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Tomb Raider: Trailer up on IGN. Looks like Uncharted: With A Woman

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Posts

  • MongerMonger I got the ham stink. Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Also, Russian attack helicopters? Not scary in video games.
    Scary? Maybe not. Surprising? Check with Snake.

    Monger on
  • SoundsPlushSoundsPlush yup, back. Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Colonel, what's a Russian gunship doing in this thread!?
    Now, the only real issue I have with this new reboot is Lara herself. For all of Underworld's faults, I actually really liked Lara's visual appearance. They managed to inject some realism into her design while retaining the classical Lara Croft look. This new redesign is somewhat of a departure from that approach and I'm not a fan of it. I do know she's supposed to be 21 in this new game and maybe that's why they changed it up. And yea, all that blood and gore matted to her face isn't very appealing. But of the two designs, I'm in the Underworld camp.
    1652232-lara_super.jpg

    I prefer the shell-shocked-college-student look over that angular alien entity on the right, myself.

    SoundsPlush on
    s7Imn5J.png
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I dunno, I think I prefer the 'old' Lara look, but the new Lara seems much better given the setting and premise.

    mr-razzcocks on
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Also, Russian attack helicopters? Not scary in video games.
    Scary? Maybe not. Surprising? Check with Snake.

    They should be scary--but like the vast majority of helicopters in video games, they aren't. They were annoying in Uncharted 2 (and the second time, annoying and stupidly implemented). Hopefully we don't have to go through that old, hashed-out fight.

    As for the new character design...I assumed they were gradually moving away the more "Cartoon-ish" design of Legend. Underworld looks less cartoony (the same for the butler, Allister, etc.), and this should look less.

    For comparison:
    lara2.jpg

    Lara-Croft-Underworld-and-Lara-Croft-Legend-tomb-raider-6320230-1169-720.jpg
    A less "cartoony" example. She actually looks a lot more cartoon-ish in most of Legend.

    I'm fine with the shift. I'm hoping for a lot more dirt/weather effects myself.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • Delta AssaultDelta Assault Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    That ponytail looks downright painful.

    Delta Assault on
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Goin' through her arm? Yeah, I'd imagine. Tomb Raider IV, I think, had really bad clipping--if she knelt down, the ponytail would go right through her torso. Strangely enough, III didn't have this problem--the ponytail was as twitchy as you'd expect it to be in 1998, but it did have proper collision detection.

    (Useless repository of 90s gaming information.)

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    In Angel Of Darkness, her ponytail would occasionally grow to six feet in length and turn into a javelin of sorts. I think that was the point at which I gave up on that game.

    mr-razzcocks on
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I'd imagined that game would have a lot of collision detection problems (I never played it). Not Trespasser bad, but bad.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • MongerMonger I got the ham stink. Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I think I need to see some in-engine shots before I can make a call on the character design. I generally like that they're moving away from the cartoonish older versions, but Lara's actually gotten less expressive since Legend. I'm not as fond of that.
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I'd imagined that game would have a lot of collision detection problems (I never played it). Not Trespasser bad, but bad.
    Nothing is Trespasser bad. I know Trespasser bad intimately well.

    Monger on
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    God, it was terrible. It was such a shame, because plot-wise it was great and it had some amazing concepts, but when there's a good two second delay between pressing a button and getting a response, you know there's something very wrong.

    mr-razzcocks on
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    I think I need to see some in-engine shots before I can make a call on the character design. I generally like that they're moving away from the cartoonish older versions, but Lara's actually gotten less expressive since Legend. I'm not as fond of that.

    Wha-at?

    Before Legend she was an almost constantly silent sociopath. Giving her Zip and Allister to talk to were the best thing Crystal Dynamics could have done to the character herself.

    mr-razzcocks on
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    I think I need to see some in-engine shots before I can make a call on the character design. I generally like that they're moving away from the cartoonish older versions, but Lara's actually gotten less expressive since Legend. I'm not as fond of that.
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I'd imagined that game would have a lot of collision detection problems (I never played it). Not Trespasser bad, but bad.
    Nothing is Trespasser bad. I know Trespasser bad intimately well.

    Interesting. I find Lara to be more expressive in Underworld--but not vocally (she's less expressive in that area, I'd admit)--her body language in-game is vastly more expressive (at the same time, there's only so much you can take from that.)

