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Gay Gamers: Mario and Luigi are brothers?!
Threepio
New Westminster, BCRegistered User regular
New Westminster, BCRegistered User regular
A thousand pardons for the title.
An article was posted on Joystiq today regarding a first-of-its-kind exploratory study examining the sexuality of male gamers. One of the first goals of the study (according to Jason Rockwood, the study's author) was to prove that homosexual gamers exist; "Yeah, it sounds ridiculous, but that's where you have to start on something like this. This survey is an attempt to quantify the existence of an invisible minority."
Some of the most interesting results seem to be the "reverse bell curve" of the results determined by the Kinsey report; Kinsey (played by the devilishly handsome Liam Neeson, I might add) theorized that the sexuality of most of us can be represented as a bell curve with the majority falling in the middle between heterosexual and homosexual (the vaunted state of "bi-sexuality").
Gamers, on the other hand, seem to cluster towards either extreme - associating as either hetero or homosexual with very few identifying as bisexual.
Curious to say the least - it might also explain why gamers find it so easy to commit to a given platform. (zing! Oddly enough when I did a search for gay gamers to see if there was an existing thread the first thread that popped up was "Dude, show us your Wii-ness")
When asked where they would like to see more homosexual (lesbian or gay) or bisexual characters represented most gamers answered "I don't know" for the majority of genres (racing, action, MMORPG, fighting); however they answerd "I would liked to see more" to a large degree in RPG games.
It also appears that the largest representation of homophobia is dished and received in the form of the epithet "that's so gay".
Anywho, I know where I fall on the scale; in the time I've spent at PA it appears to be a fairly neutral place to be for anyone of any sexuality (maybe we're all just enlightened here... heh). Do you think this study has provided accurate results? Would you object to more "alternative lifestyle" (alternative to who?!) content in games? Do you "dis" people with "that's so gay"?
An article was posted on Joystiq today regarding a first-of-its-kind exploratory study examining the sexuality of male gamers. One of the first goals of the study (according to Jason Rockwood, the study's author) was to prove that homosexual gamers exist; "Yeah, it sounds ridiculous, but that's where you have to start on something like this. This survey is an attempt to quantify the existence of an invisible minority."
Some of the most interesting results seem to be the "reverse bell curve" of the results determined by the Kinsey report; Kinsey (played by the devilishly handsome Liam Neeson, I might add) theorized that the sexuality of most of us can be represented as a bell curve with the majority falling in the middle between heterosexual and homosexual (the vaunted state of "bi-sexuality").
Gamers, on the other hand, seem to cluster towards either extreme - associating as either hetero or homosexual with very few identifying as bisexual.
Curious to say the least - it might also explain why gamers find it so easy to commit to a given platform. (zing! Oddly enough when I did a search for gay gamers to see if there was an existing thread the first thread that popped up was "Dude, show us your Wii-ness")
When asked where they would like to see more homosexual (lesbian or gay) or bisexual characters represented most gamers answered "I don't know" for the majority of genres (racing, action, MMORPG, fighting); however they answerd "I would liked to see more" to a large degree in RPG games.
It also appears that the largest representation of homophobia is dished and received in the form of the epithet "that's so gay".
Anywho, I know where I fall on the scale; in the time I've spent at PA it appears to be a fairly neutral place to be for anyone of any sexuality (maybe we're all just enlightened here... heh). Do you think this study has provided accurate results? Would you object to more "alternative lifestyle" (alternative to who?!) content in games? Do you "dis" people with "that's so gay"?
Threepio on
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And he's really more of a parody than anything. Same with the salesmen.
Yes, I sometimes happen to say stuff like "that's so gay" (doesn't really happen often anymore tho). But it's just part of the vocabulary. When i say it there is no association to homosexuality.
Edit: I just realised the fact that gay characters in games are pretty much always an over-exagerated parody of homosexuality. There are some pretty flamboyant gays out there but that doesn't mean all gay game characters should be of the flaming "OMG I'M SOOOOOOO GAY" type.
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Izuna, the unemployed ninja, is secretly(ie: not in the american version) a lesbian, I believe.
I believe I shall be investing more time into this game now. :P
I've known other gay guys who play games as well, some are rather hardcore about it.
As for "that's gay" I, personally, never use the phrase. I stand by my old favorite, "that's retarded."
