I am surprised really that Barter wasn't a bigger part of the Fallout universe from the beginning. Aside from violence, the wasteland would be built on trade.
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful. I want Long Haul and Pack Rat so I can hoard stuff, not so I can sell it. My use for the perks are opposite to what the skill required is. I am allowed to say this.
Further more, I'm going to proceed to kick the back of your chair while I do my crying. Enjoy that.
And if you want Pack Rat and Long Haul, then it's not such a useless skill anymore, is it?
Except the skill is? The skill itself is utterly useless. Its just going to be a sinkhole in which 70 points disappear to enable two whole perks. I think Pack Rat and Long Haul probably should have been simply connected to ST, EN or AG. Even all three would make sense at the same time. Since I'm not selling the goods, and the entire point of Barter as a skill, is to better trading, Barter itself is useless to me as both a player and a character.
I'll be hoarding stuff, one way or the other, those two perks were basically going to make it not a massive pain that causes me to stop playing every time I clear out an area. Fallout 3 (as all inventory games do) had a simple formula for me:
Go to area.
Kill everything. Search corpses.
Pick up loose odds and ends.
Spend 10 minutes walking super slow trying to find a box to stuff things in.
Fiddle with companions inventory to get them to help carry stuff.
Save and quit, because I don't feel like spending the next hour going back and forth between the box and my home.
Long Haul in particular would put an end to that, since I could grab all the stuff from the box, fast travel to my home and be done with it. There isn't anything in the world that would stop me from turning the Wasteland into the cleanest place on Earth. Those two were just ways to make my maid job easier.
Ya know, maybe I should create a character who is a butler or a janitor. That every character I create has OCD and can't stand the disorder of the items littered around.
tl; dr I collect things like a damned magpie and it can often cut short my good time.
Klash on
We don't even care... whether we care or not...
0
mrt144King of the NumbernamesRegistered Userregular
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful. I want Long Haul and Pack Rat so I can hoard stuff, not so I can sell it. My use for the perks are opposite to what the skill required is. I am allowed to say this.
Further more, I'm going to proceed to kick the back of your chair while I do my crying. Enjoy that.
You want a free lunch. That's not good for gameplay.
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful. I want Long Haul and Pack Rat so I can hoard stuff, not so I can sell it. My use for the perks are opposite to what the skill required is. I am allowed to say this.
Further more, I'm going to proceed to kick the back of your chair while I do my crying. Enjoy that.
You want a free lunch. That's not good for gameplay.
Its cool that you're choosing to tell me how I'm playing, but you're wrong. If I wanted a free lunch I'd whine about maxing everything and being a God. I'm not asking for a low requirement or no requirement, I'm saying that I think the current requirement was a bad choice. I got bottom of the page'd, so I'll say it again:
One way or the other, its all coming with me. Its a matter of whether I get pissed off in the process.
Its cool that you're choosing to tell me how I'm playing, but you're wrong. If I wanted a free lunch I'd whine about maxing everything and being a God. I'm not asking for a low requirement or no requirement, I'm saying that I think the current requirement was a bad choice. I got bottom of the page'd, so I'll say it again:
One way or the other, its all coming with me. Its a matter of whether I get pissed off in the process.
How is it a bad choice? You are practically proposing that barter should be made useless again because of your personal issues.
Both this skills were adjusted to the barter skill for reason of balance.
A little disappointed that the devs mentioned clearing the cache might be necessary on the 360 version.
O
I'm disappointed that I'm at all in the business of clearing caches on a console. That shit should be automatic. Plus as noted in my other post, doing so may erase some updates.
And.... why are you disappointed by that?
Lots of games can have problems with a full cache or slow down. Clear it. You will experience wonders.
Bad posting, on a mobile. See response embedded in your quote...
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful. I want Long Haul and Pack Rat so I can hoard stuff, not so I can sell it. My use for the perks are opposite to what the skill required is. I am allowed to say this.
Further more, I'm going to proceed to kick the back of your chair while I do my crying. Enjoy that.
You want a free lunch. That's not good for gameplay.
Its cool that you're choosing to tell me how I'm playing, but you're wrong. If I wanted a free lunch I'd whine about maxing everything and being a God. I'm not asking for a low requirement or no requirement, I'm saying that I think the current requirement was a bad choice. I got bottom of the page'd, so I'll say it again:
One way or the other, its all coming with me. Its a matter of whether I get pissed off in the process.
It's only a bad choice if you feel ridiculously inconvenienced by having to make choices with short term negative consequences for a greater goal.
