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Shaky Internet Friends

EpicPhoenixEpicPhoenix Registered User regular
edited September 2010 in Help / Advice Forum
Basically, here's the store. Play WoW, find one guy who's your friend all summer. A few arguements, but a great friend. Meet some new friends, guilds merge. Currently working on heroic Lich King in 10.

Basically, the guild is pissing me off. One of the officers has 4,000 gold from me that he isn't paying back, and the guild master, my close friend all this summer, owes me 5,000 gold. They don't seem to want to pay me back, but eh. Tonight we raided Stormwind, all fun until I said why not attempt the King. So, my friend goes on his alt to talk to his Alliance friends and I kill him in Goldshire. Cool.

I'm standing in Orgrimmar and he guild kicks me. Drops me as a Real ID friend. I whisper asking what happens on multiple characters, he's "done" with me. Now, it's pretty shitty. I honestly wasn't trying to make him mad doing anything, and after walking away from the computer, I come back to him saying I can have "one more chance" - and he tells me in Vent about how he's "done" with the other officer because he doesn't want him to meddle with our raid groups. Sounds like he was raging, but this an ongoing problem.

Is it worth it to stay in this guild? Of course not, there's a catch though. They raid Fridays and Saturdays, which are the only times I can raid due to school. There's another guild that raids on the weekend, but they're not as progressed.

I have friend issues IRL too, and really don't like having all these issues in a game that's supposed to be fun and an escape, but I suppose shitty drama occurs in all social interaction. I honestly have no idea what to do.

EpicPhoenix on
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    PerpetualPerpetual Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Quit WoW and never look back.

    Perpetual on
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    SkyCaptainSkyCaptain IndianaRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Your only option is to kiss ass and suck up to the guild leader until you can convince him to let you have a position of authority in the guild and then complely decimate it by stealing the guild bank and all the mats and more before gdisbanding it.

    Or you could just find new friends, even transfer servers if you find a server with more guilds that raid in your specific time slots.

    SkyCaptain on
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    eternalbleternalbl Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    1) never lend a friend money unless it's money you're willing to never see again, and

    2) changing your group of friends just means different people and the same old problems.

    You really gotta go with your gut though. Are these people really your friends or are they just keeping you around because they can take advantage of you?

    Personally, I think your guild leader sounds like he could grow up a little. He knows his little temper tantrum is wrong but his pride won't let him just say he's sorry and he can't see that you work just as hard for your gold as he does.

    eternalbl on
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    DemerdarDemerdar Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I wouldn't apologize to him. Personally, I would quit the guild and find some other people to hang out with. I mean, it's just a game. If you aren't having fun doing it then what's the point?

    Demerdar on
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    BullioBullio Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    In my experience, guildmates are just "friends" within the context of the guild. I got along real well and hung around with some awesome people in my WoW guild, but when I decided I'd had enough of WoW and quit I never heard from any of them after I left despite leaving on good terms with those people. Leaving the guild behind almost definitely isn't going to cost you actual friends. That's not to say that this is necessarily the case for everyone, but it sounds like your situation is shittier than mine was. Do what you feel is best, but I think the best advice I can give is prioritize sorting out your real life issues first.

    Bullio on
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    ceresceres When the last moon is cast over the last star of morning And the future has past without even a last desperate warningRegistered User, Moderator mod
    edited September 2010
    Perpetual wrote: »
    Quit WoW and never look back.

    I'm almost at this point myself. I have a feeling once I actually do it, it won't be as big a deal as it seems right now.

    In my experience guild drama is never worth the energy it takes to fuel the pixels on your screen that display it to you, and half the time neither are the people in charge. There's nothing special about them. If you aren't having fun anymore then quit, and it really should be as simple as that.

