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Marvel vs Capcom 3: Pay a dollar, get three titles.
Biz, does the second combo build more meter? Usually that's the trade off.
Yes, it does.
I guess that makes sense.
I guess.
The problem is that you keep using Zero and Zero just doesn't do decent damage. Unfairly so in my opinion since he's got such low health. I keep saying he really needs to get some sort of beefing up; even just something like upping his attack damage 10% would go a long way. He already does low damage, but then is designed around long combos that get completely wrecked by the scaling system.
Zero can be good fun against the unwary or inexperienced, but otherwise his mixup game just cannot make up for his low damage potential. It just doesn't make sense to want to quit the game because Capcom made a character too weak; there are plenty of others to choose from.
Good mixup actually usually is the trade off for good damage. If you can get in the hit easily your damage is usually lower. Take ammy as another example. Low ass health and average damage but has a ton of options plus having a ridiculously small hitbox.
I think zero is a fine character. 580K damage ain't no slouch for a BnB and one meter. He probably has one of the better mixup games in the game, which is important when people actually learn to block better and it becomes harder to get a hit in.
Wouldn't zero having shit for damage but good options make him a perfect character for anchor and xfactor?
Tommatt on
0
Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
edited March 2011
Right, right, I guess I should bother comprehending posts as I read them. Forget what I said about quitting the game and whatnot.
But I still think Zero got the short end of the lightsaber. His mixup game was nearly unstoppable the first few times I came across it; now he barely even seems threatening. Even when Zero does manage to slip past my defenses, he ends up doing so little damage that I can jut about shrug it off.
For comparison, take my usual three of Hulk/Wolverine/Taskmaster. Every last one of them has absolutely no problem at all surviving a Zero combo to switch out and erase half the damage it did anyway. Every one of them can also do combos at from any point which are both far easier to perform and out-damage Zero's basic combo . And not just out-damage Zero by a little, but by enough that characters can almost be dead from a single combo without even going into DHC (700k+ goes a lot farther than not even cracking 600k). Hell, Hulk can easily corner combo somebody for over 900k damage using one single super bar and an assist.
Zero is pretty close to being great, but he just needs a little nudge. Not a big one, but just enough to help offset how much he suffers due to the damage scaling. Right now, he just can't do enough against a wary opponent to offset his almost absurdly low damage.
All of your characters are pretty much the bigger hitters of the game though. Especially hulk and taskmaster.
Damage isn't the only indicator of how strong a character is though. I mean, hulk can easily out damage zero (and most of the characters in the game) but zero can easily out-zone and out-polk hulk and doesn't zero's multi hit moves basically rape hulk's super armour? Especially with shadow super.
Though seriously, with a good otg assist it seems like he actually does have decent damage.
All of your characters are pretty much the bigger hitters of the game though. Especially hulk and taskmaster.
Damage isn't the only indicator of how strong a character is though. I mean, hulk can easily out damage zero (and most of the characters in the game) but zero can easily out-zone and out-polk hulk and doesn't zero's multi hit moves basically rape hulk's super armour? Especially with shadow super.
Though seriously, with a good otg assist it seems like he actually does have decent damage.
I find that Zero's multi-hit moves are actually his greatest weakness against Hulk. Those multi-hit moves are plenty slow to super-armor his way through them. And with the shadow super going, all Hulk has to do is dodge for, what, ten seconds? Zero's zoning game isn't anywhere near strong enough to be more than a minor inconvience. In fact, Hulk is actually my preferred character to use against Zero because Hulk makes the fight so relatively quick and simple.
And while that is a pretty character-specific comparison, I think it's clear that Zero's difficulty/reward ratio is just too low. Aside from the three character I main, there are at least a half-dozen others who easily break the 700k barrier with their usual stuff, if not more, and almost all of them have higher health than Zero. If Sentinel can get such a huge nerf, then I would really like to see Zero get a kick in the pants. I mean, when I see an Akuma, I have to be careful; his supers and combos are great and effective. When I see a Zero, even a really good Zero, the game just ends up being a matter of turning Zero's offense against himself and shrugging off combos.
Oh, right...he's safe on anything, has speed, range and great damage...oh, and an awesome assist.
Bleh.
When I can beat people's entire team regardless of who they use and they can school all 3 of my remaining characters with just Wesker, something is not right.
Granted, not sentinel levels of tarded, but fighting Wesker is frustrating as all hell.
Masume on
3DS Code - 5370-0463-9307 Wii U - 'Nocero' XBox ID - therealmasume PS4 ID - realmasume
Super Armor - Property of certain moves where one hit of an incoming attack will be absorbed without interrupting the attack.
