Goshen College earns ironic hate and threats of violence.

Santa Claustrophobia

So a small Indiana college, Goshen, has decided they will no longer play The Star Spangled Banner before events. Goshen had actually not done so until March of 2010, but when they started playing the song, students and alumni of the predominantly Mennonite college objected. They felt the song glorified war and violence and being Mennonites, they didn't want to be associated with it.

So now they chose to play America the Beautiful instead.

And, of course, they aren't 'patriotic' anymore.

Who knew that a song many people don't know the words to could inspire such hatred for a small college filled with people whose faith stresses peace. Many of the comments on the Yahoo write up are truely inspiring. This one stands out:

They need to send in the national guard, Kent state style.

It's also ironic that every now and again, there is a movement in congress to change the national anthem from The Star Spangled Banner to America the Beautiful. Though it's usually because they want a song that actually uses the word 'America' in it.

glithert

Go jingoism!

moniker

America the Beautiful is a totes better song and should be our national anthem. The only problem is that it contains references to God and so should (though thanks to SCOTUS technically wouldn't) violate the establishment clause. The Star Spangled Banner sucks. Also too, our flag design is pretty mediocre.

Apothe0sis

The idea of singing any song, at all, before events is pretty stupid. The fact that it's the national anthem is doubly so.

dbrock270

Completely reasonable. I would see no reason why people would have a fuss over it.

Also, I don't read Yahoo news comments because they represent the lowest opinions and beliefs of humanity and make me want to say...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=35TbGjt-weA

Santa Claustrophobia

That it only started happening during World War II should give a clue about what it's for.

EDIT:
I only skimmed them because I knew such a story would provide a cornucopia of stupid. And I was not disappointed.

Sterica

I don't feel like the anthem glorifies war, but this doesn't even register a complaint. Much less fucked-up responses like the "Kent State Style" comment. What the fucking hell?

moniker

Apothe0sis wrote:

The idea of singing any song, at all, before events is pretty stupid. The fact that it's the national anthem is doubly so.

Eh, I don't know. Having a sort of universal prologue to public events seems useful.

wandering

I try not to think of dum-dums on the internet as real people.

moniker

Rorus Raz wrote:

I don't feel like the anthem glorifies war, but this doesn't even register a complaint. Much less fucked-up responses like the "Kent State Style" comment. What the fucking hell?

That's because you only ever hear the first stanza. Though even so, it literally just plays up the fact that we withstood a constant barrage of shelling. It's basically 'America! Shoot at us all you want, bitches, we're still here!'

Santa Claustrophobia

The Star Spangled Banner is notable as being one of the few (I'd once heard it was the only, but can't find any proof) national anthems that takes on a particularly violent bent. Most are about how beautiful or awesome the country is. Even the more martial anthems are pretty mild. The Soviet national anthem was pretty tame despite how angry it sounded.

I imagine the sort of people who are upset at this development are the same sort of people who bought those car flags years ago and drove around with it forever until it was dirty and ragged and then fell of the car when they forgot it was there.

Some symbols need more effort than 'just because' to be really meaningful.

Eat it You Nasty Pig.

The Star Spangled Banner is a much more interesting song than America the Beautiful and ought to remain the anthem for that reason alone

national anthems are mostly fucking boring, why can't we have a fun one

matt has a problem

moniker wrote:

America the Beautiful is a totes better song and should be our national anthem. The only problem is that it contains references to God and so should (though thanks to SCOTUS technically wouldn't) violate the establishment clause. The Star Spangled Banner sucks. Also too, our flag design is pretty mediocre.

The Star Spangled Banner does too, in the last verse though. And since no one knows more than the first verse, nobody cares.

Yougottawanna

The intelligence of people most likely falls along a normal distribution. The people on the way low end, like -1.96 z-score, somehow all find their way into the comments section of stories like that.

lonelyahava

I"m reading a book right now about the Chicago World's Fair in 1893 and how at the opening ceremonies for the fair, the crowd all sang "America the Beautiful" because that was what they thought the national anthem should have been.

You know, back before there was a decision made. For what it's worth, New Zealand's National Anthem is called "God Save New Zealand" and is sung first in English and then again in Maori. Which is really pretty to listen to.

dbrock270

Yougottawanna wrote:

The intelligence of people most likely falls along a normal distribution. The people on the way low end, like -1.96 z-score, somehow all find their way into the comments section of stories like that.

