Another way of looking at it is when you send out your attack/harass, you're keeping him on the defensive for a little while. Send your guy to start your expo while you're doing that, and he won't be able to push out against you.
How come I always die as soon as I put my exp down? Huh? huh?
Can any of you clowns tell me that?
if that's a universal law then why don't you not put down the XP and win? huh? huh?
Because I wanted to be like the cool kids
No, I have just had the worst timing on my exps lately. They push out the moment it is down and I'm dronin' like a mofo.
This is a common trap a lot of zerg players fall into. They just want to go super heavy econ, and it gets them screwed. Just try to build more units/spinecrawlers and don't drone so hard. Really almost every race likes to do early timing pushes versus zerg. Also just leave a ling or something right outside their ramp so you can see when they are pushing out and throw down like 3 crawlers and pump a ton of units.
Don't be afraid to drop those spine crawlers if you have the money. They really help out a lot, and can make the difference with a lot of pushes people will do.
ZypherIM on
0
VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
Another way of looking at it is when you send out your attack/harass, you're keeping him on the defensive for a little while. Send your guy to start your expo while you're doing that, and he won't be able to push out against you.
I understand this logic and I follow it BUT, there are times where your push gets slaughtered and there is a counterattack and you would rather have been making units than an expansion.
If you see the counterattack coming and your expo isn't finished yet, go ahead and cancel and use those minerals for defense if possible. Also retreating your attacking force if you think you're going to lose the fight, or lose too many units is also good.
If you see the counterattack coming and your expo isn't finished yet, go ahead and cancel and use those minerals for defense if possible. Also retreating your attacking force if you think you're going to lose the fight, or lose too many units is also good.
oh for sure, it's just you lose some minerals and some time.
and yeah I don't mean I'd suicide stuff. it's more a timing thing and a lack of really really solid scouting that leads to the scenario I presented, it's just that it does happen.
I've also noticed that like, in the level we play at I think it's more likely to lose in the scenario I presented than it is in higher level play. they seem to be more likely to take an advatnage (defending a push) and expand and rebuild and press that advantage. in a game I play I feel like counter-attacks are much more common even if they end in failure.
it's a patience thing and a lack of confidence thing I believe, but -from my experience- it's true.
What is a GOOD response to having your push stomped? I mean at this point you have the units you managed to build while the fight was occuring, versus whatever he has left, which if it was truly that one sided, is a lot.
So he is now free to expand while you, what, build units to defend against what he has? So now you catch up military wise but are down econ, so he quickly surpasses you militarily.
If youve expanded while the fight is going down, you may be in decent position to pump out enough units to survive any counter while maintaining economic parity or advantage. If you havent, well you can still pump out units, but is your 400 minerals going to really get you that much more? If youve expanded while the fight was ouccring, you could recoup a bit of that 400 minerals by the time any counter came into play.
I dunno...just seems like your screwed if that push gets handed that badly.
I was thinking about 2v2 matchups on the drive to work. I play P (only Silver) but I've found I get the least communication/cooperation from Terran partners. With a Zerg partner there are several ways to go (zealot/ling rush, Stalker/Roach, heavy macro with muta harass into late game). With Protoss I've found it a little trickier but some complimentary strategies are there (zealot rush, 8 gates, one goes mass gate the other goes robo, double fast VR). With Terran I wonder if the strategies most use are just really 1v1 based and self contained. Most people seem to (after harassment) go either marine marauder medivac, or MM+tanks+vikings which are pretty much self contained.
What I've been thinking is cutting the starport off the MM+tanks+vikings build and making it MM+tanks+phoenix+zealot meat shields. You can push with that and if you don't win you can transition into mass fast void rays extremely easily if you retain air control and supplement the ground force with immortals.
What is a GOOD response to having your push stomped? I mean at this point you have the units you managed to build while the fight was occuring, versus whatever he has left, which if it was truly that one sided, is a lot.
So he is now free to expand while you, what, build units to defend against what he has? So now you catch up military wise but are down econ, so he quickly surpasses you militarily.