Hyper armor - Property of Sentinel's S launcher and Hsien-ko's gold hyper combo buff that absorbs any number of attacks without interrupting the attack. Also note Sentinel's prevents him from taking damage during its duration (Hsien-ko's does not).
Is there a difference between super armor and hyper armor or is that just people loosely throwing words around?
One of them means protection against only one hit. The other means it will absorb all of the hits. I THINK this is how it is. Eesang told me this just yesterday but bugger I forgot which is which. He said this was applicable towards Sentinal S which would absorb multiple hits while his crouch B only absorbs one. Not sure if this is actually the case though and we may be totally wrong.
Super Armor - Property of certain moves where one hit of an incoming attack will be absorbed without interrupting the attack.
Hyper armor - Property of Sentinel's S launcher and Hsien-ko's gold hyper combo buff that absorbs any number of attacks without interrupting the attack. Also note Sentinel's prevents him from taking damage during its duration (Hsien-ko's does not).
Akuma/Taskmaster/Wesker delivers. Even using it as Akuma +2 dhc/assist options and having very basic ability with the other 2 leads to some pretty brutal stuff.
Akuma/Taskmaster/Wesker delivers. Even using it as Akuma +2 dhc/assist options and having very basic ability with the other 2 leads to some pretty brutal stuff.
Solsovly uses a combo with Akuma where he hypers twice w/no assists. It's pretty brutal.
*****
Finally got the win 10 in a row event out of the way. As is typical, last match was a struggle, but a lvl 3 XF'd Deadpool player screwed up and used his Hyper an arms length away from a lvl 3 XF'd Wesker who had 3 meters.
I used to think it was lame, but now I enjoy when he pulls that missile out of nowhere.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
Akuma/Taskmaster/Wesker delivers. Even using it as Akuma +2 dhc/assist options and having very basic ability with the other 2 leads to some pretty brutal stuff.
Solsovly uses a combo with Akuma where he hypers twice w/no assists. It's pretty brutal.
*****
Finally got the win 10 in a row event out of the way. As is typical, last match was a struggle, but a lvl 3 XF'd Deadpool player screwed up and used his Hyper an arms length away from a lvl 3 XF'd Wesker who had 3 meters.
I used to think it was lame, but now I enjoy when he pulls that missile out of nowhere.
Details? Why? He's not as safe as some of your other characters are when you throw stuff out, so it'd make sense.
**
Also, has there been a video recently of Chris / Doom / Haggar? I've run into three or four separate people in a very short time using that exact team and it's unusual that happens.
Also x2, had an awesome moment last night. Sentinel / Storm / Haggar team. I dash in at the beginning of the match, block, Haggar comes out, I attack, catch both Sentinel and Haggar with Zero.
Take 'em up, put 'em down, Rekkoha, XFC, Rekkoha, two dead characters.
I then almost lost to an XFC'd Storm, but I was still laughing the whole way.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
I'm trying to decide on a third character for my team. I'm pretty happy with X-23/Dorm, my scrubby X-23 combos DHC well into Chaotic Flame, and Dark Hole works with her teleport mixup (I'm pretty sure, at least). Any thoughts on what would be good for them? Mostly been using Morrigan or Ryu since I already kind of know how to play them, and I'm also digging Spencer.
I'm trying to decide on a third character for my team. I'm pretty happy with X-23/Dorm, my scrubby X-23 combos DHC well into Chaotic Flame, and Dark Hole works with her teleport mixup (I'm pretty sure, at least). Any thoughts on what would be good for them? Mostly been using Morrigan or Ryu since I already kind of know how to play them, and I'm also digging Spencer.
For the most part I would pick a character whose good at doing damage without meter and has a good assist that can work offensively and defensively.
X-23 is good on staying on people, so you either want someone who has something to cover her approach(beam super is always good) or someone who can keep someone pinned down during blockstrings so you can run in again(Dark Hole is pretty good with this, but it has to be spaced right).
As for Dorm, Dorm needs meter to be really scary so you want someone who doesn't have to burn through it too much or someone who builds it well. Also, having someone with a good "get off me" assist works because as soon as Dorm hits the field most people will go full-blown offense against him.
I find Dante to be pretty decent for his assist. It works as good on offense or defense but you have to space right.
Ammy and Tron also have good ones with Ammy's ice shot thing and Tron's fire move.
Doom and Iron Man both have good beam assists. They come out fast and keep your opponent in blockstun for a decent time.
There are plenty of others but those are off the top of my head.
