Meanwhile, I'm also considering taking the time to build my own custom fan controller, because I'm a gigantic fucking nerd.
mcdermott on
0
AlectharAlan ShoreWe're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered Userregular
edited March 2011
So, below (spoilered for being really freaking long) is the Case and PSU section I hope to get added to the OP. Any complaints/recommendations/accusations of fraud?
Cases and PSU: Basics and Recommendations
Choosing a case and PSU for your new PC build is often something of an afterthought. It's easy to make the mistake of focusing in hard on your sweet, sweet CPU and GPU purchases, buying the best performing components you can afford, then sticking them in whatever case you can buy with what's left of your budget, along with the cheapest PSU you could find that would (supposedly) power your build.
The reality is that Cases and PSUs are, in a way, the most important part of any PC build. A case with poor cooling performance might result in long term (or, in extreme cases, even short-term) damage to your components. The harder it is to build in your case, the more likely you are to accidentally damage the case, your components, or yourself (the cheaper the case, the sharper the edges) trying to force things. And if the case was hard to build in, it won't be easy to upgrade components in, or clean. Keep in mind that a great case is an investment. Unlike a processor or graphics card, which can go from cream of the crop to just 2nd (or 3rd) best in the time it takes to get it shipped to your door, your case can be around for a long time, and be home to many upgrades and new builds, as long as you buy a solid model that gives you room to grow. It's worth the extra expense. A PSU is even more significant. A quality, enthusiast grade PSU is a solid, efficient, purpose built piece of electronics, and if you keep things reasonable, it will serve you well through upgrades, and even new builds. A quality PSU can do all you ask of it and more, and while you shouldn't go crazy, you'd be surprised by what a nice Seasonic or Corsair or Antec (etc.) can do for you. Of course, if you choose poorly, you could turn your multi-hundred dollar PC build into a paperweight fashioned of smoldering silicon trapped within sheet metal.
Below you'll find information and guidelines on Case and PSU choice, as well as some recommendations (prices current as of March 23, 2011) on what might be a good buy for your budget.
Cases
When looking at cases, I recommend looking for the following features as a baseline:
1. Cable Management - At this point, reasonable cable management features are so common in cases at all budget levels that there really isn't any reason to buy a case without them. Sometimes the case will have a large void on the right side of the motherboard tray (many older Cooler Master cases like the CM Storm Sniper use this method), others will have cutouts (sometimes with rubber grommets) to bring cables back through. Ideally the case will feature a cutout for your 8 pin CPU power cable as well, but some cheaper cases with cable management don't have them. If you're lucky and careful, you might be able to thread your 8 pin under your motherboard and through the CPU backplate cutout to mimic the effect. Regardless of the style or number/location of cutouts offered, the basic idea is always the same, moving cables behind the motherboard tray as much as possible and bringing them out right where they need to be. Cable management doesn't just make your case innards look pretty, it helps your case stay cool.
2. Bottom-mounted PSU w/ Vent - Once again, this feature is very common on quality cases of all budget levels, so you shouldn't have any trouble finding something you like. Basically this feature improves case layout by placing your PSU at the bottom of the case, where it can intake cool air from under the case and exhaust it. It largely removes your PSU from the thermal equation. It's nice if the vent is filtered.
3. Good thermal options - At the very least your case should have mounts for a front intake fan, and a rear exhaust fan. These should be at least 120mm fan mounts. Ideally you'll have options side intake and top exhaust fans as well (2 fan mounts for each location is fairly standard in a good enthusiast level case). If you have multiple front intake fans (or a single larger, say, 200mm fan) the side intake is less important. Filtered intakes are a plus.
4. Good Design Touches - I always look for a few additional good design decisions in a case. A good case should feature at least some tool-less/screwless options for hardware mounting. Understandably, tool-less mechanisms are less numerous the lower the price of the case, but the best budget options still often feature thumbscrews, and/or a single tool-less mount on the 5.25 bays. The HDD cages should be oriented to place the "back" of the drive, where your SATA and Power connectors are, toward the side of the case with the motherboard tray, to facilitate cable routing. Keep an eye out for a nice sized CPU backplate cutout, it'll make attaching an aftermarket cooler immeasurably easier. Finally, most cases worth your time will have at least 2 front panel USB 2.0 ports to go with the HD audio hookups.
Naturally, these baselines can't cover everything, if your budget is extremely limited you might need to compromise on much of that list, but if you're looking for a mid-tower computer case to build a gaming PC in, and you have at least $40, most of those features can be yours.
After you've taken a look at what's available and eliminated those cases that just don't make the cut, buy within your budget, and keep aesthetics under consideration. You'll be less inclined to take care of something you can barely stand to look at. There are a number of unique touches and additions that can increase the value of the case for your particular build, so be thorough and make sure you've found something you can live with. If you're having trouble figuring out where to start, check the list below for some good starting points at various budget levels. PM me if you think your case is rad and I don't have it on the list!
NOTE: This list ignores shipping costs.
$40: NZXT Gamma (lacks 8 pin cutout, but is really cheap)
More money: Um...don't? Unless you're really wedded to a certain feature (like the motherboard mounting on the Raven 2/ Fortress 2 cases from Silverstone, which is pretty cool) or really need a big-ass case for your big-ass rig (XL-ATX? Really?) and big-ass water cooling loop(s) (from what little I've read, a lot of water cooling enthusiasts swear by some older Lian Li and Cooler Master full towers, or the 800D from Corsair) you won't really need to spend more.
Power Supplies
Buying a power supply is a crucial decision, and it doesn't respond well to the kind of "pop it in our test rig and benchmark it" style of reviewing that most PC component review sites tend to favor. In many cases, a power supply that runs a test rig just fine can be less efficient than advertised, unable to pull its rated peak wattage, and have out of specification electrical ripple and noise that can damage your components. Fewer sites than you'd think actually test power supplies correctly, below are 3 of my favorites:
All of these sites are very transparent about their methodology, which is good because I've found that legitimate power supply reviews are very important in determing the correct supply to buy. For example, reviews might help you find out that while some Antec PSU lines are very solid (True Power New, original Earthwatts below 650W), others are mediocre to terrible (new Earthwatts, original Earthwatts from 650W and up, Basiq). This hodgepodge of awesome, acceptable, and awful product lines occurs largely because most major PSU vendors sell PSU lines that are rebadged (and sometimes modified) power supplies from other companies (Seasonic, CWT, and many others). So, while one line might benefit by being based on a solid Seasonic platform, another might be crippled by being based on a (literally) explosive Huntkey PSU. Because you don't have time to deconstruct a boatload of power supplies, your best option is to let good, reputable reviewers do the legwork for you.
So, you have some good resources that will let you know what to look for, but when you find it, you find that it has 2 12V rails, and your good buddy told you that quality PSUs should only have a single 12V rail. Also, it's modular, and that same buddy told you all about how that's bad and not as good as hardwired cables.
Your buddy is an idiot.
Apologies for my bluntness, but there are numerous myths/semi-myths that you hear all the time about PSUs that can really interfere with the buying process. Let's take a look at some “conventional wisdom” that is simply incorrect:
Modular cabling increases resistance/is another point of failure/is at increased risk for corrosion: The first and second points are technically true, but in the first case, the added resistance is entirely negligible, it's roughly equivalent to a few additional inches of cabling. Modular cables are, in theory, at slightly increased risk for failure, but the risk is very slim in a quality supply, and if you use PSU cable extensions (for example) you're essentially assuming the same risk, just slightly further down the cable. The third claim is just untrue. Modular cabling, either in fully or partially modular supplies, is really helpful in maintaining a clean build. It's a nice feature to have that usually comes at a price premium. Don't spend loads of additional money on it, but it is worth a reasonable amount of cash to have on a quality supply.