    You have my sympathies for Trespasser. One thing I really liked that they fixed from Legend to Underworld was Lara's twitching arms when pulling (sometimes pushing) objects that looked like she was having seizures or was possessed Seth Green-style...but at least her arms never got stuck in cracks and stretched out over 10 meters.

    I wasn't impressed by the plot of Angel of Death--to much of a departure from exploration and raiding tombs and whatnot--but it was a while ago.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • surrealitychecksurrealitycheck lonely, but not unloved dreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I just hope they stick with keeley hawes. Keeeleeeyyyyy

    But in legend I dont think they mocapped her movements as they did in Underworld.

    surrealitycheck on
    obF2Wuw.png
  • MongerMonger I got the ham stink. Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    I think I need to see some in-engine shots before I can make a call on the character design. I generally like that they're moving away from the cartoonish older versions, but Lara's actually gotten less expressive since Legend. I'm not as fond of that.

    Wha-at?

    Before Legend she was an almost constantly silent sociopath. Giving her Zip and Allister to talk to were the best thing Crystal Dynamics could have done to the character herself.
    That's what I'm talking about. They did it best in Legend. I'm also mostly referring to facial animation. The mild cartoonishness of that game allowed them to exaggerate her expressions in ways that really highlighted a lot of scenes. In Anniversary and Underworld, she was much more emotionally flat.

    edit:
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Interesting. I find Lara to be more expressive in Underworld--but not vocally (she's less expressive in that area, I'd admit)--her body language in-game is vastly more expressive (at the same time, there's only so much you can take from that.)
    The body language was pretty good in Underworld, yeah. But that had the benefit of motion capture.

    Monger on
  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    The description in the OP makes this game sound just.... tedious.

    I think I'll have to take a pass on this one. Shame, I was hoping they'd strike the same gold they did with Legend.

    AbsoluteZero on
    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I just hope they stick with keeley hawes. Keeeleeeyyyyy

    But in legend I dont think they mocapped her movements as they did in Underworld.

    They didn't. That was a feature in Underworld--honestly, as much as people complain, I seriously think they're forgetting the animations in Legend, which were basically comparable to those in IV or so, albeit with nicer models. She also responded to the environment (branches in the way, fire, etc.)--awkwardly at some angles, but still better than nothing.

    The swimming is in an entirely different league--Legend has the old III/IV style of swimming (i.e. barely moving whilst kicking your legs real fast) while Underworld Lara actually moves like the freakishly fast mammal she's supposed to be under water.

    Incidentally, Surrealitycheck, are you posting from a computer in East Asia? (the font)

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    Monger wrote: »
    I think I need to see some in-engine shots before I can make a call on the character design. I generally like that they're moving away from the cartoonish older versions, but Lara's actually gotten less expressive since Legend. I'm not as fond of that.

    Wha-at?

    Before Legend she was an almost constantly silent sociopath. Giving her Zip and Allister to talk to were the best thing Crystal Dynamics could have done to the character herself.
    That's what I'm talking about. They did it best in Legend. I'm also mostly referring to facial animation. The mild cartoonishness of that game allowed them to exaggerate her expressions in ways that really highlighted a lot of scenes. In Anniversary and Underworld, she was much more emotionally flat.

    Oh, right, I mis-read this and thought you meant Legend was where it started being poor.
    I just hope they stick with keeley hawes. Keeeleeeyyyyy

    And this. A lot.

    mr-razzcocks on
  • surrealitychecksurrealitycheck lonely, but not unloved dreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Incidentally, Surrealitycheck, are you posting from a computer in East Asia? (the font)

    Wrestling with a computer in Tokyo. Tiny space bars ahoy - and it provides a perfect excuse for why I haven’t finished my lets play!

    surrealitycheck on
    obF2Wuw.png
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Incidentally, Surrealitycheck, are you posting from a computer in East Asia? (the font)

    Wrestling with a computer in Tokyo. Tiny space bars ahoy - and it provides a perfect excuse for why I haven’t finished my lets play!

    Wow, I was just joking.

    ...I assume you are not. And that I am right! Score!

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • MongerMonger I got the ham stink. Dallas, TXRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I just hope they stick with keeley hawes. Keeeleeeyyyyy

    But in legend I dont think they mocapped her movements as they did in Underworld.

