Regardless of it's importance to gameplay, or lack thereof, this new camera just make me feel claustrophobic. The maximum zoom out is only a smidgen further out than the maximum zoom in on origins.
Why defend the removal of any feature, period? Is the game somehow better for lack of an isometric view? I would certainly call it a step backwards - a small step for some, granted, but with no given reason for it's removal and no gain for it's loss, what are you supposed to call it?
I'd hate to say it, but typically in my experience, restrictive camera angles are usually implemented as a short-cut to hide backdrops and renders that aren't fully fleshed out. Basically consider World of Warcraft's old world, pre-Cataclysm. When they introduced flying mounts, people wondered why you couldn't use them in the old world. Blizzard came out and said the reason why you couldn't is because a lot of the buildings and mountains and areas beyond weren't fully realized, and flying mounts would expose a lot of unfinished shit and invisible walls. They had to redesign the old world from the ground up before it was ready for a player that could sweep their view over literally everything.
For one, I won't be spending the entire game looking at an overhead floor plan while being an immense cock and casting my aoe spells through walls.
I mean.
There's that.
Totally my fault that I did it, too, but at this point in my life I have the self control of a lemming when presented with the ability to break a game.
Why defend the removal of any feature, period? Is the game somehow better for lack of an isometric view? I would certainly call it a step backwards - a small step for some, granted, but with no given reason for it's removal and no gain for it's loss, what are you supposed to call it?
I'd hate to say it, but typically in my experience, restrictive camera angles are usually implemented as a short-cut to hide backdrops and renders that aren't fully fleshed out. Basically consider World of Warcraft's old world, pre-Cataclysm. When they introduced flying mounts, people wondered why you couldn't use them in the old world. Blizzard came out and said the reason why you couldn't is because a lot of the buildings and mountains and areas beyond weren't fully realized, and flying mounts would expose a lot of unfinished shit and invisible walls.
Not saying that is the case here, though.
Because removing features worked so well in a certain other game
Ok, seriously, vsove can you tell me if Archery got nerfed at all between this demo and release.
Because.
Damn.
Don't forget that equipment was clearly not balanced for the demo. I imagine the actual play-through will be quite a bit different. plus this is on Normal difficulty. Hell, it wouldn't surprise me if they made the Archer purposely OP because of how unpopular it was in DA:O, just to get hype going for the class.
Mike Laidlaw has said a few times that if archery is broken in DA2, it's broken in a good way and not an Origins way.
Ok, seriously, vsove can you tell me if Archery got nerfed at all between this demo and release.
Because.
Damn.
Don't forget that equipment was clearly not balanced for the demo. I imagine the actual play-through will be quite a bit different. plus this is on Normal difficulty. Hell, it wouldn't surprise me if they made the Archer purposely OP because of how unpopular it was in DA:O, just to get hype going for the class.
Still, there is no reason that my Archer's crowd control hold should one-shot mooks while my two handed warrior's Mighty blow cannot. Thats just stupid good. And it has a shorter cooldown.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
Cast a fireball in a stone corridor, watch your entire party burn and then asphyxiate.
No Hawke, why you gotta cast that?
That seems like it belongs in an RPG. RPGs aren't about fun or bending reality. It's all hardcore all the time even though you're shooting fire with your mind.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
Only half joking
ME1 inventory actually got in the way of gameplay, though.
Rogue was kinda the last class I expected to play, but stabbing dudes just feels the best. When the most grating complaint you can generate about a class is that you kinda don't like the color of the icons, it's a good class.
Ok, seriously, vsove can you tell me if Archery got nerfed at all between this demo and release.
Because.
Damn.
Archery has its place, but it always felt pretty balanced in the release build.
Some abilities were tweaked, so archers are still fun but not 'why bother with two weapons' good.
Personally, I prefer dual-wield rogue.
Can you say anything about Two-Handed Sword balance? It was insanely weak in the demo. Weaker than the Sword-and-Board warrior in terms of DPS, which is wrong on every imaginable level. I'm assuming it was just an oversight (not getting a new sword for the second part), but it'd be nice if you could confirm.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
Only half joking
I suppose you could say they "streamlined" the camera angle system, but the benefits from that decision are a lot harder to see than the inventory change.