Single Rail/Multi Rail designs are superior to Multi Rail/Single Rail designs: The objections here are slightly different. Single rail designs get boosted by many because of issues multi-rail supplies had 4-5 years ago with load balancing. Since then, design has improved and those problems are a thing of the past (at least in quality supplies). Multi-rail supplies are “superior” because Single-Rail supplies above a certain wattage (around 600W) have OCP (over current protection) that is set so high out of necessity (because all of the current on the 12V rail is on a single rail) that it's likely that, in the event of a short circuit that the SCP (Short Circuit Protection) doesn't catch, you'll sustain serious to catastrophic component damage before the OCP kicks in. Now, it's really unlikely that such a short circuit would occur, so really Multi-Rail vs. Single-Rail is a non-issue, but if you really want the absolute safest supply and you need more than 600ish Watts, go with a quality Multi-Rail unit.
Headroom! More Headroom!: Okay, so often I'm the first person to buy more than I need, but a quality PSU is a well-designed, precision engineered, ass-kicking beast with as many safety precautions built in as the manufacturer can fit onto a PCB. Additionally, a quality supply is often rated for a peak wattage significantly below what the supply can actually sustain. Why? Because a power supply is actually most efficient at between 40 and 60 percent of load. So, if you design a PSU that could technically be rated at 1000W, then label it as a 750W model, the peak wattage is closer to the 40%-60% range where the PSU is most efficient, so you get better efficiency results. Basically, don't overdo it with buying headroom, most reasonably priced enthusiast level builds will need an absolute maximum of 850W (and that's if you plan to Crossfire/SLI cards in the 200W pull range, like the 5870), and many require significantly less.
So with all that said, here's a few manufacturer recommendations/warnings to keep in mind as you buy your PSU:
The Good
Corsair – Corsair has made something of a name for itself in the PSU sector, and they do make some of the better PSUs available today (their AX series, mostly). Many of their older lines are still favorites among enthusiasts, though other companies have come out with competing/superior lines. Still, those are completely solid supplies, even if they aren't the best performers anymore. With the exception of the current “Builder Series” (PSUs labeled CX430, CX500, CX600, which are labeled at higher wattages than they probably should be), and the new Gamer Series (which I haven't seen reviewed/discussed much yet, so I reserve judgment) I would recommend a Corsair supply without hesitation.
Seasonic – Seasonic makes some of the best PSUs in the world, including most of the best PSUs in the world from vendors like Corsair and Antec. You see, Seasonic is both an OEM vendor, and a Retail vendor. Most of their supplies are clustered around lower wattages, usually under 650W, but they make high quality, efficient supplies.
Enermax – Enermax is an odd duck, they don't seem to get much attention, but they have some of the best (if not outright the best) high wattage units in the business. They aren't always priced the most competitively, but Enermax maintains a reputation for excellence.
The Mediocre
Antec – After a rough time in the PSU market, Antec has rebounded significantly in recent years and released some solid lines of PSUs. The main problem with Antec is that in addition to some great lines (like the True Power New line) they also make some very mediocre lines (Earthwatts) and some absolutely abominable lines (anything labeled Basiq). If you're buying the right supply Antec can be comparable to anyone from Seasonic to that generic supply you found smoldering in the trash 3 days ago. Between the highs and lows here, I figure they average out to the highest end of Mediocre.
Thermaltake – Another manufacturer that “averages” to mediocre. Thermaltake's line of Toughpower units is really solid, but virtually every other power supply they make is terrible.
The Bad
Cooler Master – It's surprising, in a way, that a company that makes some really great cases also makes some exceptionally terrible PSUs. Out of all the power supplies that Cooler Master has in their lineup, only the Silent Pro M is really worth your time, and even those supplies aren't particularly good values. Aside from the 4 supplies in that line, avoid like the plague.
Ultra Products – Ultra has had a fairly tarnished reputation for a while, and has made some steps toward redemption in recent years, but between their recently overturned lawsuit regarding modular PSUs, and some incidences of them falsely claiming SLI certification, it's really hard to label them as anything other than a cruddy company.
Generics – God help me, don't use the power supply that came with your case.
As for specific purchasing recommendations...well it's hard to say. PSU choice is heavily dependent on what particular wattage, feature set, and connector demands you have. Buy a good supply from a good company, and be prepared to spend at least 50 to 60 bucks, even if you're looking at something in the 500W range. It sucks to spend money, but this is one of those instances where you will pay significantly more later if you try to save 20 bucks now.
So, below (spoilered for being really freaking long) is the Case and PSU section I hope to get added to the OP. Any complaints/recommendations/accusations of fraud?
Cases and PSU: Basics and Recommendations
Choosing a case and PSU for your new PC build is often something of an afterthought. It's easy to make the mistake of focusing in hard on your sweet, sweet CPU and GPU purchases, buying the best performing components you can afford, then sticking them in whatever case you can buy with what's left of your budget, along with the cheapest PSU you could find that would (supposedly) power your build.
The reality is that Cases and PSUs are, in a way, the most important part of any PC build. A case with poor cooling performance might result in long term (or, in extreme cases, even short-term) damage to your components. The harder it is to build in your case, the more likely you are to accidentally damage the case, your components, or yourself (the cheaper the case, the sharper the edges) trying to force things. And if the case was hard to build in, it won't be easy to upgrade components in, or clean. Keep in mind that a great case is an investment. Unlike a processor or graphics card, which can go from cream of the crop to just 2nd (or 3rd) best in the time it takes to get it shipped to your door, your case can be around for a long time, and be home to many upgrades and new builds, as long as you buy a solid model that gives you room to grow. It's worth the extra expense. A PSU is even more significant. A quality, enthusiast grade PSU is a solid, efficient, purpose built piece of electronics, and if you keep things reasonable, it will serve you well through upgrades, and even new builds. A quality PSU can do all you ask of it and more, and while you shouldn't go crazy, you'd be surprised by what a nice Seasonic or Corsair or Antec (etc.) can do for you. Of course, if you choose poorly, you could turn your multi-hundred dollar PC build into a paperweight fashioned of smoldering silicon trapped within sheet metal.
Below you'll find information and guidelines on Case and PSU choice, as well as some recommendations (prices current as of March 23, 2011) on what might be a good buy for your budget.
Cases
When looking at cases, I recommend looking for the following features as a baseline:
1. Cable Management - At this point, reasonable cable management features are so common in cases at all budget levels that there really isn't any reason to buy a case without them. Sometimes the case will have a large void on the right side of the motherboard tray (many older Cooler Master cases like the CM Storm Sniper use this method), others will have cutouts (sometimes with rubber grommets) to bring cables back through. Ideally the case will feature a cutout for your 8 pin CPU power cable as well, but some cheaper cases with cable management don't have them. If you're lucky and careful, you might be able to thread your 8 pin under your motherboard and through the CPU backplate cutout to mimic the effect. Regardless of the style or number/location of cutouts offered, the basic idea is always the same, moving cables behind the motherboard tray as much as possible and bringing them out right where they need to be. Cable management doesn't just make your case innards look pretty, it helps your case stay cool.
2. Bottom-mounted PSU w/ Vent - Once again, this feature is very common on quality cases of all budget levels, so you shouldn't have any trouble finding something you like. Basically this feature improves case layout by placing your PSU at the bottom of the case, where it can intake cool air from under the case and exhaust it. It largely removes your PSU from the thermal equation. It's nice if the vent is filtered.
3. Good thermal options - At the very least your case should have mounts for a front intake fan, and a rear exhaust fan. These should be at least 120mm fan mounts. Ideally you'll have options side intake and top exhaust fans as well (2 fan mounts for each location is fairly standard in a good enthusiast level case). If you have multiple front intake fans (or a single larger, say, 200mm fan) the side intake is less important. Filtered intakes are a plus.
