In the Inquisitor table top game, one of those guys in power armor was more then a match for a seasoned Inquisitor and a 4 man retinue, armed to the teeth.
I can only imagine what a first company terminator could do.
I miss 2nd edition 40k, where like, the first scenario mission they recomend is 30 gretchin versus like 5 space marines. Back then space marines did cost 30pts if memory serves, but they could also rapid fire their bolters at any range, and throw frag grenades.
Inquisitor on
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UtsanomikoBros before DoesRollin' in the thlayRegistered Userregular
edited March 2007
Yeah, but a Gretchin is to this day a 3-point little goblin-idiot, so it's hardly a change in the tabletop wargame.
I was about to say something about the ability to adjust roleplaying games for XP, encounters, etc to factor in uber character, but suddenly I had the thought: What if they did let in super-strong, fast, and skilled Space Marines and monster characters, but didn't[/]i balance them for individual strength and simply adjusted their rewards and leveling based on that?
Picture players queueing up to enter a zone of the game, say a planet like Armageddon. You've got 100 Guardsmen, maybe 60 Ork players, and a max of 10 Space Marines, Chaos Marines, and such each. I recall the upcoming OFPS 'The Crossing' that used this concept, where PvP players played a wholly different style of game from 'single players' who would pop in to do their own solo quests and kill PvPers like they were NPCs, forcing PvP players to team up if they wanted to beat the overpowered SPers.
The problem with this for 40k, as mentioned, is that 4/5 of people will just want to be Marines. You'd never get enough of anyone else to fight unless the ranks were filled out with NPCs. In which case the design is that much closer to simply being a squad vs squad tactial MMO.
Everyone will probably be playing one of the "hero" type classes, or one of the upgraded unit types.
how could you possibly represent something like a farseer in game terms though?
"i can see thousands of years into the future, kill armies with a stare and create a psychic storm to melt tanks
lf2m abaddon pst"
Warlocks/Spiritseers.
Exarchs.
Stay away from autarchs and farseers.
FarseerBaradas on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
edited March 2007
Anyone who would not play this game because race X isn't playable is a fucking tool.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
Goomba for mentioning DoW balancing six very different races.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
Also: Can't you set up PvP like a server in a regular pew pew per-se? Except instead of making each character start level one, let them keep their aggregate stats and re-define them into the PvP enviro so that they don't have to start as level 1 chars again? Because, I mean, as much as I love being a Nazi in WWII, I just want to shoot a bitch in the face. If I play WH40k and, even though I am a fanatic for the Orks, the hell wouldn't I want to be given the chance to play as a Guardsman every once an a while?
Anyone who would not play this game because race X isn't playable is a fucking tool.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
Goomba for mentioning DoW balancing six very different races.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
The fact that every race in the Alliance isn't twice as strong as every race in the Horde?
SMs really aren't that bloody fantastic. A well placed shot WILL kill one. A squad might be hard to take down, but that's morale and yadda. Guardsmen in a group can kill a group of marines. It's all about HOW you use your guys, not "LOL LOL CHARGE THE MARINES."
EDIT: Like I said for PvP, refer to my edited idea. It may be a shitty start, but it's a better start than "DOOOOOOMED"
Here's an idea. Make it like Eve. You earn points through battle and whatnot. A marine body costs you 15 points, that IG conscript body will cost ya 2 points. When you die, you have to buy a new one. So save up and go Marine or just go with a lesser body. Wargear will also cost you more points. Want that shiny powerfist, thats another 15 points.
Though the downside is that this would kind of encourage cowardism, which is kinda the anti-thesis of the whole universe.
Simpsonia on
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ZimmydoomAccept no substitutesRegistered Userregular
Anyone who would not play this game because race X isn't playable is a fucking tool.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
Goomba for mentioning DoW balancing six very different races.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
The fact that every race in the Alliance isn't twice as strong as every race in the Horde?
SMs really aren't that bloody fantastic. A well placed shot WILL kill one. A squad might be hard to take down, but that's morale and yadda. Guardsmen in a group can kill a group of marines. It's all about HOW you use your guys, not "LOL LOL CHARGE THE MARINES."
