Larger market opportunity just means bringing back the people who were disappointed with the loss of RPG elements, it's not like they can make it more shooter-y. DA2 has shown that the RPG hardcore are a significant (or at least vocal) group.
Uh, are you reading the same statement I am? Because to me, that statement reads "ME2 was a good start, but it didn't go far enough away from its RPG heritage.
I'm worried that they are going to turn this into "Mass effect 3:Modern space warfare"
Except we know from the previous articles that have been released that they are doing the opposite and trying to bring back more of the RPG elements. I read the statement as saying that they were trying to find a balance between shooter and RPG, ME1 was more RPG than shooter and ME2 was the opposite. The statement says "a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG".
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
That statement is more likely aimed at investors who are worried about a game being pushed back and likely no nothing more about Mass Effect then the title
Larger market opportunity just means bringing back the people who were disappointed with the loss of RPG elements, it's not like they can make it more shooter-y. DA2 has shown that the RPG hardcore are a significant (or at least vocal) group.
Uh, are you reading the same statement I am? Because to me, that statement reads "ME2 was a good start, but it didn't go far enough away from its RPG heritage.
I'm worried that they are going to turn this into "Mass effect 3:Modern space warfare"
Except we know from the previous articles that have been released that they are doing the opposite and trying to bring back more of the RPG elements. I read the statement as saying that they were trying to find a balance between shooter and RPG, ME1 was more RPG than shooter and ME2 was the opposite. The statement says "a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG".
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
That statement is more likely aimed at investors who are worried about a game being pushed back and likely no nothing more about Mass Effect then the title
Stop being reasonable, and making sense, it makes it harder for me to think that ME3 is RUINED FOREVER!
Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach.
Speculation ho!
What the fuck! This does not sound good. They need to be concerned about making a great game, not about appealing to a larger market.
Needs more waggle.
GrimReaper on
PSN | Steam
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
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BerkshireEarth Federal ForcesMassachusettsRegistered Userregular
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
ME2 was also multiplatform. I think SoundsPlush (and G4) have it. We may be getting screwed on the release date so the Shovelware Central 2: HD Edition can get a port. That would be pretty remarkably upsetting, if it's true.
Berkshire on
"And don't you ever stand for that sort of thing. Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back."
GT: FootlongKaPow
Hmmm... "far larger market opportunity"? I think ME2 was pretty damn successful, so I am not clear what they mean by far larger - how many gamers are there out there who haven't already gotten into the ME universe?
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
ME2 was also multiplatform. I think SoundsPlush (and G4) have it. We may be getting screwed on the release date so the Shovelware Central 2: HD Edition can get a port. That would be pretty remarkably upsetting, if it's true.
ME1 was a better PC port than ME2.
Spoit on
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wiltingI had fun once and it was awfulRegistered Userregular
edited May 2011
The only thing that bothers me is the change in controls between ME and ME2.
wilting on
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DragkoniasThat Guy Who Does StuffYou Know, There. Registered Userregular
edited May 2011
While I know people won't listen, I think it is probably in your best interest to wait and see instead of going crazy over a sentence that could be taken in a number of ways.
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
ME2 was also multiplatform. I think SoundsPlush (and G4) have it. We may be getting screwed on the release date so the Shovelware Central 2: HD Edition can get a port. That would be pretty remarkably upsetting, if it's true.
ME1 was a better PC port than ME2.
Somewhat better game and UI controls vs. sound issues and not playing nice with alt-tab on my windows xp computer. Not sure which I preferred.
All I know is that whenever I accidentally vault out of cover due to double tapping space bar, I damn near pop a blood vessel.
Knowing what we know about ME3 it's impossible to think that it'll be less RPG than ME2, because they've outright stated that isn't the case. If ME1 had 100% of RPG fans and ME2 had 100% of Shooter fans, 50% of RPG fans, then ME3 having 100% of both would be addressing a far larger market opportunity.
Shen on
3DS: 2234-8122-8398 | Battle.net (EU): Ladi#2485
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Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
All I know is that whenever I accidentally vault out of cover due to double tapping space bar, I damn near pop a blood vessel.
Knowing what we know about ME3 it's impossible to think that it'll be less RPG than ME2, because they've outright stated that isn't the case. If ME1 had 100% of RPG fans and ME2 had 100% of Shooter fans, 50% of RPG fans, then ME3 having 100% of both would be addressing a far larger market opportunity.
