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[Vampire the Masquerade: Bloodlines] Sequel incoming! (Q1 2020)

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Posts

  • KayKay What we need... Is a little bit of PANIC.Registered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Saying "they have 15 blood points" makes little sense because the game does not follow PnP rules for like... anything. You have 15 blood points because 10 was too little in order to use your abilities and 20 was too much.

    It also ruins like... everything else in the game making any sort of sense. LaCroix(8th gen according to the blood theory) just straight murders your sire and your sire is entirely not able to do anything about this; ignorant of whatever was happening despite being a 7th generation vampire and therefore being legitimately sired by a 6th generation vampire at some point hundreds of years ago. Did your sire just decide to commit suicide by cop? At 7th generation they would have been Primogen of any clan besides maybe Tremere in LA.

    The 8th generation was most prominent in the 13th century. The vast majority of 7th generation vampires are older than that as 6th and lower have generally stopped siring at this point. Beckett is basically the youngest 7th generation vampire in the world and he wouldn't have been caught by the Prince of LA in a thousand years.

    So then your sire is only like 10 to 50 years old... then there is a 6th generation vampire floating around making new childer and letting them lose into the world? Like holy shit stop the presses LaCroix you have more important things to deal with than some dumb sarcophagus that might hold an old boy. You're already at war with an old boy.

    I mean, you're entitled to your opinion. All the resources around the game and info that's out there points to the main character in Bloodlines being uncommonly powerful for someone just Embraced. A low generation would go a long way towards explaining that, at least in part. Plus there's all the NPCs that frequently comment on how powerful and potent the PC's blood is, so make of that what you will.

    From what I recall, LaCroix is apparently 7th Gen and very very interested in diablerising whatever is apparently in the Ankaran Sarcophagus. He's also... awful. And not as smart as you'd expect. But Weird Stuff is going on in LA at the time, which again is very prominently commented on.

    Therese Voerman is apparently 6th Gen (...what).

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  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    Kay wrote: »

    I mean, you're entitled to your opinion. All the resources around the game and info that's out there points to the main character in Bloodlines being uncommonly powerful for someone just Embraced. A low generation would go a long way towards explaining that, at least in part. Plus there's all the NPCs that frequently comment on how powerful and potent the PC's blood is, so make of that what you will.

    From what I recall, LaCroix is apparently 7th Gen and very very interested in diablerising whatever is apparently in the Ankaran Sarcophagus. He's also... awful. And not as smart as you'd expect. But Weird Stuff is going on in LA at the time, which again is very prominently commented on.

    Therese Voerman is apparently 6th Gen (...what).

    8th can dominate 8th. The leading theory is that you're 8th and develop iron will...

    Answer: no all that is dumb. You have 15 blood points because that works for the game. You get stronger because its a game. Just like the same happens in Redemption where going from 9 to 8 makes like.. no difference. And you get ridonk strong in the course of 3 nights and then sleep for a thousand years and get redonker stronger in another week. Its not because Ecaterina the Wise was secretly a 4th generation vampire all along. Its because its a video game.

    Edit: I mean right? In Redemption you're explicitly 9th generation and then like 3 days after being sired as a Brujah you're all "I have 5 dots in blood magic and 5 dots in Presence"

    Goumindong on
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  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    Lol it does appear canon that Therese is 6th generation, which honestly makes me feel much better about throwing up my hands and shrugging "Videogames!" than before. Lacroix should have just diablerized her!

    https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Jacob_(Malkavian)

    Fiatil on
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  • BilliardballBilliardball Registered User regular
    If Therese was 6th, wouldn't she basically be able to wrest control of the city from anyone she pleases with a word?

    Why would she waste time playing Camarilla politics? That one makes no sense, even with so much of her time spent sabotaging herself.

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  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Yeah I think trying to impose any kind of generation logic just makes the plot completely implode. That they made her officially 6th gen AFTER the game is super dumb....

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    Corsini
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Yea the stuff that indicates Therese is 6th Gen was published in 2018. Its kind of a "everyone has to be super cool" problem that writing has i think.

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  • Road BlockRoad Block Registered User regular
    edited April 16
    Fiatil wrote: »
    Lol it does appear canon that Therese is 6th generation, which honestly makes me feel much better about throwing up my hands and shrugging "Videogames!" than before. Lacroix should have just diablerized her!

    https://whitewolf.fandom.com/wiki/Jacob_(Malkavian)

    That page does make the assumption that her sire committed Diablerie (or alternatively they messed up his generation) based on the fact he has another childe of 7th gen while being gen 5. So depending on the timeline she could be gen 7. Which still seems high but is somewhat plausible.

