I thought TP was supposed to be the last traditional Zelda?
That's how they get you to buy it.
"Make sure not to miss out on the last in the traditional Zelda game ever made! No really, look at what we're doing with the DS and Wii now! Motion Control, Mii's, casual support, and mini-games from here on out!" *
* made up quote from 2006.
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Even if they were tighter, the fact remains that motion controls will never be as responsive as just hitting buttons.
Probably true. But you could say the same about the D-pad being tighter and more responsive than an analog stick. And for fighting games most people still use the D-pad (at least I think this is true, it's been a while). At the same time the analog stick has expanded the scope of what you can *do* in games.
I encourage anybody who thinks this game can be done with a Classic Controller to actually try that set up in Dolphin. Zelda's combat is slower and more weighty than most action games, this is a design choice and they aren't going to ask for the response times of Ninja Gaiden.
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Magus`The fun has been DOUBLED!Registered Userregular
I wouldn't mind giving you more weapons to mess around with in the next game. Just using a sword (even an upgrading one) for an entire game gets kind of boring.
What would be kind of neat if the game treated the sword as just another item to equip, rather as the central default thing. And then introduce more combat-focus to their items, and introduce a FRIGGIN MAGIC WAND already.
Would be neat to see the sword being good for up close, fast combat and the wand or another item good for more deliberate, long distance combat.
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Magus`The fun has been DOUBLED!Registered Userregular
Give Link a dagger he can use in tandem with his sword. That would be neat.
I would love the hookshot to be brought back as an effective weapon in combat, say pulling in enemies far away (GET OVER HERE), and so on. Infact, a combo-style battle system which uses the gadgets in battle would be grand.
@Chen, 'cuz you wouldn't just point and shoot the wand. You would have to draw magic sigils in the air first to cast the spell or something. So it would be slower, but potentially more powerful than just shooting arrows. And you could maybe cast different spells based on elements or what have you. Or even spells that let you enchant objects and control them remotely, like the Dominion rod meets the beetle.
@Magus: dual wielding how? You only have one wiimote...
We've already got the bow for deliberate, long distance combat.
If there's one thing Nintendo tends to focus on really well, it's not being redundant about abilities - Link has one item for every situation, Samus has one beam for every situation, Mario's fireballs do different things from iceballs, which are different from the tail, etc.
I was talking about the Zelda game for the Wii U (the one that's obviously going to appear at some point).
They've said they want to keep Skyward Sword's control scheme in the future.
Personally, I'd like a dagger if they used it as an option over a shield and Link used it like parrying daggers were used historically. Less protection than a shield, but better parrying and such maybe.
@UncleSporky, Shooting arrows doesn't do the same thing as casting spells. I mean it's similar to like casting fireballs, but the effects from a magic wand could be much more diverse. In particular, imagine really involved wizrobe battles, where you'd have to counter their spells with spells of your own, or redirect their spells by wielding the wand a certain way.
It could *replace* the bow, of course. I wouldn't have a problem with that. I just like the idea of drawing sigils and having different spells.
@Magus, Aunoma has said the next Zelda game is going to use motion controls for combat again...
Qingu on
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Magus`The fun has been DOUBLED!Registered Userregular
Twinrova? Mirror Shield? Pong with Phantom Ganon? I can do this all day. :P
Not to mention that controlling a wand with the remote would look silly. Do you have to point at stuff? If so, won't Link have to stretch his arm to have a point of reference? If you push the a button, will it just shoot magic without any feedback? If not and you have to draw something, how will it determine the trajectory when you draw the spell without z-targeting?
You know how you have to draw the sigils to imprison the Imprisoned? In order to cast a spell, you'd have to first draw that spell's sigil in the air to "activate" it. So to start drawing, you just hold down A and then it would work like drawing those Imprisoned sigils. Once you've drawn a sigil, the spell is active and your wand glows a certain color.