Because most people realize that no one gives two shits about what they have to think in a comment section. It's as bad as YouTube comments.

Jokerman

Cant this be our national anthem?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxiMrvDbq3s

Fencingsax

lonelyahava wrote:

I"m reading a book right now about the Chicago World's Fair in 1893 and how at the opening ceremonies for the fair, the crowd all sang "America the Beautiful" because that was what they thought the national anthem should have been.

You know, back before there was a decision made. For what it's worth, New Zealand's National Anthem is called "God Save New Zealand" and is sung first in English and then again in Maori. Which is really pretty to listen to.

Devil in the White City? great book.

Also, I have to agree that America the Beautiful would be a better Anthem, although there are a bunch of military anthems.

matt has a problem

Now I'm curious what a Jimi Hendrix at Woodstock version of America the Beautiful would've sounded like, had it been our national anthem.

dbrock270

Jokerman wrote:

Cant this be our national anthem?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wxiMrvDbq3s

lolwut. What's this thing he's talking about in this song? "This land is your land, this land is my land" is this guy implying that America is controlled by its citizens? wut.

In all seriousness, this should be our national anthem.

Lidjis

I am a Goshen College graduate. I would be happy to answer any questions any of you have if you are curious.

Muse Among Men

moniker wrote:

America the Beautiful is a totes better song and should be our national anthem. The only problem is that it contains references to God and so should (though thanks to SCOTUS technically wouldn't) violate the establishment clause. The Star Spangled Banner sucks. Also too, our flag design is pretty mediocre.

Finally! Someone understands me.

Kalkino

lonelyahava wrote:

I"m reading a book right now about the Chicago World's Fair in 1893 and how at the opening ceremonies for the fair, the crowd all sang "America the Beautiful" because that was what they thought the national anthem should have been.

You know, back before there was a decision made. For what it's worth, New Zealand's National Anthem is called "God Save New Zealand" and is sung first in English and then again in Maori. Which is really pretty to listen to.

God Save the Queen is also our national anthem as well. At my state school in the South Island we would alternate between the two.

Centipede Damascus

Mennonites are neat. My mother's side of the family is mostly Mennonite, actually. One of my uncles sat out Vietnam as a conscientious objector, and my grandfather sat out World War II. They're no less patriotic for their pacifistic views, and I'll punch anybody in the face who says otherwise.

enlightenedbum

Jokerman wrote:

Cant this be our national anthem?

*Woody Guthrie*

It would be the most depressing fucking anthem ever? I'm pro-"America the Beautiful," personally. I'm also a sucker for "The Battle Hymn of the Republic" but obviously it shouldn't be the national anthem.

Cinders

Stupid drinking song spin off national anthem

lonelyahava

Kalkino wrote:

lonelyahava wrote:

I"m reading a book right now about the Chicago World's Fair in 1893 and how at the opening ceremonies for the fair, the crowd all sang "America the Beautiful" because that was what they thought the national anthem should have been.

You know, back before there was a decision made. For what it's worth, New Zealand's National Anthem is called "God Save New Zealand" and is sung first in English and then again in Maori. Which is really pretty to listen to.

God Save the Queen is also our national anthem as well. At my state school in the South Island we would alternate between the two.

Yes. but I don't think they sing "God Save The Queen" in Maori. which makes it less nifty.

in my personal opinion.

Muse Among Men

The biggest knock against the current anthem is that no one can sing it. You need a hell of a singing voice to make it sound decent, while you need only an adequate voice for a decent rendition of America the Beautiful.ice for a decent rendition of America the Beautiful.

Apothe0sis

moniker wrote:

Apothe0sis wrote:

The idea of singing any song, at all, before events is pretty stupid. The fact that it's the national anthem is doubly so.

Eh, I don't know. Having a sort of universal prologue to public events seems useful.

How so?

Kipling217

If Bob Jones U gets to ban interracial dating, Goshen College can ban the National Anthem.

Besides everybody only knows 2 verses of the national anthem anyways: The first and the last. Inbetween they go nhur,nhur,nhur.

Ankh-Morpork had the right idea.

Quid

Apothe0sis wrote:

moniker wrote:

Apothe0sis wrote:

The idea of singing any song, at all, before events is pretty stupid. The fact that it's the national anthem is doubly so.

