T: winky I have been reading more things and find myself disagreeing more and more with dawkin's gene-centrism
but also i kind of think the argument is useless semantics in a way
I disagree with you on both counts.
I think we should argue about it because I just recently finished the selfish gene.
Well my main criticism (and I know you commented on this a bit ago) is that selection doesn't really act on genes
I mean surely genes code for traits that are acted on by selection, but I feel the gene-centered view is a bit too...theoretical? That isn't the word...to me it seems like if you say that this gene was more successful than another, it isn't really true. The gene by itself wasn't successful, it was what the gene coded for that was successful. Like, take a fish with an antifreeze protein in the blood. The antifreeze phenotype (or lack thereof) is what determines the success of the fish. The antifreeze gene doesn't necessarily determine success. What if gene expression is interrupted? Then you could HAVE the gene, but selection wouldn't be operating on it anymore, it would be operating on the expressed phenotype.
Man this is kind of rambling, but I am trying to sort through data unrelated to this
You see, but you're still thinking of the organism as the unit there. The organism is the environment for the gene, and is putting selective pressure on the gene itself. If there is some collection of factors that is preventing expression, then the gene is being selected against (granted, of course, the gene is actually benefiting the organism's survival when expressed). The gene (or in this case, more accurately, gene complex) will feel a selective pressure towards expressing despite whatever factors are preventing it.
Anyway, the idea behind the gene being the unit is that it's what specifically holds the information to create anything in the organism. It doesn't matter how massively successful an organism is at survival if its genetic code isn't passed on. There's got to be a better way of explaining this point, I should dwell on it.
And then you start peeing, but your penis is aimed too high
And you accidentally pee into the space between the toilet bowl and the seat
And you end up pissing all over the floor but you don't notice it until your feet are all wet?
UGH
ugh I HATE THIS
FUCK MORNING WOOD
you guys are goddam retarded geese
i mean it isn't your fault you have wangs that look like corkscrews but you figure at this age you would know how to use them
geese all bein dumb
fark u shaz
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Rear Admiral ChocoI wanna be an owl, Jerry!Owl York CityRegistered Userregular
edited November 2010
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
I'm going to ask for a hundred yards of soft pink quilt for Christmas.
Then I'll sow a giant vagina costume for Choco and a giant dick costume for me and I'll bend over and run at him from across the room and make airplane noises.
Every time a woman argues for a feminist point of view, she is always told to stop being so touchy, or emotional, or irrational.
It's a really nasty bit of rhetoric and it drives me insane.
Also, being told how to post by someone who i don't even know? unimpressed, don't care if it was "joking", and fairly convinced that claiming it was a joke was just backtracking anyway.
but enough about that. more billy connolly!
I rather liked his part in Series of Unfortunate Events.
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
argh, fitting morning wood inside a toilet bowl is urgh
the worst game of operation, played in worst circumstances
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
I PUT MY MOUTH ON THAT PENIS
This is how penises work! You need to know the risks!
I'm going to ask for a hundred yards of soft pink quilt for Christmas.
Then I'll sow a giant vagina costume for Choco and a giant dick costume for me and I'll bend over and run at him from across the room and make airplane noises.
ITT all of chat will never forget to knock on cass' and chocos door ever again
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
this i understand
it's even worse because your bodys natural reaction to really really needing to hold in a piss is to get a boner
so if you reallllly need to pee then you might do that too
Arch I'm gonna go take a shower and go to class, but I really want to resume this discussion later. A thread about it might be neat, we haven't had an evolution thread in a while.
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
T: winky I have been reading more things and find myself disagreeing more and more with dawkin's gene-centrism
but also i kind of think the argument is useless semantics in a way
I disagree with you on both counts.
I think we should argue about it because I just recently finished the selfish gene.
Well my main criticism (and I know you commented on this a bit ago) is that selection doesn't really act on genes
I mean surely genes code for traits that are acted on by selection, but I feel the gene-centered view is a bit too...theoretical? That isn't the word...to me it seems like if you say that this gene was more successful than another, it isn't really true. The gene by itself wasn't successful, it was what the gene coded for that was successful. Like, take a fish with an antifreeze protein in the blood. The antifreeze phenotype (or lack thereof) is what determines the success of the fish. The antifreeze gene doesn't necessarily determine success. What if gene expression is interrupted? Then you could HAVE the gene, but selection wouldn't be operating on it anymore, it would be operating on the expressed phenotype.
Man this is kind of rambling, but I am trying to sort through data unrelated to this
You see, but you're still thinking of the organism as the unit there. The organism is the environment for the gene, and is putting selective pressure on the gene itself. If there is some collection of factors that is preventing expression, then the gene is being selected against (granted, of course, the gene is actually benefiting the organism's survival when expressed). The gene (or in this case, more accurately, gene complex) will feel a selective pressure towards expressing despite whatever factors are preventing it.
Anyway, the idea behind the gene being the unit is that it's what specifically holds the information to create anything in the organism. It doesn't matter how massively successful an organism is at survival if its genetic code isn't passed on. There's got to be a better way of explaining this point, I should dwell on it.
I guess by analogy we don't select video games solely on the quality of their code, but by how all of the code works together.
