling Assassin (my girlfriend; wore a hollowed kobold skull on her head the whole time)
    Elf Ranger
    Half-Giant Warden
    Human Warlord (left three sessions in)
    Shardmind Summoner / Ardent / Barbarian (he kept filling in spots for us)
    Warforged Wizard (whom we nicknamed Megatron)

    We also had a kobold squire named Sketzer that ended up tagging along with us and filling in spots as needed.

    So yeah. We weren't crazy optimized, and none of us - with the exception of my girl - are power gamers.

    Consistantly, we caused our own problems - screwing up stealth rolls, deciding to poke things when we shouldn't, that sort of thing. But never did it feel like "oh shit, we might die in this!" Don't think it was our GM though - it just didn't seem like encounters were really thought out.

    For instance, there's an encounter in the town square where you face off against an orc with a battleaxe. She went down in two rounds because of focus fire - what's the point in making a solo when apparently her AC and NADs are so low? I kept expecting things to jump out of the tents and ruins, but nothing came.

    In contrast, there's an encounter with an ankheg that brought me down only because he got a surprise round and a good couple of hits on the rest of us. That was a nice challenge.

    There's also an encounter with a hobgoblin riding a drake. He was tough, and had a nice multi-mark power and lots of AC and NADs, but I got lucky and crit on my Daily (Lead the Attack; woo!) which opened the door to the rest of the party just wailing on him. The closest he got to killing us was dropping my girl down with a crit - which she was complaining about until she remembered her halfling ability, and we all cheered.

    Did I mention that our poor GM looked really disappointed with the orc and hobgoblin encounters?

    It all wraps up with two skill challenges that are...eh. I don't like 'em. We've hashed it out here. Suffice to say, nothing in this module made me want to use them. They're just too...awkward, for my tastes.

    We're not completely done. There's apparently one last encounter to go, but it was twenty past ten, we needed to get home, and our warden hasn't been here for the last three sessions, so we figured it would
    be nice to allow him to be here on the last day.

    If you're curious to read things in a little more detail, this link will take you to all of the posts I've made about the game on my blog.

    With the game wrapping up next week though, I've volunteered to run something so GM gets to play. I want to do something different, but I'm not sure what I want to do. Many of us are curious for Dark Sun, but I still don't have the DSCG (being a responsible adult sucks sometimes). I'm debating between Spelljammer or Points of Light, but I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to do.

    So along with me bragging about our game and moaning about Slaying Stone, I'm also here to ask for some links to inspirational material. Anyone got any?

    ravensmuse on
    READ MY BLOG - Web Serial Fantasy - Tabletop Gaming Snips & Reviews - Flea Market Hunting
  • SipexSipex Registered User
    edited September 2010
    ravensmuse wrote: »
    So. Last night we almost finished up Slaying Stone.

    I'm...not quite sure how I feel about the adventure. It's supposed to be better, but I guess sitting on the player side of things made me feel differently? In that I guess I don't know where GM was bouncing off of us and where he was running straight from the book.

    Mostly, I didn't really feel challenged. We weren't an optimized party in the least - there's a reason we call ourselves Team Special - but we didn't really seem to hit any problems.

    This was our party:

    Human Swordmage turned Warlord (GM allowed us to switch classes as we got a feel for things)
    Halfling Assassin (my girlfriend; wore a hollowed kobold skull on her head the whole time)
    Elf Ranger
    Half-Giant Warden
    Human Warlord (left three sessions in)
    Shardmind Summoner / Ardent / Barbarian (he kept filling in spots for us)
    Warforged Wizard (whom we nicknamed Megatron)

    We also had a kobold squire named Sketzer that ended up tagging along with us and filling in spots as needed.

    So yeah. We weren't crazy optimized, and none of us - with the exception of my girl - are power gamers.

    Consistantly, we caused our own problems - screwing up stealth rolls, deciding to poke things when we shouldn't, that sort of thing. But never did it feel like "oh shit, we might die in this!" Don't think it was our GM though - it just didn't seem like encounters were really thought out.

    For instance, there's an encounter in the town square where you face off against an orc with a battleaxe. She went down in two rounds because of focus fire - what's the point in making a solo when apparently her AC and NADs are so low? I kept expecting things to jump out of the tents and ruins, but nothing came.

