HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
edited April 2011
Well, lolsony does get annoying when people spout it out too much, but the phrase exists for a goddamn reason. And this situation definitely warrants a lolsony or two.
Huh, no PSN, so no Killzone 3, ending a month-long streak of using my PS3 basically as a KZ3 console.
On the plus side, Borderlands GOTY (PS3) is on sale at Gamestop for $20 new. Wife and I've been enjoying the hell out of the local co-op. Highly recommended, and there's a good thread that explains all the addons, etc.
While I know it won't be completely warranted, this could not happen at a worse time, due to E3 right around the corner.
Basically every major announcement they have that involved online in any capacity (and I cant think of anything anyone would announce in this day and age that doesnt have some kind of online component) will be met with "Yeah, if they can keep PSN turned on."
Again, its not like it will be a 100% valid statement, but the proximity of these two events means we're going to hear it, a lot.
mxmarks on
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Meh, honestly at the end of the day, I doubt your average consumer looks at this as more than a minor inconvenience.
I actually really disagree with you on this point, and think the average consumer will view this as way MORE of an inconvenience than any of us would.
All of us understand servers, and all the fun tech stuff that all of this is tangled up in. And we all have a billion other ways to entertain ourselves right now - I can get Netflix on 3 different devices (4 actually if I charge up my unused iPhone) in the room Im sitting in alone.
But I know my dad has shown my mom how to use their XBox to watch Netflix - and that's it. He showed her step by step how to navigate to it and use it. And I know with 100% certainty that if my mom had more than 1 day straight of errors trying to watch Netflix on their TV, she'd get rid of the XBox, or at least stop using it personally (which would influence the next console my dad wanted to bring home). She doesn't get it and she doesn't care - she just knows the thing doesn't work anymore.
And while that seems kind of rash, it's just the way I think average consumers are - they want a product that works. My mom was adamant against switching from Time Warner to Verizon just because she hated the way the TV Channels were numbered. People like stuff that works, and if it ain't broke don't fix it.
I bet there's a lot of people around this time who are kind of fed up that nothing works, fed up that Sony doesn't have a set time this will all be back online, and are now trading in the PS3 for something that will work immediately - and most importantly, won't go back to Sony afterwords.
mxmarks on
PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
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Casually HardcoreOnce an Asshole. Trying to be better.Registered Userregular
edited April 2011
My only concern is that, in the possibility of this being due to hackers, my personal information is compromised.
Other then that, this whole thing is meh for me.
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited April 2011
Yeah, I think you underestimate people's intelligence and ability to deal with things.
I'm pretty sure Sony's support line is getting hammered right now, but I doubt many people are going to "throw their playstations out" probably just find something else to do over the weekend.
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
edited April 2011
I just asked this in the industry thread, but where the heck are people getting the impression that the average consumer doesn't care about the downtime?
TehSpectre, wiiware is being pirated and there are "hacked" shopping channels already.
Well, if you say it, it must be true!
This isn't my area of expertise, so if you want to convince me, I need some sources.
I can see people pirating wiiware after uploading it to the net and installing through an SD card, but not by posting a video on the web where anyone (youtube, not some obscure pirate site) can see and easily access Nintendo cash.
Yeah, I think you underestimate people's intelligence and ability to deal with things.
I'm pretty sure Sony's support line is getting hammered right now, but I doubt many people are going to "throw their playstations out" probably just find something else to do over the weekend.
On one hand I agree, but on the other, I bet there's a decent chunk of people who planned on using their PS3 for "Something to do this weekend."
And they'll find other things to do this weekend, sure. It's the fact that Wednesday they still may be trying to get the thing to work that's going to really tick people off.
mxmarks on
PSN: mxmarks - WiiU: mxmarks - twitter: @ MikesPS4 - twitch.tv/mxmarks - "Yes, mxmarks is the King of Queens" - Unbreakable Vow
For whatever reason that caused it, this outage sucks balls. Though it did cause me to seek out my first live event. Not being able to play online sucks - online play is the linchpin of modern gaming, and Sony has no one to blame but themselves for that. In my opinion they deserve no defense whatsoever.