4. Good Design Touches - I always look for a few additional good design decisions in a case. A good case should feature at least some tool-less/screwless options for hardware mounting. Understandably, tool-less mechanisms are less numerous the lower the price of the case, but the best budget options still often feature thumbscrews, and/or a single tool-less mount on the 5.25 bays. The HDD cages should be oriented to place the "back" of the drive, where your SATA and Power connectors are, toward the side of the case with the motherboard tray, to facilitate cable routing. Keep an eye out for a nice sized CPU backplate cutout, it'll make attaching an aftermarket cooler immeasurably easier. Finally, most cases worth your time will have at least 2 front panel USB 2.0 ports to go with the HD audio hookups.
Naturally, these baselines can't cover everything, if your budget is extremely limited you might need to compromise on much of that list, but if you're looking for a mid-tower computer case to build a gaming PC in, and you have at least $40, most of those features can be yours.
After you've taken a look at what's available and eliminated those cases that just don't make the cut, buy within your budget, and keep aesthetics under consideration. You'll be less inclined to take care of something you can barely stand to look at. There are a number of unique touches and additions that can increase the value of the case for your particular build, so be thorough and make sure you've found something you can live with. If you're having trouble figuring out where to start, check the list below for some good starting points at various budget levels. PM me if you think your case is rad and I don't have it on the list!
NOTE: This list ignores shipping costs.
$40: NZXT Gamma (lacks 8 pin cutout, but is really cheap)
More money: Um...don't? Unless you're really wedded to a certain feature (like the motherboard mounting on the Raven 2/ Fortress 2 cases from Silverstone, which is pretty cool) or really need a big-ass case for your big-ass rig (XL-ATX? Really?) and big-ass water cooling loop(s) (from what little I've read, a lot of water cooling enthusiasts swear by some older Lian Li and Cooler Master full towers, or the 800D from Corsair) you won't really need to spend more.
Power Supplies
Buying a power supply is a crucial decision, and it doesn't respond well to the kind of "pop it in our test rig and benchmark it" style of reviewing that most PC component review sites tend to favor. In many cases, a power supply that runs a test rig just fine can be less efficient than advertised, unable to pull its rated peak wattage, and have out of specification electrical ripple and noise that can damage your components. Fewer sites than you'd think actually test power supplies correctly, below are 3 of my favorites:
All of these sites are very transparent about their methodology, which is good because I've found that legitimate power supply reviews are very important in determing the correct supply to buy. For example, reviews might help you find out that while some Antec PSU lines are very solid (True Power New, original Earthwatts below 650W), others are mediocre to terrible (new Earthwatts, original Earthwatts from 650W and up, Basiq). This hodgepodge of awesome, acceptable, and awful product lines occurs largely because most major PSU vendors sell PSU lines that are rebadged (and sometimes modified) power supplies from other companies (Seasonic, CWT, and many others). So, while one line might benefit by being based on a solid Seasonic platform, another might be crippled by being based on a (literally) explosive Huntkey PSU. Because you don't have time to deconstruct a boatload of power supplies, your best option is to let good, reputable reviewers do the legwork for you.
So, you have some good resources that will let you know what to look for, but when you find it, you find that it has 2 12V rails, and your good buddy told you that quality PSUs should only have a single 12V rail. Also, it's modular, and that same buddy told you all about how that's bad and not as good as hardwired cables.
Your buddy is an idiot.
Apologies for my bluntness, but there are numerous myths/semi-myths that you hear all the time about PSUs that can really interfere with the buying process. Let's take a look at some “conventional wisdom” that is simply incorrect:
Modular cabling increases resistance/is another point of failure/is at increased risk for corrosion: The first and second points are technically true, but in the first case, the added resistance is entirely negligible, it's roughly equivalent to a few additional inches of cabling. Modular cables are, in theory, at slightly increased risk for failure, but the risk is very slim in a quality supply, and if you use PSU cable extensions (for example) you're essentially assuming the same risk, just slightly further down the cable. The third claim is just untrue. Modular cabling, either in fully or partially modular supplies, is really helpful in maintaining a clean build. It's a nice feature to have that usually comes at a price premium. Don't spend loads of additional money on it, but it is worth a reasonable amount of cash to have on a quality supply.
Single Rail/Multi Rail designs are superior to Multi Rail/Single Rail designs: The objections here are slightly different. Single rail designs get boosted by many because of issues multi-rail supplies had 4-5 years ago with load balancing. Since then, design has improved and those problems are a thing of the past (at least in quality supplies). Multi-rail supplies are “superior” because Single-Rail supplies above a certain wattage (around 600W) have OCP (over current protection) that is set so high out of necessity (because all of the current on the 12V rail is on a single rail) that it's likely that, in the event of a short circuit that the SCP (Short Circuit Protection) doesn't catch, you'll sustain serious to catastrophic component damage before the OCP kicks in. Now, it's really unlikely that such a short circuit would occur, so really Multi-Rail vs. Single-Rail is a non-issue, but if you really want the absolute safest supply and you need more than 600ish Watts, go with a quality Multi-Rail unit.
Headroom! More Headroom!: Okay, so often I'm the first person to buy more than I need, but a quality PSU is a well-designed, precision engineered, ass-kicking beast with as many safety precautions built in as the manufacturer can fit onto a PCB. Additionally, a quality supply is often rated for a peak wattage significantly below what the supply can actually sustain. Why? Because a power supply is actually most efficient at between 40 and 60 percent of load. So, if you design a PSU that could technically be rated at 1000W, then label it as a 750W model, the peak wattage is closer to the 40%-60% range where the PSU is most efficient, so you get better efficiency results. Basically, don't overdo it with buying headroom, most reasonably priced enthusiast level builds will need an absolute maximum of 850W (and that's if you plan to Crossfire/SLI cards in the 200W pull range, like the 5870), and many require significantly less.
So with all that said, here's a few manufacturer recommendations/warnings to keep in mind as you buy your PSU:
The Good
Corsair – Corsair has made something of a name for itself in the PSU sector, and they do make some of the better PSUs available today (their AX series, mostly). Many of their older lines are still favorites among enthusiasts, though other companies have come out with competing/superior lines. Still, those are completely solid supplies, even if they aren't the best performers anymore. With the exception of the current “Builder Series” (PSUs labeled CX430, CX500, CX600, which are labeled at higher wattages than they probably should be), and the new Gamer Series (which I haven't seen reviewed/discussed much yet, so I reserve judgment) I would recommend a Corsair supply without hesitation.
Seasonic – Seasonic makes some of the best PSUs in the world, including most of the best PSUs in the world from vendors like Corsair and Antec. You see, Seasonic is both an OEM vendor, and a Retail vendor. Most of their supplies are clustered around lower wattages, usually under 650W, but they make high quality, efficient supplies.
Enermax – Enermax is an odd duck, they don't seem to get much attention, but they have some of the best (if not outright the best) high wattage units in the business. They aren't always priced the most competitively, but Enermax maintains a reputation for excellence.
The Mediocre
Antec – After a rough time in the PSU market, Antec has rebounded significantly in recent years and released some solid lines of PSUs. The main problem with Antec is that in addition to some great lines (like the True Power New line) they also make some very mediocre lines (Earthwatts) and some absolutely abominable lines (anything labeled Basiq). If you're buying the right supply Antec can be comparable to anyone from Seasonic to that generic supply you found smoldering in the trash 3 days ago. Between the highs and lows here, I figure they average out to the highest end of Mediocre.
Thermaltake – Another manufacturer that “averages” to mediocre. Thermaltake's line of Toughpower units is really solid, but virtually every other power supply they make is terrible.
The Bad
Cooler Master – It's surprising, in a way, that a company that makes some really great cases also makes some exceptionally terrible PSUs. Out of all the power supplies that Cooler Master has in their lineup, only the Silent Pro M is really worth your time, and even those supplies aren't particularly good values. Aside from the 4 supplies in that line, avoid like the plague.
Ultra Products – Ultra has had a fairly tarnished reputation for a while, and has made some steps toward redemption in recent years, but between their recently overturned lawsuit regarding modular PSUs, and some incidences of them falsely claiming SLI certification, it's really hard to label them as anything other than a cruddy company.