EDIT: Like I said for PvP, refer to my edited idea. It may be a shitty start, but it's a better start than "DOOOOOOMED"
I don't think you understand. Being true to oft-inconsistent background fiction that is frequently ignored by its own authors is more important than having fun.
Zimmydoom, Zimmydoom
Flew away in a balloon
Had sex with polar bears
While sitting in a reclining chair
Now there are Zim-Bear hybrids
Running around and clawing eyelids
Watch out, a Zim-Bear is about to have sex with yooooooou!
0
Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Here's an idea. Make it like Eve. You earn points through battle and whatnot. A marine body costs you 15 points, that IG conscript body will cost ya 2 points. When you die, you have to buy a new one. So save up and go Marine or just go with a lesser body. Wargear will also cost you more points. Want that shiny powerfist, thats another 15 points.
Though the downside is that this would kind of encourage cowardism, which is kinda the anti-thesis of the whole universe.
Dying while in an enemy base will net you five points IF killed by an enemy and IF you have at least severely injured/killed an enemy or done something useful.
Zen Vulgarity on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
I don't think you understand. Being true to oft-inconsistent background fiction that is frequently ignored by its own authors is more important than having fun.
Tyranids? More like Zerg rush kekekekekekekeke ^________^
m i rite?
(please don't hurt me)
I like the idea of controlling a squad of characters (like Granado Espada), which makes it seem a little more true to the tabletop. I also hope it is similar to what WAR is trying to do with a strong focus on PVP and warfare.
endlosnull on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
Tyranids? More like Zerg rush kekekekekekekeke ^________^
m i rite?
(please don't hurt me)
I like the idea of controlling a squad of characters (like Granado Espada), which makes it seem a little more true to the tabletop. I also hope it is similar to what WAGGGHHH is trying to do with a strong focus on PVP and warfare.
Anyone who would not play this game because race X isn't playable is a fucking tool.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
Goomba for mentioning DoW balancing six very different races.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
The fact that every race in the Alliance isn't twice as strong as every race in the Horde?
SMs really aren't that bloody fantastic. A well placed shot WILL kill one. A squad might be hard to take down, but that's morale and yadda. Guardsmen in a group can kill a group of marines. It's all about HOW you use your guys, not "LOL LOL CHARGE THE MARINES."
EDIT: Like I said for PvP, refer to my edited idea. It may be a shitty start, but it's a better start than "DOOOOOOMED"
I don't think you understand. Being true to oft-inconsistent background fiction that is frequently ignored by its own authors is more important than having fun.
Didn't you know that?
Ignore the background and it might as well not be 40k
bongi on
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Der Waffle MousBlame this on the misfortune of your birth.New Yark, New Yark.Registered Userregular
Anyone who would not play this game because race X isn't playable is a fucking tool.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
Goomba for mentioning DoW balancing six very different races.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
The fact that every race in the Alliance isn't twice as strong as every race in the Horde?
SMs really aren't that bloody fantastic. A well placed shot WILL kill one. A squad might be hard to take down, but that's morale and yadda. Guardsmen in a group can kill a group of marines. It's all about HOW you use your guys, not "LOL LOL CHARGE THE MARINES."
EDIT: Like I said for PvP, refer to my edited idea. It may be a shitty start, but it's a better start than "DOOOOOOMED"
I don't think you understand. Being true to oft-inconsistent background fiction that is frequently ignored by its own authors is more important than having fun.
Didn't you know that?
Obviously.
It can't be the fact that one of the major themes of the setting is that individuals do not matter in the least. While we're getting a game in a genre where the hallmarks tend to be patting the players on the back and telling them that THEIR CHARACTERS ARE GREAT HEROES!
It can't that xenophobia is not only an unwritten rule, but often completely necessary. Alliances with anyone not at least vestigially related to your species don't happen unless in the most desperate situations. Here, we have a genre where what once was one of the better game settings get butchered by it's own creators so that all races fit into a nice, tidy two-sided "Good vs. different kind of good" system.
