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Cancelled

ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
edited February 2007 in Critical Failures
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I may have to write up my Gnomish Paladin character in the morning and see if I prefer RPing him under this sort of system as opposed to D&D.

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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    How does magic work? Just an "I'm casting a fireball!" and then rolling Intelligence?

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  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    How does magic work? Just an "I'm casting a fireball!" and then rolling Intelligence?

    Magic could be entirely scalable. You can cast as powerful a spell as you want, but the more powerful it is the harder it is to cast, and failing to cast it would have disastrous effects.

    To be honest I totally spaced how magic worked so you're welcome to throw any ideas at me.
    Actually, I'm pretty partial to the idea of an entirely fluid magic system based on arbitrary DM difficulty (as long as it's consistent and reasonable.) Since you're going for as rules-lite as possible, it might be reasonable just to tell players to limit what magic they can do based on their own characters concept - like a Fire mage not being able to suddenly cast a Heal spell just 'cause it's suddenly necessary.

    This looks pretty interesting, regardless. Depending on how much other interest you garner (I'm pretty busy between all the games I've got myself in already), I might toss in for this with something like an orcish shaman.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • Zetetic ElenchZetetic Elench Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    How does magic work? Just an "I'm casting a fireball!" and then rolling Intelligence?

    Magic could be entirely scalable. You can cast as powerful a spell as you want, but the more powerful it is the harder it is to cast, and failing to cast it would have disastrous effects.

    To be honest I totally spaced how magic worked so you're welcome to throw any ideas at me.
    Actually, I'm pretty partial to the idea of an entirely fluid magic system based on arbitrary DM difficulty (as long as it's consistent and reasonable.) Since you're going for as rules-lite as possible, it might be reasonable just to tell players to limit what magic they can do based on their own characters concept - like a Fire mage not being able to suddenly cast a Heal spell just 'cause it's suddenly necessary.
    That'd make for some interesting roleplaying - he may not be able to cast heal, but he would be able to cauterise the wound...

    Zetetic Elench on
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  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Okay, I guess I could roll up a teifling tank and give it a shot.

    So if I got this right my stats on my character sheet might be...

    Strength: 2D6
    Constitution: 3D6
    Dexterity: 2 D6
    Agility: 1 D6
    Wisdom: 1 D6
    Intelligence: 1 D6

    for example.

    AcidSerra on
  • GrimmyTOAGrimmyTOA Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Magic suggestion:

    Say you have five types of magic.

    Damage - Fireball! Lightning! Pew pew!
    Healing - Umm... healing. Everything from "Cure Light Wounds" to "Reinsert Liver"
    Protection - Shields and resistances and whatnot
    Utility - Moving things from hither to thither (or thither to hither). Making food. Etc.
    Knowledge - Clairvoyance & whatnot. I don't know.

    For each dice point that you put into Intelligence, you get to put a dice point into a type of magic. Then you roll the relevant dice for success.

    I don't know how they'd be opposed, and Salt's idea is much more rules-light. So, whatever. Just thought I'd throw it out there.

    Mostly I wanted to be able to use the word 'thither' in a post. Three times.

    GrimmyTOA on
  • piLpiL Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    How does magic work? Just an "I'm casting a fireball!" and then rolling Intelligence?

    Magic could be entirely scalable. You can cast as powerful a spell as you want, but the more powerful it is the harder it is to cast, and failing to cast it would have disastrous effects.

    To be honest I totally spaced how magic worked so you're welcome to throw any ideas at me.

    This reminds me of Talislanta 3e, where you had a magic score (based on int and skill) and you could specialize in some spells, and then you choose which level to cast the spell at. Then you rolled a d20 + your bonuses, and you cast the spell at that effect. Most types of magic had a 'bolt' so you could cast a fire bolt or an electric bolt which would do 1d4 damage per level (hp was pretty light in the game, so that's a lot). It was a very fluid and good system. Talislanta also had a system where if you rolled above 20 after bonuses you critted, if you rolled 10 or hgher you succeeded (for gradient things, there was a 15-20 bracket I beleive). Failing below ten but above 5 was a normal failure, and below that would be the super disasterous effects. When you cast spells (or did anything), you juggled the power of the spell with your chance of fucking up and blowing your head off or of casting it expertly and dealing double damage. Just throwing that out there, sorry it's from another system.