And I think if you go out and say "well the gene as the unit of selection really applies to all the genes and genetic complexes and interactions in an organism"
well seems to me you aren't really talking about genes as the unit of selection anymore, which is why I feel this is sort of a semantic battle at best, and at worst is a useless argument in the vein of the cis-regulatory/protein coding argument currently gracing Evolutionary Developmental biology.
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
this i understand
it's even worse because your bodys natural reaction to really really needing to hold in a piss is to get a boner
so if you reallllly need to pee then you might do that too
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
Arch I'm gonna go take a shower and go to class, but I really want to resume this discussion later. A thread about it might be neat, we haven't had an evolution thread in a while.
Remember the H/A thread with the lady who's husband would piss on her in the shower and then spread his asscheeks and all the shit from his unwiped ass would rain on her?
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
I PUT MY MOUTH ON THAT PENIS
It isn't like I don't wash it after. :P
It's exactly like that.
We never wash it after, Cass.
yeah why would we we're not putting our mouths on it
The worst is when you're tired and you've got morning wood and you sit down on the toilet to go pee and then your wang rises before you can really get going and it hits the cold underside of the seat, waking you up with a jolt and the knowledge that your dick just touched a spot that just cannot be trusted for being clean.
I PUT MY MOUTH ON THAT PENIS
It isn't like I don't wash it after. :P
It's exactly like that.
We never wash it after, Cass.
yeah why would we we're not putting our mouths on it
Also EM I would be willing to bet that in addition to curing women of histeria by fingerbanging them, olde-time doctors probably proscribed a lot of dick. As an in-office treatment.
Psycho Internet Hawk on
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SarksusATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered Userregular
Arch I'm gonna go take a shower and go to class, but I really want to resume this discussion later. A thread about it might be neat, we haven't had an evolution thread in a while.
Hmmm!
I thought that this was a part of the peeing conversation and wondered if you were actually going to make a thread on the evolution of penises in a peeing context.
Posts
You see, but you're still thinking of the organism as the unit there. The organism is the environment for the gene, and is putting selective pressure on the gene itself. If there is some collection of factors that is preventing expression, then the gene is being selected against (granted, of course, the gene is actually benefiting the organism's survival when expressed). The gene (or in this case, more accurately, gene complex) will feel a selective pressure towards expressing despite whatever factors are preventing it.
Anyway, the idea behind the gene being the unit is that it's what specifically holds the information to create anything in the organism. It doesn't matter how massively successful an organism is at survival if its genetic code isn't passed on. There's got to be a better way of explaining this point, I should dwell on it.
all consumed with hatred for the cunt who designed modern toilets
I am totally Team Dawkins, I have to admit.
that is what we're talking about here. You sit down because you're tired and drunk or sick or whatever
and then you aim too high because you're not thinking about it and it goes through the gap beetween seat and bowl and urgh
and you're not in any mood to deal with that at all
Then I'll sow a giant vagina costume for Choco and a giant dick costume for me and I'll bend over and run at him from across the room and make airplane noises.
I rather liked his part in Series of Unfortunate Events.
Also, sometimes vibrators.
I like how they show the women using it on their back and head.
i know right
o ya?!
I PUT MY MOUTH ON THAT PENIS
I've done this exactly once. Three weeks ago.
argh, fitting morning wood inside a toilet bowl is urgh
the worst game of operation, played in worst circumstances
or the lunge! it's not as active as it sounds.
This is how penises work! You need to know the risks!
Now all I can think of is doing the exercise and thrusting towards the toilet as I piss
ITT all of chat will never forget to knock on cass' and chocos door ever again
this i understand
it's even worse because your bodys natural reaction to really really needing to hold in a piss is to get a boner
so if you reallllly need to pee then you might do that too
did the doctors actually think they were helping women
or did they just want to finger women by abusing their authority
what the hell
why have we made toilets in a way that is not incredibly practical for us and useless for the females?
what's up with that?
It isn't like I don't wash it after. :P
I guess by analogy we don't select video games solely on the quality of their code, but by how all of the code works together.
And I think if you go out and say "well the gene as the unit of selection really applies to all the genes and genetic complexes and interactions in an organism"
well seems to me you aren't really talking about genes as the unit of selection anymore, which is why I feel this is sort of a semantic battle at best, and at worst is a useless argument in the vein of the cis-regulatory/protein coding argument currently gracing Evolutionary Developmental biology.
Solution: pee in the shower.
It's exactly like that.
We never wash it after, Cass.
Hmmm!
There were almost certainly both types.
Now whether it originated with one or the other, I don't really know.
yeah why would we we're not putting our mouths on it
My recollection of history was that in the Victorian times many society women went for repeated, seemingly unnecessary treatments.
That may or may not apply to Choco.
Just a typical day here in D&D!
Also EM I would be willing to bet that in addition to curing women of histeria by fingerbanging them, olde-time doctors probably proscribed a lot of dick. As an in-office treatment.
I thought that this was a part of the peeing conversation and wondered if you were actually going to make a thread on the evolution of penises in a peeing context.
thus the vibrator
can't be assed to turn on the light at 3:00am