    But honestly, this isn't just something you're going to find playing an MMO. It's easy to use the word "friend" to describe people you haven't known very long or very well, and from there even easier to group them with people who are *actually* your friends, reacting to them accordingly. But they're not. You've known them for what, 2 months? Friends and people who hang out in groups because it's convenient are not the same. This is something I've had to deal with a number of times concerning internet "friends", and sometimes it develops into something that lasts in the long term, but until then it's probably better not to confuse the two groups.

    ceres on
    And it seems like all is dying, and would leave the world to mourn
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    RaekreuRaekreu Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I doubt it's worth it to try and mend fences on this one. Even if the other guild isn't as progressed as yours, it may be worth it to go ahead and try them out. If you've got raiding experience, you could be an asset to them in helping them get further into ICC. Failing that, you could apply at other guilds and see if they've got a 2nd group/alt group running that would fit your timeslot. Just my 2 cents. I feel for you, I've been involved in a few guilds that just had some real "winners" in GM and officer positions.

    Raekreu on
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    WillethWilleth Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    They are not the only guild that operates at the time you need them to. Look on the forums.

    Willeth on
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    BeastehBeasteh THAT WOULD NOT KILL DRACULARegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Perpetual wrote: »
    Quit WoW and never look back.

    seriously this is the best choice i made with my life this year

    Beasteh on
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    BeastehBeasteh THAT WOULD NOT KILL DRACULARegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    and all those faceless wow 'friends'?

    yeah once you quit they'll drop you like a bad habit

    do yourself a favor and pull the plug

    Beasteh on
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    AdusAdus Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Beasteh wrote: »
    and all those faceless wow 'friends'?

    yeah once you quit they'll drop you like a bad habit

    do yourself a favor and pull the plug

    Well that's not necessarily true. Unless all the 'friends' you make in the game are like the people the OP mentioned. I quit WoW over a year ago and still keep in contact with quite a few people I met on it.

    I think the most important thing in a game like WoW is to find people you enjoy playing with. Drama may be hard to avoid entirely, but chances are there's a group out there that you'll get along with great. Raiding is fun but only if you like the people. Raiding with douchebags is a fucking pain in the ass and I know from plenty of experience.

    I think it's silly to just advise him to quit right off when he made no mention of being tired of the game itself.

    Adus on
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    rfaliasrfalias Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I'm fairly convinced a large portion of online gaming communities thrive on drama, despite their constant insisting that they hate drama.

    At the end of the day, you pay to play WoW the way you want to. If you don't like drama, then leave the guild. End of story.
    There are numerous guilds that raid during that time, and given your end-game experience you should have no issue getting into one of them.

    Re: Friends in online games, most are just there for self gain, but once in a while you find someone you click with. I met a now really good friend in MXO of all things and now we frequently visit eachothers home-state and all that stuff. So it's common to lose contact quickly, you will know who is actually a 'friend' once you leave.

    rfalias on
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    CognisseurCognisseur Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Er... I'm not one those people that goes "quit WoW" in response to any WoW-related problem but uh... in this case it just sounds like you need to quit WoW. The way you describe it, it just sounds like you have a second life with a second job and neither the life nor the job are more glamorous than the one you have in reality. That's a pretty poor form of escapism.

    Cognisseur on
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    Sir Red of the MantiSir Red of the Manti Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Beasteh wrote: »
    Perpetual wrote: »
    Quit WoW and never look back.

    seriously this is the best choice i made with my life this year
    Congrats. I've seen enough people sucked into such acedia over it, and they get to the point where they're looking to quit "at the end of this month", but somehow even that month gets stretched into another year or two and again I've lost someone for a giant window of time.

    Sir Red of the Manti on
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    815165815165 Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    WoW is only ever as fun as the people you're playing it with, either find good people to play with (try one of the PA forum guilds?) or find something else to do.

    815165 on
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    cr0wcr0w Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2010
    The second a game starts affecting the way you feel in real life, even a little bit, it's time to walk away. I quit WoW about a year and a half ago after years of playing and my life's improved tenfold. I realized once I got visibly angry after not getting a weapon that it was getting out of hand and just walked away.

    Haven't heard a word from any of the friends I'd made over my years of playing since. Like others have said, outside of the game itself, they're not your friends. They couldn't care less about anything but the next raid and loot, and you're just a cog in the machine they use to get it.

    cr0w on
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    ScosglenScosglen Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Internet friends can be a strange thing.