I'd just like to know why they removed it is all. ME's inventory was bloated, so it's streamlining in ME2 made sense. Removing the isometric view from DA2, at least to the naked eye, seems pointless.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
To answer seriously for a second: As much as I love inventories in other games, the concept has gotten stretched a bit thin.
When Bioshock was touted as an RPG and lacked an inventory, I was unhappy.
When Mass Effect 2 was released without one, I was almost glad to see it go. Because they correctly (to my mind, in my opinion, etc.) streamlined it. Instead of worrying about which weapon was the best, you start with the best weapons the galaxy has to offer. And acquire a few new ones. The only thing I would have liked to see in there were the weapon mods - because those are the only things that should really be floating about in the hands of lesser, non-cereberus-funded hands.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
To answer seriously for a second: As much as I love inventories in other games, the concept has gotten stretched a bit thin.
When Bioshock was touted as an RPG and lacked an inventory, I was unhappy.
When Mass Effect 2 was released without one, I was almost glad to see it go. Because they correctly (to my mind, in my opinion, etc.) streamlined it. Instead of worrying about which weapon was the best, you start with the best weapons the galaxy has to offer. And acquire a few new ones. The only thing I would have liked to see in there were the weapon mods - because those are the only things that should really be floating about in the hands of lesser, non-cereberus-funded hands.
I agree with you on the positives of streamlining the inventory in Mass Effect 2's case. It made sense from a gameplay standpoint and it worked.
Comparing inventory streamlining to the removal of the isometric camera angle isn't really a good argument - it is, for all intents and purposes, apples and oranges. I don't think any gamer would be happy to see all games be forced into one particular camera angle in this day and age, especially an over-the-shoulder angle.
The overhead view was useful approximately twice in Origins, and both times were when you were cheesing the game by setting up a Storm of the Century from the other side of the room/behind a closed door. Its loss is hardly a tragedy.
I used it all the time because it was the only way to ensure the camera wouldn't get stuck in a sub-ideal angle and actually be able to see what the whole party was doing. It was just simpler after a while.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
Only half joking
I suppose you could say they "streamlined" the camera angle system, but the benefits from that decision are a lot harder to see than the inventory change.
I'd just like to know why they removed it is all. ME's inventory was bloated, so it's streamlining in ME2 made sense. Removing the isometric view from DA2, at least to the naked eye, seems pointless.
It makes sense because the combat is faster and characters fly across the battlefield at a much faster clip and tend to do more exploitable bunching up. Positioning is also far less important than basic threat management. The camera being moved further out may only serve to make the combat more confusing.
They probably also just want you to see the combat rather than watch things that look like people down far below wiggling around while numbers pop up over their heads and bars go down.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
To answer seriously for a second: As much as I love inventories in other games, the concept has gotten stretched a bit thin.
When Bioshock was touted as an RPG and lacked an inventory, I was unhappy.
When Mass Effect 2 was released without one, I was almost glad to see it go. Because they correctly (to my mind, in my opinion, etc.) streamlined it. Instead of worrying about which weapon was the best, you start with the best weapons the galaxy has to offer. And acquire a few new ones. The only thing I would have liked to see in there were the weapon mods - because those are the only things that should really be floating about in the hands of lesser, non-cereberus-funded hands.
I agree with you on the positives of streamlining the inventory in Mass Effect 2's case. It made sense from a gameplay standpoint and it worked.
Comparing inventory streamlining to the removal of the isometric camera angle isn't really a good argument - it is, for all intents and purposes, apples and oranges. I don't think any gamer would be happy to see all games be forced into one particular camera angle in this day and age, especially an over-the-shoulder angle.
Options! It's really all I ask of developers.
Friendly fire being a separate option from Insanity difficulty. Insanity making the game harder in more ways than just "...and every enemy's hp is 1.5x"
I believe - and I'm not sure of this - that the explanation for the removal of the camera was that every single area had to be designed to account for it and it wound up being a real design limitation.