If youve expanded while the fight is going down, you may be in decent position to pump out enough units to survive any counter while maintaining economic parity or advantage. If you havent, well you can still pump out units, but is your 400 minerals going to really get you that much more? If youve expanded while the fight was ouccring, you could recoup a bit of that 400 minerals by the time any counter came into play.
I dunno...just seems like your screwed if that push gets handed that badly.
When you fall behind after a push, he is either going to counter or to pump econ. If he counters you want to be able to defend just enough to stop his guys, if he econs you want to plan on some harass, and try to catch up on econ yourself.
Playing from the back is harder, since you're going to have to take a chance somewhere. Either from making an expo that you really can't defend that well (since you can't match his army), to doing some harass play to even it out.
If you get absolutely trounced and he counters, as a zerg another thing you can try is to throw out a speedling force straight to his mineral lines. Hopefully you'll not only do some damage but put him back on the defensive.
Edit: the ling backstab is a great thing to keep in mind in general, it'll either make him paranoid at moving out, keep some units in his base to defend, or get you free scv kills.
it's playing whackamole with which one of you gets rushed first
haaate 4v4 for that reason. the game gets worse as you add more people. 1v1 is awesome, 2v2 is fun. 3v3 can be fun and 4v4 is AWFUL. I wanna play with friends so I like the coop games, but 4v4 is just too terrible to be borne.
If it was truly Mass Marines, the only way to scout this is to notice that the only thing he is producing is marines. DT's can hold, but only until he catches on. The answer lays with gaining an expo, and leaping to double robo, mass stalkers (how many ever gates this means), pump collossus as needed (get the upgrade ASAP), and the occasional observer.
The tricky part is the scouting.... I mean, is he really just building marines? You're first 3-5 guy fight ends to all marines, and only marines? can you take the leap of faith, because 30 seconds is 30 seconds too late. Otherwise, mix zealot/stalkers/sentries and see what he's got in store for you. Get at least 1 robo up. stalkers and collossus are a decent end game strat for PvT games.
A guy compiled diamond EU players data on Win % for each map for each race.
Now we have all heard the argument that balance can be changed by changing the maps we play on. As is the argument with Brood War was that the only inbalance left in it was the maps and the reason why ICCup maps were made and the only maps people played on competetively. As we are seeing with patch 1.1 the first balance focus by Blizzard is to change stats on units, with one map balance change.
We saw at MLG that Metalopolis is the most popular map among high caliber players. Do you think Blizzard will get around to making/changing maps to be a little bigger?
Thought I was finally going to win a game. I had siege tanks in my base ready to go and a pile of vikings, had a few reapers do a lot of early harassment. Watched my opponent roll up to my base with siege tanks and appear to retreat as I started blasting. Then it turned out he'd just camped them exactly outside my range, aimed at the ramp. This denied me a second base, which he already had one of, and I was fucked.
I cannot figure starcraft out.
Im not sure what other units he may or may not have had supporting his tanks, but if you had a decent amount of vikings, you could have flown them to the siege tanks and landed them, pwning the tanks. Vikings are a great counter to sieged tanks. You can flank the enemy force with them and land and take out the tanks before his main force even notices if you time a push right. You may take some losses with your main to distract his guys (a volley or so from the tanks + his marines getting a round off) but 4 or so vikings, landed on top of tanks make short work of them.
Vikings are really a great counter to most enemies long range units. The problem is, you need to get them alone, so it requires some micro that I havent yet mastered. But colossi, siege tanks and broodlords are all pretty hard countered by vikings.
Vikings are really a great counter to most enemies long^H^H^H^H range^H^H^H^H^H units.
One of the more frustrating things is a well managed decent sized group of vikings.
tough in the air, reasonably tough on the ground, their big disadvantage, is that they have to transform before attacking g/g or a/a. Banshees are the only better harassment unit.
although, terran seem to be on a mass marine/maruader drop kick lately...
Dammit, this thread moves a fucking mile an hour. I'm happily laddering away for 1.5 h and now I cannot respond to the responses I got because they're already old.