I'm trying to decide on a third character for my team. I'm pretty happy with X-23/Dorm, my scrubby X-23 combos DHC well into Chaotic Flame, and Dark Hole works with her teleport mixup (I'm pretty sure, at least). Any thoughts on what would be good for them? Mostly been using Morrigan or Ryu since I already kind of know how to play them, and I'm also digging Spencer.
I played around with making an X-23/Dorm team (with Akuma as the third). It has potential, but ultimately I abandoned it because I'm terrible at the zoning playstyle that Dorm requires. I learned a few useful things though.
You can utilize the DHC trick from X-23's Weapon X Prime hyper into Dorm's tracking fireball hyper for a damage and hitstun reset. The timing is a little tricky, you have to DHC at the last possible moment. Look for a third character that can continue this combo for a pretty simple 3 meter touch of death combo (I think with just the two hypers you'll be doing around 850-900k). You'll need someone who can hit way up in the air (like Ryu's up beam hyper, or I think things like Maximum Spider that track to the opponent) or just full screen (Ammy or Storm maybe?). You also need an assist that can hold your opponent in place briefly after X-23's OTG, because she can't combo into that hyper otherwise. Dark hole might actually work for that, I'm not sure. An assist like Tron's flame would be useful to both of them, as a GTFO me assist for Dorm, and to make people scared to push buttons vs X-23.
I think they have a lot of synergy and the team has potential, but ultimately my mindset is more that of a space invader than a space controller, and playing that team requires shifting between the two.
inlemur on
XBL - remura
0
Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
edited March 2011
I wish they would announce new dlc, and not of the event variety...I want a new character/costume/stage announcement.
I wish they would announce new dlc, and not of the event variety...I want a new character/costume/stage announcement.
If they're smart and track team rosters used in ranked or something, they'll release costumes for characters that are on the most teams, but also spread out among the most teams.
E.g., if the two most popular teams are Magneto / Storm / Sentinel and She-Hulk / Tronne / Spencer, they'll release costumes for say Storm and Spencer..
I know I am a sucker for costumes for characters I use, but could care less about others.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
Super Armor - Property of certain moves where one hit of an incoming attack will be absorbed without interrupting the attack.
Hyper armor - Property of Sentinel's S launcher and Hsien-ko's gold hyper combo buff that absorbs any number of attacks without interrupting the attack. Also note Sentinel's prevents him from taking damage during its duration (Hsien-ko's does not).
C. Viper focus attack has Hyper armor.
To be fair I'd probably remember that if anyone used Viper well. Or, at all.
In other news I just learned Wolverine is quite beastly when backed by Doom's beam. Lets him Berserker Slash to the other side, Doom fires his laser and knocks them back towards Wolvie for a full combo. Wolverine being beastly is hardly news but the Doom laser in particular strikes me as great for him. Too bad I can't do anything but spam with Doom...
Also does anyone know any particularly great combos for Tron when she's not juggling the opponent in the corner? I'm debating about picking her up but most of her stuff seems to only work in the corner for me.
And grats Banshee. Remember, it'll probably be a few days before he's gripping the controller well enough to toss it in rage.
Also does anyone know any particularly great combos for Tron when she's not juggling the opponent in the corner? I'm debating about picking her up but most of her stuff seems to only work in the corner for me.
I'm a big Tron fan, but I haven't put in as much time as I like. So take my advice with a grain of salt.
Jumping H, all day erry day. From there, juggle into Bonne strike, M, Gustaff Flame, j.H j.S, st. H, lunch rush.
It combos even when you're not in the corner, though the timing is a bit tighter than just bouncing into king servbot. There are other variations with assists and the servbot grab, but this is the basic mid-screen combo you should be comfortable with.
Also, try to avoid her multi-hit normals like cr. L, st. M and j. L. The extra hits don't do respectable damage, and they bring the scaling gods down that much faster.
Last game of the night, figure why not end with a little class. I throw out the Gamma Crush against his Wesker thinking there were only 5 seconds left in this game and no way for me to come back and make up the life difference in time. Poor guy tried to Wesker Counter super it immediately but did it too early and Wesker stood there with nothing to counter, stopped countering and got demolished by Hulk's Giant Boulder before he could do anything. Player 1 Wins.
Posts
Yes, it does.
I guess that makes sense.
I guess.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
The problem is that you keep using Zero and Zero just doesn't do decent damage. Unfairly so in my opinion since he's got such low health. I keep saying he really needs to get some sort of beefing up; even just something like upping his attack damage 10% would go a long way. He already does low damage, but then is designed around long combos that get completely wrecked by the scaling system.