It definitely can't be the idea of turning what's essentially a century of training and genetic modification into an even match for a space-redneck with a lasgun in the name of trite balance.
It can't be the fact that, while DoW's races were balanced, they still followed the basic guidelines of their Tabletop equivalent.
Oh no.
It's all because we don't like the idea of the shoulderpad fetishists strapping on a boltgun and going "WHEE!" while they kill their first Grox.
Collect 10 skulls for the skull throne, and return to me when you are done your task.
I don't think anyone in their right mind wants that kind of MMO for 40k.
I don't think 40k can become an MMO at all.
I never thought Warcraft could become a decent MMO. Ever.
I still don't think it is, but it's damn popular.
Yeah, but Warcraft is like, one of the most generic settings ever created (but it has a great art style!).
lol lol big mens in suits pew pew robots
Good, now collect some blood for the blood god, and return to me when you are finished.
WAGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
So you want another taste, huh? Looks like the Chaplain thinks you're ready for another task. Deliver this Eldar phylactery to Apothecary Edmund, 2000 meters away. But watch out for space rats! FOR THE EMPEROR!
UtsanomikoBros before DoesRollin' in the thlayRegistered Userregular
edited March 2007
Unless THQ shows off something unique or specially tailored to the setting, I can't see it being appealing to anyone outside that 'big men in suits pew pew' crowd.
De-emphasising the background, making more artwork generic and less gritty, and promoting Marines so much was a big mark on 40k during the late 90s through early 2000s. I for one couldn't give much of a damn until I started seeing art for the 4th ed rulebook and the miniatures finally looked like stuff from the good artists like Paul Daiton, Kopinski, and John Blanche.
It's not doomed, it's just highly unlikely they'll take the route of really using Warhammer as more than 'WWII-ish space opera lol' and just reel in generic gamers with the generic tired-and-true MMORPG design. Or 10 Marines Counter-striking 10 Orks over and over.
Utsanomiko on
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ViscountalphaThe pen is mightier than the swordhttp://youtu.be/G_sBOsh-vyIRegistered Userregular
I think someone else already said it but an MMO Planetside style based on the Horus Heresy would be brilliant - you don't have as many balancing issues to deal with and you have more freedom to be inventive as it's a less discussed period in the timeline. I guess the one problem is that the outcome is already set in stone but due to the scale of the 40K universe you could easily invent a campaign that occured during the Heresy.
Plus the Heresy is in many ways more interesting than the "modern" setting, partly due to the emphasis on humanities issues with itself.
I don't get the inquisitor idea - I mean how many inquisitors would you ever have in one place at one time? not a MMO's worth.
Also, they could just buy a copy of gears of war, change the models a bit and you're done!
Firstly, I haven't played 40k since the moment third edition came out. I have nothing against the later editions, but unfortunately all my friends who played did. That being said, when I did play I knew the game back and front, so with the exception of necrons, tau and dark eldar I know race backgrounds pretty well.
The point of me saying that is to address the complaints about how 'space marines would be totally overpowered'.
If I recall correctly, space marines aren't BORN space marines. They start as plebs. Normal humans. They become space marine scouts by winning tournaments or proving their valour in some other way, then have a gene-seed implanted in them.
What I'm saying is this: Human at level 1. scout at level 20, marine at level 40, terminator at level 60?
What would be wrong with that as long as other races had a similar progression?
Ie: guardian - aspect warrior - exarch - phoenix lord
and if anyone thinks this game will launch with anything but Empire, Eldar, Orks and Chaos as the playable races, you've clearly never played a 40k game before.
And yes, close combat is a major part of every race, except perhaps the tau. But tau would be difficult to implement due to their diverse range of races. Tyranids would be VERY hard to implement, if not impossible, so I reckon they might be relegated to mobs, (unless you play as a genestealer cultist... hmm...).
But look at the success of the burning crusade, do you honestly think THQ are gonna release all the races in one go? hell no! add-on packs for mmos are big business.
and guy posting about ppl getting killed by quest giver for encountering chaos - YES! you know your 40k
I think a squad system would work fairly well on 40K MMO. Look at Granado Espada (3 characters at once per player). It would solve some balance issues, but it might make controlling your team a tad difficult. They could try a 1 marine per player and a guardsmen squad per player approach too.