I'm gonna do it anyway darn tootin'.
Derrick: The "expansion is a reward"-thing is probably a good starting point for when to exp. I'll try sticking to that
Cased: My biggest problem right now is to know when to drone and when not to. The logic is ofc to drone when they're teching and get stuff when the opponent it about to move out. I just cannot seem to get the timing down. Scouting is also a pain in the ass as Zerg, I've tried keeping an overseer close to their base to get a changeling in every now and then for the last couple of games and it helps. I'll stick to that as well.
By doing so I realize that I have no idea how the mechanic for changelings work. Detectors see changelings, correct? Do sensor towers show them as red blips as well?
Zypher: Yeah, I usually put down spines when I feel like I'm behind on units. But that is usually before I exp so they don't help. Maybe I'll try getting some down in my exp and choosing to take the battle there next time.
I'm ranked at 3 in my gold league, hoping to bump up to plat soon (Got 170 bonus pool banked after going on vacation, oh yeah). However looking at replays, my average APM is usually around 25, I think the highest I've seen it at is 28. Is this normal, or am I going to have to seriously step up my game in plat?
So gomtv changed their minds? Free low quality stream and 20 for hq and vods? sounds pretty damn good to me.
but...but..whining on the internet never changes anything. At least that's what the internet told me!
I sincerely doubt the internet complaints did change anything. It was a simple marketing ploy - offer an outrageous offer first, then the still shitty option you present next seems a lot more reasonable than it should.
The standard free quality is absolute trash, and the HQ isn't much better (lower quality than most of the free streams on TL it seems). And there are no VoDs either; which really means, practically speaking, it is still not free for the vast majority of people (i.e. those not able to wake up at 4AM to watch this).
I'm ranked at 3 in my gold league, hoping to bump up to plat soon (Got 170 bonus pool banked after going on vacation, oh yeah). However looking at replays, my average APM is usually around 25, I think the highest I've seen it at is 28. Is this normal, or am I going to have to seriously step up my game in plat?
Well the biggest thing is, when you're watching those replays are you looking at current APM or overall AOM since even in the early game it's taking the overall average APM from start to fnish.
Just to give you some perspective whitera a pro only has about 120 as his TOP APM.
Its possible to be a good player and not have ridiculously high APM it just makes it harder for you to multitask
Don't forget you can walk spines around now, and taking 1 spawn larva cycle to make a creep tumor to connect your main and expo is well worth the time.
I'm ranked at 3 in my gold league, hoping to bump up to plat soon (Got 170 bonus pool banked after going on vacation, oh yeah). However looking at replays, my average APM is usually around 25, I think the highest I've seen it at is 28. Is this normal, or am I going to have to seriously step up my game in plat?
Don't sweat apm really, it's more about being efficient with your actions, apm comes with time.
Frozenzen on
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited September 2010
It's really just like anything else. If you try and be fast before you're good, it's just going to end up a lot of worthless spam, because you aren't going to be doing the right things.
I'm ranked at 3 in my gold league, hoping to bump up to plat soon (Got 170 bonus pool banked after going on vacation, oh yeah). However looking at replays, my average APM is usually around 25, I think the highest I've seen it at is 28. Is this normal, or am I going to have to seriously step up my game in plat?
Well the biggest thing is, when you're watching those replays are you looking at current APM or overall AOM since even in the early game it's taking the overall average APM from start to fnish.
Just to give you some perspective whitera a pro only has about 120 as his TOP APM.
Its possible to be a good player and not have ridiculously high APM it just makes it harder for you to multitask
Aye, concentrate on building things when you have the minerals for it. As you practice you will start to think a couple moves ahead. So instead of "Build more Overlords" making you build overlords you will see 15/18 and build an overlord. After a while you will say "okay, 15/18 overlord being built now one more drone wait for queen, inject when she comes out, and build another overlord at that time, then some more drones and zerglings" And then holy shit your APM is now up to 70.
