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Kerbal Space Progam: Rocket science is harder than it looks!

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Posts

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited August 2012
    anyone else abuse the fuel bug to make silly easy rockets? I just sent a kerbal to the Mun and back using nothing but a single seat command pod, the small fuel tank, 3 landing legs, and an air spike engine.
    basically the way fuel use is calculated is bugged atm,instead of the throttle being a percentage, it uses the square of the throttle. so the throttle at barely on uses something 1/100th of the fuel it should.

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited August 2012
    So, general question: has anyone actually gotten MechJeb to take them to Minmus via translation? Without manually correcting?

    Because the same thing always happens: the latest version of the program does a two-point plan--first, get you an orbit that puts you at distance with Minmus, then attempt a course correction to compensate for Minmus not being on the equator.

    Funny thing about that, when it completes the first step, it can't use time acceleration (because the spacecraft is accelerating). Which you can't resume without disarming MechJeb (thereby breaking the course planning). And rather than wait two and a half days in real time, your best bet is to course correct manually (which thankfully doesn't need much fuel for a small rocket).

    Synthesis on
  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    Hnmm, It doesn't do that when I use mechjeb.

    when I go to Minimus(and the mun it works the same way for me) this is my usual plan:

    1: use ascent autopilot to get into a 100km orbit of kerbin
    2: press the transfer to Minimus button on the orbital operations box
    3: the transfer drops me in a spot that will intercept minimus and get picked up by it's gravity, than I accel time until I reach about 200km altitude
    4: use the circularize orbital operation to get a nice orbit at 100km or so
    5: pick out a nice spot with the landing computer, press land at target, and hope it's not too hilly so I won't tip over.

    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Weird. I guess it depends on luck. I've never seen MechJeb correct for Minmus' non-equatorial orbit (since I haven't been willing to wait for a few days).

  • The DeliveratorThe Deliverator Slingin Pies The California BurbclavesRegistered User regular
    edited August 2012
    So the full info for the planets they're adding in 0.17 is looking pretty cool. http://i.imgur.com/gy0i3.jpg *linked for bigness* It's going to be fun (and hard) attempting all kinds of interplanetary missions. Having to work things in a whole extra SoI is going to be a challenge for sure.

    The Deliverator on
  • bamjobamjo Registered User regular
    Wow that is the first I've heard of new planets/moons. They look amazing! It will be nice to have some kind of mission goals in the game too. I like self imposed goals to a point, but it gets boring after a while.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    It's great, though it's sad that temperatures won't make a difference for a while.

    Still, IVA views? Much appreciated. The Prometheus Rover mod already has camera views, so i guess it was about time though,

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    Foomy wrote: »
    Hnmm, It doesn't do that when I use mechjeb.

    when I go to Minimus(and the mun it works the same way for me) this is my usual plan:

    1: use ascent autopilot to get into a 100km orbit of kerbin
    2: press the transfer to Minimus button on the orbital operations box
    3: the transfer drops me in a spot that will intercept minimus and get picked up by it's gravity, than I accel time until I reach about 200km altitude
    4: use the circularize orbital operation to get a nice orbit at 100km or so
    5: pick out a nice spot with the landing computer, press land at target, and hope it's not too hilly so I won't tip over.

    That's pretty much what I do, but with a smaller orbit on Minmus (I think I did about 10km). The only problem I had was having to wait in real time for it to do the actual landing, which probably took about 20 minutes since I couldn't accelerate time. I could accelerate fine up until I got into Minmus orbit, though. Once mechjeb got me on a trajectory to intersect the planet, it turned my engines off.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Weird. I'm using the same version of MechJeb. Not sure whats causing the issue.

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    It's possibly something in the rocket design, I guess.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    I doubt it, since I've attempted this on a variety of designs (at least, things that have any chance of getting to Minmus).

    Unless the programming's stages are determined on some minute issue of design. It seems far more likely that it's randomized, or maybe based on some tiny difference of what operations it was running before you activate translation.