    They didn't. That was a feature in Underworld--honestly, as much as people complain, I seriously think they're forgetting the animations in Legend, which were basically comparable to those in IV or so, albeit with nicer models. She also responded to the environment (branches in the way, fire, etc.)--awkwardly at some angles, but still better than nothing.

    The swimming is in an entirely different league--Legend has the old III/IV style of swimming (i.e. barely moving whilst kicking your legs real fast) while Underworld Lara actually moves like the freakishly fast mammal she's supposed to be under water.
    When the animation in Underworld looked good, it looked real good, but it wasn't consistent. There was a lot of speeding up and slowing down of raw motion capture that looked incredibly awkward and even kind of buggy in ways that Legend never did. Legend's animation may have been of a lower overall quality, but it was cohesive such that there was never a point where any poor animation stuck out at me. Happened constantly in Underworld.

    Monger on
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Monger wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I just hope they stick with keeley hawes. Keeeleeeyyyyy

    But in legend I dont think they mocapped her movements as they did in Underworld.

    They didn't. That was a feature in Underworld--honestly, as much as people complain, I seriously think they're forgetting the animations in Legend, which were basically comparable to those in IV or so, albeit with nicer models. She also responded to the environment (branches in the way, fire, etc.)--awkwardly at some angles, but still better than nothing.

    The swimming is in an entirely different league--Legend has the old III/IV style of swimming (i.e. barely moving whilst kicking your legs real fast) while Underworld Lara actually moves like the freakishly fast mammal she's supposed to be under water.
    When the animation in Underworld looked good, it looked real good, but it wasn't consistent. There was a lot of speeding up and slowing down of raw motion capture that looked incredibly awkward and even kind of buggy in ways that Legend never did. Legend's animation may have been of a lower overall quality, but it was cohesive such that there was never a point where any poor animation stuck out at me. Happened constantly in Underworld.

    "May" nothing, they were lower quality--and there were far fewer of them, which made it obvious (for example, having only one wall-climbing set).

    I do agree that Underworld's animations occasionally stopped incorrectly, but the same happened in Legend with simpler animation (just like every TR game, actually)--just run along a wall for an obvious example. That being said, Underworld managed to avoid Legend's disjointed cinematics (especially around Lara's hands...not sure why, given that she had five fingers with joints...) and still looked a lot better even in motion than its predecessor's (especially underwater and climbing--after Underworld, climbing in Legend seemed so repetitive and boring). Consistency is important, but so is quality (and in that area, Underworld is literally in an entirely different area than Legend, thanks in part to motion capture.)

    Of course, animations are just part of the issue. If they have a 20-man gunfight every 100 meters, the animations will be the least of the problems.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • UnbreakableVowUnbreakableVow Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Synthesis: About the Legend character design...she actually looked different in every version! Which I thought was kinda cool. I'm not sure about the GameCube version, since that was ported much later, but on PS2, Xbox and Xbox 360, Lara's facial design was slightly different for each

    UnbreakableVow on
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    On the PS2 version she looked like she was off in the clouds

    wondering what she was having for her tea that night or something

    mr-razzcocks on
  • LovelyLovely Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I loved, loved, loved, Legend. With a passion. One of my favorite games of all time. Anniversary was awesome as well. And then Underworld came out, and was just crushing disappointment. I don't know, it just didn't have the magic, and felt like they were taking the tired old "grimdark serious" route with it. I just wanna explore tombs and find magic artifacts and crack wise with my colleagues over my headset, dammit.

    This post is me

    It's also me! Man, I loved Legend and all its banter. When I heard that the sequels took that aspect out, I didn't even have the desire to play them. Bah, it just sounded boring.

    Anyways, this reboot sounds like it's going even MORE towards the SERIOUS BUSINESS route, so I'll probably pass.

    Lovely on
    sig.gif
  • PeewiPeewi Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I am kinda surprised to see people say that they liked Underworld. While not really bad, I didn't think that it was particularly good either.

    Peewi on
    Switch: SW-6132-4331-5349 || Steam
  • CherrnCherrn Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Having played a bit more of it, I have to maintain my stance. There's just something off about almost every aspect of Underworld except the graphics. I don't much care for it at all.

    Cherrn on
    All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
  • mxmarksmxmarks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    This thread has seriously made me consider double dipping on Legend and getting the 360 version.