I believe - and I'm not sure of this - that the explanation for the removal of the camera was that every single area had to be designed to account for it and it wound up being a real design limitation.
Well they said that they had to make the roofs removable, which limited verticality. We'll see if they actually do anything with that, and if it's worth the trade off.
What game are we talking about here? And what features, exactly? And are we talking about potentially game-breaking elements, or something that's almost entirely atmospheric, like a camera angle?
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
ME2. Inventory. :P
Only half joking
I suppose you could say they "streamlined" the camera angle system, but the benefits from that decision are a lot harder to see than the inventory change.
I'd just like to know why they removed it is all. ME's inventory was bloated, so it's streamlining in ME2 made sense. Removing the isometric view from DA2, at least to the naked eye, seems pointless.
It makes sense because the combat is faster and characters fly across the battlefield at a much faster clip and tend to do more exploitable bunching up. Positioning is also far less important than basic threat management. The camera being moved further out may only serve to make the combat more confusing.
They probably also just want you to see the combat rather than watch things that look like people down far below wiggling around while numbers pop up over their heads and bars go down.
I watched the combat. Avelline's attack animation was roughly 3 frames for 'pull back' and 'stab'. This was repeated at least 3 times during the few moments I was waiting for the boss to die. It looked silly.
Guys quit all this nonsense, we need to get back on topic.
Isabellas ass is insane, first it isn't even covered up, like half covered. Also...damnit was going to get pictures of a booty but google search isn't looking work appropriate. Also her bazongas are ginormous, like porn star big.
I watched the combat. Avelline's attack animation was roughly 3 frames for 'pull back' and 'stab'. This was repeated at least 3 times during the few moments I was waiting for the boss to die. It looked silly.
That's because she had Shield Defense activated.
Blackjack on
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
0
TrippyJingMoses supposes his toeses are roses.But Moses supposes erroneously.Registered Userregular
Guys, we should talk about how if you play a mage, in the exaggerated opening, Hawke has a staff shaped like a dragon's mouth at one end and that's where the fire comes out of.
Pancake on
0
FreiA French Prometheus UnboundDeadwoodRegistered Userregular
edited February 2011
I haven't read the entirety of the thread since the demo has come out, but does anyone else get ridiculously bad performance and graphical glitches with DX11 even on powerful hardware? I'm running a GTx 580, core i7 and 8 gigs of RAM and it's awful. If I switch to DX9 it's fine even at max.
Doesn't happen with other games, assuming it's just a demo thing.
I haven't read the entirety of the thread since the demo has come out, but does anyone else get ridiculously bad performance and graphical glitches with DX11 even on powerful hardware? I'm running a GTx 580, core i7 and 8 gigs of RAM and it's awful. If I switch to DX9 it's fine even at max.
Doesn't happen with other games, assuming it's just a demo thing.
DX11 isn't actually supported. It will be in the final. Turn off DX11 and Vertical Sync or you'll have problems, regardless of hardware.
Posts
I'd hate to say it, but typically in my experience, restrictive camera angles are usually implemented as a short-cut to hide backdrops and renders that aren't fully fleshed out. Basically consider World of Warcraft's old world, pre-Cataclysm. When they introduced flying mounts, people wondered why you couldn't use them in the old world. Blizzard came out and said the reason why you couldn't is because a lot of the buildings and mountains and areas beyond weren't fully realized, and flying mounts would expose a lot of unfinished shit and invisible walls. They had to redesign the old world from the ground up before it was ready for a player that could sweep their view over literally everything.
Not saying that is the case here, though.
Time to channel sarcasm to the max.
I mean.
There's that.
Totally my fault that I did it, too, but at this point in my life I have the self control of a lemming when presented with the ability to break a game.
Because removing features worked so well in a certain other game
Mike Laidlaw has said a few times that if archery is broken in DA2, it's broken in a good way and not an Origins way.
Still, there is no reason that my Archer's crowd control hold should one-shot mooks while my two handed warrior's Mighty blow cannot. Thats just stupid good. And it has a shorter cooldown.
Archery has its place, but it always felt pretty balanced in the release build.