I'm with you, Shen. I think that what they're saying is that ME1 was too RPG for the casual market and ME2 was too Shooter for the RPG fan. I think their idea of hitting a larger market is to find a better blend of the mechanics so both the RPG fans and the casual market are happy.
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
ME2 was also multiplatform. I think SoundsPlush (and G4) have it. We may be getting screwed on the release date so the Shovelware Central 2: HD Edition can get a port. That would be pretty remarkably upsetting, if it's true.
ME1 was a better PC port than ME2.
bollocks. ME2 was absolutely perfect on PC. Aside from the planet scanning which doesn't lend itself to a mouse at all everything else was seamless. It looked better, ran smoother and you could edit files to remove the need to scan planets entirely. It is unquestionably better than the ME1 pc port which was buggy, unstable and ran worse than its console counterpart.
Larger market opportunity just means bringing back the people who were disappointed with the loss of RPG elements, it's not like they can make it more shooter-y. DA2 has shown that the RPG hardcore are a significant (or at least vocal) group.
Uh, are you reading the same statement I am? Because to me, that statement reads "ME2 was a good start, but it didn't go far enough away from its RPG heritage.
I'm worried that they are going to turn this into "Mass effect 3:Modern space warfare"
Your worries are totally unfounded.
Not only have we already seen the enhanced RPG elements of the game, they have been discussed at length in all coverage of ME3 so far.
But he was right, going too far down that rabbit hole is what they tried with Dragon Age 2 and it did not sell as well as the first game.
I wouldn't characterize ME2 as a shooter anyway. As Jerry so expertly put it, RPG is now a sauce with which to flavour your game. I see ME2 and the MAss Effect series as a whole as an interactive story.
Really, if we didn't associate the genre of 'adventure games' with old-school point and click, that would be awfully apropos for these games. They combine a huge array of different design elements, from straight up third person shooting, to deep dialogue systems, to the RPG-lite flavour of upgrades and weapon choice.
At its core, Mass Effect is a story driven game with enjoyable gameplay breaks. What Riccitiello is saying here is quite clear - they're not going to follow the route of Dragon Age 2. It didn't pay off critically or financially. They're going to attract the alienated RPG fans who feel the game is slipping away from them, while also satisfying the shooter fans while at the same time keeping story the focus, which is universal.
Mass Effect 2 eliminated a lot of RPG bullshit from the first game, was an extremely streamlined affair. But it isn't one of the most highly rated games of all time because it was a competent shooter, or because it eschewed its RPG roots. It is because it balanced the two expertly while delivering the core payload of the experience, which was a character driven science fiction romp.
With ME3, all they need to do is ME2 but better. To perpetuate the RPG sauce analogy, they need more seasoning, that's all. A few more options for power advancement, more gun modifications and more gun varieties. More options to customize allies and more robust ways to upgrade the Normandy.
By doing so they keep the core of the game the same but take everything to eleven, attracting in fans who felt they preferred ME1 (of which there is a considerable block) and keeping the fans they already have.
Their decisions already reflect this. Most people (something like 80%) played soldier in ME2. So now in ME3 all classes can use assault rifles.
It's not about making this Call of Mass Effect: Future Warfare. It's about fixing the small niggling issues, correcting design flaws and flavouring the game to better fit the fanbase.
It could also, and almost certainly, means a release on all platforms, with some inked deal to bring the entire trilogy boxset to all platforms too down the road.
Of all the CEOs in all the world, Riccitiello has consistently stood on the side of fans, putting quality first while also doing all he can to make it profitable to appease everyone. Are you right to be suspicious? Probably. But they have earned the benefit of the doubt many times over.
While I know people won't listen, I think it is probably in your best interest to wait and see instead of going crazy over a sentence that could be taken in a number of ways.
See, the thing is, Dragon Age 2 has been out for two months now. Its old news and complaining about how its the antichrist and will be the damnation of games is a non-thing. BioWare, being the kind and generous company they are, released this sentence to give that particular sect of geese something to complain about.
Skull2185 on
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
So I just installed ME1, which I bought last summer, as I have been wanting to shoot mans, and could also go for an RPG with an amazing setting.
Please tell me there's something I can do to fix these textures.
Please
I beg of you
I looked around google search, found nothing. I played on 360 though, so I'm probably useless for this stuff anyway. There was a "tweak" guide but it was dumb "Set graphics to high for high graphics, turn on particle effects for particle effects"...