I don't know too much about the 40K universe, especially unit rank/type progression, but this speculation topic always interests me, since ideas for game design are always thrown out and about.
Airan on
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143999Tellin' yanot askin' ya, not pleadin' with yaRegistered Userregular
yeah, i just saw this announcement on GS and though "why of course, take my money".
Eve's the only MMO i play, but if this is in any-way good, i would probably take it up. Although i still don't like the idea of playing an MMO that locks you into certain abilities/skills, and shuts off others, as well as having 'levels'. That just doesn't sit comfortably.
I think a squad system would work fairly well on 40K MMO. Look at Granado Espada (3 characters at once per player). It would solve some balance issues, but it might make controlling your team a tad difficult. They could try a 1 marine per player and a guardsmen squad per player approach too.
I don't know too much about the 40K universe, especially unit rank/type progression, but this speculation topic always interests me, since ideas for game design are always thrown out and about.
This idea is how they need to do it. It allows balance perfectly whilst keeping to fluff. Sure marines are good (though not nearly as good as you guys are claiming they are, remember fluff is filtered through the authors perception, if you look around there are plenty of references they aren’t nearly as powerful as there are portrayed to be) but they don’t look quite as tempting when you find your squad outnumbered four to one. It allows fluff to be kept to, to a much greater extend (it’s not six guys on a bug hunt it’s a group of six squads searching for X). It allows an inclusion of a far greater range of customization and inclusion of equipment. You can have all your men individually armed with differing equipment and skills a well as letting their be player controlled transport ships and the like. It also in my opinion allows a much more skill based game by giving you a large range of strategically options that aren’t twitch reflex based. Finally it helps differ it from the majority of MMOs on the market.
This can't be done, its impossible. This would be like trying to make a WW2 MMO where you had to portray the nazis as the good guys.
40k is a thrilling and interesting world crafted over decades which does a surprisingly good job of fitting new fluff elements into itself without butchering itself but you cant take it and make it into a game where the imperium is good and jolly.
As someone said, quests would go like this.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Go and investigate the sewers, a patrol we sent down there did not return. Report to me immediately when you are done.
Into the sewers, where you find that the squad has turned to chaos and are devouring orphans for sport. After a brutal bloodbath you finally kill them all and their demon master, and driven half mad with fear you stagger out into the streets and back to the commisar. Your mind is shattered by exposure to chaos, and your body is already writhing with mutation.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Traitors you say, and they evidenced some kind of mutation? Sargeant it is well known that the emperor has defeated the chaos gods, your lies and heresy cannot be tolerated.
Shoots you in the head. You die. Permanently.
An inquisitor MMO might 'just' work, since inquisitors have the freedom to be a bit independant. However even it might need to be too cruel for a game setting.
This can't be done, its impossible. This would be like trying to make a WW2 MMO where you had to portray the nazis as the good guys.
40k is a thrilling and interesting world crafted over decades which does a surprisingly good job of fitting new fluff elements into itself without butchering itself but you cant take it and make it into a game where the imperium is good and jolly.
As someone said, quests would go like this.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Go and investigate the sewers, a patrol we sent down there did not return. Report to me immediately when you are done.
Into the sewers, where you find that the squad has turned to chaos and are devouring orphans for sport. After a brutal bloodbath you finally kill them all and their demon master, and driven half mad with fear you stagger out into the streets and back to the commisar. Your mind is shattered by exposure to chaos, and your body is already writhing with mutation.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Traitors you say, and they evidenced some kind of mutation? Sargeant it is well known that the emperor has defeated the chaos gods, your lies and heresy cannot be tolerated.
Shoots you in the head. You die. Permanently.
An inquisitor MMO might 'just' work, since inquisitors have the freedom to be a bit independant. However even it might need to be too cruel for a game setting.