    In contrast, there's an encounter with an ankheg that brought me down only because he got a surprise round and a good couple of hits on the rest of us. That was a nice challenge.

    There's also an encounter with a hobgoblin riding a drake. He was tough, and had a nice multi-mark power and lots of AC and NADs, but I got lucky and crit on my Daily (Lead the Attack; woo!) which opened the door to the rest of the party just wailing on him. The closest he got to killing us was dropping my girl down with a crit - which she was complaining about until she remembered her halfling ability, and we all cheered.

    Did I mention that our poor GM looked really disappointed with the orc and hobgoblin encounters?

    It all wraps up with two skill challenges that are...eh. I don't like 'em. We've hashed it out here. Suffice to say, nothing in this module made me want to use them. They're just too...awkward, for my tastes.

    We're not completely done. There's apparently one last encounter to go, but it was twenty past ten, we needed to get home, and our warden hasn't been here for the last three sessions, so we figured it would
    be nice to allow him to be here on the last day.

    If you're curious to read things in a little more detail, this link will take you to all of the posts I've made about the game on my blog.

    With the game wrapping up next week though, I've volunteered to run something so GM gets to play. I want to do something different, but I'm not sure what I want to do. Many of us are curious for Dark Sun, but I still don't have the DSCG (being a responsible adult sucks sometimes). I'm debating between Spelljammer or Points of Light, but I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to do.

    So along with me bragging about our game and moaning about Slaying Stone, I'm also here to ask for some links to inspirational material. Anyone got any?

    Here are some notable campaign logs which I found inspiring: http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116836

    Sipex on
    Horseshoe wrote:
    I've got good news and bad news about 6th level, That Guy. The good news is that Forbiddance spell allows you to prevent enemies different alignment from entering a consecrated area, which is actually useful! The bad news is that the only other new sixth level spell makes lunch for everybody. Guess which one the party is going to expect you to cast.
  • AegofAegof Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    ravensmuse wrote: »
    With the game wrapping up next week though, I've volunteered to run something so GM gets to play. I want to do something different, but I'm not sure what I want to do. Many of us are curious for Dark Sun, but I still don't have the DSCG (being a responsible adult sucks sometimes). I'm debating between Spelljammer or Points of Light, but I'm not sure exactly what I'm going to do.

    So along with me bragging about our game and moaning about Slaying Stone, I'm also here to ask for some links to inspirational material. Anyone got any?

    This flash animation has a bunch of crazy shit going on. You don't need to understand the context to see that nearly everything that happens can be translated into a set piece encounter or skill challenge.

    Aegof on
    I'm providing ambience.
  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    We should translate the Ravenloft board game to Maptool and have an October Halloween Ravenloft Extravaganza.

    Edit: Exstrahdaganza!

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    ravensmuse:

    It's a little unclear in your description, but it sounds like you had a lot more than 5 players at any one time. Was your DM compensating for that many additional players by adding more monsters into the game/increasing levels to keep the encounter exp budget equivalent? That solo in particular sounds like it was designed as a challenge for 5 people that just got wailed to death because there were 7 of you.

    Terrendos on
  • TurksonTurkson Near the mountains of ColoradoRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Solo creatures, despite their name, should never be solo. Throw in some minions or a few easier monsters. 1 creature by itself is going to be murdered by the party.

    As a side note, I find myself getting more and more irritated by having the plot hook come from a tavern. I think the next campaign I run will be in a dry county.

    Turkson on
    We missed a few places...
  • HachfaceHachface Not the Minister Farrakhan you're thinking of Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Turkson wrote: »
    Solo creatures, despite their name, should never be solo. Throw in some minions or a few easier monsters. 1 creature by itself is going to be murdered by the party.

    This is less true with MM3 solos.

    Hachface on
  • ChanusChanus Sugoi! ^_____^Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    My wildest dreams may be coming true.

    I just posted a "Hey, you nerds wanna play D&D?" on Facebook and people responded! I know people who want to play D&D!

    I might pee a little.

    Chanus on
    **Winner Softest and Most Comfy Hugs Award Summer 2018**

    Blueberrywerewlf on the Sony Anime Games Box | BluberryWerewlf on the BroBone
  • PantheraOncaPantheraOnca Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Chanus wrote: »
    My wildest dreams may be coming true.

