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IGN's top 10 game franchises that jumped the shark.

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    DondumsDondums Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Mattie wrote: »
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    If any series has jumped the shark, it's Final Fantasy. Wake me up when FF12 is over, seriously. That game would do better as a narcotic.

    Seriously. When i read that #1 was predictable i said "final fantasy".

    I am ashamed that isnt on the list.

    Just curious, when did you think FF jumped?

    IX

    Aw, IX's my favorite one. Now I feel guilty. :(

    I liked IX. I'd think FFX-2 would be where the series jumped the shark, though FFXII seemed to be a very good start towards veering the series in the right direction (though this 3 versions of FFXIII is kind of throwing me off) - then again, I haven't beat FFXII yet (~40 hours in), so unless it goes drastically downhill, I doubt my opinion of the game, or the series, will change.

    EDIT: and by the above post's qualifications, Sonic jumped the shark and well-deserved its spot at number one on IGN's list. Sonic 3 and Knuckles is the highpoint of that series for me. It makes me giddy.

    Dondums on
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    Eight RooksEight Rooks Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I think some people here arn't quite getting the meaning of "jumped the shark."

    The phrase does not simply mean going from great to suck, it implies a change in the overall feel, usually by taking something so far as to be silly. For example, Sonic jumped the shark once the number of playable characters shot through the roof and you played as Sonic for like an hour, and humans started appearing.

    FFIX adheres to the cliches of FF so much that it cannot possibly have "jumped the shark." Perfect Dark Zero didn't radically change the franchise, the quality was just lower, so it too doesn't qualify.

    Like I said, neither are IGN. Dynasty Warriors doesn't qualify by those criteria.

    Eight Rooks on
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    DusdaDusda is ashamed of this post SLC, UTRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    yalborap wrote: »
    Dusda wrote: »
    Why isn't Perfect Dark on the list?

    Because while PD0 is not as good as PD, it certainly does not require jumping over sharks.

    Also because PD spans all of two games.

    The fustrating thing about Sonic is that it's so easy to fix. Every fan with half a brain could make a better 3d Sonic than Sega has, even without resorting to Secret Rings style rails.
    *shrugs* PD0 seems like it just killed the franchise for me. Joanna Dark went from being a mature, confident female protagonist to a poppy Barbie doll with a machine gun. Blugh.

    Dusda on
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    yalborapyalborap Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Dusda wrote: »
    yalborap wrote: »
    Dusda wrote: »
    Why isn't Perfect Dark on the list?

    Because while PD0 is not as good as PD, it certainly does not require jumping over sharks.

    Also because PD spans all of two games.

    The fustrating thing about Sonic is that it's so easy to fix. Every fan with half a brain could make a better 3d Sonic than Sega has, even without resorting to Secret Rings style rails.
    *shrugs* PD0 seems like it just killed the franchise for me. Joanna Dark went from being a mature, confident female protagonist to a poppy Barbie doll with a machine gun. Blugh.

    She was younger and less mature. That's what happens when you do a prequel, your characters go from mature and confident adults to stupid kids.

    yalborap on
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    EtchEtch Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Halfmex wrote:

    9. Um...what? The only thing Street Fighter suffers from is a lack of anything new being released in years. Still, the Alpha series and SF I-III (with their little "-edition" updates) are all solid games. Has there been a shitty SF game?

    Street Fighter: The Movie: The Game

    Etch on
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    kriegskriegs Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm confused by this little bit on Turok:

    "When Acclaim hit a financial iceberg, it appeared Turok would be put to rest. Not so. Disney Interactive is reviving the franchise."

    Disney Interactive? Wtf? Are they gonna include... The Land Before Time characters in it?

    kriegs on
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    HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Etch wrote: »
    Halfmex wrote:

    9. Um...what? The only thing Street Fighter suffers from is a lack of anything new being released in years. Still, the Alpha series and SF I-III (with their little "-edition" updates) are all solid games. Has there been a shitty SF game?

    Street Fighter: The Movie: The Game
    That had so little to do with the series that I don't believe it qualifies. Plus I don't think Capcom had anything to do with it, did they? I can't remember.

    Edit: Evidently they published it, Incredible Technologies developed it. Meh, either way I still don't consider it canon to the series.