If there are people who bought their Playstations without games firmly in mind as their primary use of the thing, they aren't inconvenienced in any way at all. I doubt most even have a PSN account. This only really affects people like us who use their system online a lot. If this had happened the same time last year rather than right now, I probably wouldn't even have noticed because my only online game was Demon's Souls.
I just asked this in the industry thread, but where the heck are people getting the impression that the average consumer doesn't care about the downtime?
No one has said that; however "average consumer" - whoever that is - will most likely not view it through the same lens as the hardcore online users. It's a service outage, and service outages happen to electronic devices all the time.
In my opinion they deserve no defense whatsoever.
/head-scratch
It's their fault because someone may have decided to expose a flaw in a (to me at least) intricate computer system? That's certainly not giving ANY company who deals in online commerce any slack. Hurray for those companies that have the perfect-system.
How often does "service outage" last 4+ days? You think an "average consumer" would find it acceptable if their phone, internet or power was out for that long?
Most "average consumers" I know freak out if the can't get online for more than an hour....
How often does "service outage" last 4+ days? You think an "average consumer" would find it acceptable if their phone, internet or power was out for that long?
Most "average consumers" I know freak out if the can't get online for more than an hour....
You're comparing the PSN to "power"; let's get a relativity scale going here. And how many of these freakouts actually switch internet providers?
SONY is having its XBOX Live moment; if it goes to day 14, I'm sure they'll give the people something better than Undertow.
Are we trying to predict how people will react? Predictions can be wrong and that doesn't make the predictor a bad person.
Or are we trying to persuasively influence how people on this forum feel about the outage?
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In order to gain access to debug mode and add money to you wallet, you just have to tell PS3 that you are running under escalated privileges?
Sony developed a network where the end client is ASSUMED to authenticated? Holy shit! No credentials or anything? Did they seriously think that thier key would never be compromised?
I work for a major insurance company, and the field computer systems are locked down. Besides encrypting the hard drives, access is granted by a tier process, and we sure as hell don't trust the system logging into our network. Any point a failure between the [REDACTED], [REDACTED], and [REDACTED], communicating with the [REDACTED], the whole system halts must be manually unlocked by at least three people on a worst case situation.
Assuming that the system connecting your network is secure is just asinine! Did they have any security researchers look into the process at all, or were they too busy SUING THEM to notice.
This is an amusing thread. All that's happened is people can't play games online...A free service (some of us pay for the plus, but i don't believe that it's required for any game). In no way could I characterize this as anything but a minor inconvenience. And even among minor inconveniences, this is pretty laughable.
At a professional level, Sony's gotten a black eye over the whole thing. But i seriously doubt more than five people will be standing at gamestop looking at the xbox9000 vs playstation 56 and think, oh, there was that one time when PSN went down for a week.
This is an amusing thread. All that's happened is people can't play games online...A free service (some of us pay for the plus, but i don't believe that it's required for any game). In no way could I characterize this as anything but a minor inconvenience. And even among minor inconveniences, this is pretty laughable.
At a professional level, Sony's gotten a black eye over the whole thing. But i seriously doubt more than five people will be standing at gamestop looking at the xbox9000 vs playstation 56 and think, oh, there was that one time when PSN went down for a week.
From my perspective, I really want to play Moon diver right now. But I can't, because I paid for it and didn't have space to download it. Now, I paid for a game I don't have access to. That's very souring on the whole 'well you can't play games online' idea. I can't play a game I paid for. Also, I've put a couple hundred dollars into the PSN network. I think I have the right to be upset at this outage.
TehSpectre, wiiware is being pirated and there are "hacked" shopping channels already.
Well, if you say it, it must be true!
This isn't my area of expertise, so if you want to convince me, I need some sources.
I can see people pirating wiiware after uploading it to the net and installing through an SD card, but not by posting a video on the web where anyone (youtube, not some obscure pirate site) can see and easily access Nintendo cash.