Their are plenty of good reasons you could find though. Maybe everybody is stuck on a planet slowly being overrun by tyranids. Most of the leadership is dead or taken what interplanetary ships remain and run. All that is left are rag tag groups of men hiding out in jungle/desert/other terrain bases doing what they can to survive. Trying to build ships from the wreckage to run before the inquisitors are able to get to the planet and begin exterminus.
Leitner on
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MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited March 2007
I too read a lot of the fluff. They are that good compared to you or me or joe blogs hive dweller. But versus a guardman, it is possible to kill one if you are lucky. It happens all the time in fluff.
Remember, most of the fluff about marines is presented from in empire perspective, and in the same style as old school war propaganda crossed with catholic church style bible thumping.
They have backup organs and nanofibre armor under their skin that lets them interface with their armor.
However without that armor, one good bolter round to the head and they will die. They don't have backup brains.
The reason they win so much is their incredible discipline, organisation and ability to stay completely cool under fire. They are backed up by superior technology and squad discipline. An inexperienced space marine commander will get annihilated in the tabletop game by anyone good. What fluff does, is assume their commanders are ALWAYS good. Tactical geniuses.
A good 40k mmo would require jo blo 9 year old to play this dude and his friend joe blo 7 year old to back him up like a real fellow space marine. Not run around going yehaa blam blam blam, because if they do that, they will die to virtually anything else. Ideally, they would also take skill to use.
This is THQ of course, so probably they'll just give them insane stats because they don't really understand the fluff at all.
Morninglord on
(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
I like the idea of customisable squads instead of individual characters.
I feel these squads should have a limitation in order to maintain balance.
Marines have 3 or 5 members, guardsmen have 15.. etc.. These squads should be pretty balanced. Maybe you could even have different jobs within the squads.
I'd also make that if one died, it'd cost you. So that playing Marines should be alot harder, then playing with "expendable" guardsmen.
About the marines: maybe you only become a lvl1 space marine once you get to lvl70 marine scout.
Posts
In the Inquisitor table top game, one of those guys in power armor was more then a match for a seasoned Inquisitor and a 4 man retinue, armed to the teeth.
I can only imagine what a first company terminator could do.
I miss 2nd edition 40k, where like, the first scenario mission they recomend is 30 gretchin versus like 5 space marines. Back then space marines did cost 30pts if memory serves, but they could also rapid fire their bolters at any range, and throw frag grenades.
I was about to say something about the ability to adjust roleplaying games for XP, encounters, etc to factor in uber character, but suddenly I had the thought: What if they did let in super-strong, fast, and skilled Space Marines and monster characters, but didn't[/]i balance them for individual strength and simply adjusted their rewards and leveling based on that?
Picture players queueing up to enter a zone of the game, say a planet like Armageddon. You've got 100 Guardsmen, maybe 60 Ork players, and a max of 10 Space Marines, Chaos Marines, and such each. I recall the upcoming OFPS 'The Crossing' that used this concept, where PvP players played a wholly different style of game from 'single players' who would pop in to do their own solo quests and kill PvPers like they were NPCs, forcing PvP players to team up if they wanted to beat the overpowered SPers.
The problem with this for 40k, as mentioned, is that 4/5 of people will just want to be Marines. You'd never get enough of anyone else to fight unless the ranks were filled out with NPCs. In which case the design is that much closer to simply being a squad vs squad tactial MMO.
Warlocks/Spiritseers.
Exarchs.
Stay away from autarchs and farseers.
Anyone who immediately thinks the concept is doomed is a fucking tool.
And how is 4/5 people wanting to be SMs really different from every newbie fuckface wanting to play Alliance in WoW?
Also: Can't you set up PvP like a server in a regular pew pew per-se? Except instead of making each character start level one, let them keep their aggregate stats and re-define them into the PvP enviro so that they don't have to start as level 1 chars again? Because, I mean, as much as I love being a Nazi in WWII, I just want to shoot a bitch in the face. If I play WH40k and, even though I am a fanatic for the Orks, the hell wouldn't I want to be given the chance to play as a Guardsman every once an a while?
The fact that every race in the Alliance isn't twice as strong as every race in the Horde?
