Posted two Sonic-related questions in the iPhone thread, but maybe I'll have better luck here:
So if you happen to own a console that can play Sonic CD, is there any benefit to getting the iOS version besides price?
I'm debating whether or not I would get an equal experience on the iPad 2. $5 is cheap, but $2 is cheaper.
Also can you turn off the d-pad/button labels on the screen?
Sega and Sonic All Stars Racing is now 99 cents, along with several other Sega games.
I have heard a lot of praise for this game, and I'm almost ready to dive in but....
Just to double check, it is good, right?
I mean, it's a Sonic spinoff game, so I have my doubts....
No benefit besides a slightly cheaper price and portability
I actually haven't tried to turn off my buttons on-screen, but I'd doubt it on the iOS version.
The console versions of Sonic Allstars racing was developed by Sumo Digital, who has a fantastic pedigree - they were originally Gremlin Graphics, who were probably the best and most consistent Amiga developer. They developed tons and tons of now-forgotten Amiga classics, but they're probably best known (pre-sega) for the Lotus Turbo Challenge series. Once they came to Sega, they cut their teeth porting Outrun 2, and have released a string of critically successful games under Sega.
Essentially, the big brother versions of the game comes from a very old, very quality developer. Now, the iOS version? That port was handled by Gameloft, who I'd consider one of the best iOS developers. I haven't actually played it, but considering the source material is great, and the people who handled the port are generally higher quality, I'd have to bet that there wouldn't be many other games that are more worthy of your $0.99 gamble.
EDIT: You know, it just hit me how perfect Gremlin coming to Sega was... their best known series was Outrun's main competition, and their second best known series, Zool, was Amiga's answer to Sonic.
I think I still have a copy of it for the genesis somewhere.
Zool 1, as a game, is awful. It's the worst kind of Sonic clone. Unfortunately, that's the one which was ported to just about eveything ever. Nearly everyone who has heard of Zool, remembers the series from Zool 1. Which is a shame, because the sequel, Zool 2, is a hell of a lot better in every way. It's more focused, it controls miles better, the way it handles speed is improved, the level layout is great, and the graphics and music are wonderful. I've played lots, and lots of Sonic clones before, and they all seem to focus on speed (without considering the sort of level design to facilitate it) and almost always ignore the aesthetics of the series, the abstract surreal atmosphere that the Sonic games had along with the synthy techno-pop music that accompanied it. Zool 2 nails those aspects of Sonic, with some of the best sonic-like music I've heard outside of a Sonic game.
The great thing about Zool 2 is that Gremlin seemed to keep working on Zool 2 post release. It was originally an Amiga 500 game, which featured solid gradients for backgrounds, then it was upgraded to AGA, where it kept the solid gradient backgrounds but added background objects to make it look prettier. Then it was ported to the Jaguar, where it ditched the solid gradient backgrounds and got flat image backgrounds. Then they made the final version, the CD32 version, which added a bunch of parallax scrolling and really fleshed out the backgrounds (which look very sonic-esq). My favorite level is level 2 (level 3 on the CD32, which included an extra stage at the beginning of the game) - Blueberry Hill. It's visually unlike any other Sonic level, looking kinda like a mashup of Gex and Rayman, but thematically it's basically Chemical Plant Zone with electricity.
Again, it's unfortunate that the very poor first game got ported everywhere, while the much superior sequel was pretty much Amiga exclusive, with the only 2 console ports coming to the Atari Jaguar (one of the few games on the system definitely worth picking up) and the CD32.
This game is beautiful with the Nostalgic filter turned on. I got up to Stardust Speedway before taking a break (mainly to switch the soundtrack to US for this level). So far I've had two deaths, two timestones and one good future! Sadly, this is the turning out to be best run I've ever had in Sonic CD. :P
Heads up guys - I got a USB converter for my Galaxy S Tab and tried plugging in a USB Sega Saturn pad, and it worked without configuration. Instantly recognized and mapped. If you have the ability to try a USB controller on your android device, definitely do, as it improves the game immensely.
First time through, got one good future and one time stone. But I didn't have to use any continues! And now Tails is mine. Still not sure which soundtrack I prefer--they're both excellent.