Little more practice where you are subconciously thinking "Okay, I just injected larva and built an overlord so thats going to take 30 seconds let me scout with these lings, hitting 5sd every 10 seconds, oh a zealot I can kill lets kill him, cool my inject is about to pop build more units and inject again, and try and kill probes with these zerglings that are now in his base" and holy shit now your APM is 120 and your in diamond league.
If you go the other way of Spam shit to get APM up it ends up like this. "Okay okay okay, spam spam spam, select workers, select hatch spam rally, select workers, select hatch sdsdsd, oh shit my workers aren't mining anymore cause I didn't actually select my hatch." Sure your APM will be 300, but your workers aren't mining!
Practice your BO, think 3 moves ahead, then incorporate some micro. Your APM will naturally go up.
i'm willing to bet that with the free stream someone is going to record it or it will be in a restream's archives, etc etc
Of course, I'm actually pretty sure there'll be HD that someone will restream and make VoDs of too. But either way, both are piracy and it doesn't change the fact that GoM is retarded.
I'm still looking for a good 2v2 partner who's gonna be on consistently.
Also, do you guys really think 1.1 will change the 2-gate / 4-gate push dramatically? It seems to be only an extra 5 seconds per wave, and 5 seconds more per initial zealot. I'm not sure the 20-40 seconds really makes a difference for zerg players. Am I wrong?
Chubby Bunny on
Battle.net: ChubbyBunny#1452 | Steam: Bunny1248 | Xbox Live: CBunny1
I'm still looking for a good 2v2 partner who's gonna be on consistently.
Also, do you guys really think 1.1 will change the 2-gate / 4-gate push dramatically? It seems to be only an extra 5 seconds per wave, and 5 seconds more per initial zealot. I'm not sure the 20-40 seconds really makes a difference for zerg players. Am I wrong?
It'll make some difference.
I've busted a fair few entrances with seconds to spare at least :P.
Frozenzen on
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
I'm still looking for a good 2v2 partner who's gonna be on consistently.
Also, do you guys really think 1.1 will change the 2-gate / 4-gate push dramatically? It seems to be only an extra 5 seconds per wave, and 5 seconds more per initial zealot. I'm not sure the 20-40 seconds really makes a difference for zerg players. Am I wrong?
5s can be a life time in StarCraft. It can be the difference between living and dieing to a rush. So, I don't think it will end 2-gate/4-gate, but it will give the defender what amounts to an eternity to get defense up.
I honestly dont see how its needed to have an average APM over like 70 by the end of a normal game. I mean for the first 5 or so minutes, you can max out your effeciency with like 5-30 APM. Even if there was a need to go a lot higher for the rest of a game, youd need to be at like 90 for the next 10 minutes straight to get the average up to 70.
How do you need to be clicking 1.5 times per second ALWAYS in a game of SC2? It just doesnt make sense to me, logically.
Cased: My biggest problem right now is to know when to drone and when not to. The logic is ofc to drone when they're teching and get stuff when the opponent it about to move out. I just cannot seem to get the timing down. Scouting is also a pain in the ass as Zerg, I've tried keeping an overseer close to their base to get a changeling in every now and then for the last couple of games and it helps. I'll stick to that as well.
For droning, I don't think you have to think "when should I drone, when should I make units". If you know for sure he won't be attacking you, then building all drones is great. However, if you're not sure, there's nothing wrong with having a mixture for each round of spawn larva: spawn one or two drones and the rest units.
For scouting, I find putting overlords and zerglings everywhere helps. If you have vision of a large part of the map, it's easy to know when he's moving out. Also, it can sometimes be useful to just run a zergling at his base and see what he attacks you with.
I honestly dont see how its needed to have an average APM over like 70 by the end of a normal game. I mean for the first 5 or so minutes, you can max out your effeciency with like 5-30 APM. Even if there was a need to go a lot higher for the rest of a game, youd need to be at like 90 for the next 10 minutes straight to get the average up to 70.
