Determining rent

That_Spoony_Bard

So we have a friend who's staying with us currently (for those of you who remember...same person in the last thread that I created). She stayed with us for about a month and a half for free before she was able to get college and a job lined up. She's now working p/t at a fast food joint and going to school pretty much full time. Because of her situation, she is able to get grant money (tuition covered + 1,200 dollars cash...or something like that) every quarter.

Now, I've looked around the area and it seems like the average price for a private room + a bathroom is roughly 300 dollars. Based on what she makes (minimum wage in WA is...8.55?), as well as the quarterly grants, is 300 dollars + 1/3 of electric bill a reasonable amount to ask for? I want her to feel like she's being independent, but I don't want to be ripping her off/making it so she can't save up for whatever.

EggyToast

Since you're doing this as a favor for a friend, but still want her to pay rent, I wouldn't look to the local housing prices and set a number. I would use something more like Section 8 calculations, which is 30% of gross income. That way it's clear that it's based on how much she has, and is reasonable, rather than something arguably arbitrary.

Deebaser

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

Darkewolfe

Are you prepared to either throw her out or have a knock-down, drag-out fight over rent if her means ever increases and you think it appropriate to raiser her rent? If not, set it at equal to or just below local market standard.

Al_wat

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend. Charging rent is one (totally reasonable) thing, but basically taking control of your friends finances like this to set up savings of their money without their knowledge just seems completely wrong.

edit: I mean, if you wanted to discuss doing this with your friend, fully having their support and knowledge, go for it.

Zeon

Al_wat wrote: »

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend. Charging rent is one (totally reasonable) thing, but basically taking control of your friends finances like this to set up savings of their money without their knowledge just seems completely wrong.

edit: I mean, if you wanted to discuss doing this with your friend, fully having their support and knowledge, go for it.

Nah id probably be overjoyed if when i moved out my friend gave me back a check for 20% of all the rent i had ever payed him. You dont even have to tell them you saved it for that reason, just say "You know, i was thinking, i might have charged you a bit too much. Heres 20% back".

Deebaser

Al_wat wrote: »

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend.

Not at all. You're charging $250, it's none of their business what you do with $50 of that money. When she's looking to get another place, you can "gift" her a security deposit. If things go sour, you can "pay" her to go away without it turning into a massive legal hassle. If everything's gravy and she's on the right track in two years and gets her own place with the money she saved up, get her a really nice birthday gift.

If you explicitly spell it out, then yes, it is patronizing and insulting. If you don't say a word about it, it's your money. You're budgeting funds for your future convenience.

Since the OP doesn't want to charge her a massively reduced rate to avoid being patronizing, AND wants her to be able to save, this is a reasonable solution.

defreak

I agree with Al_wat, definitely bring up the idea of saving money, but don't do it without her knowing. Maybe you can "make her" save money by saying you're lowering the rent well below market rate, but only if she saves that extra money.

Also I think EggyToast's idea is great for her specific situation.

amateurhour

If it's a good friend, I'm all for the idea of setting aside a little cash in an account.

I mean if she remains cool, it's a nice gift when she gets her own place down the road. If she gets to be a pain in the ass, it covers the cost of a u-haul down the road.

Either way, it's a good idea.

Also, even if it's a close friend you love and would never hurt you and blah blah, don't forget to get a lease agreement. It can/should be a month to month in this case, wherein you can terminate the lease at any time with a 30 day notice and she can do the same.

jedikuonji

amateurhour wrote: »

don't forget to get a lease agreement.

I agree. Whatever you decide on, make sure it's written down.

I do like the suggestion of a percentage based rent, perhaps capped at 250 or 300 or whatever you all are comfortable with.

HIGH NOON

Zeon wrote: »

Al_wat wrote: »

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend. Charging rent is one (totally reasonable) thing, but basically taking control of your friends finances like this to set up savings of their money without their knowledge just seems completely wrong.

edit: I mean, if you wanted to discuss doing this with your friend, fully having their support and knowledge, go for it.

Nah id probably be overjoyed if when i moved out my friend gave me back a check for 20% of all the rent i had ever payed him. You dont even have to tell them you saved it for that reason, just say "You know, i was thinking, i might have charged you a bit too much. Heres 20% back".

thirding this. as a couch-surfing student like myself, I would have killed to see this happen from one of my old landlords. it wouldn't be insulting, and if you word like as Zeon put it, she might even be really thankful.