Then to actually cast the spell, well, it could depend on the spell. If you've drawn the sigil for "fireball," you could just point and shoot like the bow. Or you could fling the wiimote to "throw" the fireball, like the whip controls, or blow it like the gust jar. It could be different for each spell, or you could cast the same spell in different ways. But it would be slower than just firing an arrow or throwing out the whip, because of the prelimary sigil-drawing step—so you'd have to be much more deliberate about timing your attacks. You might even have to use quicker attacks, from a sword or arrows, to wear down your opponent into a defensive position to give yourself time to cast a more powerful spell.
Reflect spells could simply work like the mirror shield in the Twinrova battle, but they could also be more complex and require you to hold the wand at certain angles, or gesture in certain ways, to reflect a given spell. Like if a wizrobe casts a lightning bolt at you, you would have to quickly gesture in a zigzag pattern to effectively absorb/reflect the lightning.
Another approach to reflecting spells: holding the wiimote straight out forward would put the wand in a neutral "defensive" position where it automatically absorbs spells cast against it (think how Obi Wan absorbs Sith lightning with his lightsaber, or Harry Potter drawing in Voldemort's lightning bolt). BUT—once you absorb a spell, you have to quickly gesture a certain way to redirect or reflect it, otherwise it still explodes in your face.
There's other options for a magic wand item, too. Spells don't just have to be attack/defend. There could be a teleport spell. Draw a sigil, point the remote, POOF, you disappear and reappear where you're pointing. There could be a telekinetic spell, where you draw a sigil and then your remote works like the gravity gun from that one game. Stuff like that gets complex, however, because you then have to design your levels around the option of teleporting/throwing environmental objects around.
But there's no end to the fun that could be had with a damn magic wand. This is why I want to play the next game as Zelda where the wand is the main weapon.
So I've been fucking around on my brother's wii shop trying to get his netflix to update and I noticed that SS has a save file patch for the glitch. Pretty cool.
I was wondering about this. Could I download the patch now, or is it meant to only work on a save that's corrupted?
You've basically described the Move game Sorcery, Qingu.
Well that's exciting. (Just watched a video)
Doesn't look as good* as a Zelda game would be, though. And no drawing sigils to cast spells! That would be half the fun. And I didn't see anything about reflecting enemy spells or interacting with their attacks. It just looks like you dodge what they throw at you, and you can mix your "magic missile" with effects like flame and ice. Still cool looking though.
*Edit: I mean, tight in the controls, the animation—it looks a lot choppier than Zelda does.
I'm avoiding this thread as much as I can to avoid any SS spoilers (I have gone full dark on this game....won't even watch any TV commercials that pop up), but I wonder if this is the most negative commentary I've seen in the game? Everywhere and everyone else has basically been all "Best Zelda Evar!!!11", minus GiantBomb as everyone besides Patrick hates Japan.
The controls are a learning curve, but there's also this excitement you simply do not get with traditional controls when they work. I love doing the spinning slash as I always imagine doing a "Hulk busting out of chains" motion. And since that same motion is used to break Link from being webbed, I think that was the intent.
Anyway, it always puts me on a rage when people like GAF sing WW's praises. I don't hate the game, but whenever I don't see any of the criticisms that seemed so obvious to me get brought up, I feel shut out.
As I mentioned in my blog, the main theme felt like I was having my ear holes raped. And it was all because of the instrumentation.
I like the original, MIDI music has a certain charm to it and it doesn't sound too high pitched to me. Wind Waker probably has the best overall presentation of the series.
I'm avoiding this thread as much as I can to avoid any SS spoilers (I have gone full dark on this game....won't even watch any TV commercials that pop up), but I wonder if this is the most negative commentary I've seen in the game? Everywhere and everyone else has basically been all "Best Zelda Evar!!!11", minus GiantBomb as everyone besides Patrick hates Japan.
The controls are a learning curve, but there's also this excitement you simply do not get with traditional controls when they work. I love doing the spinning slash as I always imagine doing a "Hulk busting out of chains" motion. And since that same motion is used to break Link from being webbed, I think that was the intent.
Anyway, it always puts me on a rage when people like GAF sing WW's praises. I don't hate the game, but whenever I don't see any of the criticisms that seemed so obvious to me get brought up, I feel shut out.