    Halfmex on
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    darunia106darunia106 J-bob in games Death MountainRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm just surprised that a development company for a movie studio known for family entertainment is now developing a game that lives in infamy as one of the first senseless killing games. I mean, primitive type characters shooting dinosaurs with crossbows and advanced weaponry? What the heck were they smoking?

    darunia106 on
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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    kriegs wrote: »
    I'm confused by this little bit on Turok:

    "When Acclaim hit a financial iceberg, it appeared Turok would be put to rest. Not so. Disney Interactive is reviving the franchise."

    Disney Interactive? Wtf? Are they gonna include... The Land Before Time characters in it?

    I read Turok as Truck.

    Maybe Disney just wants to stop making only kids games.

    Couscous on
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    ToadTheMushroomToadTheMushroom Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Id love a Turok/Disney cross game like Kingdom Hearts.

    Cerebral Bore'ing Mickey, while Minnie lies over his body crying tears of blood, then Rex comes along and you gut him like a fish.

    ToadTheMushroom on
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    BubbaTBubbaT Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    I think some people here arn't quite getting the meaning of "jumped the shark."

    The phrase does not simply mean going from great to suck, it implies a change in the overall feel, usually by taking something so far as to be silly. For example, Sonic jumped the shark once the number of playable characters shot through the roof and you played as Sonic for like an hour, and humans started appearing.

    FFIX adheres to the cliches of FF so much that it cannot possibly have "jumped the shark." Perfect Dark Zero didn't radically change the franchise, the quality was just lower, so it too doesn't qualify.

    So would that be X-2 or XI?

    One takes the series from its roots of epic, world-saving quest to virtual dressup Jpop concert. The other completely drops one of the series' signatures of a melodramatic narrative to enter the neverending story genre of the MMO.

    And missing from the list is a series that, while never as big as a Street Fighter or Megaman, jumped as hard as anyone else up there - Dead or Alive.

    BubbaT on
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    jclastjclast Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    BubbaT wrote: »
    I think some people here arn't quite getting the meaning of "jumped the shark."

    The phrase does not simply mean going from great to suck, it implies a change in the overall feel, usually by taking something so far as to be silly. For example, Sonic jumped the shark once the number of playable characters shot through the roof and you played as Sonic for like an hour, and humans started appearing.

    FFIX adheres to the cliches of FF so much that it cannot possibly have "jumped the shark." Perfect Dark Zero didn't radically change the franchise, the quality was just lower, so it too doesn't qualify.

    So would that be X-2 or XI?

    One takes the series from its roots of epic, world-saving quest to virtual dressup Jpop concert. The other completely drops one of the series' signatures of a melodramatic narrative to enter the neverending story genre of the MMO.

    And missing from the list is a series that, while never as big as a Street Fighter or Megaman, jumped as hard as anyone else up there - Dead or Alive.

    Hate the story all you want, but the dress up you speak of is actually a kickass job system.

    And I liked the mission-based gameplay. It's nice when RPGs try new things, even if they're not always the greatest thing since sliced bread (like FFVIII's junction system and level-with-you enemies).

    jclast on
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    SnorkSnork word Jamaica Plain, MARegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    eelektrik wrote: »
    While I agree that the recent Worms games havnt been nearly as good, IGN fails for mentioning Worms: Armegeddon in the same negative way as Worms 3D and so on. They fail so fucking hard.
    Fucking word. Worms: Armageddon was in my opinion, the peak of the franchise. The only thing Worms World Party added was a multiplayer mode that sucked slightly less. My friends and I still play Worms from time to time. Great game.

    Snork on
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    Vincent GraysonVincent Grayson Frederick, MDRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    A series can't have jumped the shark when the best game thus far was the most recent one, which is why Final Fantasy doesn't' belong anywhere near that list.

    Sure, it's had ups and downs over the years, but it's not as though the series was one huge upward slope and then a sudden drop in quality. Some of the games have been great, some have been ok, and some had been either bad, or so different that it turned a lot of people off, but either way, XII was so fucking awesome it hurts.

    Vincent Grayson on
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    GrimDog420GrimDog420 Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    street fighter 3rd strike, the last of the street fighters (not counting the ex, alphas and that shit) was easily the best in the series. i shit on ign

    GrimDog420 on
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    Psycho Internet HawkPsycho Internet Hawk Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    BubbaT wrote: »
    I think some people here arn't quite getting the meaning of "jumped the shark."