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    I guess I should mention that I don't let it automate stages, only throttle. Not sure if that matters.

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited August 2012
    Anyone got a link to a mod with a 3m(or is it 2m? whatever the larger size is) tri-coupler? I try and keep mostly stock for my play, but one of those would be super useful. And trying to search for a single part in the add-on forums is near impossible I'm finding.

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    So I just got the full game, what part kits should I download? Also besides MechJeb any other addons?

    Steam ID: Webguy20
    Origin ID: Discgolfer27
    Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    I guess I should mention that I don't let it automate stages, only throttle. Not sure if that matters.

    Weird....I may just have a case of brain fart, here, but I don't recall there being a stage option for orbital translation. There's one for ascent, certainly.

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I guess I should mention that I don't let it automate stages, only throttle. Not sure if that matters.

    Weird....I may just have a case of brain fart, here, but I don't recall there being a stage option for orbital translation. There's one for ascent, certainly.

    Yeah, I think you're right. Just throwing it out there, though.

  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    I swear, playing this game is a series of "Oh wait that works? I can do that? Well that makes it easier"

    Like, for any new players having problems?

    1: Liquid engines need gas, solid boosters don't use fuel
    2: Support struts hold stuff together
    3: You have to turn on the SAS systems to do anything
    4: The green circle on the ball is prograde, the green circle with an x through it is retrograde.
    And here's the one I just learned today:
    5: RCS can be manually piloted, they're not just for making turning easier. This makes Mun landings a million times easier.

  • striderjgstriderjg Registered User regular
    edited August 2012
    ello thread. After having my eye on this game for awhile, I finally got it yesterday and promptly stranded one of my kerbals in orbit:) Today I designed a rescue ship and attempted to retrieve him..... things didn't go as planned:)

    Spoilered for big
    Go Away! No room. Catch the next one!
    AE82DC4A114336AF0E56A0E28171180E2BF197C0

    So I though... hmmmm maybe I can bring him out of orbit on the outside since re-entry heat doesn't seem to be modeled yet and don't know what kinda grip he's got:)
    Sorry dude!
    2E787DC7720F36681DB91069FDB703F72E663209

    Heh:) Is there as of yet a way to launch a 3 person command module with only 2 crew?:)

    striderjg on
    steam_sig.png
  • ILMTitanILMTitan Registered User regular
    You could just have a crew member exit the module while still on the launchpad.

  • striderjgstriderjg Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    ah... hadn't thought of that. Good idea:) Time to design RescueBoat mk3.
    Thanks:)

    striderjg on
    steam_sig.png
  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    striderjg wrote: »
    ah... hadn't thought of that. Good idea:) Time to design RescueBoat mk3.
    Thanks:)

    Just remember that 3-man rockets are harder to build and get right than 1-man.

    My first rescue mission I stranded 2 extra dudes.

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    One mod I really love is Kerbal Engineer Redux. it lets you see a lot of really useful stats while you build your rocket in the hanger, and the one i love it most for is thrust to weight ratios per stage.

    it really helps me get out of that "add more fuel, add more engines, add more stages" loop when making some designs, more is not always better.

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • striderjgstriderjg Registered User regular
    That mod sounds REALLY interesting Foomy. Definitely checking it out. One of my major gripes is the lack of information conveyed in the ui. Both in building and flying.

    As for my kerbal lost in space.... Got him:)
    B6FF4B12CE4247E3BF37BA5F0E631440155B2311
    Was reallly tricky as I had degraded Bob's orbit and Pe was in the atmosphere so was making it almost impossible to match orbits till I realized those jet packs are STRONG! Raised Bob's Pe with his pack then got him pretty easy. Over engineered the rocket as I was bringing a lot of fuel to try to get the orbits worked out. Precarious to launch but it got them there:)

    steam_sig.png
  • striderjgstriderjg Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    Weird bug.
    FB9B39A425226E83510CD8DDF4B177CF2D3AED3A
    Ladder and struts went funky. The ladder was confirmed fine before launch as I eva'd on the pad to make sure the ladder was setup correctly.
    And jebediah knocked it over getting out but was able to stand up with rcs rockets.
    DF1B5652DE7E72E4DD325BCE76465A1F318E9A81

    striderjg on
    steam_sig.png
  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I guess I should mention that I don't let it automate stages, only throttle. Not sure if that matters.