As I mentioned in my blog, the main theme felt like I was having my ear holes raped. And it was all because of the instrumentation.
I mean, I'm not some orchestral snob who demands real instruments all the time, but the original was clearly too high pitched and annoying.
Sure, it's just an opinion, I'm just bummed that I'm apparently the only one who felt this way.
Have you heard a tinwhistle? It is a very shrill thing. That is what they used in Wind Waker (or a MIDI version of it). In the 25th Anniversary compilation they used a flute.
So after doing that Hero Mode run I've come to really hate the constant item messages. They really need to tone that down for the next Zelda game. It still is my favorite 3D Zelda game, probably because my first was TP so I don't have the Ocarina nostalgia glasses. Overall? I still think LTTP is my favorite just because there's SO many dungeons and you spend so much time in them instead of running around an overworld. This is probably why I don't like Minish Cap that much. I know people love their sandboxes and all, but I just hope the next Zelda apes some stuff from Metroid Prime's map design and integrates it into what they got here in SS. I love what they did here but I wish the zones were connected.
So uh, how do you download the Zelda fix off the Wii?
It's trivial to avoid the gamebreaking bug. Here, I'll give you a clue. I promise this won't spoil anything important.
At a certain point in the game, after the 6th dungeon, you will have to find three parts of something. Don't go to the desert region first.
Well I managed to download it anyway, so might as well patch it to be safe.
Only question is...if I patch my save before I get to that point, will I future proof my game? Or do I have to get the bug first and the fix it by patch?
what I want from the next 3d Zelda - a large(r) and connected overworld, more towns/npcs/sidequests, new weapons/items that can be used as weapons (probably not going to happen because of motion+), more complicated puzzles (I liked most of the SS dungeons, but they were all rather on the easy side), no more duplicate bosses and midbosses (yes, that irked me), and Zelda playing a more active role (or maybe even team her up with Link, like in ST)
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That's how they get you to buy it.
"Make sure not to miss out on the last in the traditional Zelda game ever made! No really, look at what we're doing with the DS and Wii now! Motion Control, Mii's, casual support, and mini-games from here on out!" *
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
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I really loved the gyro aiming in OOT3D, so yeah they better bring it back.
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Would be neat to see the sword being good for up close, fast combat and the wand or another item good for more deliberate, long distance combat.
Steam Profile | Signature art by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass
He would dual wield it with the sword. Use it for cool looking attacks or something, would just be there for a 'Oh, neat' factor.
Steam Profile | Signature art by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass
@Magus: dual wielding how? You only have one wiimote...
If there's one thing Nintendo tends to focus on really well, it's not being redundant about abilities - Link has one item for every situation, Samus has one beam for every situation, Mario's fireballs do different things from iceballs, which are different from the tail, etc.
Steam Profile | Signature art by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass
I meant as a more common thing.
What I would like is to wield a spear. Not those unwieldy ones in WW, but one you can actually keep and joust with. On Epona.
They've said they want to keep Skyward Sword's control scheme in the future.
Personally, I'd like a dagger if they used it as an option over a shield and Link used it like parrying daggers were used historically. Less protection than a shield, but better parrying and such maybe.
It could *replace* the bow, of course. I wouldn't have a problem with that. I just like the idea of drawing sigils and having different spells.
@Magus, Aunoma has said the next Zelda game is going to use motion controls for combat again...
Steam Profile | Signature art by Alexandra 'Lexxy' Douglass
Not to mention that controlling a wand with the remote would look silly. Do you have to point at stuff? If so, won't Link have to stretch his arm to have a point of reference? If you push the a button, will it just shoot magic without any feedback? If not and you have to draw something, how will it determine the trajectory when you draw the spell without z-targeting?
You know how you have to draw the sigils to imprison the Imprisoned? In order to cast a spell, you'd have to first draw that spell's sigil in the air to "activate" it. So to start drawing, you just hold down A and then it would work like drawing those Imprisoned sigils. Once you've drawn a sigil, the spell is active and your wand glows a certain color.