    It was the last game I played (and loved) for the oXBox.

    mxmarks on
    PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
  • l337CrappyJackl337CrappyJack Registered User
    edited December 2010
    It was the first game I ever bothered to get every achievement for.

    Didn't hurt that doing most of the stuff unlocked cheats or new pretty outfits for me to play dressup with because I am a ten year old girl and have literally purchased games based solely on the fact that you can change outfits in it.

    l337CrappyJack on
  • mxmarksmxmarks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Monger wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Also, Russian attack helicopters? Not scary in video games.
    Scary? Maybe not. Surprising? Check with Snake.

    They should be scary--but like the vast majority of helicopters in video games, they aren't. They were annoying in Uncharted 2 (and the second time, annoying and stupidly implemented). Hopefully we don't have to go through that old, hashed-out fight.

    As for the new character design...I assumed they were gradually moving away the more "Cartoon-ish" design of Legend. Underworld looks less cartoony (the same for the butler, Allister, etc.), and this should look less.

    For comparison:
    lara2.jpg

    Lara-Croft-Underworld-and-Lara-Croft-Legend-tomb-raider-6320230-1169-720.jpg
    A less "cartoony" example. She actually looks a lot more cartoon-ish in most of Legend.

    I'm fine with the shift. I'm hoping for a lot more dirt/weather effects myself.

    You know, it isnt until I see shots like these that I get why my girlfriend always asks me if I'm playing Tomb Raider for "the boobs", and rolls her eyes when I pop it in.

    When I'm actually playing the game, I just know she's a lady. A pretty lady, raidin' tombs. The cut scenes are pretty spread out, the camera is mostly zoomed back so I can see where I'm going, and I never really notice that holy SHIT they really have just gotten to the point of absolutley ABSURD breast size.

    mxmarks on
    PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
  • mr-razzcocksmr-razzcocks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    mxmarks wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Monger wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Also, Russian attack helicopters? Not scary in video games.
    Scary? Maybe not. Surprising? Check with Snake.

    They should be scary--but like the vast majority of helicopters in video games, they aren't. They were annoying in Uncharted 2 (and the second time, annoying and stupidly implemented). Hopefully we don't have to go through that old, hashed-out fight.

    As for the new character design...I assumed they were gradually moving away the more "Cartoon-ish" design of Legend. Underworld looks less cartoony (the same for the butler, Allister, etc.), and this should look less.

    For comparison:
    lara2.jpg

    Lara-Croft-Underworld-and-Lara-Croft-Legend-tomb-raider-6320230-1169-720.jpg
    A less "cartoony" example. She actually looks a lot more cartoon-ish in most of Legend.

    I'm fine with the shift. I'm hoping for a lot more dirt/weather effects myself.

    You know, it isnt until I see shots like these that I get why my girlfriend always asks me if I'm playing Tomb Raider for "the boobs", and rolls her eyes when I pop it in.

    When I'm actually playing the game, I just know she's a lady. A pretty lady, raidin' tombs. The cut scenes are pretty spread out, the camera is mostly zoomed back so I can see where I'm going, and I never really notice that holy SHIT they really have just gotten to the point of absolutley ABSURD breast size.

    You can't tell from those pictures, but Crystal Dynamics actually made them smaller

    mr-razzcocks on
  • EdS25EdS25 Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Peewi wrote: »
    I am kinda surprised to see people say that they liked Underworld. While not really bad, I didn't think that it was particularly good either.

    I liked Underworld a lot. It's been a while since I played it but really don't remember all these animation issues and such. It had huge, twisty environments with lots of secrets that were fun to figure out and that's what I took away from it. I can see how it would be divisive but I really liked the Norse angle and the aesthetic of the final levels as well.

    EdS25 on
    Currently Playing : FE:Awakening, AC:NL
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    EdS25 wrote: »
    Peewi wrote: »
    I am kinda surprised to see people say that they liked Underworld. While not really bad, I didn't think that it was particularly good either.

    I liked Underworld a lot. It's been a while since I played it but really don't remember all these animation issues and such. It had huge, twisty environments with lots of secrets that were fun to figure out and that's what I took away from it. I can see how it would be divisive but I really liked the Norse angle and the aesthetic of the final levels as well.