I never understand people who defend the major corporation that screwed up in these circumstances. Do you work for Sony? Own a lot of Sony stock? Then why do you feel like you need to come to their defense?
I've seen multiple people that I know on facebook complaining about this. Not people who are into gaming massively, just people that play a bit of PES and CODBLOPS every now and again. People that definitely represent a lot of Sony's typical customers.
Edit: People still remember that time that everyone's PS3 stopped working because the clock got a bit fucked up.
This is an amusing thread. All that's happened is people can't play games online...A free service (some of us pay for the plus, but i don't believe that it's required for any game). In no way could I characterize this as anything but a minor inconvenience. And even among minor inconveniences, this is pretty laughable.
At a professional level, Sony's gotten a black eye over the whole thing. But i seriously doubt more than five people will be standing at gamestop looking at the xbox9000 vs playstation 56 and think, oh, there was that one time when PSN went down for a week.
Unfortunately, it's more than "play games online." It's an operating store / service on many levels. Furthermore, we live in a world where this service is expected as the commonplace thing.
You're absolutely right though, it's free, people get what they pay for when they go with Sony.
Is Engadget bullshitting or is PSN actually still down due to hackers???
Is this really "anonymous" or someone's retaliation for Sony suing the two hackers who made piracy possible (geohot and graf, I think) after that first group re-enabled Linux (failoverflow)?
Color me ever so slightly impressed...
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Heard the proposition that RIAA and MPAA should join forces and form "Music And Film Industry Association"?
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
I never understand people who defend the major corporation that screwed up in these circumstances. Do you work for Sony? Own a lot of Sony stock? Then why do you feel like you need to come to their defense?
Well, don't get as ridiculous as they are. They defend it because they bought into the product, it's the one they chose, and they have a sense of brand loyalty. Brand loyalty is fine if it's a passive "Eh, it's what I go with," but as we see on the internet with video games people get passionate about it.
There's nothing wrong with defending something rationally, but to excuse errors as non-issues is wrong. It's also wrong to blow things out of proportion, or spread rumors maliciously. If rumors are discussed with the note that they are merely rumors, that is fine.
I hate having to say these things, because I expect people to know it already.
Henroid on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
Is Engadget bullshitting or is PSN actually still down due to hackers???
Is this really "anonymous" or someone's retaliation for Sony suing the two hackers who made piracy possible (geohot and graf, I think) after that first group re-enabled Linux (failoverflow)?
Color me ever so slightly impressed...
Sony's initial comment about this issue was 'outside intrusion.' Anonymous typically lays claim to acts it does, and they passed this one off as not being them. A part of Anonymous' statement says Sony is likely saying "outside intrustion" because it's convenient to, since Anonymous did go after the PSN earlier this month.
The reality of the situation is nobody but Sony knows what happened, and you can't always take public statements at face value. Especially when they come three days late.
I never understand people who defend the major corporation that screwed up in these circumstances. Do you work for Sony? Own a lot of Sony stock? Then why do you feel like you need to come to their defense?
Baiting for the fanboys to show themselves?
Sony offers a service that I enjoy.
Something happened to the service so Sony took it down to fix it.
It is taking longer than originally expected.
They have apologized and will (in my opinion) offer some kind of retribution because of their mistake.
This isn't like the "Sony is being a dick over Geohot" scandal where Sony was being a huge prick. This is them trying to fix a mistake that some douche capitalized on and ruined it for the rest of us.
I am mad at the people that caused the problem, not Sony.
Now if it comes to be that my credcard info or some shit has been compromised or that all my PSN downloads have to be rebought? I will be pissed.
Until then, I am annoyed, but not angry. I can go get on my wii or the PC or something and play online there. I can still stream movies. I can still play my single player games.
Sony offers their online services for free and that buys my goodwill.
TehSpectre on
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
Is this really "anonymous" or someone's retaliation for Sony suing the two hackers who made piracy possible (geohot and graf, I think) after that first group re-enabled Linux (failoverflow)?