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  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007

    Hit points are determined by rolling all of your Constitution dice (in this case, 3) and adding them together. Not sure what I'm going to do with characters that only have 1 Constitution die, though...

    Perhaps you could add a base number (+3 or so), which would mean 1D6 characters would average only half a 3D6 character's Con rolls rather than a third.

    Also, when I was toying with the idea of running an Oz PBP game, I brainstormed a rather loose & fanciful magic system that could let players devise their own spells beforehand using a series of cost/difficulty modifiers depending on what the spell would do, scope, duration, requirements (is it brewed from ingredients or just a casting ritual? Or bound to a magic item) number of uses, etc.

    Concerning spell magnitude and attempts to increase it by raising difficulty, I like the idea that if they fail the new roll the spell is simply reduced in power by that much (ie, if they roll a 10 trying to cast something at 20 difficulty it ends up half as strong), rather than the result of "your spell fails to be cast," which is rather detached roleplaying.

    Anywho, here's the important numbers on my character concept:

    Blublo Phillippei
    Gnomish Paladin

    Strength: 3D6
    Constitution: 2D6
    Dexterity: 1D6
    Agility: 1D6
    Wisdom: 2D6
    Intelligence: 1D6

    Suggested equipment includes a bastard sword and a set of Gnomish halfplate mail. I'll write up a description and background when things get rolling.

    EDIT: Forgot the 10th dice. I think I'll go with a high amount of strength and be a damage-dealer/healer.

    Utsanomiko on
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    GrimmyTOA wrote:
    Magic suggestion:

    Say you have five types of magic.

    Damage - Fireball! Lightning! Pew pew!
    Healing - Umm... healing. Everything from "Cure Light Wounds" to "Reinsert Liver"
    Protection - Shields and resistances and whatnot
    Utility - Moving things from hither to thither (or thither to hither). Making food. Etc.
    Knowledge - Clairvoyance & whatnot. I don't know.

    For each dice point that you put into Intelligence, you get to put a dice point into a type of magic. Then you roll the relevant dice for success.

    I don't know how they'd be opposed, and Salt's idea is much more rules-light. So, whatever. Just thought I'd throw it out there.

    Mostly I wanted to be able to use the word 'thither' in a post. Three times.
    That would leave utility mages pretty much in the dust (jack-of-all-tradsing), and make specialization almost mandatory if you ever wanna pull anything big off.

    I dunno much about the setting Zombie's trying to put together (dunno if he's really even got one in mind except for the plot hook), but I'm looking at somethin' like this:

    Strength: 2d6
    Constitution: 2d6
    Dexterity: 1d6
    Agility: 1d6
    Wisdom: 1d6
    Intelligence: 3d6

    As an Orcish Warshaman (maybe switch the Strength and Int), who would specialize in battle magic or maybe animalistic magics ("I call on the wolf to grant me his speed!" or "The owl gives me his wisdom!") >>

    INeedNoSalt on
  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I kind of like the idea fo leaving magic vague, and undefined. You just start out by saying what schools of magic you can perform in, and the DM can, on the fly, determine how difficult a spell is. And this way if your evokation mage keeps going batshit with Necromantic summons, for example, the DM can have his zombie hordes turn and eat him. =P

    http://invisiblecastle.com/find.py?id=861510

    HP roll of 9, lol.

    So my character in full would be
    Tylla Merrin
    Female Teifling
    Horns and Yellow Eyes
    Red Hair
    Strength 2D6
    Constitution 3D6
    Dexterity 2D6
    Agility 1D6
    Wisdom 1D6
    Intelligence 1D6

    Cut paste a carbon copy background about a small town and ostricization by her peers. Tour of duty withthe local militia, and now out to prove she isn't evil... while trying to resist the temptation to kill kittens. =P

    AcidSerra on
  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Alright, I think I've come up with a decent Magic system.