    Weird....I may just have a case of brain fart, here, but I don't recall there being a stage option for orbital translation. There's one for ascent, certainly.

    So I played this some yesterday. While looking around, I noticed that mechjeb said it would have a problem with translation if your inclination and eccentricity wasn't near 0. So if you aren't using the ascent module or are very, very good, that could be your problem.

    I also worked on a redesign of my current rocket to cut down on weight. I realized if using mechjeb, I'll have to be very careful with solid boosters because with the current design, I guess it can't compensate so if I set it for a 100k orbit, I end up with almost 600k before the solid boosters stop, then it just circularizes that. I'll have to play with it.

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    try changing your ascent path to something that turns at a lower altitude, or a sharper turn. Or just set it to manual stages if your having trouble with mechjeb and solid boosters.

    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • DrovekDrovek Registered User regular
    Finally took the plunge and bought it. Getting used to the new options and balance (at least it feels a bit different from the demo, Solid Boosters at least do feel with a bit more oomp.)

    Trying to get used to it, more or less. Getting orbits is easy... getting orbits with enough fuel to do anything but reentry is not.

    Also, planes!

    (Can't wait for the next patch with planets and shit... though I maybe should focus on the mun?)

    steam_sig.png( < . . .
  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    I think the closer I've ever gotten a pair of modules was still around 4000 meters.

    Orbital rendezvous, even in rockets that are too tiny to carry and meaningful payload aside from their crew and are very maneuverable, is beyond my abilities. Color me impressed.

  • Sir CarcassSir Carcass I have been shown the end of my world Round Rock, TXRegistered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    I think the closer I've ever gotten a pair of modules was still around 4000 meters.

    Orbital rendezvous, even in rockets that are too tiny to carry and meaningful payload aside from their crew and are very maneuverable, is beyond my abilities. Color me impressed.

    Yeah, I assumed mechjeb would do this until I actually got into orbit and then couldn't find it. Kinda surprised that it doesn't.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    I think the creator of MechJeb openly acknowledged that the rendezvous function does not work--the best bet is the rendezvous option in the ascent program, and even that is very haphazard. Given MechJeb's ability to calculate things is still much less than the actual computers in the 1960s could, that doesn't surprise me too much.

  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    Argblarg. I am so bad at this, but I want to not be bad at this. I can consistently land on the Mun with a single kerbal rocket, but the stupid three-man fuel tanks are just too damn heavy for me to get much further than orbit. Also when I say "land" I mean there's a greater than even chance I'll botch the landing even with sufficient fuel.

    I am bad at space.

  • DrovekDrovek Registered User regular
    Well, I just barely managed to land today. Mostly vertical, controlled fall into the Mun (not sure if there's a better landing technique, maybe there is.)
    BEB5572BC23688F889905BD3C024540B7231A9D8

    A (very slightly modified version of this) took me there:
    CAFF489672307252551D5EEFA62E5E7E524CE4EA

    I'll toy around for a bit and ready up the trip back and hero reception.

    Meanwhile, at the base:
    680E7637B95D47F2975C9D76C28F17616DF84C2F

    steam_sig.png( < . . .
  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    Looks like I need more boosters. Lots, lots more boosters.

  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    edited September 2012
    By the way, the crappy shitty tiny engine that doesn't matter?

    Great for moon landings and takeoffs. Even with just a small fuel tank.

    I just created a fantastic rocket in 3 main stages. Boosters+Liquid engines. Then Boosters. Then Boosters, and boosters.

    2nd stage is for retrograde rocket and setting up the Mun landing. I jettison at 2500m and use the itty-bitty engine with a small fuel tank for landing. Then I use RCS to fine-tune the land. After that, it's a burn+RCS to take off, one orbit around the Mun, and back to Kerbin orbit. Then landing with the parachute.