    Road Block on
  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    I'm pretty sure Bloodlines is a big reason that setting is still popular, since there's a lot of references to characters from the game in 5th edition as well as L.A. By Night. I assume they were trying to play up Therese as being a big bad ass, but it doesn't really make any sense if you examine it long. Particularly since we know Therese refuses to drink directly from people and instead takes her blood bagged, which even on the weaker end of a 6th generation vampire (which she would be since she is not that old as far as we know) she would be unable to do that. That being said, it's also not egregious as you might think since, as noted, even at a low generation a vampire won't be that strong until they've got some centuries under their belt. Stronger than some fresh 13th generation, sure, but nowhere on the level of even like an 8th generation that's several centuries old. At least according to V5.

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  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    This is why Generation was a dumb mechanic and Blood Potency was superior. Wish they would have ported that over to Masquerade somehow, but that would have probably fucked up the metaplot and all that. Blood Potency handles all the "unusually powerful" shenanigans because you could just not need to explain it, unlike an explicit lineage/hierarchy.

  • Jeep-EepJeep-Eep Registered User regular
    I hope the ray-tracing can fall back to DXR.

  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    There is Blood Potency in 5th edition, your generation just sets the lower and upper limits of it. Mind I assume you're referencing Requiem, which I don't know much about.

    Though I also realized a flaw in my previous assertion. Jeannette does drink straight from the source, and might do all the actual feeding while Therese just drinks useless blood.

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  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Generation refers to how far you are from Caine I think. So if you get chomped on by a 6th gen you are a seventh gen . 7->8 etc what I dont know is where the cutoffs for powerful is.

    I do know that. I just have no idea what generations typically correspond to what centuries (and by definition, it's pretty variable).

    Orca wrote: »
    Synthesis wrote:
    Isn't "Your sarcasm makes me wet," the highest compliment an Abh can pay a human?

    Only if said Abh is a member of the nobility.
  • Zombie GandhiZombie Gandhi Registered User regular
    Iblis wrote: »
    There is Blood Potency in 5th edition, your generation just sets the lower and upper limits of it. Mind I assume you're referencing Requiem, which I don't know much about.

    Though I also realized a flaw in my previous assertion. Jeannette does drink straight from the source, and might do all the actual feeding while Therese just drinks useless blood.

    Neat. I haven't read 5th ed yet. Still seems arbitrarily limiting (Dominate being restricted by Generation really doubled-down on Generation being the most important trait), but progress in one direction.

    Maybe I'll pick up 5th ed when Bloodlines comes out because the itch will come back strong.

  • DemonStaceyDemonStacey TTODewback's Daughter In love with the TaySwayRegistered User regular
    As someone who has only played Bloodlines and reading all of this... yea I think the generation stuff having such hard lined rules is pretty lame for video games(and just personally in general I think it kinda sucks) and would definitely be better to not that way in the next game either.

    desc wrote: »
    ~ * ~ Week-Long Dance-a-thon Booty Ribbon ~ * ~
  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    Kay wrote: »
    The player character is canonically 8th Gen, as they have 15 blood points.

    LaCroix is therefore 7th or lower, as he can Dominate you early on.

    Later in the game, he attempts to Dominate you again and FAILS, and the other NPCs (Andrei in particular) comment on how your blood potency has increased through the game. Which is very weird.

    Lacroix just botched his roll.

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Generation refers to how far you are from Caine I think. So if you get chomped on by a 6th gen you are a seventh gen . 7->8 etc what I dont know is where the cutoffs for powerful is.

    I do know that. I just have no idea what generations typically correspond to what centuries (and by definition, it's pretty variable).

    Generation and age are completely uncoupled from each other. A 5th generation vampire could have been embraced last week, and while they'll have great blood buffs and healing they're not going to be any more effective than any other freshly created character.

    Generation is never mentioned in Bloodlines and isn't an important mechanic, so this conversation is largely moot. It's not true that Therese being 6th generation would completely alter the balance of power in LA though, generation simply isn't that powerful. Lacroix could be any generation, there are no real hints about it either way and it isn't actually important.