How is it a bad choice? You are practically proposing that barter should be made useless again because of your personal issues.
Both this skills were adjusted to the barter skill for reason of balance.
Because I think the link between what the perk does and its requirement isn't great. I get that the idea is you're taking more shit so that you can sell it. For me, that isn't how it works. Again, I already said why. Don't need to say it a third time, do I?
If I really wanted to whine, would I not be saying there shouldn't be perks for it? Would I not be saying that it should be an automatic feature that your character just has?
I'm more than willing to give up to spots for what are, nominally, worthless perks that only help you move things back to your stash*. After a certain point, you've found the best gear lying around on the ground, after a certain point caps don't mean anything, so even for Barter, those perks become useless. I'll always want to pick up trash, though.
Like I said, I think it'd have been better linked to all the SPECIAL stats that logically require that type of strength. The ST to actually lift the extra crap, the EN to continue doing so and the AG to not trip over your own feet.
Its like putting points in Swimming when playing Deus Ex.
It's only a bad choice if you feel ridiculously inconvenienced by having to make choices with short term negative consequences for a greater goal.
I do feel inconvenienced. Quite some bit, considering, as I said, I'll be snagging all the goodie goods and it will take a long time without Long Haul.
There is just nothing more to be said here, I do X, you don't, since I do X, Y seems silly, since you don't, it doesn't.
*Yes. Worthless, even for the magpie. I will not be using 90% of what I take back. I will have 3 weapons I actually use, one suit of armour and one helmet. Everything else will be useless, outside of specific moments like a rad suit in a high rad area.
Edit: For what it's worth, Broken Steel almost killed me. The endless power armours was murder. It was like Bethesda were playing a cruel joke on me.
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful.
Your very complaint defeats your point so hilariously it's not even that funny in the end. The whole reason Barter is tied to those skills is *precisely* to strengthen Barter as a skill. There is even a quote in the previous thread that is precisely the logic. Barter gives you access to great perks and increased prices for what you sell (it also allows you to negotiate for better rewards for some quests as well).
You can't whine that Barter is useless and then note the two great advantages Barter based characters enjoy. That's just ridiculous.
Edit: It appears everyone disagrees with you (In reality I should have read further than just immediately responding, it looks like dogpiling for dogpilings sake). Also, for what it's worth this is also the way I would have designed the game. Skills that are a bit less useful, like Barter deserve very strong advantages elsewhere and perks are the place in Fallout to do it.
So I played a lot of Red Dead before this. I was afraid it might burn me out on the whole western/desert thing.
...pretty much had the exact opposite effect. Instead of eying Anti-Material rifles, I'm in anticipation for a .357 and a duster.
Frosty the Snow Plow on
0
AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
edited October 2010
I have decided to get the cannibalism ball rolling that I will let my character almost starve to death with no food before I do it the first time. Seems an appropriate way to start something like that (especially because you cannot start with the cannibalism perk). I imagine that period will be an utter bastard given that starvation probably imposes some penalties.
Sirialisof the Halite Throne.Registered Userregular
edited October 2010
A guy at Bethesda forum says he has the guide for NV
Implant spoilers
IMPLANTS:
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants.
A guy at Bethesda forum says he has the guide for NV
Implant spoilers
IMPLANTS:
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants. (1 endurance per implant)
So essentially you need 6 endurance to get the whole SPECIAL package and 8 to get the extra two? Hm. Time to rework my build.
Frosty the Snow Plow on
0
Sirialisof the Halite Throne.Registered Userregular
A guy at Bethesda forum says he has the guide for NV
Implant spoilers
IMPLANTS:
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants. (1 endurance per implant)
So essentially you need 6 endurance to get the whole SPECIAL package and 8 to get the extra two? Hm. Time to rework my build.
No, I edited my post and removed that part about it being 1 endurance per implant, it was another guy that said that, and he "heard it somewhere" I'm not putting much faith in that bit yet then.
A guy at Bethesda forum says he has the guide for NV
Implant spoilers
IMPLANTS:
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants. (1 endurance per implant)
So essentially you need 6 endurance to get the whole SPECIAL package and 8 to get the extra two? Hm. Time to rework my build.
No, I edited my post and removed that part, it was another guy that said that, and he "heard it somewhere" I'm not putting much faith in that bit then.
And it would have been 7 and 9, not 6 and 8.
If Endurance would've required one and given one, it would've essentially been a free implant, yes? There's seven SPECIAL stats.
And rad. I really didn't want to rework my build.