How do you need to be clicking 1.5 times per second ALWAYS in a game of SC2? It just doesnt make sense to me, logically.
you usually don't in the beginning, correct
but there are points in the game when you have 2 or 3 bases where there definitely are actions at that rate when you factor in production, a battle, scouting, building new buildings, new expansion, etc
so a lot of people just constantly go at that rate, regardless if they actually have that many things to do -- reason behind this is that when there is a situation where you need to be moving that fast, it will be second nature to you
TL DRNot at all confident in his reflexive opinions of thingsRegistered Userregular
edited September 2010
Creep Tumors are one of my favorite things. I usually spend my second or third energy cycle on one and try to have a few spreading around the map constantly. They're awesome early detection for attacks, especially against Terran Mech.
I had a Protoss player take out my nat the other day and camp my front door with cannons and his army. Before he knew it, my creep highway had encircled his forces. I think there's a strong psychological component here; not only do I have vision of any reinforcements, my influence envelops his forces.
TL DR on
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
I honestly dont see how its needed to have an average APM over like 70 by the end of a normal game. I mean for the first 5 or so minutes, you can max out your effeciency with like 5-30 APM. Even if there was a need to go a lot higher for the rest of a game, youd need to be at like 90 for the next 10 minutes straight to get the average up to 70.
How do you need to be clicking 1.5 times per second ALWAYS in a game of SC2? It just doesnt make sense to me, logically.
The longer the game goes, the more your APM has to ramp up to be able to correctly multitask everything. More expansions to deal with, more units to move around, more things to research.
Most really high APM players spend their "APM budget" on unit micro though, where things like "move, stop, move, stop" can be APM intensive, but very important in fire fights.
Posts
This is a common trap a lot of zerg players fall into. They just want to go super heavy econ, and it gets them screwed. Just try to build more units/spinecrawlers and don't drone so hard. Really almost every race likes to do early timing pushes versus zerg. Also just leave a ling or something right outside their ramp so you can see when they are pushing out and throw down like 3 crawlers and pump a ton of units.
I understand this logic and I follow it BUT, there are times where your push gets slaughtered and there is a counterattack and you would rather have been making units than an expansion.
those times suck.
http://www.sc2replayed.com/replays/70761-1v1-terran-zerg-xelnaga-caverns
oh for sure, it's just you lose some minerals and some time.
and yeah I don't mean I'd suicide stuff. it's more a timing thing and a lack of really really solid scouting that leads to the scenario I presented, it's just that it does happen.
I've also noticed that like, in the level we play at I think it's more likely to lose in the scenario I presented than it is in higher level play. they seem to be more likely to take an advatnage (defending a push) and expand and rebuild and press that advantage. in a game I play I feel like counter-attacks are much more common even if they end in failure.
it's a patience thing and a lack of confidence thing I believe, but -from my experience- it's true.
So he is now free to expand while you, what, build units to defend against what he has? So now you catch up military wise but are down econ, so he quickly surpasses you militarily.
If youve expanded while the fight is going down, you may be in decent position to pump out enough units to survive any counter while maintaining economic parity or advantage. If you havent, well you can still pump out units, but is your 400 minerals going to really get you that much more? If youve expanded while the fight was ouccring, you could recoup a bit of that 400 minerals by the time any counter came into play.
I dunno...just seems like your screwed if that push gets handed that badly.
What I've been thinking is cutting the starport off the MM+tanks+vikings build and making it MM+tanks+phoenix+zealot meat shields. You can push with that and if you don't win you can transition into mass fast void rays extremely easily if you retain air control and supplement the ground force with immortals.
Whats the standard P&T combination right now?
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
gg
Playing from the back is harder, since you're going to have to take a chance somewhere. Either from making an expo that you really can't defend that well (since you can't match his army), to doing some harass play to even it out.
If you get absolutely trounced and he counters, as a zerg another thing you can try is to throw out a speedling force straight to his mineral lines. Hopefully you'll not only do some damage but put him back on the defensive.