    I'm kind of surprised of the rosy view people have of Legend--I know the game was well received, but when it was new, people used to hate Zip and Allister, and complained about them rigorously. Not because their function wasn't a good idea, but because they thought they were extremely annoying. That little glowing fairy from Zelda annoying.

    A few years later, and everyone loves them. i thought they were okay, and I still think they were okay. They also love the shooting mechanic people hated back then too. *shrug* People having complaints isn't bad, it's natural, it's just odd that people have pushed them out of their minds so quickly.

    That's just at the PA forums--TRC, unsurprisingly, being a Tomb Raider forum, offers a more consistent opinion, from what I can tell (which doesn't mean they like Legend less, but they tend to remember their complaints when the game first came out). I think here at PA, the reason is that we don't actually want another Tomb Raider style game--we want another Uncharted 2, but produced by Crystal Dynamics, and featuring a woman instead of a young Alec Baldwin. That's why we draw all the comparisons (they're both "adventure games", right?). Something to hold people over to Uncharted 3.

    Which isn't unreasonable. Uncharted 2 was basically a huge blockbuster sequel. It's sort of the "Halo-killer" phenomenon--everything that's remotely similar is going to be compared to it. Unfortunately for them though, from what little you can tell this early in the process, I don't think we're going to get that. Which makes me happy (If I wanted that, I'd just play Uncharted 2 again) but is going to upset people.

    Of course, it's entirely possible that they will go an entirely different way with it, and the end product will have Lara shooting from behind cover, blowing up tanks with an RPG-7, shooting at an attack helicopter from the back of a train, cracking wise with an old guy with a mustache, constantly, and rarely being alone.

    Maybe if we make it an evil, haunted Japanese tank and an evil, haunted Japanese attack helicopter...

    No, wait, they tried that in Devil May Cry 2.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    I've always liked Zip, Allister... not so much. I love Legend so much mostly because it was the first good TR game in a really long time, so it holds a special place. I don't care what anyone says, Underworld was Aces.

    Now that I think about it, Zip did greatly annoy me at one part of Legend. And that was the dirtbike section of Peru. Jumping the bridge ramps...

    "WOAHHHHHHHH"
    "YEAHHHHHHHHH" OMG dude..shut it. Still like him though.

    2011 is shaping up to be a good year, after a mostly disappointing 2010

    Skull2185 on
    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    They were good for laughs (to me) the first time through, but a lot of people hate that sort of shtick. I'm surprised we're so forgiving, frankly.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • surrealitychecksurrealitycheck lonely, but not unloved dreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered User regular
    edited December 2010
    People don't like z and a because they say good stuffbut because they provide human beings for Lara to interact with. They give her character. They also mean she doesn't have to monologue like a maniac. Also screw iPhone keyboards.

    surrealitycheck on
    obF2Wuw.png
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Yeah, I haven't had good experiences with them either.

    (iPhone keyboards that is...but I really don't like touchscreen keyboards, the reason why I went with a Dell Venue Pro.)

    I actually like the notion of Lara being intelligent, cunning, but also pretty misanthropic. It covers an area that tends to be left behind by protagonists in out-in-the-wild "adventure games"--wherein most protagonists are likable, popular people who everyone's mother loves, in addition to being great at everything, to distinguish them from their asshole nemesis.

    Excluding Guybrush Threepwood, who's supposed to be a bumbling, lovable loser, of course.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • CherrnCherrn Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I'm kind of surprised of the rosy view people have of Legend--I know the game was well received, but when it was new, people used to hate Zip and Allister, and complained about them rigorously. Not because their function wasn't a good idea, but because they thought they were extremely annoying. That little glowing fairy from Zelda annoying.

    A few years later, and everyone loves them. i thought they were okay, and I still think they were okay. They also love the shooting mechanic people hated back then too. *shrug* People having complaints isn't bad, it's natural, it's just odd that people have pushed them out of their minds so quickly.

    No, I still think they are completely pointless and inane stereotypes, and I definitely think Legend has its fair share of problems - the level design isn't all that great, neither is the combat and all the vehicle sequences are fucking terrible. Anniversary is by far the better game as far as I'm concerned.

    That said, I still enjoyed the game a great deal; it was a refreshing new take on the series that didn't fall into the same pittraps as the games that came before it. It was an overall solid title, and Anniversary improved on it, streamlining the combat even further and bringing back some of the more adventurous and creative level design that made the series in the first place. In my opinion, it is the quintessential remake.