Zero can be good fun against the unwary or inexperienced, but otherwise his mixup game just cannot make up for his low damage potential. It just doesn't make sense to want to quit the game because Capcom made a character too weak; there are plenty of others to choose from.
Good mixup actually usually is the trade off for good damage. If you can get in the hit easily your damage is usually lower. Take ammy as another example. Low ass health and average damage but has a ton of options plus having a ridiculously small hitbox.
I think zero is a fine character. 580K damage ain't no slouch for a BnB and one meter. He probably has one of the better mixup games in the game, which is important when people actually learn to block better and it becomes harder to get a hit in.
But I still think Zero got the short end of the lightsaber. His mixup game was nearly unstoppable the first few times I came across it; now he barely even seems threatening. Even when Zero does manage to slip past my defenses, he ends up doing so little damage that I can jut about shrug it off.
For comparison, take my usual three of Hulk/Wolverine/Taskmaster. Every last one of them has absolutely no problem at all surviving a Zero combo to switch out and erase half the damage it did anyway. Every one of them can also do combos at from any point which are both far easier to perform and out-damage Zero's basic combo . And not just out-damage Zero by a little, but by enough that characters can almost be dead from a single combo without even going into DHC (700k+ goes a lot farther than not even cracking 600k). Hell, Hulk can easily corner combo somebody for over 900k damage using one single super bar and an assist.
Zero is pretty close to being great, but he just needs a little nudge. Not a big one, but just enough to help offset how much he suffers due to the damage scaling. Right now, he just can't do enough against a wary opponent to offset his almost absurdly low damage.
Damage isn't the only indicator of how strong a character is though. I mean, hulk can easily out damage zero (and most of the characters in the game) but zero can easily out-zone and out-polk hulk and doesn't zero's multi hit moves basically rape hulk's super armour? Especially with shadow super.
Though seriously, with a good otg assist it seems like he actually does have decent damage.
Prepare
TWITTER TWATS
Join us, Hat.
Join usssss.
Chun Li is so much better in your old game...
I find that Zero's multi-hit moves are actually his greatest weakness against Hulk. Those multi-hit moves are plenty slow to super-armor his way through them. And with the shadow super going, all Hulk has to do is dodge for, what, ten seconds? Zero's zoning game isn't anywhere near strong enough to be more than a minor inconvience. In fact, Hulk is actually my preferred character to use against Zero because Hulk makes the fight so relatively quick and simple.
And while that is a pretty character-specific comparison, I think it's clear that Zero's difficulty/reward ratio is just too low. Aside from the three character I main, there are at least a half-dozen others who easily break the 700k barrier with their usual stuff, if not more, and almost all of them have higher health than Zero. If Sentinel can get such a huge nerf, then I would really like to see Zero get a kick in the pants. I mean, when I see an Akuma, I have to be careful; his supers and combos are great and effective. When I see a Zero, even a really good Zero, the game just ends up being a matter of turning Zero's offense against himself and shrugging off combos.
Oh, right...he's safe on anything, has speed, range and great damage...oh, and an awesome assist.
Bleh.
When I can beat people's entire team regardless of who they use and they can school all 3 of my remaining characters with just Wesker, something is not right.
Granted, not sentinel levels of tarded, but fighting Wesker is frustrating as all hell.
Wii U - 'Nocero'
XBox ID - therealmasume
PS4 ID - realmasume
Hyper armor - Property of Sentinel's S launcher and Hsien-ko's gold hyper combo buff that absorbs any number of attacks without interrupting the attack. Also note Sentinel's prevents him from taking damage during its duration (Hsien-ko's does not).
One of them means protection against only one hit. The other means it will absorb all of the hits. I THINK this is how it is. Eesang told me this just yesterday but bugger I forgot which is which. He said this was applicable towards Sentinal S which would absorb multiple hits while his crouch B only absorbs one. Not sure if this is actually the case though and we may be totally wrong.
edit: oops beat'd but I guess he was right!
C. Viper focus attack has Hyper armor.
Solsovly uses a combo with Akuma where he hypers twice w/no assists. It's pretty brutal.
*****
Finally got the win 10 in a row event out of the way. As is typical, last match was a struggle, but a lvl 3 XF'd Deadpool player screwed up and used his Hyper an arms length away from a lvl 3 XF'd Wesker who had 3 meters.
I used to think it was lame, but now I enjoy when he pulls that missile out of nowhere.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
TWITTER TWATS
Iron Man is pissing me off.
**
Also, has there been a video recently of Chris / Doom / Haggar? I've run into three or four separate people in a very short time using that exact team and it's unusual that happens.