Then to actually cast the spell, well, it could depend on the spell. If you've drawn the sigil for "fireball," you could just point and shoot like the bow. Or you could fling the wiimote to "throw" the fireball, like the whip controls, or blow it like the gust jar. It could be different for each spell, or you could cast the same spell in different ways. But it would be slower than just firing an arrow or throwing out the whip, because of the prelimary sigil-drawing step—so you'd have to be much more deliberate about timing your attacks. You might even have to use quicker attacks, from a sword or arrows, to wear down your opponent into a defensive position to give yourself time to cast a more powerful spell.
Reflect spells could simply work like the mirror shield in the Twinrova battle, but they could also be more complex and require you to hold the wand at certain angles, or gesture in certain ways, to reflect a given spell. Like if a wizrobe casts a lightning bolt at you, you would have to quickly gesture in a zigzag pattern to effectively absorb/reflect the lightning.
Another approach to reflecting spells: holding the wiimote straight out forward would put the wand in a neutral "defensive" position where it automatically absorbs spells cast against it (think how Obi Wan absorbs Sith lightning with his lightsaber, or Harry Potter drawing in Voldemort's lightning bolt). BUT—once you absorb a spell, you have to quickly gesture a certain way to redirect or reflect it, otherwise it still explodes in your face.
There's other options for a magic wand item, too. Spells don't just have to be attack/defend. There could be a teleport spell. Draw a sigil, point the remote, POOF, you disappear and reappear where you're pointing. There could be a telekinetic spell, where you draw a sigil and then your remote works like the gravity gun from that one game. Stuff like that gets complex, however, because you then have to design your levels around the option of teleporting/throwing environmental objects around.
But there's no end to the fun that could be had with a damn magic wand. This is why I want to play the next game as Zelda where the wand is the main weapon.
I was wondering about this. Could I download the patch now, or is it meant to only work on a save that's corrupted?
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Doesn't look as good* as a Zelda game would be, though.
*Edit: I mean, tight in the controls, the animation—it looks a lot choppier than Zelda does.
The controls are a learning curve, but there's also this excitement you simply do not get with traditional controls when they work. I love doing the spinning slash as I always imagine doing a "Hulk busting out of chains" motion. And since that same motion is used to break Link from being webbed, I think that was the intent.
Anyway, it always puts me on a rage when people like GAF sing WW's praises. I don't hate the game, but whenever I don't see any of the criticisms that seemed so obvious to me get brought up, I feel shut out.
As I mentioned in my blog, the main theme felt like I was having my ear holes raped. And it was all because of the instrumentation.
I mean, just compare this:
to this:
I mean, I'm not some orchestral snob who demands real instruments all the time, but the original was clearly too high pitched and annoying.
Sure, it's just an opinion, I'm just bummed that I'm apparently the only one who felt this way.
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Skyward Sword's music was like manna from heaven for me.
I also think the new guy's compositions are just better than Kondo's. Per game at least.
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Have you heard a tinwhistle? It is a very shrill thing. That is what they used in Wind Waker (or a MIDI version of it). In the 25th Anniversary compilation they used a flute.
edit: An example of tinwhistle play, I'd say Wind Waker's MIDI adaptation's pretty damn good.
So nice I'm gonna give you the full version.
Well I managed to download it anyway, so might as well patch it to be safe.
Only question is...if I patch my save before I get to that point, will I future proof my game? Or do I have to get the bug first and the fix it by patch?
Blog||Tumblr|Steam|Twitter|FFXIV|Twitch|YouTube|Podcast|PSN|XBL|DarkZero
what I want from the next 3d Zelda - a large(r) and connected overworld, more towns/npcs/sidequests, new weapons/items that can be used as weapons (probably not going to happen because of motion+), more complicated puzzles (I liked most of the SS dungeons, but they were all rather on the easy side), no more duplicate bosses and midbosses (yes, that irked me), and Zelda playing a more active role (or maybe even team her up with Link, like in ST)