So I FINALLY got around to putting this on my phone (been playing the android port on my tablet) and was wonderfully surprised to see that it also includes keypad support. WASD for movement, the L key to jump. This makes playing the game with a wiimote mapped to a keyboard possible on any android device.
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Dark Raven XLaugh hard, run fast,be kindRegistered Userregular
So guys, as someone who grew up with Sonic, but never played CD, here's my impressions as a newcomer:
The boss fights are way too easy. Up until Metal Sonic. Then HOLY SHIT. It wouldn't be so bad if he was on a fixed route through the level, but he seems to speed up and slow down based on your progress, making it hard to judge when I should try to take the lead. Shouldn't complain I guess, cause he was a challenge for me, and that's what boss fights are for, right?
The Special Stages suck. I say this not only because I have failed each and every one, but also because they have really bad conveyance. Why does the timer suddenly speed up? That ain't cool, don't do that. The goal is not clear, and it's not as intuitive as the Sonic 1-3 special stages with their very clear goal.
The level design is great. I know this must be divisive, but I love it. It's more exploratory than the other classic games, BUT on the other hand, it is nigh impossible to intentionally time travel your first run through a level. You can luck into it, sometimes. But mostly it's a pain in the ass reaching and maintaining speed in these levels. Worst part is losing your opportunity and not being able to retrigger it by hitting a Time Post again. Hrrg.
Might sound like I'm baggin' on it a lot, but nope: I love CD. It's a great game, but I'm not sad I never got it earlier. The polish of this new release is great.
t is nigh impossible to intentionally time travel your first run through a level
As someone who knows Sonic CD inside and out, everything about this port is great, but it IS different from the original. Namely in the physics department - there are several locations where you can no longer time travel, where you could before. The best, easiest example to demonstrate this is in Palmtree Panic act 1 - in the Sega CD version, you can grab the past time post before the first loop and you will automatically time travel - you'll have enough speed and you'll activate the time travel before you have time to hit the ground. In this remake, Sonic is ever so slightly heavier, so that you reach the floor before you time travel. You now have to position yourself to bounce on a butterfry coming out of the loop.
it was much easier to manage your time travel in the original.
EDIT: And as for Metal Sonic - it's the very essence of Sonic the Hedgehog. As always, the high path is your best friend. Let him get ahead of you a bit and concentrate early on on using the super peel out on the tiny quarter pipes to shoot yourself high in the air. This will give you the opportunity to hit a floating platform on the pretty hard to reach upper path. if you get to this path, you're pretty much guaranteed to win, because metal Sonic can't hit you or catch up.
TheSonicRetard on
0
SteevLWhat can I do for you?Registered Userregular
Finally beat the game. I was doing good with getting perfect futures until world 3 or 4, then everything fell apart. And I got 4 time stones, but just couldn't get through the bonus stages after that (and sometimes, I couldn't even get TO the bonus stages). I guess that's what a second and third playthrough is for!
The Special Stages suck. I say this not only because I have failed each and every one, but also because they have really bad conveyance. Why does the timer suddenly speed up? That ain't cool, don't do that. The goal is not clear, and it's not as intuitive as the Sonic 1-3 special stages with their very clear goal.
The timer suddenly speeds up only if you touch the water. Also, when the timer falls below 20 seconds, an extra UFO appears in the middle of the stage. If you hit it, you get extra time.
One boss I have a rough time with is the pinball flipper boss. I just find the flippers don't seem as intuitive as those in other Sonic games...
It's funny, in the original game I was always able to get through that part in a few seconds. I had a difficult time navigating it in this version, and I'm starting to think it was from the changed physics that @TheSonicRetard mentioned earlier.
One boss I have a rough time with is the pinball flipper boss. I just find the flippers don't seem as intuitive as those in other Sonic games...
It's funny, in the original game I was always able to get through that part in a few seconds. I had a difficult time navigating it in this version, and I'm starting to think it was from the changed physics that @TheSonicRetard mentioned earlier.
That or I'm just rusty.
Hmm, interesting notion; I seem to recall having less trouble in the original as well.
Sega is looking to build on the momentum of Sonic Generations and Sonic CD with the next installment of Sonic 4, and the tiny bit of news revealed thusfar gives reason to be excited. Here's what we know so far:
-The sales of episode 1 caught Sega completely by surprise, and as such, episode 2 will be given a much bigger budget than episode 1, and a longer development cycle (approx. 2 years)
-The Sonic Rush engine is no longer being used, instead a "new" engine is being used for physics. Since no one picked it up, I'll mention that Sonic Generations 3DS had even better physics than the HD version, with much better rolling that is pretty similar to the genesis games.