    I just posted a "Hey, you nerds wanna play D&D?" on Facebook and people responded! I know people who want to play D&D!

    sweet!
    I might pee a little.

    ew.

    PantheraOnca on
  • HorseshoeHorseshoe Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Torgo wrote: »
    You should implement Kikubaaqudgha, one of the gods from Dungeon Crawl, just to hear your players try and pronounce his name.

    I had an Orc Paladin who was a Priest of Beogh, the Orc god of Dungeon Crawl. He was Orc Jesus.

    Oh man I may have to steal this.

    "Keep us safely in this dungeon, Great Beogh, and may no wandering adventurers come to slay us... well, at least not any time soon. We know this prayer to be futile, O God of Dugeon Crawls, but we just thought we'd ask."

    Horseshoe on
    dmsigsmallek3.jpg
  • TofystedethTofystedeth veni, veneri, vamoosi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    He wasn't the God of Dungeon Crawls, he was a god, in the game Dungeon Crawl.

    Unless you meant to misread it that way for comedy.

    Tofystedeth on
    steam_sig.png
  • PantheraOncaPantheraOnca Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I originally read it as "God of Dungeon Crawls" not "A God, in the game Dungeon Crawl" too. I am saddened that was not how it was intended.

    PantheraOnca on
  • templewulftemplewulf The Team Chump USARegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Hey guys, I don't have DDI, but I want to play a barehand monk | brawler fighter hybrid. How feasible would that be, and what books would I need to get it?

    templewulf on
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  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    templewulf wrote: »
    Hey guys, I don't have DDI, but I want to play a barehand monk | brawler fighter hybrid. How feasible would that be, and what books would I need to get it?

    PHB3 and Martial Power 2 for the Monk, Hybrid and Brawler rules, I would guess.

    Undead Scottsman on
  • Silas BrownSilas Brown Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I am a consumer whore who purchased the Orcus "mini." Goddamn, this dude is a brute.

    Silas Brown on
  • Mr_RoseMr_Rose 83 Blue Ridge Protects the Holy Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    templewulf wrote: »
    Hey guys, I don't have DDI, but I want to play a barehand monk | brawler fighter hybrid. How feasible would that be, and what books would I need to get it?
    Well, you need PH1 for most of the fighter powers and the main details, PH3 for the Monk and hybrid rules, Martial Power 2 for the Brawler style and powers and.. that looks like it.

    Unfortunately though, you won't be able to combine the monk unarmed strike with the brawler "free hand" thing unless you choose hybrid multi-classing as your PP and you'll have to burn plenty of feats to get decent armour.

    Mr_Rose on
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  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Torgo wrote: »
    You should implement Kikubaaqudgha, one of the gods from Dungeon Crawl, just to hear your players try and pronounce his name.

    I had an Orc Paladin who was a Priest of Beogh, the Orc god of Dungeon Crawl. He was Orc Jesus.

    Oh man I may have to steal this.

    "Keep us safely in this dungeon, Great Beogh, and may no wandering adventurers come to slay us... well, at least not any time soon. We know this prayer to be futile, O God of Dugeon Crawls, but we just thought we'd ask."
    Haha, I think he meant the orc god inDungeon Crawl.

    Also, I forgot that Orc Jesus was Dungeon Crawl and not D&D. Got my circles mixed up. Also also, Dungeon Crawl is awesome. Also also also, I should really get to work on making a 4E roguelike.


    Terrendos wrote: »
    ravensmuse:

    It's a little unclear in your description, but it sounds like you had a lot more than 5 players at any one time. Was your DM compensating for that many additional players by adding more monsters into the game/increasing levels to keep the encounter exp budget equivalent? That solo in particular sounds like it was designed as a challenge for 5 people that just got wailed to death because there were 7 of you.
    No, that solo is just a huge wussy. It's really not that difficult an encounter. Slaying Stone really isn't difficult, but I prefer the way it's put together on the DM side of things.

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    So how do free action moves that grant attacks work now? Can my barbarian use his rampage free attack after getting a crit, then use Swift Charge if he kills that enemy in the same turn?

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • soxboxsoxbox Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    smeej wrote: »
    So how do free action moves that grant attacks work now? Can my barbarian use his rampage free attack after getting a crit, then use Swift Charge if he kills that enemy in the same turn?

    "A creature can take a free action to use an attack power only once per turn."