I felt compelled to help you though because of your epic hypnotic avatar.
Skull2185 on
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
I don't know why people would take one line to mean they're abandoning RPG elements entirely when they've already told us that weapon mods were coming back and that they're looking to spice up / improve the skill trees. Combined with the fact that this remains a Bioware game, which means it has excellent chances of having enjoyable dialogue and epic as fuck cutscenes, what else do people want?
Give me improved weapon mods but avoid the clusterfuck that it could become having to clear out ones inventory after every mission and slowly upgrade everyones shit one at a time and I'll be a happy man.
Forar on
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
I don't know why people would take one line to mean they're abandoning RPG elements entirely when they've already told us that weapon mods were coming back and that they're looking to spice up / improve the skill trees. Combined with the fact that this remains a Bioware game, which means it has excellent chances of having enjoyable dialogue and epic as fuck cutscenes, what else do people want?
Its the curse BioWare must suffer for never making a bad game. DA2 had the same thing happen almost instantly. Game was announced, screen shot came out, game was branded "the end of times" and the thread here became largely unbearable.
Things haven't gotten too bad here yet, so hopefully I don't have to abandon the ME thread until after ME3 comes out.
Skull2185 on
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
I don't know why people would take one line to mean they're abandoning RPG elements entirely when they've already told us that weapon mods were coming back and that they're looking to spice up / improve the skill trees. Combined with the fact that this remains a Bioware game, which means it has excellent chances of having enjoyable dialogue and epic as fuck cutscenes, what else do people want?
Its the curse BioWare must suffer for never making a bad game. DA2 had the same thing happen almost instantly. Game was announced, screen shot came out, game was branded "the end of times" and the thread here became largely unbearable.
Things haven't gotten too bad here yet, so hopefully I don't have to abandon the ME thread until after ME3 comes out.
Just make weapon mods as clearly defined as the weapons were in ME2. One for each.
A scope. A stock. An underbarrel grenade launcher or something.
Then the more customizable things. A thing that increases damage. A thing that increases ammo capacity.
Single, specific items that clip on.
On the one hand this clearly makes the most sense, and has been demonstrated to work great in numerous other games.
On the other, man do I miss stacking a sniper out so it overheats in one shot, 'we're going tank hunting boys'. Was a really unique system, just poorly balanced. Though I think that might be basically inherent in the system.
I don't know why people would take one line to mean they're abandoning RPG elements entirely when they've already told us that weapon mods were coming back and that they're looking to spice up / improve the skill trees. Combined with the fact that this remains a Bioware game, which means it has excellent chances of having enjoyable dialogue and epic as fuck cutscenes, what else do people want?
Its the curse BioWare must suffer for never making a bad game. DA2 had the same thing happen almost instantly. Game was announced, screen shot came out, game was branded "the end of times" and the thread here became largely unbearable.
Things haven't gotten too bad here yet, so hopefully I don't have to abandon the ME thread until after ME3 comes out.
If only I had any photoshop skills whatsoever.
"It won't be an RPG anymore!"
"The graphics are taking a step back!"
"Ammo will ruin the game!"
"They'll never replace Wrex in my heart!"
"Ashley is Space Hitler!"
"They're giving us a Batarian Squadmate!"
i'm not worried that they're removing RPG elements - if anything, CoD and other shooters have been ADDING them: levels, unlocks, customization, etc.
i am a little worried that they're tweaking powers and abilities so the game works in multi, though. so many things would be completely broken there that they'd have to nerf everything to have any balance.
curly haired boy on
Registered just for the Mass Effect threads | Steam: click ^^^ | Origin: curlyhairedboy
For the record, while I don't feel that ammo "ruined the game", I do feel like it cost a bit of the setting's uniqueness.
The heat buildup system from the first game with its technical backing was something that I hadn't seen anywhere else, and that was really cool. It gave the game and the setting a little something special when compared to everything else out there.
And now it's gone, and that little bit of special is too. There is plenty of other good stuff in Mass Effect, but losing that made it a little less cool in my mind.
Larger market opportunity just means bringing back the people who were disappointed with the loss of RPG elements, it's not like they can make it more shooter-y. DA2 has shown that the RPG hardcore are a significant (or at least vocal) group.
Uh, are you reading the same statement I am? Because to me, that statement reads "ME2 was a good start, but it didn't go far enough away from its RPG heritage.