    My personal metric for whether or not someone you only know over the internet is really your friend, is whether they would be willing to go out of their way to help you in real life.

    If these people won't even be decent to you in a videogame, then they are not worth even a fraction of the mindshare you're giving them.

    If a something that happens in a game can distress you enough that you feel the need to ask others for help as to how you should feel or proceed, then it is a pretty big sign that you could stand to step away from the game and get some perspective.

    Scosglen on
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    Sir Headless VIISir Headless VII Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    WOW is a game. People play games to have fun. If you aren't having fun playing the game don't play. If people are making the game not fun don't play with those people. Also "here's the store" isn't an expression.

    Sir Headless VII on
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    GafotoGafoto Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Beasteh wrote: »
    Perpetual wrote: »
    Quit WoW and never look back.

    seriously this is the best choice i made with my life this year
    I agree. All the time spent cultivating internet friends could be spent cultivating friends you can see, hear and depending on how much they like you, touch.

    Gafoto on
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    exisexis Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    OP seems to like playing WoW. It's great that people quit it and are happier for it, but that doesn't seem to be what this thread is about.

    @OP: Quit your guild and find another. Consider transferring servers. It's not too expensive if you spend a lot of time playing WoW, and it opens up a bazillion different options as far as raid times and types of people go. If you're looking for progression raiding, consider applying to a bunch of other guilds first, and transfer if you're accepted to any.

    exis on
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    cr0wcr0w Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2010
    Yeah, if you're happy with the game itself, there's no reason to quit. Check the WoW forums in the guild recruitment section and see if there are any guilds that fit your requirements and talk to them and see if there's mutual interest. If the people are the only source of trouble for you in the game, by all means do whatever you can to continue enjoying it. You can't continue to let these people treat you this way, though, just because you feel like you have no other options to continue in the game.

    If you have to leave and miss a few raids, it's not the end of the world. Take your time to find better people and it will increase your enjoyment and experience tenfold.

    cr0w on
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    PerpetualPerpetual Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    exis wrote: »
    OP seems to like playing WoW. It's great that people quit it and are happier for it, but that doesn't seem to be what this thread is about.

    OP: Guys, the people I do drugs with are treating me badly.
    Everyone: Stop doing drugs.
    Exis: well, the OP seems to like doing drugs. It's great that people quit it and are happier for it, but that doesn't seem to be what this thread is about.
    cr0w wrote: »
    Yeah, if you're happy with the game itself, there's no reason to quit.

    Um, there are plenty of great reasons to quit WoW. You know it. I know it. Everyone who plays knows it. So let's stop beating around the bush with "weeeeeellllll if you really enjoy it you don't have to quit."

    Perpetual on
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    eternalbleternalbl Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Beasteh wrote: »
    and all those faceless wow 'friends'?

    yeah once you quit they'll drop you like a bad habit

    do yourself a favor and pull the plug

    While it's petered down to 1 now, I still talked frequently with a good number of the people I met playing lineage after I quit, through MSN and e-mail. I guess it really depends on who you are, I just played lineage because I enjoyed it and joined a group of people who also were just cool people who played lineage some in their spare time.
    Perpetual wrote:
    exis wrote: View Post
    OP seems to like playing WoW. It's great that people quit it and are happier for it, but that doesn't seem to be what this thread is about.
    OP: Guys, the people I do drugs with are treating me badly.
    Everyone: Stop doing drugs.
    Exis: well, the OP seems to like doing drugs. It's great that people quit it and are happier for it, but that doesn't seem to be what this thread is about.

    cr0w wrote: View Post
    Yeah, if you're happy with the game itself, there's no reason to quit.
    Um, there are plenty of great reasons to quit WoW. You know it. I know it. Everyone who plays knows it. So let's stop beating around the bush with "weeeeeellllll if you really enjoy it you don't have to quit."