Frosty the Snow Plow on
0
Sirialisof the Halite Throne.Registered Userregular
A guy at Bethesda forum says he has the guide for NV
Implant spoilers
IMPLANTS:
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants. (1 endurance per implant)
So essentially you need 6 endurance to get the whole SPECIAL package and 8 to get the extra two? Hm. Time to rework my build.
No, I edited my post and removed that part, it was another guy that said that, and he "heard it somewhere" I'm not putting much faith in that bit then.
And it would have been 7 and 9, not 6 and 8.
If Endurance would've required one and given one, it would've essentially been a free implant, yes? There's seven SPECIAL stats.
And rad. I really didn't want to rework my build.
It might still be true, the problem is that the guide doesnt describe the prerequisites that well.
Posts
no u
I don't think Barter is a decent skill and I don't like it hampering the two perks I view as the most useful. I want Long Haul and Pack Rat so I can hoard stuff, not so I can sell it. My use for the perks are opposite to what the skill required is. I am allowed to say this.
Further more, I'm going to proceed to kick the back of your chair while I do my crying. Enjoy that.
I love asplorin.
Hey, I have a blog! (Actually being updated again!)
3DS: 0860-3240-2604
So, should I go for a second?
Steam: CavilatRest
Perception 6
Endurance 7
Charisma 1
Intellijence 6
Agility 8
Luck 7
Traits: Trigger Discipline, Small Frame
Hardcore run:
Level 2 Friend of the Night (PE6, Sneak 30)
Level 4 Educated (Int 4)
Level 6 Cannibal
Level 8 Strong Back (Str 5, End 5)
Level 10 The Professional (Sneak 70)
Level 12 Sniper (Pe 6, Agi 6)
Level 14 Adamantium Skeleton
Level 16 Better Criticals (Per 6, Lck 6)
Level 18 Jury Rigging (Repair 90)
Level 20 Grim Reaper's Sprint
Except the skill is? The skill itself is utterly useless. Its just going to be a sinkhole in which 70 points disappear to enable two whole perks. I think Pack Rat and Long Haul probably should have been simply connected to ST, EN or AG. Even all three would make sense at the same time. Since I'm not selling the goods, and the entire point of Barter as a skill, is to better trading, Barter itself is useless to me as both a player and a character.
I'll be hoarding stuff, one way or the other, those two perks were basically going to make it not a massive pain that causes me to stop playing every time I clear out an area. Fallout 3 (as all inventory games do) had a simple formula for me:
Go to area.
Kill everything. Search corpses.
Pick up loose odds and ends.
Spend 10 minutes walking super slow trying to find a box to stuff things in.
Fiddle with companions inventory to get them to help carry stuff.
Save and quit, because I don't feel like spending the next hour going back and forth between the box and my home.
Long Haul in particular would put an end to that, since I could grab all the stuff from the box, fast travel to my home and be done with it. There isn't anything in the world that would stop me from turning the Wasteland into the cleanest place on Earth. Those two were just ways to make my maid job easier.
Ya know, maybe I should create a character who is a butler or a janitor. That every character I create has OCD and can't stand the disorder of the items littered around.
tl; dr I collect things like a damned magpie and it can often cut short my good time.
You want a free lunch. That's not good for gameplay.
No link, but you can see the blurb over there. You know where. That place? With those people? Don't make say it...
Perception: 6
Endurance: 5
Charisma: 4
Intelligence: 8
Agility: 6
Luck: 5
Traits:
Trigger Discipline
Wild Wasteland
Lvl. 02: Friend of the Night
Lvl. 04: Educated
Lvl. 06: Comprehension
Lvl. 08: Commando
Lvl. 10: Pack Rat
Lvl. 12: Sniper
Lvl. 14: Strong Back
Lvl. 16: Adamantium Skeleton
Lvl. 18: Better Criticals
Lvl. 20: Grim Reaper's Sprint
Lvl. 22: Long Haul
Lvl. 24: Explorer
Lvl. 26: Nuka Chemist
Lvl. 28: Nerves of Steel
Its cool that you're choosing to tell me how I'm playing, but you're wrong. If I wanted a free lunch I'd whine about maxing everything and being a God. I'm not asking for a low requirement or no requirement, I'm saying that I think the current requirement was a bad choice. I got bottom of the page'd, so I'll say it again:
One way or the other, its all coming with me. Its a matter of whether I get pissed off in the process.
And.... why are you disappointed by that?
Lots of games can have problems with a full cache or slow down. Clear it. You will experience wonders.