    Spellcasters choose some form of magic to specialize in (fire, ice, earth etc.). They can cast any sort of spell they want that falls under this specialization. The DM/GM (in this case, me) chooses to set a difficulty level for this spell. The caster then rolls his Intelligence dice, and if it is greater than the target level the spells is successfully casted.

    In addition, characters and NPCs can roll Critical Successes and Critical Failures during any action, in and out of combat (except for basic movement). If the character rolls all sixes, it is a critical success (for balance reasons, critical successes scale with level. For example, a critical success with 3 dice in Agility is much more successful than a critical success with 1 die in Agility). If the character rolls all ones, it is a critical failure and the results are disastrous (spells backfiring, weapons being dropped etc.). I haven't worked out the results of a critical success as of yet, any suggestions there are also welcome.

    Zombiemambo on
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Do we have an option for wisdom-based magic? I figure I'd use it for blessings and healing rather than elemental magic.

    Utsanomiko on
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  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I thnk you should probably make crit successes a bit context based. Like a strength crit can change based on wether your wielding a slashing/blunt weapon, or are trying to move a heavy rock, etc..

    And since I assume constitution will take the place of any fortitude saves and what not, the very idea of a critical success can be very different from situation to situation.

    AcidSerra on
  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I was thinking Critical Successes are calculated as follows...
      1D6 - no bonus 2D6 - +1 bonus 3D6 - +2 bonus etc.

    That way, even though you're more likely to roll a critical success with 1 die, there is no bonus for it. Additionally, you are less likely to roll a critical failure when more dice are invested in a single ability.

    What does a critical success do, exactly?

    Critical successes, outside of combat, allow a character to perform an action that might be too hard for them normally. For example, a character wants to climb a rope, but he is not strong enough. Let's say his Strength roll must be 13. He rolls two sixes, and gains a +1 bonus, allowing him to safely climb the rope.

    Critical successes are much more advantageous in combat. Critical success bonuses apply to damage, to-hit, dodge and constitution rolls. Critical successes also apply to spells.

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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    But... less skilled characters are more likely to need help from a critical success and they don't get any bonus at all.

    Hm.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    But... less skilled characters are more likely to need help from a critical success and they don't get any bonus at all.

    Hm.

    I believe the point was that if the characters weren't skilled at it, they should expect to fail, or just not put themselves in those situations at all whenver possible.

    AcidSerra on
  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    AcidSerra wrote:
    But... less skilled characters are more likely to need help from a critical success and they don't get any bonus at all.

    Hm.

    I believe the point was that if the characters weren't skilled at it, they should expect to fail, or just not put themselves in those situations at all whenver possible.
    We have 10 points to spend over 6 attributes. Characters are going to be Not Skilled more often than Skilled.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    AcidSerra wrote:
    But... less skilled characters are more likely to need help from a critical success and they don't get any bonus at all.

    Hm.

    I believe the point was that if the characters weren't skilled at it, they should expect to fail, or just not put themselves in those situations at all whenver possible.
    We have 10 points to spend over 6 attributes. Characters are going to be Not Skilled more often than Skilled.

    Exactly, a 1/6 chance to get some extra oomph would be nice. Average skill die criticals are going to be rather unnotable when it's only two points less than 3% of the time, and for 3D skills we'll probably never see critical (1/212 chance). Quite diminishing.

    Zombie has seemed to have built some of the mechanics of his system before designing the rules. I think it should be kept simpler than that (hell, it may not even *need* criticals).

    Utsanomiko on
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  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Utsanomiko wrote:
    AcidSerra wrote:
    But... less skilled characters are more likely to need help from a critical success and they don't get any bonus at all.

    Hm.

    I believe the point was that if the characters weren't skilled at it, they should expect to fail, or just not put themselves in those situations at all whenver possible.
    We have 10 points to spend over 6 attributes. Characters are going to be Not Skilled more often than Skilled.

    Exactly, a 1/6 chance to get some extra oomph would be nice. Average skill die criticals are going to be rather unnotable when it's only two points less than 3% of the time, and for 3D skills we'll probably never see critical (1/212 chance). Quite diminishing.