Edit: the ling backstab is a great thing to keep in mind in general, it'll either make him paranoid at moving out, keep some units in his base to defend, or get you free scv kills.
haaate 4v4 for that reason. the game gets worse as you add more people. 1v1 is awesome, 2v2 is fun. 3v3 can be fun and 4v4 is AWFUL. I wanna play with friends so I like the coop games, but 4v4 is just too terrible to be borne.
Oh nice, got the link? It's not a surprising move, given the backlash. Believe it or not, people do listen to the internet when it gets angry.
If it was truly Mass Marines, the only way to scout this is to notice that the only thing he is producing is marines. DT's can hold, but only until he catches on. The answer lays with gaining an expo, and leaping to double robo, mass stalkers (how many ever gates this means), pump collossus as needed (get the upgrade ASAP), and the occasional observer.
The tricky part is the scouting.... I mean, is he really just building marines? You're first 3-5 guy fight ends to all marines, and only marines? can you take the leap of faith, because 30 seconds is 30 seconds too late. Otherwise, mix zealot/stalkers/sentries and see what he's got in store for you. Get at least 1 robo up. stalkers and collossus are a decent end game strat for PvT games.
Joe's Stream.
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=149242
I would not mind to play $20 for the Vods.
A guy compiled diamond EU players data on Win % for each map for each race.
Now we have all heard the argument that balance can be changed by changing the maps we play on. As is the argument with Brood War was that the only inbalance left in it was the maps and the reason why ICCup maps were made and the only maps people played on competetively. As we are seeing with patch 1.1 the first balance focus by Blizzard is to change stats on units, with one map balance change.
We saw at MLG that Metalopolis is the most popular map among high caliber players. Do you think Blizzard will get around to making/changing maps to be a little bigger?
Im not sure what other units he may or may not have had supporting his tanks, but if you had a decent amount of vikings, you could have flown them to the siege tanks and landed them, pwning the tanks. Vikings are a great counter to sieged tanks. You can flank the enemy force with them and land and take out the tanks before his main force even notices if you time a push right. You may take some losses with your main to distract his guys (a volley or so from the tanks + his marines getting a round off) but 4 or so vikings, landed on top of tanks make short work of them.
Vikings are really a great counter to most enemies long range units. The problem is, you need to get them alone, so it requires some micro that I havent yet mastered. But colossi, siege tanks and broodlords are all pretty hard countered by vikings.
Joe's Stream.
but...but..whining on the internet never changes anything. At least that's what the internet told me!
I'm gonna do it anyway darn tootin'.
Derrick: The "expansion is a reward"-thing is probably a good starting point for when to exp. I'll try sticking to that
Cased: My biggest problem right now is to know when to drone and when not to. The logic is ofc to drone when they're teching and get stuff when the opponent it about to move out. I just cannot seem to get the timing down. Scouting is also a pain in the ass as Zerg, I've tried keeping an overseer close to their base to get a changeling in every now and then for the last couple of games and it helps. I'll stick to that as well.
By doing so I realize that I have no idea how the mechanic for changelings work. Detectors see changelings, correct? Do sensor towers show them as red blips as well?
Zypher: Yeah, I usually put down spines when I feel like I'm behind on units. But that is usually before I exp so they don't help. Maybe I'll try getting some down in my exp and choosing to take the battle there next time.
Edit: grammar's ain't my thaing
I'm ranked at 3 in my gold league, hoping to bump up to plat soon (Got 170 bonus pool banked after going on vacation, oh yeah). However looking at replays, my average APM is usually around 25, I think the highest I've seen it at is 28. Is this normal, or am I going to have to seriously step up my game in plat?
Steam: adamjnet
BUT, the queen/ spit mechanic helped out my macro tremendously when I switched back over to Protoss. Things felt a little bit...smoother.
I sincerely doubt the internet complaints did change anything. It was a simple marketing ploy - offer an outrageous offer first, then the still shitty option you present next seems a lot more reasonable than it should.
The standard free quality is absolute trash, and the HQ isn't much better (lower quality than most of the free streams on TL it seems). And there are no VoDs either; which really means, practically speaking, it is still not free for the vast majority of people (i.e. those not able to wake up at 4AM to watch this).