    That's cool if quitting WoW has helped you gain a better social life or re-focus on studies or whatever. But quit preaching. Some people are perfectly capable of having a life and enjoying some WoW occasionally.

    eternalbl on
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    PerpetualPerpetual Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    eternalbl wrote: »
    That's cool if quitting WoW has helped you gain a better social life or re-focus on studies or whatever. But quit preaching. Some people are perfectly capable of having a life and enjoying some WoW occasionally.

    You should read the OP again and ask yourself if he sounds like such a person.

    Perpetual on
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    eternalbleternalbl Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Perpetual wrote: »
    eternalbl wrote: »
    That's cool if quitting WoW has helped you gain a better social life or re-focus on studies or whatever. But quit preaching. Some people are perfectly capable of having a life and enjoying some WoW occasionally.

    You should read the OP again and ask yourself if he sounds like such a person.

    Because he says he's having trouble with friends IRL? I'm not about to assume WoW is the problem when he's given no info.

    Otherwise, of course he should be pissed that his friends are stiffing him.

    Basically, I don't think there's anything that could give either of us the info to decide that for him.

    eternalbl on
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    Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    The plain fact is that millions of people play/have played WoW while maintaining entirely normal, healthy lives, and jobs, and so on. This whole "wow destroys your life quit while you caaaannnnn" thing is like this generation's reefer madness or something.

    Anyway, OP, your guild sucks. Too bad, it happens. Go find a new one! There are some pretty great options in the mmo subforum.

    ed: and not to put too fine a point on it, but raiding with people who suck? Not worth it.

    Eat it You Nasty Pig. on
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    RikushixRikushix VancouverRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Perpetual wrote: »
    eternalbl wrote: »
    That's cool if quitting WoW has helped you gain a better social life or re-focus on studies or whatever. But quit preaching. Some people are perfectly capable of having a life and enjoying some WoW occasionally.

    You should read the OP again and ask yourself if he sounds like such a person.

    The point is that the OP has not asked whether he should quit WoW or not. He has not demonstrated once that he is no longer enjoying the game. Which is why it's kinda presumptuous to say "just quit." Not terrible advice, but not really on topic, either.

    Rikushix on
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    AdusAdus Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Honestly if this were about any other form of recreation than WoW, people wouldn't harp on quitting so much. "My Karate class pisses me off, I enjoy the practice but the other people in the class make it a frustrating experience." "Well maybe you should just quit!"

    Adus on
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    EshEsh Tending bar. FFXIV. Motorcycles. Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Adus wrote: »
    Honestly if this were about any other form of recreation than WoW, people wouldn't harp on quitting so much. "My Karate class pisses me off, I enjoy the practice but the other people in the class make it a frustrating experience." "Well maybe you should just quit!"

    That's a pretty terrible analogy.

    Esh on
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    AdusAdus Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Thanks for your opinion, I guess?

    Adus on
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    DemerdarDemerdar Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Oh man. H&A turning into a firing range, lol :^:

    Demerdar on
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    Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    1) If you want to keep playing WoW, I'd recommend transferring to another server or re-rolling. Everything else is not worth the drama. Regardless of how "real" WoW actually is, you're going to treat the relationships there like any other relationship in your life, and if things end on bad terms then constantly being reminded of that person or running into them isn't going to help your ability to get over the whole thing. Every time you see them or their guild tag, your blood is going to boil and you're going to get pissed off. You're going to bring up or get dragged into discussions about the guild with other people. You will develop a "reputation" based on past interaction and, fair or not, people will judge you for it. Your WoW life is easier if you just leave the whole thing altogether and try to move on.

    2) Maybe take this as an opportunity to re-asses your priorities and how much time you spend investing in a game like WoW. If it's your cup of tea, more power to you. But if everything else in your life brings you dissatisfaction and you're only using WoW as a means to get away, then perhaps you could be spending your time addressing these things first. If you are coming to a situation where your WoW guild/social life falls apart and you feel like your world is coming to an end, then that would be a giant red flag to me.