    Zombie has seemed to have built some of the mechanics of his system before designing the rules. I think it should be kept simpler than that (hell, it may not even *need* criticals).
    What if you went with exploding sixes? It's not quite the same as a critical, but it still gives an unskilled character a chance at a solid roll, and a more skilled character a greater chance.

    Edit: 'Exploding' meaning 'rerolled', so when you roll a 6, you roll again and add the result; there's still an obvious benefit and no decreased chance at a crit as you gain skill (because 3 dice gives you a bigger chance to roll sixes, and you'd reroll all the sixes), while not making low-skill characters outright incapable of difficult tasks.

    Edit2: Regarding magic, would a mage with, say, a Fire specialization be completely incapable of magic in other realms? That might be a pretty harsh limitation (although might help to keep casters from becoming far more powerful than melee-ers.) What if each caster got, say, 1 'pool' of powers (fire/water/life/death/whatever) for each die of Int?

    Maybe the pools could be tiered, with 3 int giving: 3D Fire, 2D Life, 1D Earth.

    That might be more complex than you're looking for, but it gives a wider range of magic to casters, with obvious specializations.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    What if you went with exploding sixes? It's not quite the same as a critical, but it still gives an unskilled character a chance at a solid roll, and a more skilled character a greater chance.

    Edit: 'Exploding' meaning 'rerolled', so when you roll a 6, you roll again and add the result; there's still an obvious benefit and no decreased chance at a crit as you gain skill (because 3 dice gives you a bigger chance to roll sixes, and you'd reroll all the sixes), while not making low-skill characters outright incapable of difficult tasks.

    I was mulling over a single 'wild die' with that function, but your method sounds like a good implementation, and it'd provide the low-skill 'oomph' I mentioned. It'd still be rare for higher-levels, but that's kind of the nature of the adept and rerolling three dice is a lot more rewarding than adding 3 points.

    Edit2: Regarding magic, would a mage with, say, a Fire specialization be completely incapable of magic in other realms? That might be a pretty harsh limitation (although might help to keep casters from becoming far more powerful than melee-ers.) What if each caster got, say, 1 'pool' of powers (fire/water/life/death/whatever) for each die of Int?

    Maybe the pools could be tiered, with 3 int giving: 3D Fire, 2D Life, 1D Earth.

    That might be more complex than you're looking for, but it gives a wider range of magic to casters, with obvious specializations.

    I'd suggest on the other hand that a 'realm' of magic should have some flexibility in what exactly its element encompasses. For example, 'fire' could include spells of warmth to soothe minor wounds or counter ice damage, or spells to produce smoke and create cover.

    Would each spell-caster have access to a veritable library of powers with a single 1D in a domain or just a select number of pre-defined incantations numbered based on their skill die?

    Utsanomiko on
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Utsanomiko wrote:
    Would each spell-caster have access to a veritable library of powers with a single 1D in a domain or just a select number of pre-defined incantations numbered based on their skill die?
    Ideally, you've have 'infinite' access to basically anything related to the appropriate sphere, except, y'no, good luck flooding the Great Palace with 1D Water magic.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Edit2: Regarding magic, would a mage with, say, a Fire specialization be completely incapable of magic in other realms? That might be a pretty harsh limitation (although might help to keep casters from becoming far more powerful than melee-ers.) What if each caster got, say, 1 'pool' of powers (fire/water/life/death/whatever) for each die of Int?

    Maybe the pools could be tiered, with 3 int giving: 3D Fire, 2D Life, 1D Earth.

    That might be more complex than you're looking for, but it gives a wider range of magic to casters, with obvious specializations.

    Or you could simply add 1-2 d6 of difficulty to spells not within their realm. That way they can try very hard and use simple ones, but a complex spell being pulled off would be a stroke of Cthulu's own luck.

    AcidSerra on
  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm trying to figure out a way to make everyone capable of fighting in melee, but a 1D6 Dexterity score is just too low for anybody fighting something faster than molasses.

    I'd recommend combining Dexterity and Agility together, since the later seems a bit limited in scope and nobody's taking it anyway. Either that or, like, *not* make 1D6 too slow to fight.