Generics – God help me, don't use the power supply that came with your case.
As for specific purchasing recommendations...well it's hard to say. PSU choice is heavily dependent on what particular wattage, feature set, and connector demands you have. Buy a good supply from a good company, and be prepared to spend at least 50 to 60 bucks, even if you're looking at something in the 500W range. It sucks to spend money, but this is one of those instances where you will pay significantly more later if you try to save 20 bucks now.
Looks like a solid update to me. I've got a Corsair 600T if you want to toss my name in there.
Everything is from Amazon because I have moral qualms with newegg. I'd rather pay a few dollars more (or less! in some cases) and not give them my money.
I guess really what I need is just a going over to make sure I'm not doing anything dumb/incorrect. I'll need some thermal paste for the processor. Last time I built a machine the stock thermal pads kinda sucked so it was much better to DIY. Is that still the case? Also should I be looking for an aftermarket cooler? That's something I've never done, but I'm building this rig to potentially overclock a bit (nothing outrageous) so that may be useful.
You'll get better temperatures from applying an aftermarket paste/grease, and even better temperatures with an aftermarket cooler, but it's not necessary, especially if you don't plan to go crazy with your overclocks. That said, I'm big on cool, so even getting something like a Cooler Master Hyper 212+ would give you more headroom for OCing, and is modestly priced.
As for your PSU, it's way more power than you'll ever need, and isn't as efficient as newer models, but there's nothing particularly terrible about it.
And I've added Alecthar's updated section to the OP!
This is becoming a monstrous zombie of culled together knowledge, and that's awesome~
ZALMAN ZM-CS5B Clip for my Zalman CNPS7000C-Cu cooler that's been sitting on an old mobo for awhile. (Anyone see any compatibility issues with the new mobo? I'm kind of worried about it hitting the RAM slots.)
$4.99
Total:
$1489.24 shipped.
Anything I'm missing, any compatibility issues? Anything glaringly obvious that I probably just missed or can at least pretend I just missed copying?
ZALMAN ZM-CS5B Clip for my Zalman CNPS7000C-Cu cooler that's been sitting on an old mobo for awhile. (Anyone see any compatibility issues with the new mobo? I'm kind of worried about it hitting the RAM slots.)
$4.99
Total:
$1489.24 shipped.
Anything I'm missing, any compatibility issues? Anything glaringly obvious that I probably just missed or can at least pretend I just missed copying?
Maybe upgrade to this mobo instead, if I order soon:
ZALMAN ZM-CS5B Clip for my Zalman CNPS7000C-Cu cooler that's been sitting on an old mobo for awhile. (Anyone see any compatibility issues with the new mobo? I'm kind of worried about it hitting the RAM slots.)
$4.99
Total:
$1489.24 shipped.
Anything I'm missing, any compatibility issues? Anything glaringly obvious that I probably just missed or can at least pretend I just missed copying?
Most coolers don't cover more than the closest DIMM slot, so I wouldn't be too worried about clearance issues, as you can always use the 2 other slots. If you really think it'll be a problem, buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
Also, you might save yourself 20 bucks and go with an Antec Truepower 650W. Partially modular, higher efficiency, and even if you get your 560 Ti SLI on down the road, it'll be enough to handle them.
And that cooler is fucking obscenely large, but I forgot about the multiple slots and the fact that it's only 1 card anyway. So I should be good.
Woops, didn't notice that.
You'll actually see better performance from purchasing a 2x2GB kit. Running a single DIMM means you miss out on dual channel hotness.
And from the pics I can find of your cooler, it looks like you might have enough clearance on that closest DIMM slot, even with the high-ish profile heat spreaders on the Ripjaws. If you have trouble, you can always use the other set of slots, though, or buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
You'd be better off the with the stock cooler than using that old thing. I should know, I have one on my old Socket 478 and it won't be as good as the stock one. Go with the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus or Xigmatech Gaia.
A shame the Asrock Extreme 4 is out of stock, that mobo accepts even Socket 775 coolers as it has the mounting for them.
And that cooler is fucking obscenely large, but I forgot about the multiple slots and the fact that it's only 1 card anyway. So I should be good.
Woops, didn't notice that.
You'll actually see better performance from purchasing a 2x2GB kit. Running a single DIMM means you miss out on dual channel hotness.
And from the pics I can find of your cooler, it looks like you might have enough clearance on that closest DIMM slot, even with the high-ish profile heat spreaders on the Ripjaws. If you have trouble, you can always use the other set of slots, though, or buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
Woot! Thanks for the help. Memory is one of my weakest points (always been something I've cheaped out on) so it's good to learn about it. Plus that saves me like $5!
You'd be better off the with the stock cooler than using that old thing. I should know, I have one on my old Socket 478 and it won't be as good as the stock one. Go with the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus or Xigmatech Gaia.
A shame the Asrock Extreme 4 is out of stock, that mobo accepts even Socket 775 coolers as it has the mounting for them.
Really? I always thought that that was a pretty decent cooler, even for it's age. Anything specifically wrong with it? I was sort of excited to bring that back out.
edit2: Think that Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus will fit in that case fine? Not sure about clearance, looks wtfhueg.
edit3: Would the stock heatsink be fine if I wasn't doing real intense overclocking? Not sure if stock heatsinks have gotten any better in recent years.
It was for its time, but cooling has gotten quite a bit better since those early days with more fins for heat dissipation and better fans that won't clog with dust as easily.
The stock cooler is more efficient than that is now, and most all good/great aftermarket coolers use the stand-up heatsink design for a more efficient way of heat dissipation especially with input/output of air through the case if done correctly.
And that cooler is fucking obscenely large, but I forgot about the multiple slots and the fact that it's only 1 card anyway. So I should be good.
Woops, didn't notice that.
You'll actually see better performance from purchasing a 2x2GB kit. Running a single DIMM means you miss out on dual channel hotness.
And from the pics I can find of your cooler, it looks like you might have enough clearance on that closest DIMM slot, even with the high-ish profile heat spreaders on the Ripjaws. If you have trouble, you can always use the other set of slots, though, or buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
Woot! Thanks for the help. Memory is one of my weakest points (always been something I've cheaped out on) so it's good to learn about it. Plus that saves me like $5!
You'd be better off the with the stock cooler than using that old thing. I should know, I have one on my old Socket 478 and it won't be as good as the stock one. Go with the Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus or Xigmatech Gaia.
A shame the Asrock Extreme 4 is out of stock, that mobo accepts even Socket 775 coolers as it has the mounting for them.
Really? I always thought that that was a pretty decent cooler, even for it's age. Anything specifically wrong with it? I was sort of excited to bring that back out.
edit2: Think that Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus will fit in that case fine? Not sure about clearance, looks wtfhueg.
edit3: Would the stock heatsink be fine if I wasn't doing real intense overclocking? Not sure if stock heatsinks have gotten any better in recent years.
Unfortunately, the better tower-style CPU coolers suffer from WTFHUEG Syndrome.
You might have some clearance issues with Ripjaws and the CM 212+ if you mount the included fan on the DIMM side of the 'sink (and your RAM is in the DIMMS closest to the CPU socket). You could always mount the fan to pull rather than push though.
I'm pretty sure that the Hyper 212+ will fit without issue into the Zalman Z9, I think I remember looking. Plus, I think the offset on the top side intake fan is far enough to the right that you can mount a 120mm fan there without clearance issues with the CPU heatsink.
If you're going to take a CPU above stock, I'd recommend aftermarket cooling. It's likely that stock cooling would handle a modest overclock, but temps would be high, it'd probably be a little loud...basically sub-optimal with a pretty low ceiling and more risk.
AlectharAlan ShoreWe're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered Userregular
edited March 2011
I'd save yourself some cash and Crossfire 6950s. The performance is really very competitive with the 6970 for significantly less cash. Even if you can't find combos for the 6950 similar to what you have listed there, you'll still probably save at least $100.