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Generation and age are uncoupled but correlated. And while it also is “uncoupled” with strength it does cap stat values and blood pool and blood use which is... well its direct power really.

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  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    They're not even correlated. They're completely separate attributes and you can't infer anything about one from the other. Capped stat values are only important if you've had enough time to learn stats above 5.

    Hobnail wrote: »
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    jakobagger
  • DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    The best you could say is that age raises the floor of your stats, but only because it gives you enough time to raise them.

  • Igpx407Igpx407 Registered User regular
    I know the sewers are often the most derided level, but for me the Sabbat hideout at the end of the game was the worst part. At least the sewers had the occasional puzzle and combat was spread out. The Sabbat hideout was just an exhausting grind with an even more boring interior.

    Also Giovanni mansion is sadly a disappointment. It's too brief. I wish it had just a few more missions to flesh out that clan and their politicking.

  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    They are absolutely correlated. “Not necessarily a casual relation but the ability to infer” is what correlation means.... and like. We can derive causation directly from generation to age.

    If generation = 1 then age = really fucking old
    If generation = 2 then...

    This isnt as clear cut as you get above generation 8 or so but like... so?

    There are almost no high gen vampires that are old. The higher your gen the more likely youre to be young. The lower your gen the more likely to be old. That is what correlation means

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    SneaksSynthesisNeaden
  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    I understand that very authoritatively saying things that are completely wrong is your whole bit, so don't feel the need to discuss this any further with you. I have nothing to add, and you are not pleasant to converse with.
    Igpx407 wrote: »
    I know the sewers are often the most derided level, but for me the Sabbat hideout at the end of the game was the worst part. At least the sewers had the occasional puzzle and combat was spread out. The Sabbat hideout was just an exhausting grind with an even more boring interior.

    Also Giovanni mansion is sadly a disappointment. It's too brief. I wish it had just a few more missions to flesh out that clan and their politicking.

    The Giovanni mansion and hotel are both unfortunately super rushed, to the point where the mansion even has broken VO in many places. I kind of like the hotel as a place to try out my build, but there's a lot of buggy scripting and it's a pretty ugly level in general.

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
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  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    Having gotten through the Giovanni mansion recently on my replay, it was fairly disappointing that they had all these secret passages and spy holes and shit, but there was basically nothing to do with them. Can definitely tell they scrapped some stuff there.

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  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Iblis wrote: »
    Having gotten through the Giovanni mansion recently on my replay, it was fairly disappointing that they had all these secret passages and spy holes and shit, but there was basically nothing to do with them. Can definitely tell they scrapped some stuff there.

    Possibly, or it could be a case that having them tells you more about the giovanni mindset.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Chantry of NightmaresRegistered User regular
    I was happy just to have a Giovanni appear, seems like the kind of clan that gets easily overlooked.

    9LlOwgn.png
    Well, good morning. Welcome to the new scenario. What should we do today?
    Moridin889
  • OctoberRavenOctoberRaven Plays fighting games for the story Skyeline Hotel Apartment 4ARegistered User regular
    edited April 17
    Kay wrote: »
    From what I recall, LaCroix is apparently 7th Gen and very very interested in diablerising whatever is apparently in the Ankaran Sarcophagus. He's also... awful. And not as smart as you'd expect.

    "Hm. The new kid keeps surviving the suicide missions I send them on. Maybe it would behoove me to get them on my side? Naaaaaah, better try to kill them some more. Meanwhile I'm going to get literally the worst cop in LA to be my security guard."

    OctoberRaven on
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  • Igpx407Igpx407 Registered User regular
    It looks like Penny Arcade also has a Vampire the Masquerade rpg podcast as part of their patreon. Does anyone know how good it is? I’m dangerously close to subscribing just for that.

  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Igpx407 wrote: »
    It looks like Penny Arcade also has a Vampire the Masquerade rpg podcast as part of their patreon. Does anyone know how good it is? I’m dangerously close to subscribing just for that.

    Ask Tube, it's his game and it starts like...today.

    YaYa wrote: »
    FUCK YEAH LET'S FIGHT THE MOON
    Fencingsax
  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    Tube is one of the people playing and I think a producer on it. I was thinking of checking it out myself once I caught up to LA By Night.

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Pretty sure he's taking over Storyteller duties today. He's been posting on it off and on in the SE++ RP thread. He posted this today:
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    3clipseKoopahTroopahIgpx407Kristmas Kthulhunever dieElvenshaejdarksun
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Chantry of NightmaresRegistered User regular
    So... can any of us join the game? Or is it predetermined?