    Utsanomiko on
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Ooh, I like the 'exploding dice' idea alot. And by 'like' I mean 'I'm going to use.' For every 6 you roll, you add one additional die to the pool.

    You can cast any form of magic you want, but even the most basic spells outside of your specialization can be challenging, even to a highly intelligent arcane wizard. If you were to say casting a fireball would be the easiest fire spell to cast, and a mage specializing in water magic attempts it, I would add one extra die to the pool because he is not familiar with that kind of magic. It's still fairly easy to cast, but it's more prone to failure.

    I'm trying to figure out a way to make everyone capable of fighting in melee, but a 1D6 Dexterity score is just too low for anybody fighting something faster than molasses.
    Well, even with D6 base and 6D6 to spread around, your average that is still 2D6, which should be reasonable. 3D6 will be strong and 4D6 will probably be very strong. There's probably not much reason to go into 5D6 at character start, I'd assume.

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  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Hmm an interesting redesign for my tank might be...

    STR: 2D6
    CON: 3D6
    DEX: 2D6
    WIS: 1D6
    INT: 2D6

    With illusion magic specialty. The illusion magic is to increase perceived threat of the tank, keeping damage focused on her.

    AcidSerra on
  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Salt had the Orc character; Acid's is a Tiefling by last account.

    And I don't see why a character couldn't be a notably intelligent or civilized Orc, regardless.

    Utsanomiko on
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Right now there's not any 'cost' for spell use, but probably it shouldn't work out that anyone who an average intelligence should be a spellcaster.

    The New And Improved Shaman will look somethin' like this:

    Str: 2D6
    Con: 2D6
    Dex: 2D6
    Wis: 1D6
    Int: 3D6

    Specializing in destructive magic.

    @Utsan, anyway: I think Zombie's point was a character who uses Illusions to look scary won't have much effect on orc bad guys, and that's all we'll be dealing with in the test-run.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'd still keep the illussion magic. It prevents me having to carry torches for one. Also beyond looking big and scary, if you look like the only thing, a single round fog spell, it can have a huge impact. Like the stat says, intelligence is the key to it's use. ^.^

    AcidSerra on
  • UtsanomikoUtsanomiko Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Well then, I think I'll adjust my character's stats to be:

    Str: 3D6
    Con: 2D6
    Dex: 2D6
    Wis: 2D6
    Int: 1D6

    Assuming he'd be using Wisdom to perform blessings, prayers & such.

    Utsanomiko on
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  • ZombiemamboZombiemambo Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
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  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm still not a big fan of average intelligence = spellcaster, regardless, as most characters will have 2 dice in most skills (and generally one at 1D6 and one at 3D6); there's no reason then for every character not to be a spellcaster and drop their Wisdom down (which, comparably, is relatively useless next to other skills.)

    Magic isn't very special if every character can cast spells.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • AcidSerraAcidSerra Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    /sigh

    For starters I can only cast low level and short duration spells. Beyond that, I gave up a certain amount of fighting ability in order ot have those spells, in case you hadn't noticed, the two main skills governing melee offense are exactly the same between your spell caster and my fighter. I choose not to "specialize" in fighitng, but instead to be a generalist, a spellsword to borrow a class name from Elder Scrolls, with some magic to help my fighting skills.

    Your spell caster isn't even a specialist, since a specialist spell caster would look more like,
    1
    2
    1
    1
    5
    Allowing them to cast very high level spells. But you choose to genralize and include some combat ability. Us fighters are merely wishing for the same chance.

    P.S. Wisdom isn't a wasted stat, since I get the feeling we're gonna have alot of equipment by the end that we can't identify and therefore can't use. Hell it would be hilarious if Zombie dropped 7 different cursed equipmetn pieces and let us stupidly walk into the curses since we have no wisdom to identify them with.

    AcidSerra on
  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    A spellcaster would look like a completely incapable character?

    Somehow, I don't think spending half of my points on Int and then being below average in everything else quite qualifies as standard.

    Besides, this wasn't even a burn on you, don't get so defensive. Zombie wants input, that's my input. Spellcasting shouldn't be something every character can do.

    INeedNoSalt on
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