Euphemonitsudemo sagashiteiruyodokka ni kimi no sugata woRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
Yeah, I really like where ZvZ is at atm. It feels like a really good matchup. Yeah, there are still bling/sling fests, but they're very much all-in now, and games only really get stuck in that phase if both players stick with it. The exact opposite of before, really! And once into midgame, pure roach loses to a lot of unit comps.
Yeah, I really like where ZvZ is at atm. It feels like a really good matchup. Yeah, there are still bling/sling fests, but they're very much all-in now, and games only really get stuck in that phase if both players stick with it. The exact opposite of before, really! And once into midgame, pure roach loses to a lot of unit comps.
For instance muta/anything, roach/hydra, roach/infestor, hydra/infestor, ultra/infestor (though you need a big gas income lead to pull that last one off).
kedinik on
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infestors are so good in zvz because everything but broods have such short range.
Fungaling a group of roaches on a ramp or chain fungaling a pack of mutas is the best.
I am not really looking forward to FoxeR that much. I sort of only want to see Jinro's game. But last time I tried to hold out to see a later match even the SQ test stream was full.
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
Well, I'm wondering if MC can take MarineKing. I hope so.
He seems like just about the most well rounded and competent protoss around, 'cept for maybe Tester.
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
MC v Jinro as a semi.
That would be intense.
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
(is anyone warming up the board)
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
are you kidding? ogsMC vs marineking aahh this will be great. I've only seen MK play TvP once against Tester and he only won because Tester's 400APM didnt prevent him getting his army surrounded
Protoss domination at lower levels is more because people try to turtle/build up, and a Protoss Deathball > Zerg/Terran Deathballs.
I believe there are many protoss that would disagree with you, but I will say not a word
As far as death balls go, my money is on a tank-heavy Terran for ground. I'm not sure about air.
I think Protoss domination at lower levels is because the race as a whole requires fewer APM. I'm undecided about their macro in general, but I personally find it just a little easier than T.
I can't comment on Z as I haven't played them much.
As a lower level player with a clearly defined skill ceiling, I would disagree on this point. Terran's major micro requirement is also the first one any silver league players learns how to do - stutter step. It's easy and crazily effective. With MMM balls in particular there is almost no positional requirement from the units whatsoever. It's also pretty easy to macro whilst continuing to micro your bio ball around.
In terms of economy, I don't see how one has any more APM required than the other.
'Toss fails on this front in two stages - stutter step is almost useless with gateway units and it's very tricky to keep your units correctly in position ('lots in front of stalker, sentries within FF range). It can be slightly difficult to keep the medivacs in range but really you just need to advance a little slower.
Add to this the fact that 'toss has to move the camera away from battle to warp units, and then rally each group individually to battle - basic unit macro takes 2-3 times as much APM (and time) as T.
T Micro, I would say, requires more APM, but not in a way that makes it more difficult. Basic kiting / stutter step is easier than getting off a decent FF in the open or even making sure your sentry is actually close enough to do so, whilst at the same time not having your stalkers blocking your zealots.
Obviously there is much more to it in the higher leagues, but down where I am, having played both races quite a bit this is how I see it.
The discrepancy in win %, I would say, is far more down to a lack of game sense amongst all races. Colossi are very easy to micro, I admit it, but in the lower leagues there is less knowledge about how to prevent a 'Toss from massing them. Turtling is actually very effective because lower league players don't have the innate desire to expand and win a long term macro game. There is really no knowledge of timing windows or timing pushes in this league. Once a Gold Toss gets 4 or 5 colossi, it's pretty much GG.
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ALRIGHT FINE I GOT AN AVATAR
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
KlykaDO you have anySPARE BATTERIES?Registered Userregular
edited December 2010
I have come to play very defensively with my Toss now.
I used to be aggressive and attack,lose my army and then the game but have now completely changed that attitude.
I also use Forcefields as a defense mechanism now. I don't even try to split the enemy army,I just build a wall in front of them to gain more time to warp in units for defense.
It's working well!
edit: anyone got a GSL restream for me?
Klyka on
SC2 EU ID Klyka.110
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3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
Posts
For instance muta/anything, roach/hydra, roach/infestor, hydra/infestor, ultra/infestor (though you need a big gas income lead to pull that last one off).
Fungaling a group of roaches on a ramp or chain fungaling a pack of mutas is the best.
I am the best idler.
Here is why versus a 2350 player.
Over an hour. Complete mine out, and he leaves because basically 'welp this is going to last forever.'
MFING
HWAITING
Derp.
they are all one girl.
even the guys.
Gigantic conspiracy.
e: FfffFFF beaten
I believe it.
Couldn't care less about this first match. SHOW ME JINRO
He seems like just about the most well rounded and competent protoss around, 'cept for maybe Tester.
That would be intense.
That's a good idea actually.
Like "Where is the bathroom" and "hello".
EDIT: Although this seems to be working for him.
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Me on Twitch!
That was a crazy rush.
As a lower level player with a clearly defined skill ceiling, I would disagree on this point. Terran's major micro requirement is also the first one any silver league players learns how to do - stutter step. It's easy and crazily effective. With MMM balls in particular there is almost no positional requirement from the units whatsoever. It's also pretty easy to macro whilst continuing to micro your bio ball around.
In terms of economy, I don't see how one has any more APM required than the other.
'Toss fails on this front in two stages - stutter step is almost useless with gateway units and it's very tricky to keep your units correctly in position ('lots in front of stalker, sentries within FF range). It can be slightly difficult to keep the medivacs in range but really you just need to advance a little slower.
Add to this the fact that 'toss has to move the camera away from battle to warp units, and then rally each group individually to battle - basic unit macro takes 2-3 times as much APM (and time) as T.
T Micro, I would say, requires more APM, but not in a way that makes it more difficult. Basic kiting / stutter step is easier than getting off a decent FF in the open or even making sure your sentry is actually close enough to do so, whilst at the same time not having your stalkers blocking your zealots.
Obviously there is much more to it in the higher leagues, but down where I am, having played both races quite a bit this is how I see it.
The discrepancy in win %, I would say, is far more down to a lack of game sense amongst all races. Colossi are very easy to micro, I admit it, but in the lower leagues there is less knowledge about how to prevent a 'Toss from massing them. Turtling is actually very effective because lower league players don't have the innate desire to expand and win a long term macro game. There is really no knowledge of timing windows or timing pushes in this league. Once a Gold Toss gets 4 or 5 colossi, it's pretty much GG.
Steam: adamjnet
I mean it was cheese; if it had failed he would have been amazingly behind.
But it was awesome cheese.
Not cheese. But all-in.
I used to be aggressive and attack,lose my army and then the game but have now completely changed that attitude.
I also use Forcefields as a defense mechanism now. I don't even try to split the enemy army,I just build a wall in front of them to gain more time to warp in units for defense.
It's working well!
edit: anyone got a GSL restream for me?
O HAI FOUND U
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Me on Twitch!
Also I bet since his attempt at a macro game failed he's going to just cheese/proxy/all-in every game.