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    Well, good morning. Welcome to the new scenario. What should we do today?
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    I'm 99% sure that's a game Tube's running in real life with people he knows.

    YaYa wrote: »
    FUCK YEAH LET'S FIGHT THE MOON
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  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    Yesterday’s game was a new arc and a good jumping on point imo

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
  • Igpx407Igpx407 Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    Yesterday’s game was a new arc and a good jumping on point imo

    I subscribed to the patreon just for these and am excited to jump in.

    Side question: I’m working my way through LA by Night and how canonical are the events of Bloodlines to that show? They reuse a lot of NPC characters but don’t seem to acknowledge Lacroix or his Camarilla incursion. There’s a speech Baron Ambrams have at one point that I believe says the last time they dealt with the ivory tower was in the 40s.

  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    Igpx407 wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    Yesterday’s game was a new arc and a good jumping on point imo

    I subscribed to the patreon just for these and am excited to jump in.

    Side question: I’m working my way through LA by Night and how canonical are the events of Bloodlines to that show? They reuse a lot of NPC characters but don’t seem to acknowledge Lacroix or his Camarilla incursion. There’s a speech Baron Ambrams have at one point that I believe says the last time they dealt with the ivory tower was in the 40s.

    Bloodlines is canon but they're deliberately vague about how events transpired due to multiple endings etc.

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
  • QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Tube wrote: »
    Igpx407 wrote: »
    Tube wrote: »
    Yesterday’s game was a new arc and a good jumping on point imo

    I subscribed to the patreon just for these and am excited to jump in.

    Side question: I’m working my way through LA by Night and how canonical are the events of Bloodlines to that show? They reuse a lot of NPC characters but don’t seem to acknowledge Lacroix or his Camarilla incursion. There’s a speech Baron Ambrams have at one point that I believe says the last time they dealt with the ivory tower was in the 40s.

    Bloodlines is canon but they're deliberately vague about how events transpired due to multiple endings etc.

    Like they've talked about how Therese and Jeanette are both still around. The only way both personalities are still around is if you make them get along... otherwise one of them 'dies'.

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  • TubeTube Administrator, ClubPA admin
    They'd come back either way. There's no curing being a Malkavian.

    Hobnail wrote: »
    This forum has taken everything from me
    Rchanenjmcdonald
  • cj iwakuracj iwakura The Rhythm Regent Chantry of NightmaresRegistered User regular

    In Bloodlines 2, you will wake as a Thinblood - learning about the playable clans and political factions of Seattle - before joining one of the ancient clans.

    Thinbloods are a recent, weaker strain of vampire who face a constant struggle to survive in the World of Darkness. While they are often treated as second-class citizens by full-blood Kindred, Seattle’s leadership has been uncharacteristically tolerant of Thinbloods. As Seattle has only relatively recently come under Camarilla control, it remains a city of opportunity where Thinbloods can navigate their way into the higher circles of vampire society; however, they are rarely shown the same respect or legal standing that full-blood clan members enjoy.

    Chiropteran
    This Thinblood discipline calls on the vampire’s strong affinity to bats, allowing her to move through the air and summon swarms.

    Mentalism
    This Thinblood discipline allows the vampire to manipulate objects through telekinesis - allowing them to even pull weapons from enemies’ hands.

    Nebulation
    This Thinblood discipline allow the vampire to call on her affinity to mist, allowing her to summon and command it.

    They're actually doing marketing, wonders never cease!

    9LlOwgn.png
    Well, good morning. Welcome to the new scenario. What should we do today?
    Zombie GandhiDarkPrimus3clipsejdarksunFencingsaxDemonStaceyFleebElvenshaeKoopahTroopahAegisFiatilKristmas KthulhuMoridin889Rchanen
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Thinblood... Clan?

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
  • jdarksunjdarksun Scion of Chaos Registered User regular
    Thinblood... Clan?
    Sure, why not? You're too thin blooded to exhibit clan traits, and didn't the thinbloods tend to stick together?

    I was FILLED WITH HYPE upon receiving this email, not gonna lie.

    So six clans? Thinblood + five others? Anybody else think that the Chiropteran / Mentalism / Nebulation thing is a hint? Feels sort of Gangrel / Tremere / Nosferatu to me.

This discussion has been closed.