Also x2, had an awesome moment last night. Sentinel / Storm / Haggar team. I dash in at the beginning of the match, block, Haggar comes out, I attack, catch both Sentinel and Haggar with Zero.
Take 'em up, put 'em down, Rekkoha, XFC, Rekkoha, two dead characters.
I then almost lost to an XFC'd Storm, but I was still laughing the whole way.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
He's gonna be the Best MvC4 (or 5) player Ever.
For the most part I would pick a character whose good at doing damage without meter and has a good assist that can work offensively and defensively.
X-23 is good on staying on people, so you either want someone who has something to cover her approach(beam super is always good) or someone who can keep someone pinned down during blockstrings so you can run in again(Dark Hole is pretty good with this, but it has to be spaced right).
As for Dorm, Dorm needs meter to be really scary so you want someone who doesn't have to burn through it too much or someone who builds it well. Also, having someone with a good "get off me" assist works because as soon as Dorm hits the field most people will go full-blown offense against him.
I find Dante to be pretty decent for his assist. It works as good on offense or defense but you have to space right.
Ammy and Tron also have good ones with Ammy's ice shot thing and Tron's fire move.
Doom and Iron Man both have good beam assists. They come out fast and keep your opponent in blockstun for a decent time.
There are plenty of others but those are off the top of my head.
I played around with making an X-23/Dorm team (with Akuma as the third). It has potential, but ultimately I abandoned it because I'm terrible at the zoning playstyle that Dorm requires. I learned a few useful things though.
You can utilize the DHC trick from X-23's Weapon X Prime hyper into Dorm's tracking fireball hyper for a damage and hitstun reset. The timing is a little tricky, you have to DHC at the last possible moment. Look for a third character that can continue this combo for a pretty simple 3 meter touch of death combo (I think with just the two hypers you'll be doing around 850-900k). You'll need someone who can hit way up in the air (like Ryu's up beam hyper, or I think things like Maximum Spider that track to the opponent) or just full screen (Ammy or Storm maybe?). You also need an assist that can hold your opponent in place briefly after X-23's OTG, because she can't combo into that hyper otherwise. Dark hole might actually work for that, I'm not sure. An assist like Tron's flame would be useful to both of them, as a GTFO me assist for Dorm, and to make people scared to push buttons vs X-23.
I think they have a lot of synergy and the team has potential, but ultimately my mindset is more that of a space invader than a space controller, and playing that team requires shifting between the two.
Nintendo Network ID - Brainiac_8
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Add me!
If they're smart and track team rosters used in ranked or something, they'll release costumes for characters that are on the most teams, but also spread out among the most teams.
E.g., if the two most popular teams are Magneto / Storm / Sentinel and She-Hulk / Tronne / Spencer, they'll release costumes for say Storm and Spencer..
I know I am a sucker for costumes for characters I use, but could care less about others.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
This has totally made my day. There's no way you can possibly click that spoiler and not smile ear to ear.
CONGRATS TO YOU!!!! And to whoever helped with that :P
Steam | Live
To be fair I'd probably remember that if anyone used Viper well. Or, at all.
In other news I just learned Wolverine is quite beastly when backed by Doom's beam. Lets him Berserker Slash to the other side, Doom fires his laser and knocks them back towards Wolvie for a full combo. Wolverine being beastly is hardly news but the Doom laser in particular strikes me as great for him. Too bad I can't do anything but spam with Doom...
Also does anyone know any particularly great combos for Tron when she's not juggling the opponent in the corner? I'm debating about picking her up but most of her stuff seems to only work in the corner for me.
And grats Banshee. Remember, it'll probably be a few days before he's gripping the controller well enough to toss it in rage.
I'm a big Tron fan, but I haven't put in as much time as I like. So take my advice with a grain of salt.
Jumping H, all day erry day. From there, juggle into Bonne strike, M, Gustaff Flame, j.H j.S, st. H, lunch rush.
It combos even when you're not in the corner, though the timing is a bit tighter than just bouncing into king servbot. There are other variations with assists and the servbot grab, but this is the basic mid-screen combo you should be comfortable with.
Also, try to avoid her multi-hit normals like cr. L, st. M and j. L. The extra hits don't do respectable damage, and they bring the scaling gods down that much faster.
that is silly.
I actually didn't know that if that's the case. I just knew it absorbed unlimited hits
For the first 12 frames he's vulnerable though. Not sure if that changes anything. I am surprise it has H. Armor instead of just being armored though
What's this 10 win achievement talk? I thought it was only 5 in this game.
Wesker feeds on your tears
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
This game is so much fun.