-Tails joins Sonic in this game
-It shouldn't be any surprise to anyone who finished episode 1, but Metal Sonic is the main villain this time
-Completely new graphics engine - the Wii is no longer supported, and the graphics engine, along with the art style, is being completely revamped.
-Specific complaints have already been addressed - no more uncurling, no more wall-walking
-Due to all the changes in gameplay and graphics engine, this episode will not connect to Episode 1 ala Sonic & Knuckles. Essentially, this is a clean break from the previous game.
In addition, a completely worthless trailer has been released:
Sega is looking to build on the momentum of Sonic Generations and Sonic CD with the next installment of Sonic 4, and the tiny bit of news revealed thusfar gives reason to be excited. Here's what we know so far:
-The sales of episode 1 caught Sega completely by surprise, and as such, episode 2 will be given a much bigger budget than episode 1, and a longer development cycle (approx. 2 years)
-The Sonic Rush engine is no longer being used, instead a "new" engine is being used for physics. Since no one picked it up, I'll mention that Sonic Generations 3DS had even better physics than the HD version, with much better rolling that is pretty similar to the genesis games.
-Tails joins Sonic in this game
-It shouldn't be any surprise to anyone who finished episode 1, but Metal Sonic is the main villain this time
-Completely new graphics engine - the Wii is no longer supported, and the graphics engine, along with the art style, is being completely revamped.
-Specific complaints have already been addressed - no more uncurling, no more wall-walking
-Due to all the changes in gameplay and graphics engine, this episode will not connect to Episode 1 ala Sonic & Knuckles. Essentially, this is a clean break from the previous game.
In addition, a completely worthless trailer has been released:
Sega is looking to build on the momentum of Sonic Generations and Sonic CD with the next installment of Sonic 4, and the tiny bit of news revealed thusfar gives reason to be excited. Here's what we know so far:
-The sales of episode 1 caught Sega completely by surprise, and as such, episode 2 will be given a much bigger budget than episode 1, and a longer development cycle (approx. 2 years)
-The Sonic Rush engine is no longer being used, instead a "new" engine is being used for physics. Since no one picked it up, I'll mention that Sonic Generations 3DS had even better physics than the HD version, with much better rolling that is pretty similar to the genesis games.
-Tails joins Sonic in this game
-It shouldn't be any surprise to anyone who finished episode 1, but Metal Sonic is the main villain this time
-Completely new graphics engine - the Wii is no longer supported, and the graphics engine, along with the art style, is being completely revamped.
-Specific complaints have already been addressed - no more uncurling, no more wall-walking
-Due to all the changes in gameplay and graphics engine, this episode will not connect to Episode 1 ala Sonic & Knuckles. Essentially, this is a clean break from the previous game.
In addition, a completely worthless trailer has been released:
Since the Wii is out for Episode 2, is a WiiU version a possibility?
I would not doubt it. Also, expect there to be an Android version this time around.
0
Dark Raven XLaugh hard, run fast,be kindRegistered Userregular
edited December 2011
Guys, correct me if my thinking is wonky here, but...
Putting this much time and effort into building "Episode 2" seems like a bad idea. If it's on an all new engine, with a totally different art style and better physics? Then why name it Sonic 4: Episode 2? Why chain a fancy new game to a chain wreck?
I really hope they drop it, name it Sonic 5. Nothing good can come of the 4 title. It's not like a good second half will redeem the first. I'd actually rather they crank out a quickie second half of Sonic 4, then spend all this time and effort on a full on massive Sonic 5.
Guys, correct me if my thinking is wonky here, but...
Putting this much time and effort into building "Episode 2" seems like a bad idea. If it's on an all new engine, with a totally different art style and better physics? Then why name it Sonic 4: Episode 2? Why chain a fancy new game to a chain wreck?
I really hope they drop it, name it Sonic 5. Nothing good can come of the 4 title. It's not like a good second half will redeem the first. I'd actually rather they crank out a quickie second half of Sonic 4, then spend all this time and effort on a full on massive Sonic 5.