I'm worried that they are going to turn this into "Mass effect 3:Modern space warfare"
Except we know from the previous articles that have been released that they are doing the opposite and trying to bring back more of the RPG elements. I read the statement as saying that they were trying to find a balance between shooter and RPG, ME1 was more RPG than shooter and ME2 was the opposite. The statement says "a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG".
I know all the info prior to this statement says the opposite, which is why I'm not too worried, but that statement seems pretty clearly in favor of less RPG elements.
"address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass Effect 2 began to approach"
"Mass effect 2 began to approach" those words are key, because ME2 was more shooter than RPG.
Actually, that could very well mean ME3 also on Project Cafe, if you think about it. ME1 was only on one console("than Mass Effect did"), and ME2 was on two consoles of 3 ("and Mass Effect 2 began to approach").
For the record, while I don't feel that ammo "ruined the game", I do feel like it cost a bit of the setting's uniqueness.
The heat buildup system from the first game with its technical backing was something that I hadn't seen anywhere else, and that was really cool. It gave the game and the setting a little something special when compared to everything else out there.
And now it's gone, and that little bit of special is too. There is plenty of other good stuff in Mass Effect, but losing that made it a little less cool in my mind.
My wife just played through the first one and is now on ME2, and she HATES needing to have ammo. She much prefers the playstyle of the first game mostly for that reason. She also doesn't like the powers as much, but she went Soldier again in ME2 when I recommended Vanguard, so I consider that one a little bit on her. So ammo did "ruin" a few people's day, to be sure.
Posts
That statement is more likely aimed at investors who are worried about a game being pushed back and likely no nothing more about Mass Effect then the title
Stop being reasonable, and making sense, it makes it harder for me to think that ME3 is RUINED FOREVER!
Needs more waggle.
---
I've got a spare copy of Portal, if anyone wants it message me.
GT: FootlongKaPow
ME1 was a better PC port than ME2.
Somewhat better game and UI controls vs. sound issues and not playing nice with alt-tab on my windows xp computer. Not sure which I preferred.
Knowing what we know about ME3 it's impossible to think that it'll be less RPG than ME2, because they've outright stated that isn't the case. If ME1 had 100% of RPG fans and ME2 had 100% of Shooter fans, 50% of RPG fans, then ME3 having 100% of both would be addressing a far larger market opportunity.
I'm with you, Shen. I think that what they're saying is that ME1 was too RPG for the casual market and ME2 was too Shooter for the RPG fan. I think their idea of hitting a larger market is to find a better blend of the mechanics so both the RPG fans and the casual market are happy.
bollocks. ME2 was absolutely perfect on PC. Aside from the planet scanning which doesn't lend itself to a mouse at all everything else was seamless. It looked better, ran smoother and you could edit files to remove the need to scan planets entirely. It is unquestionably better than the ME1 pc port which was buggy, unstable and ran worse than its console counterpart.
Your worries are totally unfounded.
Not only have we already seen the enhanced RPG elements of the game, they have been discussed at length in all coverage of ME3 so far.
But he was right, going too far down that rabbit hole is what they tried with Dragon Age 2 and it did not sell as well as the first game.
I wouldn't characterize ME2 as a shooter anyway. As Jerry so expertly put it, RPG is now a sauce with which to flavour your game. I see ME2 and the MAss Effect series as a whole as an interactive story.
Really, if we didn't associate the genre of 'adventure games' with old-school point and click, that would be awfully apropos for these games. They combine a huge array of different design elements, from straight up third person shooting, to deep dialogue systems, to the RPG-lite flavour of upgrades and weapon choice.
At its core, Mass Effect is a story driven game with enjoyable gameplay breaks. What Riccitiello is saying here is quite clear - they're not going to follow the route of Dragon Age 2. It didn't pay off critically or financially. They're going to attract the alienated RPG fans who feel the game is slipping away from them, while also satisfying the shooter fans while at the same time keeping story the focus, which is universal.
Mass Effect 2 eliminated a lot of RPG bullshit from the first game, was an extremely streamlined affair. But it isn't one of the most highly rated games of all time because it was a competent shooter, or because it eschewed its RPG roots. It is because it balanced the two expertly while delivering the core payload of the experience, which was a character driven science fiction romp.
With ME3, all they need to do is ME2 but better. To perpetuate the RPG sauce analogy, they need more seasoning, that's all. A few more options for power advancement, more gun modifications and more gun varieties. More options to customize allies and more robust ways to upgrade the Normandy.