SMs really aren't that bloody fantastic. A well placed shot WILL kill one. A squad might be hard to take down, but that's morale and yadda. Guardsmen in a group can kill a group of marines. It's all about HOW you use your guys, not "LOL LOL CHARGE THE MARINES."
EDIT: Like I said for PvP, refer to my edited idea. It may be a shitty start, but it's a better start than "DOOOOOOMED"
Though the downside is that this would kind of encourage cowardism, which is kinda the anti-thesis of the whole universe.
I don't think you understand. Being true to oft-inconsistent background fiction that is frequently ignored by its own authors is more important than having fun.
Didn't you know that?
Dying while in an enemy base will net you five points IF killed by an enemy and IF you have at least severely injured/killed an enemy or done something useful.
I see what you did there.
m i rite?
(please don't hurt me)
I like the idea of controlling a squad of characters (like Granado Espada), which makes it seem a little more true to the tabletop. I also hope it is similar to what WAR is trying to do with a strong focus on PVP and warfare.
Fixed.
Ignore the background and it might as well not be 40k
It can't be the fact that one of the major themes of the setting is that individuals do not matter in the least. While we're getting a game in a genre where the hallmarks tend to be patting the players on the back and telling them that THEIR CHARACTERS ARE GREAT HEROES!
It can't that xenophobia is not only an unwritten rule, but often completely necessary. Alliances with anyone not at least vestigially related to your species don't happen unless in the most desperate situations. Here, we have a genre where what once was one of the better game settings get butchered by it's own creators so that all races fit into a nice, tidy two-sided "Good vs. different kind of good" system.
It definitely can't be the idea of turning what's essentially a century of training and genetic modification into an even match for a space-redneck with a lasgun in the name of trite balance.
It can't be the fact that, while DoW's races were balanced, they still followed the basic guidelines of their Tabletop equivalent.
Oh no.
It's all because we don't like the idea of the shoulderpad fetishists strapping on a boltgun and going "WHEE!" while they kill their first Grox.
I would give anything for one that doesn't suck.
Plus: a motherfucking Wild West MMO, with trains and horses and injuns.
I don't think anyone in their right mind wants that kind of MMO for 40k.
I don't think 40k can become an MMO at all.
I never thought Warcraft could become a decent MMO. Ever.
I still don't think it is, but it's damn popular.
Yeah, but Warcraft is like, one of the most generic settings ever created (but it has a great art style!).
lol lol big mens in suits pew pew robots
WAGHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
De-emphasising the background, making more artwork generic and less gritty, and promoting Marines so much was a big mark on 40k during the late 90s through early 2000s. I for one couldn't give much of a damn until I started seeing art for the 4th ed rulebook and the miniatures finally looked like stuff from the good artists like Paul Daiton, Kopinski, and John Blanche.
It's not doomed, it's just highly unlikely they'll take the route of really using Warhammer as more than 'WWII-ish space opera lol' and just reel in generic gamers with the generic tired-and-true MMORPG design. Or 10 Marines Counter-striking 10 Orks over and over.
THQ is going to fuck this up badly. They did it to tetris, they will ruin warhammer 40k.
Plus the Heresy is in many ways more interesting than the "modern" setting, partly due to the emphasis on humanities issues with itself.
I don't get the inquisitor idea - I mean how many inquisitors would you ever have in one place at one time? not a MMO's worth.
Also, they could just buy a copy of gears of war, change the models a bit and you're done!
Firstly, I haven't played 40k since the moment third edition came out. I have nothing against the later editions, but unfortunately all my friends who played did. That being said, when I did play I knew the game back and front, so with the exception of necrons, tau and dark eldar I know race backgrounds pretty well.
The point of me saying that is to address the complaints about how 'space marines would be totally overpowered'.
If I recall correctly, space marines aren't BORN space marines. They start as plebs. Normal humans. They become space marine scouts by winning tournaments or proving their valour in some other way, then have a gene-seed implanted in them.
What I'm saying is this: Human at level 1. scout at level 20, marine at level 40, terminator at level 60?
What would be wrong with that as long as other races had a similar progression?