The game sold like crazy. It was in no way a "chain wreck" (I think you mean train wreck?)
It's named episode 2 because it's the second episode in a series, episode 1 ended with a cliffhanger.
In addition, a completely worthless trailer has been released:
Incorrect, good sir:
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mntorankusuI'm not sure how to use this thing....Registered Userregular
The name doesn't really matter, and it would be ridiculous to drop the second episode now when they already released the first one and promised another one such a long time ago.
What they really need to do is get the same people who designed the levels in Generations (HD) to do it here. Complain about the physics all you want, the real dealbreaker in Sonic 4 is the level design.
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Dark Raven XLaugh hard, run fast,be kindRegistered Userregular
The game sold like crazy. It was in no way a "chain wreck" (I think you mean train wreck?)
It's named episode 2 because it's the second episode in a series, episode 1 ended with a cliffhanger.
I haven't slept in some time! Yes, train wreck. ;D
I know it sold like crazy, but have you met a single person who rates it anywhere above the absolute worst 'classic' Sonic game? If people were satisfied with it, why all the talk about how far removed Episode 2 is from 1?
EDIT; to better state my position; How many people you think bought Sonic 4 because of it's nostalgia cred without any prior knowledge about it and were disappointed? I'm betting a lot! Think those same people will go buy Sonic 4: Episode 2? If they knew it was a clean break, they'd be more inclined, right?
Finally had time to beat this and Sonic Generations both this weekend. I agree it would have been awesome if Time Attack had let you pick Past/Future stages (also I think stage select should have been unlocked on your save file after beating the game like S3&K instead of an extra unlocked by Time Attack), but oh well.
I liked that they actually went through and made a bunch of new sprites for Tails. You know those ramps in Palmtree Panic where it looks like the camera rotates to follow Sonic from above as he runs through them? If you go back and jump down one of those ramps, Sonic has a special sprite for that, and they made one for Tails too instead of just defaulting to a regular airborn sprite. Heck, I'm surprised they made a rotate-off-the-spring sprite for Tails instead of just using his old one. They really put a lot of polish into that.
If I jam Sonic and Knuckles into my Xbox will it let me play Knuckles in Sonic CD, or just more blue sphere?
There are other secrets which haven't been revealed yet.
Speaking of polished extra characters, was this a hint at Knuckles DLC or just wishful thinking? Because I would totally pay a few dollars to add Knuckles to the game. When I was running through, I was actually trying to keep an eye out to see if there was anywhere it didn't look like he could go due to not being able to jump as high as Sonic, but most of that is negated by his wall climbing ability.
GamersGate has the PC version available for pre-order for $3.74. It says 3rd party account is required to play it, so I'm assuming that means this will be Steamworks?
Posts
Every time you ask it gets delayed some more.
This would not surprise me, but I can't help but ask, because I enjoyed Generations so much that I need a Sonic fix.
So if you happen to own a console that can play Sonic CD, is there any benefit to getting the iOS version besides price?
I'm debating whether or not I would get an equal experience on the iPad 2. $5 is cheap, but $2 is cheaper.
Also can you turn off the d-pad/button labels on the screen?
Sega and Sonic All Stars Racing is now 99 cents, along with several other Sega games.
I have heard a lot of praise for this game, and I'm almost ready to dive in but....
Just to double check, it is good, right?
I mean, it's a Sonic spinoff game, so I have my doubts....
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No benefit besides a slightly cheaper price and portability
I actually haven't tried to turn off my buttons on-screen, but I'd doubt it on the iOS version.
The console versions of Sonic Allstars racing was developed by Sumo Digital, who has a fantastic pedigree - they were originally Gremlin Graphics, who were probably the best and most consistent Amiga developer. They developed tons and tons of now-forgotten Amiga classics, but they're probably best known (pre-sega) for the Lotus Turbo Challenge series. Once they came to Sega, they cut their teeth porting Outrun 2, and have released a string of critically successful games under Sega.
Essentially, the big brother versions of the game comes from a very old, very quality developer. Now, the iOS version? That port was handled by Gameloft, who I'd consider one of the best iOS developers. I haven't actually played it, but considering the source material is great, and the people who handled the port are generally higher quality, I'd have to bet that there wouldn't be many other games that are more worthy of your $0.99 gamble.