By doing so they keep the core of the game the same but take everything to eleven, attracting in fans who felt they preferred ME1 (of which there is a considerable block) and keeping the fans they already have.
Their decisions already reflect this. Most people (something like 80%) played soldier in ME2. So now in ME3 all classes can use assault rifles.
It's not about making this Call of Mass Effect: Future Warfare. It's about fixing the small niggling issues, correcting design flaws and flavouring the game to better fit the fanbase.
It could also, and almost certainly, means a release on all platforms, with some inked deal to bring the entire trilogy boxset to all platforms too down the road.
Of all the CEOs in all the world, Riccitiello has consistently stood on the side of fans, putting quality first while also doing all he can to make it profitable to appease everyone. Are you right to be suspicious? Probably. But they have earned the benefit of the doubt many times over.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
See, the thing is, Dragon Age 2 has been out for two months now. Its old news and complaining about how its the antichrist and will be the damnation of games is a non-thing. BioWare, being the kind and generous company they are, released this sentence to give that particular sect of geese something to complain about.
I completely agree, I was just going for the popular vote.
Carth was the man.
Please tell me there's something I can do to fix these textures.
Please
I beg of you
I looked around google search, found nothing. I played on 360 though, so I'm probably useless for this stuff anyway. There was a "tweak" guide but it was dumb "Set graphics to high for high graphics, turn on particle effects for particle effects"...
I felt compelled to help you though because of your epic hypnotic avatar.
Give me improved weapon mods but avoid the clusterfuck that it could become having to clear out ones inventory after every mission and slowly upgrade everyones shit one at a time and I'll be a happy man.
A scope. A stock. An underbarrel grenade launcher or something.
Then the more customizable things. A thing that increases damage. A thing that increases ammo capacity.
Single, specific items that clip on.
Its the curse BioWare must suffer for never making a bad game. DA2 had the same thing happen almost instantly. Game was announced, screen shot came out, game was branded "the end of times" and the thread here became largely unbearable.
Things haven't gotten too bad here yet, so hopefully I don't have to abandon the ME thread until after ME3 comes out.
Granted, I never played DA2.
But I'd still buy a 40 lb bag of sand with the Bioware logo on it with the expectation that it would be the most engrossing bag of sand ever produced.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
On the one hand this clearly makes the most sense, and has been demonstrated to work great in numerous other games.
On the other, man do I miss stacking a sniper out so it overheats in one shot, 'we're going tank hunting boys'. Was a really unique system, just poorly balanced. Though I think that might be basically inherent in the system.
If only I had any photoshop skills whatsoever.
"It won't be an RPG anymore!"
"The graphics are taking a step back!"
"Ammo will ruin the game!"
"They'll never replace Wrex in my heart!"
"Ashley is Space Hitler!"
"They're giving us a Batarian Squadmate!"
i am a little worried that they're tweaking powers and abilities so the game works in multi, though. so many things would be completely broken there that they'd have to nerf everything to have any balance.
Registered just for the Mass Effect threads | Steam: click ^^^ | Origin: curlyhairedboy
The heat buildup system from the first game with its technical backing was something that I hadn't seen anywhere else, and that was really cool. It gave the game and the setting a little something special when compared to everything else out there.
And now it's gone, and that little bit of special is too. There is plenty of other good stuff in Mass Effect, but losing that made it a little less cool in my mind.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
"This one wants edible crystalline carbohydrates of the sucrose variety. This one wonders if the quarian wants to provide such."
What? I don't even want to... actually, I kinda do.
I really want to see that.
This is starting to get fanfictiony.
Actually, that could very well mean ME3 also on Project Cafe, if you think about it. ME1 was only on one console("than Mass Effect did"), and ME2 was on two consoles of 3 ("and Mass Effect 2 began to approach").
Seems kinda silly to me, though.
My wife just played through the first one and is now on ME2, and she HATES needing to have ammo. She much prefers the playstyle of the first game mostly for that reason. She also doesn't like the powers as much, but she went Soldier again in ME2 when I recommended Vanguard, so I consider that one a little bit on her. So ammo did "ruin" a few people's day, to be sure.
What do you mean?
Which, by the way, doesn't appear to have anything about 'ammo' at all. Clearly needs an update/extended version.
(There's a spoiler or two if you're one of the folks who just started playing your way thru the series, FYI)