Posts
Ha, I missed laughing man.
On the plus side, Borderlands GOTY (PS3) is on sale at Gamestop for $20 new. Wife and I've been enjoying the hell out of the local co-op. Highly recommended, and there's a good thread that explains all the addons, etc.
Basically every major announcement they have that involved online in any capacity (and I cant think of anything anyone would announce in this day and age that doesnt have some kind of online component) will be met with "Yeah, if they can keep PSN turned on."
Again, its not like it will be a 100% valid statement, but the proximity of these two events means we're going to hear it, a lot.
The bad will this is generating will certainly offset the money they save by stopping a few hundred pirates getting crap for free.
I actually really disagree with you on this point, and think the average consumer will view this as way MORE of an inconvenience than any of us would.
All of us understand servers, and all the fun tech stuff that all of this is tangled up in. And we all have a billion other ways to entertain ourselves right now - I can get Netflix on 3 different devices (4 actually if I charge up my unused iPhone) in the room Im sitting in alone.
But I know my dad has shown my mom how to use their XBox to watch Netflix - and that's it. He showed her step by step how to navigate to it and use it. And I know with 100% certainty that if my mom had more than 1 day straight of errors trying to watch Netflix on their TV, she'd get rid of the XBox, or at least stop using it personally (which would influence the next console my dad wanted to bring home). She doesn't get it and she doesn't care - she just knows the thing doesn't work anymore.
And while that seems kind of rash, it's just the way I think average consumers are - they want a product that works. My mom was adamant against switching from Time Warner to Verizon just because she hated the way the TV Channels were numbered. People like stuff that works, and if it ain't broke don't fix it.
I bet there's a lot of people around this time who are kind of fed up that nothing works, fed up that Sony doesn't have a set time this will all be back online, and are now trading in the PS3 for something that will work immediately - and most importantly, won't go back to Sony afterwords.
Other then that, this whole thing is meh for me.
I'm pretty sure Sony's support line is getting hammered right now, but I doubt many people are going to "throw their playstations out" probably just find something else to do over the weekend.
This isn't my area of expertise, so if you want to convince me, I need some sources.
I can see people pirating wiiware after uploading it to the net and installing through an SD card, but not by posting a video on the web where anyone (youtube, not some obscure pirate site) can see and easily access Nintendo cash.
On one hand I agree, but on the other, I bet there's a decent chunk of people who planned on using their PS3 for "Something to do this weekend."
And they'll find other things to do this weekend, sure. It's the fact that Wednesday they still may be trying to get the thing to work that's going to really tick people off.
No one has said that; however "average consumer" - whoever that is - will most likely not view it through the same lens as the hardcore online users. It's a service outage, and service outages happen to electronic devices all the time.
/head-scratch
It's their fault because someone may have decided to expose a flaw in a (to me at least) intricate computer system? That's certainly not giving ANY company who deals in online commerce any slack. Hurray for those companies that have the perfect-system.
How often does "service outage" last 4+ days? You think an "average consumer" would find it acceptable if their phone, internet or power was out for that long?
Most "average consumers" I know freak out if the can't get online for more than an hour....
They probably don't care about the money they save by stopping the pirates/money they lose by turning off the PSN for a week.
They probably care about the fact developers might stop putting their content on their system if people could easily steal it.
You're comparing the PSN to "power"; let's get a relativity scale going here. And how many of these freakouts actually switch internet providers?
SONY is having its XBOX Live moment; if it goes to day 14, I'm sure they'll give the people something better than Undertow.
Are we trying to predict how people will react? Predictions can be wrong and that doesn't make the predictor a bad person.
Or are we trying to persuasively influence how people on this forum feel about the outage?
XBL Michael Spencer || Wii 6007 6812 1605 7315 || PSN MichaelSpencerJr || Steam Michael_Spencer || Ham NOØK
QRZ || My last known GPS coordinates: FindU or APRS.fi (Car antenna feed line busted -- no ham radio for me X__X )
In order to gain access to debug mode and add money to you wallet, you just have to tell PS3 that you are running under escalated privileges?