Just because there are so few gay/lesbian game characters out there doesn't mean they are bing prejudiced.
Just means, like the real world community, homosexuals are in the minority, and as such this will be reflected in the games.
In many games, you take on the role of a character, be it an FPS or an RPG or what. This character is your avatar in the world. If that character is gay, and you are not, it will not sit right. And vice versa.
It's such a non-issue that it seems almost pathetic that these people are trying to get publicity for something that is of no importance at all. It isn't that I feel homosexuals should not be represented, it just seems to me that even if they were, it wouldnt make any difference to me, other than I would prefer to play in the games a straight character like myself.
I dont know how they feel about this, but I don't understand what their 'endgame' target is. To have a load more gay characters represented in games. So what?
Just cause I don't want to play as a gay character in a game doesn't make me homophobic, it just means I prefer to play games where I can relate to the main character, either in reality or in aspiration (for example, most guys want to be a hero type badass a la God of War or Doom or something, even though they aren't one in real life)
Seems to me like this is publicity for publicitys sake. There is absolutely nothing wrong with gay people being underrepresented in gaming. It has nothing to do with the inherent social and political issues with being gay, it is just that the large majority of gamers are straight, and as such want to play a character that they can relate to.
A game like the Sims is good. As that allows full control over everything.
Sugar.
Dismayed By Humanity Since 1992.
Anyway, the earliest gay character I can think of is Tony in Earthbound. Beyond that, there's Joachim, the shopkeepers, and the acupuncturist from the Shadow Hearts series.
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Dismayed By Humanity Since 1992.
How can you express a preference for playing characters you relate to while simultaneously ignoring the desire of homosexual players to play characters they can relate to?
Frankly, as silent protagonists slowly disappear and cutscenes do more and more to separate the star of a game from the people who play them, I don't think the sexual preference of a main character (and especially not side characters) needs to adhere so strictly to the norm. The main character already doesn't have my name, distinguishing features, or voice, so one more difference won't really make a difference.
It'd be nice if we got to a point where we could choose a sexual preference for our characters in games that heavily emphasize romantic subplots (RPGs mostly, right?), but even at this point the games that even go so far as to let you choose a gender for your main character are few in number, Pokemon and KOTOR being the examples that immediately come to mind.
Eh, Kefka was just fucked-up in general. I don't think he was "meant to be" anything but insane.
Kefka always struck me as a sort of crazy jester character.
Speaking of Final Fantasy, I really enjoyed the fact that Kuja, despite being the most feminine male villain the series has ever seen, is also the most blatantly heterosexual. The man is attracted to, flirts with, and hits on Dagger at multiple points throughout the game.
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I loved the in-game conversation about him being bisexual.
My lady walks in, looks at it and proclaims, "That is very gay."
I agreed, couldn't figure out why I would want to keep playing it after solving the minigames, and returned it.
But if games were TRULY representative of the real world, 10 percent of all characters (be they main or secondary) would be gay. As it stands right now, the only ones people can think of are self-generated or parodies.
The fact that gay gamers exist isn't really interesting, but the treatment of sexuality in games certainly is, I'd say.
Oh, just because a guy wears makeup and a dress, he's fucked up.... you bigoted bastard! Just kidding
Dismayed By Humanity Since 1992.
These two are kicking my ass to hades on hard mode.
edit: better vid
Like, say, visible minorities? Makes me think of the Clerks Animated Series episode with Lando - our black friend!
What about Tomb Raider - you're not a woman, do you associate? Does it sit right?
I think Half Life 2 is a good example I can use to get my point over.
In that game, YOU are Gordon Freeman. It isnt like Halo where you play 'as' Master Chief. In HL2 you are put into the role of the main protagonist.
Now Alyx is the romantic interest here. Meaning Gordon is considered straight. Now what if Kleiner was the romantic interest. That would alienate a large amount of straight people who would feel uncomfortable at playing as a character who does not share their sexual preferences.
Now I recognise that gay people feel exactly the same way, that they dont feel comfotable playing a straight man in that game. But, if as a game designer you want to sell your game to the largest market, in the real world this is the straight market, not the gay market. It is a simple matter of numbers.