    [strike]Swift Charge is a free action, not a free action to use an attack power, so it is untouched. The only things affected are where you see the wording such as "may make an attack as a free action".[/strike]

    Edit: Actually I think what I just said is completely wrong. Swift Charge is a free action to trigger charge, which is an attack power.

    soxbox on
  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    The wording is all confusing too. Rampage let's me me make an attack as a free action 1/round when I crit, while Swift Charge is a free action I can activate when the prerequisites are met.

    I hate when they fix some issue created by powergamers and make things complicated for everyone else. :(

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • TofystedethTofystedeth veni, veneri, vamoosi Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    smeej wrote: »
    Horseshoe wrote: »
    Torgo wrote: »
    You should implement Kikubaaqudgha, one of the gods from Dungeon Crawl, just to hear your players try and pronounce his name.

    I had an Orc Paladin who was a Priest of Beogh, the Orc god of Dungeon Crawl. He was Orc Jesus.

    Oh man I may have to steal this.

    "Keep us safely in this dungeon, Great Beogh, and may no wandering adventurers come to slay us... well, at least not any time soon. We know this prayer to be futile, O God of Dugeon Crawls, but we just thought we'd ask."
    Haha, I think he meant the orc god inDungeon Crawl.

    Also, I forgot that Orc Jesus was Dungeon Crawl and not D&D. Got my circles mixed up. Also also, Dungeon Crawl is awesome. Also also also, I should really get to work on making a 4E roguelike.
    As in a roguelike PC game with 4e rules or a roguelike tabletop?

    either sounds fun and I'd play/assist in the making of both!

    Tofystedeth on
    steam_sig.png
  • smeejsmeej Registered User
    edited September 2010
    A PC game. I think it'd be really fun and shouldn't be tooooo difficult, but I also don't generally have the time.

    I'm taking a vacation the week after next so maybe I can sit down and do some groundwork.

    smeej on
    IT'S A SAD THING THAT YOUR ADVENTURES HAVE ENDED HERE!!
  • DarmakDarmak RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Okay, I'm wanting to finally get a few people together to play some D&D and I'm going to DM. I've never played D&D, much less been a DM, and neither have any of my potential players, so is there anything I can do to make starting it a bit easier?

    I was planning on using the Dark Sun campaign setting and perhaps some sort of pre-made adventure thing, and having some or most of my players make their characters beforehand to try and speed things up a tiny bit. All I have right now is the DM guides 1 & 2, all 3 player's manuals, and the first monster manual, plus the dark sun campaign setting (the DS creature catalog is coming in the mail).

    Should I buy some miniatures and dungeon tiles, or can I make do with a whiteboard and some printed pictures to represent characters and monsters? Is there any information that would be handy to have printed out and easily accessible? I kind of feel overwhelmed at the moment so any help would be appreciated.

    Darmak on
    eg62xrm.jpg
  • TurksonTurkson Near the mountains of ColoradoRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    You might want to go check out the Essentials box that has the rest of the community in an uproar.

    http://www.wizards.com/dnd/Product.aspx?x=dnd/products/dndacc/244660000

    Lesson to learn: Ignore ignorant ingrates on the internet.

    Turkson on
    We missed a few places...
  • AmiguAmigu Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    A tile grid that can take white board markers is a great investment. So is the starter set as it comes with lots of tokens and also a full set of dice, which you'll be glad to have seen as new people won't have dice of their own. Models are cool eye candy but not a must have. Monsters are so expendable that I never bothered with models but it's cool to have models for the heroes and maybe some key npcs!

    Amigu on
    BitD PbP Character Volstrom
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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    The new treasure parcel system in the Rules Conpendium is interesting. It's 4 d20 rolls for each treasure parcel, one for gold/silver, one for a magic item, one for art pieces and/or gems, and then another one for a magic item.

    So you could end up with a lot of loot and a couple magic items... or you could end up with nothing. I tried using it today after three encounters and the group ended up with about 50 gold and 2 magic items.

    DarkPrimus on
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  • AegeriAegeri Plateau of LengRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I believe it's just an alternative system to the usual treasure parcel system and wishlists. It's not something I have any interest in, but a few people have asked for a random system and so wizards have provided one.

    Aegeri on
    The Roleplayer's Guild: My blog for roleplaying games, advice and adventuring.
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