EDIT: You know, it just hit me how perfect Gremlin coming to Sega was... their best known series was Outrun's main competition, and their second best known series, Zool, was Amiga's answer to Sonic.
I think I still have a copy of it for the genesis somewhere.
Zool 1, as a game, is awful. It's the worst kind of Sonic clone. Unfortunately, that's the one which was ported to just about eveything ever. Nearly everyone who has heard of Zool, remembers the series from Zool 1. Which is a shame, because the sequel, Zool 2, is a hell of a lot better in every way. It's more focused, it controls miles better, the way it handles speed is improved, the level layout is great, and the graphics and music are wonderful. I've played lots, and lots of Sonic clones before, and they all seem to focus on speed (without considering the sort of level design to facilitate it) and almost always ignore the aesthetics of the series, the abstract surreal atmosphere that the Sonic games had along with the synthy techno-pop music that accompanied it. Zool 2 nails those aspects of Sonic, with some of the best sonic-like music I've heard outside of a Sonic game.
The great thing about Zool 2 is that Gremlin seemed to keep working on Zool 2 post release. It was originally an Amiga 500 game, which featured solid gradients for backgrounds, then it was upgraded to AGA, where it kept the solid gradient backgrounds but added background objects to make it look prettier. Then it was ported to the Jaguar, where it ditched the solid gradient backgrounds and got flat image backgrounds. Then they made the final version, the CD32 version, which added a bunch of parallax scrolling and really fleshed out the backgrounds (which look very sonic-esq). My favorite level is level 2 (level 3 on the CD32, which included an extra stage at the beginning of the game) - Blueberry Hill. It's visually unlike any other Sonic level, looking kinda like a mashup of Gex and Rayman, but thematically it's basically Chemical Plant Zone with electricity.
Again, it's unfortunate that the very poor first game got ported everywhere, while the much superior sequel was pretty much Amiga exclusive, with the only 2 console ports coming to the Atari Jaguar (one of the few games on the system definitely worth picking up) and the CD32.
tl;dr: Zool 1 - trash. Zool 2 - pretty good.
Probably not until january.
I am giddy over the Sonic 4 Episode 2 info coming this week. Though my giddiness is based on the hope that it's going to use the Retro Engine.
The boss fights are way too easy. Up until Metal Sonic. Then HOLY SHIT. It wouldn't be so bad if he was on a fixed route through the level, but he seems to speed up and slow down based on your progress, making it hard to judge when I should try to take the lead. Shouldn't complain I guess, cause he was a challenge for me, and that's what boss fights are for, right?
The Special Stages suck. I say this not only because I have failed each and every one, but also because they have really bad conveyance. Why does the timer suddenly speed up? That ain't cool, don't do that. The goal is not clear, and it's not as intuitive as the Sonic 1-3 special stages with their very clear goal.
The level design is great. I know this must be divisive, but I love it. It's more exploratory than the other classic games, BUT on the other hand, it is nigh impossible to intentionally time travel your first run through a level. You can luck into it, sometimes. But mostly it's a pain in the ass reaching and maintaining speed in these levels. Worst part is losing your opportunity and not being able to retrigger it by hitting a Time Post again. Hrrg.
Might sound like I'm baggin' on it a lot, but nope: I love CD. It's a great game, but I'm not sad I never got it earlier. The polish of this new release is great.
Also US soundtrack is best.
As someone who knows Sonic CD inside and out, everything about this port is great, but it IS different from the original. Namely in the physics department - there are several locations where you can no longer time travel, where you could before. The best, easiest example to demonstrate this is in Palmtree Panic act 1 - in the Sega CD version, you can grab the past time post before the first loop and you will automatically time travel - you'll have enough speed and you'll activate the time travel before you have time to hit the ground. In this remake, Sonic is ever so slightly heavier, so that you reach the floor before you time travel. You now have to position yourself to bounce on a butterfry coming out of the loop.
it was much easier to manage your time travel in the original.
EDIT: And as for Metal Sonic - it's the very essence of Sonic the Hedgehog. As always, the high path is your best friend. Let him get ahead of you a bit and concentrate early on on using the super peel out on the tiny quarter pipes to shoot yourself high in the air. This will give you the opportunity to hit a floating platform on the pretty hard to reach upper path. if you get to this path, you're pretty much guaranteed to win, because metal Sonic can't hit you or catch up.