Plus, if you buy reference 6950 cards, you can flash one of the 2 BIOS on the board and see if it will unlock to a stable 6970.
And, really, Crossfire performance on 2 6950s should be really impressive, I'd say the 2 6970s would be overkill, unless you're gaming at a really, really high resolution.
Also, even with the combo deal, the Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB is cheaper than that WD Caviar drive, and you can actually use Spinpoints in a RAID.
I'd save yourself some cash and Crossfire 6950s. The performance is really very competitive with the 6970 for significantly less cash. Even if you can't find combos for the 6950 similar to what you have listed there, you'll still probably save at least $100.
Plus, if you buy reference 6950 cards, you can flash one of the 2 BIOS on the board and see if it will unlock to a stable 6970.
And, really, Crossfire performance on 2 6950s should be really impressive, I'd say the 2 6970s would be overkill, unless you're gaming at a really, really high resolution.
Also, even with the combo deal, the Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB is cheaper than that WD Caviar drive, and you can actually use Spinpoints in a RAID.
Yeah I was thinking about doing 6950's instead of the 70's so I'll look at that build. If it saves enough cash I'll buy a 128Gb ssd instead of a 64Gb. Also, I was gonna get the WD because it has SATA 6, and the motherboard has plenty of ports for it. Does it matter much?
MSI P67A-GD65 Motherboard
$179.99 (I have been bouncing between this and the $139.99 version... still not 100%, but I have some room for improvement in my budget, so I just might go with this)
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus CPU Cooler
$34.99 (sort of hesitant about this still, as installing it seems sort of nerve-wracking, but I'll just deal, because I want to overclock this mother)
So about that Open-Box 6870 1GB I bragged about a few days ago...that came in the mail today and compared to the HD4850 512MB it's replacing:
GPU-Z shows the HD6870 idling at ~32C/21% fan (inaudible), down from ~50C/0% fan (inaudible)
Furmark's 720p test only brought card to ~70C, fan barely nudged upward throughout versus 80-85C/35% fan (audible, but not loud)
Played a bit of LoL at 1920x1200 on High Everything/Low Shadows; the HD6870 never went above 45C nor did the fan move up (unsurprising given the Furmark result above)
Both cards are the same length, as I had a single-slot HD4850 whose heatsink I replaced with a AC Twin Turbo - so I've gotten a PCI slot back during the upgrade.
I can't wait to try other games tonight and see how real 1080p runs.
I'm so tired of typing long posts, submitting and the server being too busy at the moment, with me losing my post.
My ECS Black Deluxe P67H2-A2 is officially on its way back to California. I'm a little worried though that I forgot to put something in the box (usb 3.0 front panel) and I'm not sure if they will care of even notice. The link to the product on their site is dead, and when I asked someone on the phone what accessories came with it she linked me to a $50 ECS board and said whatever's in that picture. It's not like they can resell the first crop of P67s so I'm not sure if they'll care but they may just on principle.
I'm leaning heavily towards the ASRock Extreme6 right now especially with ASUS not having a board for what I want plus a $70 price gap between the board that's too little and the one that's too much where what I want would fit perfectly if it existed.
I am sort of wondering what the extra $30 from the extreme6 would give me for the"Professional" besides extra room for another 16gb of ram I would never take advantage of
ChaosHatHop, hop, hop, HA!Trick of the lightRegistered Userregular
edited March 2011
I'm posting from my new computer! I'll post pictures and everything later. Install wasn't too hard overall except for installing the video card. It wouldn't fit with the motherboard already installed so I had to take out the mobo, install the video card, and then screw the whole thing back in. The CPU and heat sink was also a somewhat harrowing experience, I knew I would have to apply a good amount of force to get the fan on there but I didn't expect the mobo to bend so much getting it on there.
I got nervous trying to connect everything power wise since I knew it could make everything explode, but everything turned on right the first try. I didn't connect the power and HDD leds for the case since the motherboard lists a + and - on the two pins for the cable, but the cable itself has a + and Ground (everything else had + and Ground, no +/-) and I didn't want to risk anything stupid.
Oh, and my DVD drive is pretty much the worst possible one apparently. It doesn't work with the case's screwless install unless it sticks about a third out (which means the front part won't close over it). I can't screw it in either since the holes don't line up with the case. Right now it's just kind of sitting in there loosely and my plan is to never move it. Ever.
Hoover, I demand a build-log, or at the very least a detailed description of your experience building in the Z9.
Well, the mobo will come in tomorrow, and the new RAM will be here on Thursday. I work overnights but i'm off Thursday - Saturday so i'll have plenty of time to document.
I'll see if I can't get my good camera back from my mom since my Droid camera just doesn't cut it in my home office area.
The CPU and heat sink was also a somewhat harrowing experience, I knew I would have to apply a good amount of force to get the fan on there but I didn't expect the mobo to bend so much getting it on there.
This was probably the most tense moment of my build as well.
I almost always try to mount my heatsink before installing the motherboard now. So much less intense that way. I don't know who the fuck came up with the design for the socket/heatsink standard on these chips, but he should be fucking shot.
Also, as for forum fuckmuppetry, option B is to open up notepad and copy/paste the post into there, just in case the webs eat it. It's a strategy I've used on error-prone forums for years now.
mcdermott on
0
AlectharAlan ShoreWe're not territorial about that sort of thing, are we?Registered Userregular
I almost always try to mount my heatsink before installing the motherboard now. So much less intense that way. I don't know who the fuck came up with the design for the socket/heatsink standard on these chips, but he should be fucking shot.
Also, as for forum fuckmuppetry, option B is to open up notepad and copy/paste the post into there, just in case the webs eat it. It's a strategy I've used on error-prone forums for years now.
Yeah, mounting beforehand is really the way to go. It can be really difficult to manage with the all-in-one water coolers (getting it into the case with the radiator hanging off sucks, so I usually don't bother till the mobo is in the case), but with air coolers it's really simple. I usually hold off on adding the fans till the motherboard is situated though, the less unwieldy the motherboard is going in, the better.
========================= Aumni: I don't know if you're dead-set on a full upgrade, but since your CPU is only a 1.8 GHz C2D I'm thinking you could get away with going for a used Q6600 - even a used Q9x50 if your motherboard supports 45nm LGA 775's - and that itself would be a strong improvement. That said, I think you spend a tad too much of your budget on the GPU and would rebalance it as such:
$252 - i5-2500k + Cooler Master Hyper 212+
$250 - MSI GTX 560 Twin Frozr $150 - Corsair 650W V2 + Samsung Spinpoint 1TB (not counting $10 coupon on the HDD) $150 - 8GB DDR3-1333 Ripjaws (comes with 2GB Flash Drive) + CM 690 (1st version/$10 MIR) (several strong combos with the RAM)
$120 - MSI P67 Board
By downgrading one step on the GPU, we get a much better PSU, Case, and CPU cooler while coming out ahead by $25-30.
Subtotal: $922
========================= Doctor Deimos: I echo Alecthar and suggest going for Crossfire 6950s if you're going to CF out of the gate since each GPU is $70-90 more for about a 10% increase per GPU.
========================= UEAKCrash: Looks fine for that budget; though I would go for the lighter motherboard and a 120GB Intel SSD, I don't know your needs, which is what's really important here. Don't forget to grab combos as appropriate like the i5-2500k/Hyper 212 linked above.
=========================
So while playing a newly installed Sims Medieval last night I could hear a very high pitched scratching noise coming from my hard drive. Using this Seagate hard drive.
Is this cause for alarm? This rig is only about two and half weeks old.
Posts
Choosing a case and PSU for your new PC build is often something of an afterthought. It's easy to make the mistake of focusing in hard on your sweet, sweet CPU and GPU purchases, buying the best performing components you can afford, then sticking them in whatever case you can buy with what's left of your budget, along with the cheapest PSU you could find that would (supposedly) power your build.