    But I'm not really finding any of this in Underworld. The whole game feels so sterile and haphazard; Lara is fugly as hell, and the annoying cast of expendable sidecharacters are back with a vengeance. I like the more open level design, but the mechanics and movement feel so awkward that it ruins the pacing for me. Also they somehow managed to make the combat worse, which is quite a feat in itself. I'll keep playing for completionism's sake, but right now I can't find much to enjoy here.

    Edit:

    And no, I don't want Tomb Raider to turn into Uncharted. If anything, I hope they completely do away with the combat. But since that's not a realistic expectation, follow in Anniversary's footsteps - where the whole point was to get it over with as quickly as possible and look flashy while doing so.

    Cherrn on
    All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Cherrn wrote: »
    But I'm not really finding any of this in Underworld. The whole game feels so sterile and haphazard; Lara is fugly as hell, and the annoying cast of expendable sidecharacters are back with a vengeance. I like the more open level design, but the mechanics and movement feel so awkward that it ruins the pacing for me. Also they somehow managed to make the combat worse, which is quite a feat in itself. I'll keep playing for completionism's sake, but right now I can't find much to enjoy here.

    Fair opinion. Personally, I'll take less cartoony Lara over more cartoony Lara, especially if the later requires Warner Brothers-style expressions to convey emotions. I do disagree with some of this--how is Legend's environments--less detailed, and including an entire level which is basically just construction-filled rooftops and varnished corridors, somehow "less sterile"? Additionally, you're basically repeating what I've said--Zip and Allister are at full "voice in your ear" power in Legends (versus being far more quiet in Underworld), and somehow, they're back "with a vengeance"?

    Skull actually summed it up pretty well: "WOAHHHHHHHH" "YEAHHHHHHHHH". That's pretty much the biggest thing I remember of Zip and Allister from Legend. I did not miss it.

    Personally, I thought gunfights with 20 guys and a prolonged motorcycle section on a track ruined the pacing (what with you not being able to get off and move on foot, or explore, for that matter--at least it wasn't in all the levels, like the horrid firefights). You've acknowledged you don't like the vehicle sections, and if you want to forgive them, that's fine--I personally won't. By comparison, my biggest complaint about Underworld is that they decided to go with the boring, and increasingly overused, "Norse Mythology route"--but I'll forgive that for not having all ledges be the same distance from each other, climbing in multiple directions, and animations actually showing her respond to the environment (in addition to much, much better environments.) I guess I'm more apt to forgive awkward mechanics simply because I have a far greater number of ways to approach a given area.

    And not having to abruptly fight 20 guys like this suddenly stopped being TR and started being Mercenaries instead.

    Synthesis on
    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • CherrnCherrn Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    Uh, I explicitly chided Legend for doing all the things you mentioned. But I still enjoyed it more than I do Underworld. Some of that might just be the ravages of time, as I haven't played it in years, but I do maintain that it was a perfectly solid, enjoyable reboot for the series. At the time, anyway. Maybe my expectations are different today, I don't know. But I have in fact played Anniversary recently, and Underworld feels like a huge step down from that.

    Cherrn on
    All creature will die and all the things will be broken. That's the law of samurai.
  • mxmarksmxmarks Registered User regular
    edited December 2010
    As long as we're naming gripes, I am kind of happy we're rebooting it so we can do away with the whole "Croft Family Mansion" thing. I have a feeling I'll be in a very small minority, but I like the idea of the Croft family - adventurers and explorers who have amassed wealth and live a life of luxury - but I honestly hate so much the "secret basement!" aspect that ALWAYS seems to crop up.

    Maybe I just hated Underworld's so much that I feel like there was multiple times Lara had to venture within her own house, but it feels so forced and stupid on so many levels, and seems to bring otherwise semi-interesting stories to a halt for me.

    Ancient civilizations building crazy intricate contraptions to hide insane, god-like power weapons? Totally awesome.

    Dad hiding a note in his basement - but fills the basement with absolutely insane traps and crazy poles and switches? Stupid.

    Just live in a sweet house and maybe hide some stuff behind a painting, but take your adventures outside, young lady!

    mxmarks on
    PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
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