    Inquisitor77 on
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    CryogenCryogen Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    1) If you want to keep playing WoW, I'd recommend transferring to another server or re-rolling. Everything else is not worth the drama. Regardless of how "real" WoW actually is, you're going to treat the relationships there like any other relationship in your life, and if things end on bad terms then constantly being reminded of that person or running into them isn't going to help your ability to get over the whole thing. Every time you see them or their guild tag, your blood is going to boil and you're going to get pissed off. You're going to bring up or get dragged into discussions about the guild with other people. You will develop a "reputation" based on past interaction and, fair or not, people will judge you for it. Your WoW life is easier if you just leave the whole thing altogether and try to move on.

    This is the best advice imho, assuming you actually want to continue playing. WoW (and the internet in general) is actually worse than real life relationships in this sense, in that people will openly be huge dicks right to your face or act like an internet toughguy, where in real life the person would typically just ignore you at worst. Reroll or transfer.

    Cryogen on
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    QuidQuid Definitely not a banana Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    I'd recommend the server transfer if you want to keep playing too. Go on the forums and look for guilds that raid when convenient for you, contact them, and see if they could use another person.

    Quid on
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    cr0wcr0w Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited September 2010
    Perpetual wrote: »
    exis wrote: »
    Um, there are plenty of great reasons to quit WoW. You know it. I know it. Everyone who plays knows it. So let's stop beating around the bush with "weeeeeellllll if you really enjoy it you don't have to quit."

    In our minds, yes. There are tons of reasons. Basing my opinion on the OP's post, he may not see it that way.

    cr0w on
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    NylonathetepNylonathetep Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    You should Join up with the Penny Arcade Guilds in Dark Iron. We are on the Alliance Side thou but we are cool people and we have like 5 - 6 guilds of people in one giant Guild Alliance. We have different Raid groups and many raids running (including weekends).

    From my experience... while there are good people out there online.. I would be very careful about who you call friends on the internet. There's all kinds of people online... while most act friendly they won't go the distance or return favours for you just because being online isn't real to them... there's definate your share of moochers (real life and digital) that just takes and takes and won't offer anything back.. and ofcourse the guildie backstabber who talks behind your back.

    It's much easier on the web because you get to see more people online, you can get stuff with minimual effort (farming gold is quite easy on WoW now), as well as talking behind people's back using /tells and officer chats.

    Nylonathetep on
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    SipexSipex Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Esh wrote: »
    Adus wrote: »
    Honestly if this were about any other form of recreation than WoW, people wouldn't harp on quitting so much. "My Karate class pisses me off, I enjoy the practice but the other people in the class make it a frustrating experience." "Well maybe you should just quit!"

    That's a pretty terrible analogy.

    How so Esh? It makes sense to me.

    I'm honestly curious. I hear this thrown around a lot and I'm beginning to think it's an internet response to any analogy.

    Sipex on
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    EshEsh Tending bar. FFXIV. Motorcycles. Portland, ORRegistered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Sipex wrote: »
    Esh wrote: »
    Adus wrote: »
    Honestly if this were about any other form of recreation than WoW, people wouldn't harp on quitting so much. "My Karate class pisses me off, I enjoy the practice but the other people in the class make it a frustrating experience." "Well maybe you should just quit!"

    That's a pretty terrible analogy.

    How so Esh? It makes sense to me.

    I'm honestly curious. I hear this thrown around a lot and I'm beginning to think it's an internet response to any analogy.

    Last time I checked Karate didn't involve the soul crushing time commitment that progression in WoW does. Also, it's quite a bit healthier for you. It's like comparing Coca Cola to V8. Sure, they both quench the thirst, but one is infinitely better for you.

    EDIT: One will actually benefit you in the long run.

    Esh on
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    SipexSipex Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Eh, I can't see that being too important in this case.

    Basically, I just see "I have a social activity that I enjoy but the people there are dicks but leaving the group will seriously impede my ability to enjoy this activity, what do I do?"

    I'm done though, don't want to take this off track.

    Sipex on
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    edited September 2010
    Honestly, when you get older, you will almost certainly come to regret having spent your Friday and Saturday nights raiding in WoW. I mean, it's one thing if you're just doing it in your off time, but actually scheduling your life around a video game sucks.

    Seriously, you're only young once.

    Thanatos on
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