Well the biggest thing is, when you're watching those replays are you looking at current APM or overall AOM since even in the early game it's taking the overall average APM from start to fnish.
Just to give you some perspective whitera a pro only has about 120 as his TOP APM.
Its possible to be a good player and not have ridiculously high APM it just makes it harder for you to multitask
SC2: XxKhrushchev.539
Don't sweat apm really, it's more about being efficient with your actions, apm comes with time.
Speed will naturally come with skill.
Yeah, you're the 1 in a sampling of 30-40 people who would if the TL poll is any indication.
Aye, concentrate on building things when you have the minerals for it. As you practice you will start to think a couple moves ahead. So instead of "Build more Overlords" making you build overlords you will see 15/18 and build an overlord. After a while you will say "okay, 15/18 overlord being built now one more drone wait for queen, inject when she comes out, and build another overlord at that time, then some more drones and zerglings" And then holy shit your APM is now up to 70.
Little more practice where you are subconciously thinking "Okay, I just injected larva and built an overlord so thats going to take 30 seconds let me scout with these lings, hitting 5sd every 10 seconds, oh a zealot I can kill lets kill him, cool my inject is about to pop build more units and inject again, and try and kill probes with these zerglings that are now in his base" and holy shit now your APM is 120 and your in diamond league.
If you go the other way of Spam shit to get APM up it ends up like this. "Okay okay okay, spam spam spam, select workers, select hatch spam rally, select workers, select hatch sdsdsd, oh shit my workers aren't mining anymore cause I didn't actually select my hatch." Sure your APM will be 300, but your workers aren't mining!
Practice your BO, think 3 moves ahead, then incorporate some micro. Your APM will naturally go up.
Of course, I'm actually pretty sure there'll be HD that someone will restream and make VoDs of too. But either way, both are piracy and it doesn't change the fact that GoM is retarded.
Also, do you guys really think 1.1 will change the 2-gate / 4-gate push dramatically? It seems to be only an extra 5 seconds per wave, and 5 seconds more per initial zealot. I'm not sure the 20-40 seconds really makes a difference for zerg players. Am I wrong?
My Digital Pin Lanyard || PAX East '13, '14, '15, '19 | PAX South '15
It'll make some difference.
I've busted a fair few entrances with seconds to spare at least :P.
5s can be a life time in StarCraft. It can be the difference between living and dieing to a rush. So, I don't think it will end 2-gate/4-gate, but it will give the defender what amounts to an eternity to get defense up.
How do you need to be clicking 1.5 times per second ALWAYS in a game of SC2? It just doesnt make sense to me, logically.
For droning, I don't think you have to think "when should I drone, when should I make units". If you know for sure he won't be attacking you, then building all drones is great. However, if you're not sure, there's nothing wrong with having a mixture for each round of spawn larva: spawn one or two drones and the rest units.
For scouting, I find putting overlords and zerglings everywhere helps. If you have vision of a large part of the map, it's easy to know when he's moving out. Also, it can sometimes be useful to just run a zergling at his base and see what he attacks you with.
you usually don't in the beginning, correct
but there are points in the game when you have 2 or 3 bases where there definitely are actions at that rate when you factor in production, a battle, scouting, building new buildings, new expansion, etc
so a lot of people just constantly go at that rate, regardless if they actually have that many things to do -- reason behind this is that when there is a situation where you need to be moving that fast, it will be second nature to you
spamming is totally personal preference though
I had a Protoss player take out my nat the other day and camp my front door with cannons and his army. Before he knew it, my creep highway had encircled his forces. I think there's a strong psychological component here; not only do I have vision of any reinforcements, my influence envelops his forces.
The longer the game goes, the more your APM has to ramp up to be able to correctly multitask everything. More expansions to deal with, more units to move around, more things to research.
Most really high APM players spend their "APM budget" on unit micro though, where things like "move, stop, move, stop" can be APM intensive, but very important in fire fights.