Sony developed a network where the end client is ASSUMED to authenticated? Holy shit! No credentials or anything? Did they seriously think that thier key would never be compromised?
I work for a major insurance company, and the field computer systems are locked down. Besides encrypting the hard drives, access is granted by a tier process, and we sure as hell don't trust the system logging into our network. Any point a failure between the [REDACTED], [REDACTED], and [REDACTED], communicating with the [REDACTED], the whole system halts must be manually unlocked by at least three people on a worst case situation.
Assuming that the system connecting your network is secure is just asinine! Did they have any security researchers look into the process at all, or were they too busy SUING THEM to notice.
At a professional level, Sony's gotten a black eye over the whole thing. But i seriously doubt more than five people will be standing at gamestop looking at the xbox9000 vs playstation 56 and think, oh, there was that one time when PSN went down for a week.
You honestly think people won't remember this for years to come? Ok.... xD
From my perspective, I really want to play Moon diver right now. But I can't, because I paid for it and didn't have space to download it. Now, I paid for a game I don't have access to. That's very souring on the whole 'well you can't play games online' idea. I can't play a game I paid for. Also, I've put a couple hundred dollars into the PSN network. I think I have the right to be upset at this outage.
Edit: People still remember that time that everyone's PS3 stopped working because the clock got a bit fucked up.
Unfortunately, it's more than "play games online." It's an operating store / service on many levels. Furthermore, we live in a world where this service is expected as the commonplace thing.
You're absolutely right though, it's free, people get what they pay for when they go with Sony.
http://www.engadget.com/2011/04/23/playstation-network-outage-blamed-on-external-intrusion-conti/
Is Engadget bullshitting or is PSN actually still down due to hackers???
Is this really "anonymous" or someone's retaliation for Sony suing the two hackers who made piracy possible (geohot and graf, I think) after that first group re-enabled Linux (failoverflow)?
Color me ever so slightly impressed...
Well, don't get as ridiculous as they are. They defend it because they bought into the product, it's the one they chose, and they have a sense of brand loyalty. Brand loyalty is fine if it's a passive "Eh, it's what I go with," but as we see on the internet with video games people get passionate about it.
There's nothing wrong with defending something rationally, but to excuse errors as non-issues is wrong. It's also wrong to blow things out of proportion, or spread rumors maliciously. If rumors are discussed with the note that they are merely rumors, that is fine.
I hate having to say these things, because I expect people to know it already.
Sony's initial comment about this issue was 'outside intrusion.' Anonymous typically lays claim to acts it does, and they passed this one off as not being them. A part of Anonymous' statement says Sony is likely saying "outside intrustion" because it's convenient to, since Anonymous did go after the PSN earlier this month.
The reality of the situation is nobody but Sony knows what happened, and you can't always take public statements at face value. Especially when they come three days late.
Sony offers a service that I enjoy.
Something happened to the service so Sony took it down to fix it.
It is taking longer than originally expected.
They have apologized and will (in my opinion) offer some kind of retribution because of their mistake.
This isn't like the "Sony is being a dick over Geohot" scandal where Sony was being a huge prick. This is them trying to fix a mistake that some douche capitalized on and ruined it for the rest of us.
I am mad at the people that caused the problem, not Sony.
Now if it comes to be that my credcard info or some shit has been compromised or that all my PSN downloads have to be rebought? I will be pissed.
Until then, I am annoyed, but not angry. I can go get on my wii or the PC or something and play online there. I can still stream movies. I can still play my single player games.
Sony offers their online services for free and that buys my goodwill.
It's still possible Sony caused the problem themselves. Just because they point in a direction doesn't mean it's the right one.
Retribution? Probably.
Reparation? Maybe.
Steam
I saw on the PixelJunk twitter feed that they had a free weekend lined up for Shooter 2 for this weekend.
I think it is silly to automatically call them liars.
It's not Anonymous.