The reality is that Cases and PSUs are, in a way, the most important part of any PC build. A case with poor cooling performance might result in long term (or, in extreme cases, even short-term) damage to your components. The harder it is to build in your case, the more likely you are to accidentally damage the case, your components, or yourself (the cheaper the case, the sharper the edges) trying to force things. And if the case was hard to build in, it won't be easy to upgrade components in, or clean. Keep in mind that a great case is an investment. Unlike a processor or graphics card, which can go from cream of the crop to just 2nd (or 3rd) best in the time it takes to get it shipped to your door, your case can be around for a long time, and be home to many upgrades and new builds, as long as you buy a solid model that gives you room to grow. It's worth the extra expense. A PSU is even more significant. A quality, enthusiast grade PSU is a solid, efficient, purpose built piece of electronics, and if you keep things reasonable, it will serve you well through upgrades, and even new builds. A quality PSU can do all you ask of it and more, and while you shouldn't go crazy, you'd be surprised by what a nice Seasonic or Corsair or Antec (etc.) can do for you. Of course, if you choose poorly, you could turn your multi-hundred dollar PC build into a paperweight fashioned of smoldering silicon trapped within sheet metal.
Below you'll find information and guidelines on Case and PSU choice, as well as some recommendations (prices current as of March 23, 2011) on what might be a good buy for your budget.
Cases
When looking at cases, I recommend looking for the following features as a baseline:
1. Cable Management - At this point, reasonable cable management features are so common in cases at all budget levels that there really isn't any reason to buy a case without them. Sometimes the case will have a large void on the right side of the motherboard tray (many older Cooler Master cases like the CM Storm Sniper use this method), others will have cutouts (sometimes with rubber grommets) to bring cables back through. Ideally the case will feature a cutout for your 8 pin CPU power cable as well, but some cheaper cases with cable management don't have them. If you're lucky and careful, you might be able to thread your 8 pin under your motherboard and through the CPU backplate cutout to mimic the effect. Regardless of the style or number/location of cutouts offered, the basic idea is always the same, moving cables behind the motherboard tray as much as possible and bringing them out right where they need to be. Cable management doesn't just make your case innards look pretty, it helps your case stay cool.
2. Bottom-mounted PSU w/ Vent - Once again, this feature is very common on quality cases of all budget levels, so you shouldn't have any trouble finding something you like. Basically this feature improves case layout by placing your PSU at the bottom of the case, where it can intake cool air from under the case and exhaust it. It largely removes your PSU from the thermal equation. It's nice if the vent is filtered.
3. Good thermal options - At the very least your case should have mounts for a front intake fan, and a rear exhaust fan. These should be at least 120mm fan mounts. Ideally you'll have options side intake and top exhaust fans as well (2 fan mounts for each location is fairly standard in a good enthusiast level case). If you have multiple front intake fans (or a single larger, say, 200mm fan) the side intake is less important. Filtered intakes are a plus.
4. Good Design Touches - I always look for a few additional good design decisions in a case. A good case should feature at least some tool-less/screwless options for hardware mounting. Understandably, tool-less mechanisms are less numerous the lower the price of the case, but the best budget options still often feature thumbscrews, and/or a single tool-less mount on the 5.25 bays. The HDD cages should be oriented to place the "back" of the drive, where your SATA and Power connectors are, toward the side of the case with the motherboard tray, to facilitate cable routing. Keep an eye out for a nice sized CPU backplate cutout, it'll make attaching an aftermarket cooler immeasurably easier. Finally, most cases worth your time will have at least 2 front panel USB 2.0 ports to go with the HD audio hookups.
Naturally, these baselines can't cover everything, if your budget is extremely limited you might need to compromise on much of that list, but if you're looking for a mid-tower computer case to build a gaming PC in, and you have at least $40, most of those features can be yours.
After you've taken a look at what's available and eliminated those cases that just don't make the cut, buy within your budget, and keep aesthetics under consideration. You'll be less inclined to take care of something you can barely stand to look at. There are a number of unique touches and additions that can increase the value of the case for your particular build, so be thorough and make sure you've found something you can live with. If you're having trouble figuring out where to start, check the list below for some good starting points at various budget levels. PM me if you think your case is rad and I don't have it on the list!
NOTE: This list ignores shipping costs.
Power Supplies
Buying a power supply is a crucial decision, and it doesn't respond well to the kind of "pop it in our test rig and benchmark it" style of reviewing that most PC component review sites tend to favor. In many cases, a power supply that runs a test rig just fine can be less efficient than advertised, unable to pull its rated peak wattage, and have out of specification electrical ripple and noise that can damage your components. Fewer sites than you'd think actually test power supplies correctly, below are 3 of my favorites:
johnnyGuru
[H]ardOCP
Hardware Secrets
All of these sites are very transparent about their methodology, which is good because I've found that legitimate power supply reviews are very important in determing the correct supply to buy. For example, reviews might help you find out that while some Antec PSU lines are very solid (True Power New, original Earthwatts below 650W), others are mediocre to terrible (new Earthwatts, original Earthwatts from 650W and up, Basiq). This hodgepodge of awesome, acceptable, and awful product lines occurs largely because most major PSU vendors sell PSU lines that are rebadged (and sometimes modified) power supplies from other companies (Seasonic, CWT, and many others). So, while one line might benefit by being based on a solid Seasonic platform, another might be crippled by being based on a (literally) explosive Huntkey PSU. Because you don't have time to deconstruct a boatload of power supplies, your best option is to let good, reputable reviewers do the legwork for you.
So, you have some good resources that will let you know what to look for, but when you find it, you find that it has 2 12V rails, and your good buddy told you that quality PSUs should only have a single 12V rail. Also, it's modular, and that same buddy told you all about how that's bad and not as good as hardwired cables.
Your buddy is an idiot.
Apologies for my bluntness, but there are numerous myths/semi-myths that you hear all the time about PSUs that can really interfere with the buying process. Let's take a look at some “conventional wisdom” that is simply incorrect:
So with all that said, here's a few manufacturer recommendations/warnings to keep in mind as you buy your PSU:
The Good
Corsair – Corsair has made something of a name for itself in the PSU sector, and they do make some of the better PSUs available today (their AX series, mostly). Many of their older lines are still favorites among enthusiasts, though other companies have come out with competing/superior lines. Still, those are completely solid supplies, even if they aren't the best performers anymore. With the exception of the current “Builder Series” (PSUs labeled CX430, CX500, CX600, which are labeled at higher wattages than they probably should be), and the new Gamer Series (which I haven't seen reviewed/discussed much yet, so I reserve judgment) I would recommend a Corsair supply without hesitation.
Seasonic – Seasonic makes some of the best PSUs in the world, including most of the best PSUs in the world from vendors like Corsair and Antec. You see, Seasonic is both an OEM vendor, and a Retail vendor. Most of their supplies are clustered around lower wattages, usually under 650W, but they make high quality, efficient supplies.
Enermax – Enermax is an odd duck, they don't seem to get much attention, but they have some of the best (if not outright the best) high wattage units in the business. They aren't always priced the most competitively, but Enermax maintains a reputation for excellence.
The Mediocre
Antec – After a rough time in the PSU market, Antec has rebounded significantly in recent years and released some solid lines of PSUs. The main problem with Antec is that in addition to some great lines (like the True Power New line) they also make some very mediocre lines (Earthwatts) and some absolutely abominable lines (anything labeled Basiq). If you're buying the right supply Antec can be comparable to anyone from Seasonic to that generic supply you found smoldering in the trash 3 days ago. Between the highs and lows here, I figure they average out to the highest end of Mediocre.
Thermaltake – Another manufacturer that “averages” to mediocre. Thermaltake's line of Toughpower units is really solid, but virtually every other power supply they make is terrible.