An ideal situation would be to have all characters asexual or have plotlines in the game to allow for both groups of people. However, realistically this is too time constraining and is not feasible to do. Hence why, if you are a game designer and have to plum for one route it would be the straight route, to cater for the largest market.
Just how most games are marketed towards men, most characters in games cater for the largest group of gamers, the straight people.
I think KOTOR is good, as is the Sims. In that they at least made your character have the option of being either. And certainly, in Mass Effect you can choose everything, as long as your name is Shepherd, which is ambiguous as to being either male or female.
I don't think it's any surprise that so few video game characters are anything other than run-of-the-mill hetero. If you want to sell a lot of copies of your game, you go out of your way to make it appeal to as many people as possible. You don't want to make any design decisions that might actively deter people from buying your game.
Imagine a heavily story-driven action game, in the vein of a Metal Gear Solid, that featured a homosexual protagonist.
Adolescent male 1: "Hey man, are you going to buy Game X? I hear it's got awesome guns and stuff."
Adolescent male 2: "No way, man, that game is for fags, didn't you hear?"
I'm not saying it's good or healthy that this hypothetical is so easy to dream up, but it is, and I'm sure a lot of publishers have thought of it too. It's not hard to imagine a publisher shooting down a design doc because they're worried about sexuality issues.
And what developer is going to go to bat for such a minor issue, anyway? I'm sure most developers, if not all, would feel that it's not worth losing a project over it.
So, I don't think we're really ever going to see games pushing the envelope on the sexuality issue. They'll probably lag behind the cultural curve for a good while.
What if Alyx was played by a rather good looking lad? And Kleiner was played by a raggedy old science woman spurned for her advances in the field with bosoms that had a half life (zing) of a decade ago?
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But I am not Gordon Freeman. The main character of the video game is Gordon Freeman. I am not a theoretical physicist. I failed chemistry and never even took a physics class in all my years of schooling.
I am not Gordon any more than I am Chrono, or Tir, or my kickass Tremere in Bloodlines.
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Zan... Zangief was gay?
It's all becoming clear now.
His "Dislikes" include beautiful young women.
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To clarify. Tomb Raider is also a good example. You control a female, Lara Croft. But unlike Half Life 2, you are mearley a 3rd person experience, not just in control but in plot. You don't play Lara Croft, you play 'as' Lara Croft. In that way, it doesnt matter if you are male or female, as you are simply controlling a character.
In HL2 you play Gordon Freeman. He doesnt speak, you have no 'cutscenes' and even the ones with dialogue you get to choose what to do, who to look at, where to stand.
There is a vast amount more of your own personality imprinted on the freeman character in HL2 than the Lara croft character in Tomb Raider.
My main point though is why should it matter. I mean, I dont know. Im straight. As a gay person, do you feel somehow offended because there arent enough gay characters in games. I think that it wouldnt bother me so much. Its just a matter of preference.
Im not calling for any sort of prejudice or segregation, but why should there be gays in games. I dont like that sort of 'forced' equality. By pointing out that there arent enough gays you create a situation where you are assuming they are not equal. If you truly believed both groups to be equal it wouldnt matter if either was represented.
Its a tricky subject, I know. And far be it for me to call myself an expert in any way. Im just musing on generalisations.
I just would prefer that sexual preference be left out of games, and the wider media such as films, for that matter. To me, there is no difference between a gay or a straight person, and by making that clear in a game would only worsen the situation. By which I mean, if a game calls for issues of sexual preference, then yes, representing both groups is fine.
But can you honestly name more than 5 games that actually have sex, or real relationships. Most games are racers, or shooters, or strategy. The small minority of games that would even have the opportunity to feature a gay person shouldnt have it forced on them. That would worsen the situation by making the gay character an anomaly, a 'token black guy' kind of scenario where there would obviuously be a big fuss about their sexuality.
To me it doesnt matter. Id prefer a character was well written, voiced well and integral to a complex and involving plot then simply 'the gay guy'. That said, both can go hand in hand.
Queers of War
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The trouble right now is that they aren't equal. I can name loads of well-developed, deep heterosexual characters. I can name two well-developed, deep homosexual characters. That's not equality. Am I saying "Every straight character must have an equal and opposite gay character"? No, because that'd be retarded. I'm saying "Hey, how about some gay characters that aren't blatantly offensive stereotypes."
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