    The phrase does not simply mean going from great to suck, it implies a change in the overall feel, usually by taking something so far as to be silly. For example, Sonic jumped the shark once the number of playable characters shot through the roof and you played as Sonic for like an hour, and humans started appearing.

    FFIX adheres to the cliches of FF so much that it cannot possibly have "jumped the shark." Perfect Dark Zero didn't radically change the franchise, the quality was just lower, so it too doesn't qualify.

    So would that be X-2 or XI?

    One takes the series from its roots of epic, world-saving quest to virtual dressup Jpop concert. The other completely drops one of the series' signatures of a melodramatic narrative to enter the neverending story genre of the MMO.

    And missing from the list is a series that, while never as big as a Street Fighter or Megaman, jumped as hard as anyone else up there - Dead or Alive.

    Man, Dead or Alive has always been about silly crazy-ass shit like hot ninjas fighting commandos or whatever. It never jumped the shark because it was rediculous in the first place.

    Psycho Internet Hawk on
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    darunia106darunia106 J-bob in games Death MountainRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    BubbaT wrote: »
    I think some people here arn't quite getting the meaning of "jumped the shark."

    The phrase does not simply mean going from great to suck, it implies a change in the overall feel, usually by taking something so far as to be silly. For example, Sonic jumped the shark once the number of playable characters shot through the roof and you played as Sonic for like an hour, and humans started appearing.

    FFIX adheres to the cliches of FF so much that it cannot possibly have "jumped the shark." Perfect Dark Zero didn't radically change the franchise, the quality was just lower, so it too doesn't qualify.

    So would that be X-2 or XI?

    One takes the series from its roots of epic, world-saving quest to virtual dressup Jpop concert. The other completely drops one of the series' signatures of a melodramatic narrative to enter the neverending story genre of the MMO.

    And missing from the list is a series that, while never as big as a Street Fighter or Megaman, jumped as hard as anyone else up there - Dead or Alive.

    Man, Dead or Alive has always been about silly crazy-ass shit like hot ninjas fighting commandos or whatever. It never jumped the shark because it was rediculous in the first place.

    Wasn't the creator sued several times for sexual harrassment in the workplace?

    darunia106 on
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    slash000slash000 Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Street Fighter only had a few bad games; Street Fighter the Movie, and the 3D Street Fighter EX games, which were kinda mediocre.


    The only reason they've put SF on the list is because of its # of iterations. Big deal. I don't see each 'release' of SF as a 'new game' in the series, but as a remixing/rebalancing of the game in each 'subseries.'


    The fact is, besides Ex and The Movie, which really had nothing to do with Street Fighter proper, all of the SF games were extremely solid, really great games.

    Third Strike may have been the 'third SFIII,' but there's a reason that worldwide tournaments are still being held for it.

    The fact that SFII basically revolutionized the concept of a 'fighting game' back when it came out and became a worldwide phenomenon practically is a pretty impossible impact for ANY subsequent SF game to equal. The fact that SFIII is still a major force in the fighting game genre, however, is about as close as anyone could possibly hope for. There are still worldwide tournaments held for SFIII. Hell, SFIII:TS is one of of a few games that are holding what few arcades there are left in the USA alive.


    edit: I'm not saying SF should or should not be on the list. I'm just saying that it's not like the series was run into the ground.

    slash000 on
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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    If any series has jumped the shark, it's Final Fantasy. Wake me up when FF12 is over, seriously. That game would do better as a narcotic.

    Seriously. When i read that #1 was predictable i said "final fantasy".

    I am ashamed that isnt on the list.

    Just curious, when did you think FF jumped?

    Personally, 2.

    Realistically, summons and the ridiculousness that they and their ilk have become.

    edit: and cut scenes, god damn that is a lot of damn cut scenes.

    Goumindong on
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    slash000slash000 Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Based on the way they've qualified certain franchises to be on this list, they could have easily put just about any sports franchise on there and it would've been right at home.

    slash000 on
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    LewiePLewieP Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    slash000 wrote: »
    Based on the way they've qualified certain franchises to be on this list, they could have easily put just about any sports franchise on there and it would've been right at home.

    or, indeed 'EA'

    LewieP on
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    darunia106darunia106 J-bob in games Death MountainRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Goumindong wrote: »
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    If any series has jumped the shark, it's Final Fantasy. Wake me up when FF12 is over, seriously. That game would do better as a narcotic.