The timer suddenly speeds up only if you touch the water. Also, when the timer falls below 20 seconds, an extra UFO appears in the middle of the stage. If you hit it, you get extra time.
My Backloggery
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
It's funny, in the original game I was always able to get through that part in a few seconds. I had a difficult time navigating it in this version, and I'm starting to think it was from the changed physics that @TheSonicRetard mentioned earlier.
That or I'm just rusty.
My Backloggery
Otherwise, I'll just play the one in Sonic Gems.
Only two time stones thus far, it's fairly infuriating because I typically miss it by just one.
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Hmm, interesting notion; I seem to recall having less trouble in the original as well.
Of course, since you can switch physics...
I seem better able to do the special stages now, whereas before, not so much.
Might just be me, though.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
Ya hear me sonic team?
Sega is looking to build on the momentum of Sonic Generations and Sonic CD with the next installment of Sonic 4, and the tiny bit of news revealed thusfar gives reason to be excited. Here's what we know so far:
-The sales of episode 1 caught Sega completely by surprise, and as such, episode 2 will be given a much bigger budget than episode 1, and a longer development cycle (approx. 2 years)
-The Sonic Rush engine is no longer being used, instead a "new" engine is being used for physics. Since no one picked it up, I'll mention that Sonic Generations 3DS had even better physics than the HD version, with much better rolling that is pretty similar to the genesis games.
-Tails joins Sonic in this game
-It shouldn't be any surprise to anyone who finished episode 1, but Metal Sonic is the main villain this time
-Completely new graphics engine - the Wii is no longer supported, and the graphics engine, along with the art style, is being completely revamped.
-Specific complaints have already been addressed - no more uncurling, no more wall-walking
-Due to all the changes in gameplay and graphics engine, this episode will not connect to Episode 1 ala Sonic & Knuckles. Essentially, this is a clean break from the previous game.
In addition, a completely worthless trailer has been released:
http://imgur.com/w3u5i
Coming in 2012
Since the Wii is out for Episode 2, is a WiiU version a possibility?
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I would not doubt it. Also, expect there to be an Android version this time around.
Putting this much time and effort into building "Episode 2" seems like a bad idea. If it's on an all new engine, with a totally different art style and better physics? Then why name it Sonic 4: Episode 2? Why chain a fancy new game to a chain wreck?
I really hope they drop it, name it Sonic 5. Nothing good can come of the 4 title. It's not like a good second half will redeem the first. I'd actually rather they crank out a quickie second half of Sonic 4, then spend all this time and effort on a full on massive Sonic 5.
The game sold like crazy. It was in no way a "chain wreck" (I think you mean train wreck?)
It's named episode 2 because it's the second episode in a series, episode 1 ended with a cliffhanger.
What they really need to do is get the same people who designed the levels in Generations (HD) to do it here. Complain about the physics all you want, the real dealbreaker in Sonic 4 is the level design.
I haven't slept in some time! Yes, train wreck. ;D
I know it sold like crazy, but have you met a single person who rates it anywhere above the absolute worst 'classic' Sonic game? If people were satisfied with it, why all the talk about how far removed Episode 2 is from 1?
EDIT; to better state my position; How many people you think bought Sonic 4 because of it's nostalgia cred without any prior knowledge about it and were disappointed? I'm betting a lot! Think those same people will go buy Sonic 4: Episode 2? If they knew it was a clean break, they'd be more inclined, right?
I liked that they actually went through and made a bunch of new sprites for Tails. You know those ramps in Palmtree Panic where it looks like the camera rotates to follow Sonic from above as he runs through them? If you go back and jump down one of those ramps, Sonic has a special sprite for that, and they made one for Tails too instead of just defaulting to a regular airborn sprite. Heck, I'm surprised they made a rotate-off-the-spring sprite for Tails instead of just using his old one. They really put a lot of polish into that.
Speaking of polished extra characters, was this a hint at Knuckles DLC or just wishful thinking? Because I would totally pay a few dollars to add Knuckles to the game. When I was running through, I was actually trying to keep an eye out to see if there was anywhere it didn't look like he could go due to not being able to jump as high as Sonic, but most of that is negated by his wall climbing ability.