The Bad
Cooler Master – It's surprising, in a way, that a company that makes some really great cases also makes some exceptionally terrible PSUs. Out of all the power supplies that Cooler Master has in their lineup, only the Silent Pro M is really worth your time, and even those supplies aren't particularly good values. Aside from the 4 supplies in that line, avoid like the plague.
Ultra Products – Ultra has had a fairly tarnished reputation for a while, and has made some steps toward redemption in recent years, but between their recently overturned lawsuit regarding modular PSUs, and some incidences of them falsely claiming SLI certification, it's really hard to label them as anything other than a cruddy company.
Generics – God help me, don't use the power supply that came with your case.
As for specific purchasing recommendations...well it's hard to say. PSU choice is heavily dependent on what particular wattage, feature set, and connector demands you have. Buy a good supply from a good company, and be prepared to spend at least 50 to 60 bucks, even if you're looking at something in the 500W range. It sucks to spend money, but this is one of those instances where you will pay significantly more later if you try to save 20 bucks now.
Battle.net
Looks like a solid update to me. I've got a Corsair 600T if you want to toss my name in there.
Everything is from Amazon because I have moral qualms with newegg. I'd rather pay a few dollars more (or less! in some cases) and not give them my money.
EVGA GeForce GTX 560 Ti Superclocked 1024MB GDDR5 01G-P3-1563-AR.
Looking at 2 of these potentially.
Corsair Vengeance 8 GB ( 2 x 4 GB ) DDR3 1600 MHz (PC3 12800) 240-Pin DDR3 CMZ8GX3M2A1600C9
Intel Core i7-2600K Processor with 8 MB Cache, 3.40 GHz for Socket LGA1155 - Unlocked Boxed
ASUS P8P67 DELUXE LGA 1155 SATA 6Gbps and USB 3.0 Supported Intel P67 DDR3 2400 ATX Motherboard
I've already got a few items listed below.
Corsair Graphite Series 600T Mid-Tower Gaming Case CC600T
Crucial RealSSD C300 128 GB 2.5-Inch Hard Drive with Data Transfer Kit CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1CCA
2x Seagate Barracuda 1gb HDD's in a mirrored RAID
COOLER MASTER Real Power Pro1000 RS-A00-EMBA 1000W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply
Bought this in Jan 2008. Should I be looking to replace this? My gut says yes but I'm not convinced.
I've got monitors, speakers, keyboard/mouse, optical drive, etc.
I guess really what I need is just a going over to make sure I'm not doing anything dumb/incorrect. I'll need some thermal paste for the processor. Last time I built a machine the stock thermal pads kinda sucked so it was much better to DIY. Is that still the case? Also should I be looking for an aftermarket cooler? That's something I've never done, but I'm building this rig to potentially overclock a bit (nothing outrageous) so that may be useful.
Thanks in advance.
As for your PSU, it's way more power than you'll ever need, and isn't as efficient as newer models, but there's nothing particularly terrible about it.
And I've added Alecthar's updated section to the OP!
This is becoming a monstrous zombie of culled together knowledge, and that's awesome~
$89.99
-
S15-0570 ::Sparkle SXX5701280D5NM GeForce GTX 570 Fermi Video Card - 1280MB GDDR5, PCI-Express 2.0, Dual-DVI, Mini-HDMI, DirectX 11, SLI Ready(3.2 lbs)
$334.99
-
ULT40450 ::Ultra ULT40450 Power Supply Vibration Dampener - Standard ATX, Silicone Material(0.1 lbs)
-
M452-6206 ::MSI P67A-C43 B3 Intel P67 Motherboard - ATX, Socket H2 (LGA1155), Intel P67 Express, DDR3 2133MHz (O.C.), SATA 6.0 Gb/s, Gigabit LAN, 1 x PCI-Express x16, USB 3.0(2.7 lbs)
$119.99
-
P33-6110 ::Patriot PGV38G1333ELK Gaming i5 8GB PC10666 RAM - DDR3, 1333MHz, 2x4096MB, 9-9-9-24(0.1 lbs)
$89.99
-
TSD-500AADS ::Western Digital WD5000AADS Caviar Green Hard Drive - 500GB, SATA-3G, 32MB, Intellipower(1.45 lbs)
$39.99
-
C283-3122 ::Cooler Master RC-430-KWN1 Elite 430 Mid Tower ATX Case - ATX/Micro-ATX, USB, Audio, 120mm Blue LED Fan, Black(13.05 lbs)
$49.99
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I69-2500K ::Intel Core i5-2500K BX80623I52500 Unlocked Processor - Quad Core, 6MB L3 Cache, 3.30 GHz, Socket H2 (LGA1155), Retail(0.85 lbs)
Now I'm at the hesitation phase where it's 'Do I REALLY need to upgrade my current computer'. Will need to think on this a bit. Current system:
Core 2 Duo 1.8
4 Gigs of ram
Nvidia GTX 260
I do have the Nvidia vision so these upgrades would allow for more 3d...baaaah decisions decisions.
$69.99
2x Acer V223WEJbd Black 22" 5ms Widescreen LCD Monitor
$139.99 each
CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W PSU
$109.99
MSI P67A GD53 Mobo
$149.99 (Hopefully it won't be sold out relatively soon, who knows.)
Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz CPU
$224.99
MSI N560GTX-TI Twin Frozr II/OC GeForce GTX 560 Ti (Fermi) 1GB GPU
$249.99 (drool.)
Intel X25-M SSDSA2MH080G2K5 80GB SSD
$184.49 (OS drive/ maybe steam?)
Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 1.5TB HDD
$69.99 (Drive for everything else)
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB Memory
$54.99 (This seems to be a given here)
Logitech G500 Mouse
$53.99
LITE-ON Motherfucking Keyboard.
$7.99 (Does it type words? Deal.)
ZALMAN ZM-CS5B Clip for my Zalman CNPS7000C-Cu cooler that's been sitting on an old mobo for awhile. (Anyone see any compatibility issues with the new mobo? I'm kind of worried about it hitting the RAM slots.)
$4.99
Total:
$1489.24 shipped.
Anything I'm missing, any compatibility issues? Anything glaringly obvious that I probably just missed or can at least pretend I just missed copying?
I didn't end up getting a new card since I managed to fix my current one, but I was this close to buying a 560 Ti.
Maybe upgrade to this mobo instead, if I order soon:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813130582
Most coolers don't cover more than the closest DIMM slot, so I wouldn't be too worried about clearance issues, as you can always use the 2 other slots. If you really think it'll be a problem, buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
Also, you might save yourself 20 bucks and go with an Antec Truepower 650W. Partially modular, higher efficiency, and even if you get your 560 Ti SLI on down the road, it'll be enough to handle them.
Battle.net
And that cooler is fucking obscenely large, but I forgot about the multiple slots and the fact that it's only 1 card anyway. So I should be good.
Woops, didn't notice that.
You'll actually see better performance from purchasing a 2x2GB kit. Running a single DIMM means you miss out on dual channel hotness.
And from the pics I can find of your cooler, it looks like you might have enough clearance on that closest DIMM slot, even with the high-ish profile heat spreaders on the Ripjaws. If you have trouble, you can always use the other set of slots, though, or buy RAM without high profile heat spreaders.
Battle.net
A shame the Asrock Extreme 4 is out of stock, that mobo accepts even Socket 775 coolers as it has the mounting for them.
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
Woot! Thanks for the help. Memory is one of my weakest points (always been something I've cheaped out on) so it's good to learn about it. Plus that saves me like $5!
Really? I always thought that that was a pretty decent cooler, even for it's age. Anything specifically wrong with it? I was sort of excited to bring that back out.
edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835118047 This is my cooler for those following.
edit2: Think that Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus will fit in that case fine? Not sure about clearance, looks wtfhueg.
edit3: Would the stock heatsink be fine if I wasn't doing real intense overclocking? Not sure if stock heatsinks have gotten any better in recent years.