    Seriously. When i read that #1 was predictable i said "final fantasy".

    I am ashamed that isnt on the list.

    Just curious, when did you think FF jumped?

    Personally, 2.

    Realistically, summons and the ridiculousness that they and their ilk have become.

    edit: and cut scenes, god damn that is a lot of damn cut scenes.

    You think that's a lot? I turned in Metal Gear Solid: the Twin Snakes at Gamestop because it was 3/4 cutscenes!

    darunia106 on
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    darunia106darunia106 J-bob in games Death MountainRegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    LewieP wrote: »
    slash000 wrote: »
    Based on the way they've qualified certain franchises to be on this list, they could have easily put just about any sports franchise on there and it would've been right at home.

    or, indeed 'EA'

    darunia106 on
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    RainbowDespairRainbowDespair Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    The thing is that Final Fantasy isn't really a series in the sense that something like Metal Gear Solid or Dragon Quest is a series. Final Fantasy really just means "whatever big budget Fantasy/Sci-Fi RPG that Square wants to release." Sure there are a couple of minor connections like Chocobos and summons, but it was only fairly recently that the individual games in the series starting to become interconnected.

    And well, arguing about when FF jumped the shark (if it ever did) is pointless. You get a group of 6 RPG fans together and I can almost guarantee you that you'll get 6 different opinions on which Final Fantasies were great and which ones were weak.

    RainbowDespair on
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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    If any series has jumped the shark, it's Final Fantasy. Wake me up when FF12 is over, seriously. That game would do better as a narcotic.

    Seriously. When i read that #1 was predictable i said "final fantasy".

    I am ashamed that isnt on the list.

    Just curious, when did you think FF jumped?

    Personally, 2.

    Realistically, summons and the ridiculousness that they and their ilk have become.

    edit: and cut scenes, god damn that is a lot of damn cut scenes.

    You think that's a lot? I turned in Metal Gear Solid: the Twin Snakes at Gamestop because it was 3/4 cutscenes!

    I played through the first Xenosaga game... And i still think its a lot of cut scenes[though to be fair, i skipped each and every cut in Xenosaga when i finnaly went through it.
    The thing is that Final Fantasy isn't really a series in the sense that something like Metal Gear Solid or Dragon Quest is a series. Final Fantasy really just means "whatever big budget Fantasy/Sci-Fi RPG that Square wants to release." Sure there are a couple of minor connections like Chocobos and summons, but it was only fairly recently that the individual games in the series starting to become interconnected.

    And well, arguing about when FF jumped the shark (if it ever did) is pointless. You get a group of 6 RPG fans together and I can almost guarantee you that you'll get 6 different opinions on which Final Fantasies were great and which ones were weak.


    Which is irrelevent to whether or not it has jumped the shark.

    Goumindong on
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    MattieMattie Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    LewieP wrote: »
    slash000 wrote: »
    Based on the way they've qualified certain franchises to be on this list, they could have easily put just about any sports franchise on there and it would've been right at home.

    or, indeed 'EA'

    The brilliance of the skill stick in NHL 07 cancels any of the lameness in their other 07 sports titles.

    Mattie on
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    ToadTheMushroomToadTheMushroom Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    FF9 onwards has been a downhill slope in my opinion.

    I dont think too many people would argue otherwise. Maybe they would but who listens to raging FF fanboys anyways.






    j/k, seriously though, 9 and 8 were brilliant. The others I just dont 'get' at all. FFX-2 was garbage.

    ToadTheMushroom on
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    BiggNifeBiggNife Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    From what I've played of THP8, I like it a lot more than I did the Underground games. I dont see why IGN doesnt like it so much.

    BiggNife on
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    Zephyr_FateZephyr_Fate Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    darunia106 wrote: »
    Goumindong wrote: »
    If any series has jumped the shark, it's Final Fantasy. Wake me up when FF12 is over, seriously. That game would do better as a narcotic.

    Seriously. When i read that #1 was predictable i said "final fantasy".

    I am ashamed that isnt on the list.

    Just curious, when did you think FF jumped?
    VII, but picked up with IX, then went back down again.