How is it a bad choice? You are practically proposing that barter should be made useless again because of your personal issues.
Both this skills were adjusted to the barter skill for reason of balance.
I *think* you can hold down the 'A' button while the game is loading. Seems to me that I had to do this with Oblivion as well.
There is some other way to do it via memory management in the dashboard, but AFAIK that deletes some software updates too.
Bad posting, on a mobile. See response embedded in your quote...
It's only a bad choice if you feel ridiculously inconvenienced by having to make choices with short term negative consequences for a greater goal.
Because I think the link between what the perk does and its requirement isn't great. I get that the idea is you're taking more shit so that you can sell it. For me, that isn't how it works. Again, I already said why. Don't need to say it a third time, do I?
If I really wanted to whine, would I not be saying there shouldn't be perks for it? Would I not be saying that it should be an automatic feature that your character just has?
I'm more than willing to give up to spots for what are, nominally, worthless perks that only help you move things back to your stash*. After a certain point, you've found the best gear lying around on the ground, after a certain point caps don't mean anything, so even for Barter, those perks become useless. I'll always want to pick up trash, though.
Like I said, I think it'd have been better linked to all the SPECIAL stats that logically require that type of strength. The ST to actually lift the extra crap, the EN to continue doing so and the AG to not trip over your own feet.
Its like putting points in Swimming when playing Deus Ex.
I do feel inconvenienced. Quite some bit, considering, as I said, I'll be snagging all the goodie goods and it will take a long time without Long Haul.
There is just nothing more to be said here, I do X, you don't, since I do X, Y seems silly, since you don't, it doesn't.
*Yes. Worthless, even for the magpie. I will not be using 90% of what I take back. I will have 3 weapons I actually use, one suit of armour and one helmet. Everything else will be useless, outside of specific moments like a rad suit in a high rad area.
Edit: For what it's worth, Broken Steel almost killed me. The endless power armours was murder. It was like Bethesda were playing a cruel joke on me.
I just can't say no to Romans.
Your very complaint defeats your point so hilariously it's not even that funny in the end. The whole reason Barter is tied to those skills is *precisely* to strengthen Barter as a skill. There is even a quote in the previous thread that is precisely the logic. Barter gives you access to great perks and increased prices for what you sell (it also allows you to negotiate for better rewards for some quests as well).
You can't whine that Barter is useless and then note the two great advantages Barter based characters enjoy. That's just ridiculous.
Edit: It appears everyone disagrees with you (In reality I should have read further than just immediately responding, it looks like dogpiling for dogpilings sake). Also, for what it's worth this is also the way I would have designed the game. Skills that are a bit less useful, like Barter deserve very strong advantages elsewhere and perks are the place in Fallout to do it.
I'm gonna try and do it Yojimbo style.
I'm going with them first for the same reason.
S - 4
P - 6
E - 4
C - 6
I - 6
A - 8
L - 6
Tagging small guns, lock pick, and sneak.
Wild wasteland on.
Cowboy will be a key perk.
You can mathematically predict the time, frequency, and precise blood rage every single topic will have on them.
...pretty much had the exact opposite effect. Instead of eying Anti-Material rifles, I'm in anticipation for a .357 and a duster.
Seven more hours!
Implant spoilers
The cost of implants are astronomical, even with a huge barter skill, you need caps in the thousands, or tens of thousands. They are not tailored to low level players.
Agility Implant + 1 AGL (End, AGL < 10)
Charisma Implant +1 charisma (End,CHR < 10)
Sub-Dermal Armor +4 damage threshold
Endurance Implant + 1 END (END, END < 10)
Intelligence Implant + 1 INT (End, INT < 10)
Luck Implant +1 Luck (End, Luck < 10)
Perception Implant +1 PER (End,Per needs to be < 10)
Moncyte Breeder: slowly regen lost HP 1 hp every 10 sec (need necessary funds and END)
Srenth Implant +1 STR, (END, STR < 10)
Purchased from Doctor Usanagi at New Vegas Medical Center and only there. Need Endurance to handle implants.
No, I edited my post and removed that part about it being 1 endurance per implant, it was another guy that said that, and he "heard it somewhere" I'm not putting much faith in that bit yet then.
And it would have been 7 and 9, not 6 and 8.
Voice Acting
If Endurance would've required one and given one, it would've essentially been a free implant, yes? There's seven SPECIAL stats.
And rad. I really didn't want to rework my build.
It might still be true, the problem is that the guide doesnt describe the prerequisites that well.
Shitty Tumblr:lighthouse1138.tumblr.com