The stock cooler is more efficient than that is now, and most all good/great aftermarket coolers use the stand-up heatsink design for a more efficient way of heat dissipation especially with input/output of air through the case if done correctly.
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
Unfortunately, the better tower-style CPU coolers suffer from WTFHUEG Syndrome.
You might have some clearance issues with Ripjaws and the CM 212+ if you mount the included fan on the DIMM side of the 'sink (and your RAM is in the DIMMS closest to the CPU socket). You could always mount the fan to pull rather than push though.
I'm pretty sure that the Hyper 212+ will fit without issue into the Zalman Z9, I think I remember looking. Plus, I think the offset on the top side intake fan is far enough to the right that you can mount a 120mm fan there without clearance issues with the CPU heatsink.
If you're going to take a CPU above stock, I'd recommend aftermarket cooling. It's likely that stock cooling would handle a modest overclock, but temps would be high, it'd probably be a little loud...basically sub-optimal with a pretty low ceiling and more risk.
Battle.net
Shell Shocking SON OF A BITCH!
Why couldn't they have done this before I ordered my RAM...
Anybody interested in buying 8GB (2x4GB) of DDR3 1333 Ripjaws off of me?
^^^^ Seriously not kidding, i'm now selling this if anybody is interested, just message me.
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
Don't waste your money. You won't use most of those 8 gigs, you definitely won't even come close to using 16.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
too late... hence why I said seriously
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
The only great deals I see are a Samsung F3 1tb for $55 and an Antec Lanboy for $150 after discounts and a rebate.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119225
AsRock mobo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157240
Corsair H60 CPU cooler
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16835181015
LG Blu Ray player
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827136183
Crucial SATA III SSD (for OS)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148361
Corsair 850w PSU and WD 1TB HD
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.617003
i7 2600K and HD 6970
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.620047
another HD 6970 and 8 gigs of RAM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.604569
comes to $2070 (without shipping), but the $70 in rebates brings it down to $2000
Plus, if you buy reference 6950 cards, you can flash one of the 2 BIOS on the board and see if it will unlock to a stable 6970.
And, really, Crossfire performance on 2 6950s should be really impressive, I'd say the 2 6970s would be overkill, unless you're gaming at a really, really high resolution.
Also, even with the combo deal, the Samsung Spinpoint F3 1TB is cheaper than that WD Caviar drive, and you can actually use Spinpoints in a RAID.
Battle.net
Yeah I was thinking about doing 6950's instead of the 70's so I'll look at that build. If it saves enough cash I'll buy a 128Gb ssd instead of a 64Gb. Also, I was gonna get the WD because it has SATA 6, and the motherboard has plenty of ports for it. Does it matter much?
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
$69.99
2X Acer V223WEJbd Black 22" Monitors
$139.99ea
Antec TruePower New TP-650 650W PSU
$79.99 (thank you!)
MSI P67A-GD65 Motherboard
$179.99 (I have been bouncing between this and the $139.99 version... still not 100%, but I have some room for improvement in my budget, so I just might go with this)
MSI N560GTX-TI Twin Frozr II Videocard
$249.99
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 4GB (2 x 2GB)
$49.99 (thank you again!)
Intel Core i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz CPU
$224.99
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus CPU Cooler
$34.99 (sort of hesitant about this still, as installing it seems sort of nerve-wracking, but I'll just deal, because I want to overclock this mother)
Intel X25-M 80GB SSD
$184.49 (OS drive + steam maybe?)
Seagate Barracuda 7200.11 1.5TB HDD
$69.99 (everything else)
Logitech G500 Mouse
$53.99
TOTAL:
$1478.38 + $31.49 shipping ($1509.87)
Pretty damn on my $1500 mark. Anything I'm missing or could cut back on slightly?
Keyboard, DVD drive, and Win 7 Pro already on hand.
Battle.net
A reminder that the RAM in that picture, 2x4GB 8GB GSkill Ripjaws DDR3 1333, is for sale.
Size Comparison
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
I can't wait to try other games tonight and see how real 1080p runs.
EDIT: Open Box Alert - who wanted to crossfire 6970s?
My ECS Black Deluxe P67H2-A2 is officially on its way back to California. I'm a little worried though that I forgot to put something in the box (usb 3.0 front panel) and I'm not sure if they will care of even notice. The link to the product on their site is dead, and when I asked someone on the phone what accessories came with it she linked me to a $50 ECS board and said whatever's in that picture. It's not like they can resell the first crop of P67s so I'm not sure if they'll care but they may just on principle.
I'm leaning heavily towards the ASRock Extreme6 right now especially with ASUS not having a board for what I want plus a $70 price gap between the board that's too little and the one that's too much where what I want would fit perfectly if it existed.
I am sort of wondering what the extra $30 from the extreme6 would give me for the"Professional" besides extra room for another 16gb of ram I would never take advantage of
I wouldn't worry about it.
Battle.net
Just spam F5 until it goes through. You won't lose your post, and it totally won't make the forum constipation any worse, right?
Edit: Lost count of the number of refreshes necessary to make this post at about a dozen.
Battle.net
I got nervous trying to connect everything power wise since I knew it could make everything explode, but everything turned on right the first try. I didn't connect the power and HDD leds for the case since the motherboard lists a + and - on the two pins for the cable, but the cable itself has a + and Ground (everything else had + and Ground, no +/-) and I didn't want to risk anything stupid.
Oh, and my DVD drive is pretty much the worst possible one apparently. It doesn't work with the case's screwless install unless it sticks about a third out (which means the front part won't close over it). I can't screw it in either since the holes don't line up with the case. Right now it's just kind of sitting in there loosely and my plan is to never move it. Ever.
Thanks again to everyone who helped!
Well, the mobo will come in tomorrow, and the new RAM will be here on Thursday. I work overnights but i'm off Thursday - Saturday so i'll have plenty of time to document.
I'll see if I can't get my good camera back from my mom since my Droid camera just doesn't cut it in my home office area.
PSN: HooverFanPA
Steam: HooverFan
This was probably the most tense moment of my build as well.
Also, as for forum fuckmuppetry, option B is to open up notepad and copy/paste the post into there, just in case the webs eat it. It's a strategy I've used on error-prone forums for years now.
Yeah, mounting beforehand is really the way to go. It can be really difficult to manage with the all-in-one water coolers (getting it into the case with the radiator hanging off sucks, so I usually don't bother till the mobo is in the case), but with air coolers it's really simple. I usually hold off on adding the fans till the motherboard is situated though, the less unwieldy the motherboard is going in, the better.
Battle.net
Aumni: I don't know if you're dead-set on a full upgrade, but since your CPU is only a 1.8 GHz C2D I'm thinking you could get away with going for a used Q6600 - even a used Q9x50 if your motherboard supports 45nm LGA 775's - and that itself would be a strong improvement. That said, I think you spend a tad too much of your budget on the GPU and would rebalance it as such:
$252 - i5-2500k + Cooler Master Hyper 212+
$250 - MSI GTX 560 Twin Frozr
$150 - Corsair 650W V2 + Samsung Spinpoint 1TB (not counting $10 coupon on the HDD)
$150 - 8GB DDR3-1333 Ripjaws (comes with 2GB Flash Drive) + CM 690 (1st version/$10 MIR) (several strong combos with the RAM)
$120 - MSI P67 Board
By downgrading one step on the GPU, we get a much better PSU, Case, and CPU cooler while coming out ahead by $25-30.
Subtotal: $922
=========================
Doctor Deimos: I echo Alecthar and suggest going for Crossfire 6950s if you're going to CF out of the gate since each GPU is $70-90 more for about a 10% increase per GPU.
=========================
UEAKCrash: Looks fine for that budget; though I would go for the lighter motherboard and a 120GB Intel SSD, I don't know your needs, which is what's really important here. Don't forget to grab combos as appropriate like the i5-2500k/Hyper 212 linked above.
=========================
Is this cause for alarm? This rig is only about two and half weeks old.