    Zephyr_Fate on
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    PataPata Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    FFX-2 was garbage.

    FFX-2 has one of the best battle systems in any Final Fantasy game.

    Pata on
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    SnorkSnork word Jamaica Plain, MARegistered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Pata wrote: »
    FFX-2 was garbage.

    FFX-2 has one of the best battle systems in any Final Fantasy game.

    Too bad everything else about it was horrible.

    Snork on
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    PataPata Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    Snork wrote: »
    Pata wrote: »
    FFX-2 was garbage.

    FFX-2 has one of the best battle systems in any Final Fantasy game.

    Too bad everything else about it was horrible.

    What?

    Graphics are the same as FFX, AKA: Good.

    Music is decent, some tunes catchy, others meh. (You'll get tired of the battle theme)

    The story is... different. But it's not that bad. It's a story targeted at japansese girls. There are far worse.

    And it has New Game+, something that every RPG should have.

    Pata on
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    KorKor Known to detonate from time to time Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    When it comes to Sonic... there are soooo many things that could fix this series.

    1 - the writing. Now, I'm probably one a few people here that actually reads the archie comics for Sonic the hedgehog, and maybe its just me, but the plot points there are great. Sometimes a bit overdone, but there are gems that are awesome to find. For the game series... has it ever even been fucking explained why earth has furries co-existing with humans? Because the comic does a great job making that claim.

    2 - the cast. Fuck shadow. The whole rival hedgehog thing has been done since Sonic 2. Please put an end to it. Metal Sonic was okay, Mecha Sonic, better in his older incarnations, but Shadow, and now Silver? wtf? Bring me back some freedom fighters. Hell, everyone here pretty much agrees that the SatAM Sonic cartoon was the best. Why these characters never transfered over into the games, is still a mystery (sans Sonic Spinball).

    3 -the world. I don't understand why every single sonic has to be placed in some new location, or Hubs in the newer versions. I'd love to see a newer sonic have something of a world map, that is actually traversable, and I'd love to see plot based around these locations. I mean... as with all older games, levels were just tossed in as a sign of progression, and that was fine. In the newer games, tell us why those levels existed. I'd love to play a newer sonic game that for some story releated reason, forced me to go back to Chemical Plant zone, to dig up some of Robotnik's old research. You know, toss in a bit of nostalgia.

    4 -the gameplay. Now... you could (I stress could) have more than 1 playable character, and that would be fine. The older games did it well enough. However, if you do this, you need to limit the variations. Sonic 3 & Knuckles did it best. Each character had the same basic gameplay, but just enough variation to make you feel like you're playing a totally different game. Whereas making Shadow play EXACTLY like Sonic, Rogue like Knuckles, etc... This just makes things boring.

    Bah... I could rant on this for hours... but I'm gonna cut myself off here, as not to torture you guys.

    Kor on
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    FyreWulffFyreWulff YouRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited February 2007
    Final Fantasy jumped at 6.

    It went from a decent game series with good progression to a series with pointlessly long cutscenes, horrible writing, and too many emos.


    edit: this is including FF6

    FyreWulff on
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    TheySlashThemTheySlashThem Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    All in all, the only thing on the list I disagree with is them saying Worms: Armagheddon was a bad entry in the series.

    Other than that, it's pretty spot on.

    TheySlashThem on
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    Target PracticeTarget Practice Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    You know what this list is missing? King's Quest.

    It totally jumped the shark with The Princeless Bride.

    Target Practice on
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    cooljammer00cooljammer00 Hey Small Christmas-Man!Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    MegaMan Legends was pretty awesome, IIRC.

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    KorKor Known to detonate from time to time Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    MegaMan Legends was pretty awesome, IIRC.

    That it was.

    I had a hard time playing Legends 2 though... as Megaman was voiced by Sailor Jupiter...

    Kor on
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    SquashuaSquashua __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2007
    I'm sure someone said it, but I'm really surprised the Green Toy "Army Men" franchise series wasn't listed.

    Of course, "Army Men" has never been good, so maybe there was never a shark for them to jump over.

    Better off playing "Toy Commander" on the DC.

    Edit: Wow, no one said it.

    Squashua on
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    PataPata Registered User regular
    edited February 2007
    How the heck has Megaman "jumped the shark"?

    Pata on
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