    Also, if you add more boosters, remember support struts.

    My old munshot rocket was 2 main stages. But it sucked to turn.

    Khavall on
  • KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    Drovek wrote: »
    Well, I just barely managed to land today. Mostly vertical, controlled fall into the Mun (not sure if there's a better landing technique, maybe there is.)
    BEB5572BC23688F889905BD3C024540B7231A9D8

    A (very slightly modified version of this) took me there:
    CAFF489672307252551D5EEFA62E5E7E524CE4EA

    I'll toy around for a bit and ready up the trip back and hero reception.

    Meanwhile, at the base:
    680E7637B95D47F2975C9D76C28F17616DF84C2F

    For a single-pilot rocket, the smaller SRB is all you need. Also, advanced Canards generate some lift, as I understand. The Command and Control Winglet is the only thing you need. Also, the thinner fuel tanks are best for one-person rockets, the thicker ones for 3.

    My current munshot rocket which I'm thinking of extending to Minmus has 3 main stages.

    1st is boosters+3 Liquid engines/3tanks each without thrust vectoring. I have some RCS fuel and rockets, but I'm thinking of removing them because I don't need them that much. This stage is for getting into a good orbit at whatever altitude.
    2nd is 1 Liquid engine with some wings and 2 liquid fuel tanks. 2nd also has the ASAS. 2nd is for establishing the munshot orbit and applying initial retro-thrust. It jettisons at 2500m over the mun.
    3rd is the lander Landing gears, itty bitty engine, tiny fuel tank, RCS. It's just there to land and go back to Kerbin. If Minmus orbit can't be broken with it, I'll adjust it, but for munshots it's more than fine.

    As an example, here's my munshot lander:

    screenshot17w.png


  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    Those sure are some complicated rockets, more is not always better.

    this is my favorite Mun/Minimus Lander design, gets into a 100km orbit of kerbin with about 3k L of fuel left in the booster stage, so enough to get the translation burn to mun/minmus and usually enough to circularize around them, leaving the top fuel tank fuel for a return:
    e5sjb.jpg

    this is the build:
    stage 0: parachute / 3-man capsule / decoupler / some flood lights
    stage 1: fl-t16 fuel tank / 6 lander legs / more lights / Lv909 engine / decoupler / 2x telus lv ladders
    stage 2: 2x fl-t32 tanks / fl-t16 tank / lvt30 engine / 6 radial decoupler
    stage 3: 12x fl-t32 tanks / 6x lvt30 engine

    and than you just need to do the usual build technique of strapping every tank to each other, and the tanks to decouplers etc. You want your rockets to have as little wobble as possible, when in doubt add more struts.

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Is it still possible to not have a parachute? Or has the complexity changed enough that there's just no way to build a rocket that can land on the Mun, then back on Kerbin on a column of flame?

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    with the right design and good fuel management you can still do it. even easier if you don't have the fuel bug fixed (there's a mod that fixes the problem until 1.7 comes out)
    I just find it way easier to use a parachute, plus I enjoy they way they look.

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Well, the only reason I did it was because I had run out of things to do in the free version. So I modified my most successful rocket and almost landed back on the launch pad. I drifted a bit too far west and was worried about fuel, so I touched down just off the flat square of land that the pad is on.

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    edited September 2012
    if your still on the demo version and need a new challenge(or this one is fun on full too), you can try building a rocket with nothing but RCS thrusters. A person or 2 over on the KSP forums have managed to get orbit with one.

    other fun things to try include:
    only SRBs for a mun and back trip (I keep trying this one and failing)
    Flying a plane around the world
    making a hovercraft (air engines only, fly no higher than 10m above the ground)
    Helicopters (you mount engines so they spin you, and use wings are the roter blades for lift)
    seeing how far a single un-piloted srb can go in distance (so you command pod must be left on the launchpad)

    Foomy on
    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
This discussion has been closed.