Eh, I don't know. Having a sort of universal prologue to public events seems useful.

How so?

Yeah, I find the song singing annoying.

lonelyahava

<insert idealistic pie in the sky in the following>

It's a good way to get everybody, at least for that moment in space, on the same page. Sure, you're rooting for the Phillies, and I'm cheering on the Mets, but at this point in time in space we can all get together and sing a song for the 3 minutes or so of your life that it takes. And then we can go back to throwing things at each other and booing.

Also, I have to admit it, the best part of going to the Orioles games growing up (other than watching Cal Ripken Jr play) was the end of the song where "oh say does that star..." part happens and everybody in the entire stadium shouts out "OH!" at the same time (because you know, Orioles.. O's... yeah ok hush it's fun).

Also, I have to say that I enjoy hearing the Star Spangled Banner played at the Olympics. I don't quite think that "America the Beautiful" will have that same stirring sound to it as the National Anthem is played when your athlete/team is on top of the podium. But again, I'm a crazy idealistic who likes to pretend that every once in a while people can stop arguing and get to one point together.

/end fantasy talk

dlinfiniti

what they need is a good fight song...
oh wa-...
nm

enlightenedbum

dlinfiniti wrote:

what they need is a good fight song...
oh wa-...
nm

I'm in favor of making "The Victors" the national anthem. :P

Gosling

I'd mainly be happy if fans half in the bag from tailgating didn't start cheering before the damn thing is over. If you're going to play the anthem, play the anthem. I don't want to hear peoplestart cheering at "banner yet wave" or "rockets' red glare" or drowning out the whole fucking thing I'm looking at you Bears fans.

Rhesus Positive

Santa Claustrophobia wrote:

The Star Spangled Banner is notable as being one of the few (I'd once heard it was the only, but can't find any proof) national anthems that takes on a particularly violent bent. Most are about how beautiful or awesome the country is. Even the more martial anthems are pretty mild. The Soviet national anthem was pretty tame despite how angry it sounded.

Sixth verse of "God Save the Queen":

Lord grant that Marshal Wade
May by thy mighty aid
Victory bring
May he sedition hush
And like a torrent rush
Rebellious Scots to crush
God save the Queen

Although it's not like anybody sings that verse, or any of them past the first. The second verse has bits about frustrating our enemies' knavish tricks, but that's not really violent and it's all about saving the Queen so it's more about self-defence.

StrayDog

Santa Claustrophobia wrote:

The Star Spangled Banner is notable as being one of the few (I'd once heard it was the only, but can't find any proof) national anthems that takes on a particularly violent bent. Most are about how beautiful or awesome the country is. Even the more martial anthems are pretty mild. The Soviet national anthem was pretty tame despite how angry it sounded.

Isn't La Marseillaise a violent song? Though, I always liked that scene from Casablanca.

Muse Among Men wrote:

The biggest knock against the current anthem is that no one can sing it. You need a hell of a singing voice to make it sound decent, while you need only an adequate voice for a decent rendition of America the Beautiful.ice for a decent rendition of America the Beautiful.

I always felt Star Spangled Banner was sang very poorly when sung solo. People always have to add in clumsy, exaggerated melismas. But I heard an Army choir's rendition and thought that was pretty awesome. I feel like it's a song that needs multiple people.


Edit - I could totally get behind Guthrie's This Land is Your Land. I don't find it depressing at all.

GoodOmens

Kipling217 wrote:

Besides everybody only knows 2 verses of the national anthem anyways: The first and the last. Inbetween they go nhur,nhur,nhur.

People know the last verse? I'm not even sure I've ever heard the last verse.

I'm completely in favor of America the Beautiful. Because, well, America is beautiful. Specifically, I think the official version should be sung by Ray Charles.

zeeny

Apothe0sis wrote:

The idea of singing any song, at all, before events is pretty stupid. The fact that it's the national anthem is doubly so.

We agree on so many things. We should make a shitload of babies to continue our work of posting THE WORD on internet forums, apo.

Nought

Lidjis wrote:

I am a Goshen College graduate. I would be happy to answer any questions any of you have if you are curious.

Why do you hate America?

Chanus

We should make our national anthem "My Country, 'Tis of Thee"!

Wait...