Some abilities were tweaked, so archers are still fun but not 'why bother with two weapons' good.
Personally, I prefer dual-wield rogue.
And as far as Archery goes in DAO, it sucked balls in vanilla, but Combat Tweaks brought it up to par with other fighting styles. Too bad you had to be playing the PC version to reap the benefit.
That could easily have been solved by, y'know, proper clipping coding.
I'd love to see a fireball that properly burns through the wooden walls of the house. And is stopped short by a stone wall.
It'd certainly add an element of "do I really want to cast that here?" to the mix.
ME2. Inventory. :P
Only half joking
Cast a fireball in a stone corridor, watch your entire party burn and then asphyxiate.
No Hawke, why you gotta cast that?
That seems like it belongs in an RPG. RPGs aren't about fun or bending reality. It's all hardcore all the time even though you're shooting fire with your mind.
Heh. That would actually be in keeping with the spirit of the first game, at least.
ME1 inventory actually got in the way of gameplay, though.
edit: But of course I waste my totp on this.
Can you say anything about Two-Handed Sword balance? It was insanely weak in the demo. Weaker than the Sword-and-Board warrior in terms of DPS, which is wrong on every imaginable level. I'm assuming it was just an oversight (not getting a new sword for the second part), but it'd be nice if you could confirm.
I suppose you could say they "streamlined" the camera angle system, but the benefits from that decision are a lot harder to see than the inventory change.
I'd just like to know why they removed it is all. ME's inventory was bloated, so it's streamlining in ME2 made sense. Removing the isometric view from DA2, at least to the naked eye, seems pointless.
To answer seriously for a second: As much as I love inventories in other games, the concept has gotten stretched a bit thin.
When Bioshock was touted as an RPG and lacked an inventory, I was unhappy.
When Mass Effect 2 was released without one, I was almost glad to see it go. Because they correctly (to my mind, in my opinion, etc.) streamlined it. Instead of worrying about which weapon was the best, you start with the best weapons the galaxy has to offer. And acquire a few new ones. The only thing I would have liked to see in there were the weapon mods - because those are the only things that should really be floating about in the hands of lesser, non-cereberus-funded hands.
I agree with you on the positives of streamlining the inventory in Mass Effect 2's case. It made sense from a gameplay standpoint and it worked.
Comparing inventory streamlining to the removal of the isometric camera angle isn't really a good argument - it is, for all intents and purposes, apples and oranges. I don't think any gamer would be happy to see all games be forced into one particular camera angle in this day and age, especially an over-the-shoulder angle.
I used it all the time because it was the only way to ensure the camera wouldn't get stuck in a sub-ideal angle and actually be able to see what the whole party was doing. It was just simpler after a while.
It makes sense because the combat is faster and characters fly across the battlefield at a much faster clip and tend to do more exploitable bunching up. Positioning is also far less important than basic threat management. The camera being moved further out may only serve to make the combat more confusing.
They probably also just want you to see the combat rather than watch things that look like people down far below wiggling around while numbers pop up over their heads and bars go down.
Options! It's really all I ask of developers.
Friendly fire being a separate option from Insanity difficulty. Insanity making the game harder in more ways than just "...and every enemy's hp is 1.5x"
Well they said that they had to make the roofs removable, which limited verticality. We'll see if they actually do anything with that, and if it's worth the trade off.
I watched the combat. Avelline's attack animation was roughly 3 frames for 'pull back' and 'stab'. This was repeated at least 3 times during the few moments I was waiting for the boss to die. It looked silly.
Isabellas ass is insane, first it isn't even covered up, like half covered. Also...damnit was going to get pictures of a booty but google search isn't looking work appropriate. Also her bazongas are ginormous, like porn star big.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
admit it
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
It's ok to admit you checked her out. I don't think anyone will revoke your Rainbow Card. :P
Doesn't happen with other games, assuming it's just a demo thing.
DX11 isn't actually supported. It will be in the final. Turn off DX11 and Vertical Sync or you'll have problems, regardless of hardware.
I mean it won't be a horrible loss, but it'll annoy me.