Al_wat

Yeah if you word it differently like "oh I decided I was charging too much heres a refund" the person in question would probably be pretty happy with it... and you're right, depending on how you look at it, that $50 is yours and what you decide to do with it is your business.

It still seems really patronizing and when you get right down to it, you're unilaterally deciding that you know better what to do with their money than they do.

If I were in that situation yeah, I'd be happy to get the money at the end, but if i knew the exact circumstances I'd be pretty fucking pissed.


Also I'm not saying this isn't motivated by good intentions. It definitely is. To me, it seems more about trying to assume a level of control over someone else's life and finances, when you really shouldn't be presuming to put yourself in that position with someone who is a legal adult.

I dunno, I hate to make a big deal out of one person's suggestion though. See what the OP thinks.

Artereis

I'd say treating it similarly to a security deposit is a pretty safe way to go.

EggyToast

Arguably, once the friend is able to move out, she will be financially secure. I agree with the security deposit idea, or, another way to approach it, refunding her last month's rent. That way it's more like a friend doing a decent, nice thing, rather than secretly creating a savings account.

shutz

Not really useful for the OP, but I have a story I'd like to share.

My dad did something similar for me.

When I completed my bachelor's degree and got a job (while still living at home with my parents, at 22) my dad started charging me a pension. Basically, 25$/week, which was totally reasonable, especially considering the amount of food I ate...

Soon after (but not because of) that, I announced that I would be moving out and getting an apartment, the following July (this was in the fall, so I had lots of time) because July 1st is the date when everybody moves, here in Québec.

Fast-forward to the following Spring, I find an apartment, and I'm discussing the fact that I'll have to pay the first month and the security deposit when I sign the lease, even though I'm a few months away from moving in. I'm not acting specifically worried about the money, but not sounding especially confident either.

My dad disappears, and comes back a few minutes later with all I paid him up until then.

I almost cried, I didn't expect it at all. It's my dad, and he's allowed to be patronizing with me, but this is completely different. Such a great gesture.

Since I had the money in the bank to pay my new landlord upon signing, that money went towards all the stuff I had to get in order to now live on my own.

On a completely unrelated note: to anyone moving out for the first time, just set one day aside, and go through Wal-mart, but really go through the entire store (except maybe for the food and clothing departments.) Look at everything. You might notice all sorts of things you wouldn't otherwise think of getting that will be useful to you. If I hadn't done that, I wouldn't have thought of getting a flashlight, among other things.

LewieP's Mummy

Talk to your friend, ask her what she thinks is fair, and set your expectations of her - when lewieP's sister's boyfriend moved in with us, we discussed rent, and agreed hed pay £30 per week, as he had a low payed job, and that he would also do some chores. that just about covered his food. When he got a better paid job, he came to me and told me he wanted to pay more - £50 per week, and still did chores.
We were both happy with the arrangement, he lived with us for 3 years.

Forbe!

Al_wat wrote: »

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend. Charging rent is one (totally reasonable) thing, but basically taking control of your friends finances like this to set up savings of their money without their knowledge just seems completely wrong.

edit: I mean, if you wanted to discuss doing this with your friend, fully having their support and knowledge, go for it.

Think of it as a security deposit.

FyreWulff

Forbe! wrote: »

Al_wat wrote: »

Deebaser wrote: »

If independence is your primary concern and not cash-money, I'd set the base below market rate, say $250, but since you're trying to help her get back on her feet, bank $50 of that in a savings account for her on the quiet side.

You'll be pulling in $200 a month plus utilities and she'd be saving cash without even realizing it.

While this may seem like a good idea, isn't it really patronizing and kind of insulting to do this? I'm talking specifically about banking $50 a month for your friend. Charging rent is one (totally reasonable) thing, but basically taking control of your friends finances like this to set up savings of their money without their knowledge just seems completely wrong.

edit: I mean, if you wanted to discuss doing this with your friend, fully having their support and knowledge, go for it.

Think of it as a security deposit.

Yep, that's how I'd frame it. Even some cities actually FORCE your landlord to put your deposit in a bank account and give you the money+interest back when you move out, so it's the same idea.