Ie: guardian - aspect warrior - exarch - phoenix lord
ork - nob - big nob - boss?
cultist - ??? - chaos marine - chaos terminator/obliterator
and if anyone thinks this game will launch with anything but Empire, Eldar, Orks and Chaos as the playable races, you've clearly never played a 40k game before.
And yes, close combat is a major part of every race, except perhaps the tau. But tau would be difficult to implement due to their diverse range of races. Tyranids would be VERY hard to implement, if not impossible, so I reckon they might be relegated to mobs, (unless you play as a genestealer cultist... hmm...).
But look at the success of the burning crusade, do you honestly think THQ are gonna release all the races in one go? hell no! add-on packs for mmos are big business.
and guy posting about ppl getting killed by quest giver for encountering chaos - YES! you know your 40k
I don't know too much about the 40K universe, especially unit rank/type progression, but this speculation topic always interests me, since ideas for game design are always thrown out and about.
Eve's the only MMO i play, but if this is in any-way good, i would probably take it up. Although i still don't like the idea of playing an MMO that locks you into certain abilities/skills, and shuts off others, as well as having 'levels'. That just doesn't sit comfortably.
This idea is how they need to do it. It allows balance perfectly whilst keeping to fluff. Sure marines are good (though not nearly as good as you guys are claiming they are, remember fluff is filtered through the authors perception, if you look around there are plenty of references they aren’t nearly as powerful as there are portrayed to be) but they don’t look quite as tempting when you find your squad outnumbered four to one. It allows fluff to be kept to, to a much greater extend (it’s not six guys on a bug hunt it’s a group of six squads searching for X). It allows an inclusion of a far greater range of customization and inclusion of equipment. You can have all your men individually armed with differing equipment and skills a well as letting their be player controlled transport ships and the like. It also in my opinion allows a much more skill based game by giving you a large range of strategically options that aren’t twitch reflex based. Finally it helps differ it from the majority of MMOs on the market.
they've just got more and more ridiculously stupid over the years
Oh. I haven't kept up with the last edition (maybe last two editions?). How the mighty have fallen.
40k is a thrilling and interesting world crafted over decades which does a surprisingly good job of fitting new fluff elements into itself without butchering itself but you cant take it and make it into a game where the imperium is good and jolly.
As someone said, quests would go like this.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Go and investigate the sewers, a patrol we sent down there did not return. Report to me immediately when you are done.
Into the sewers, where you find that the squad has turned to chaos and are devouring orphans for sport. After a brutal bloodbath you finally kill them all and their demon master, and driven half mad with fear you stagger out into the streets and back to the commisar. Your mind is shattered by exposure to chaos, and your body is already writhing with mutation.
Imperial Commisar Scorn - Traitors you say, and they evidenced some kind of mutation? Sargeant it is well known that the emperor has defeated the chaos gods, your lies and heresy cannot be tolerated.
Shoots you in the head. You die. Permanently.
An inquisitor MMO might 'just' work, since inquisitors have the freedom to be a bit independant. However even it might need to be too cruel for a game setting.
Their are plenty of good reasons you could find though. Maybe everybody is stuck on a planet slowly being overrun by tyranids. Most of the leadership is dead or taken what interplanetary ships remain and run. All that is left are rag tag groups of men hiding out in jungle/desert/other terrain bases doing what they can to survive. Trying to build ships from the wreckage to run before the inquisitors are able to get to the planet and begin exterminus.
Remember, most of the fluff about marines is presented from in empire perspective, and in the same style as old school war propaganda crossed with catholic church style bible thumping.
They have backup organs and nanofibre armor under their skin that lets them interface with their armor.
However without that armor, one good bolter round to the head and they will die. They don't have backup brains.
The reason they win so much is their incredible discipline, organisation and ability to stay completely cool under fire. They are backed up by superior technology and squad discipline. An inexperienced space marine commander will get annihilated in the tabletop game by anyone good. What fluff does, is assume their commanders are ALWAYS good. Tactical geniuses.
A good 40k mmo would require jo blo 9 year old to play this dude and his friend joe blo 7 year old to back him up like a real fellow space marine. Not run around going yehaa blam blam blam, because if they do that, they will die to virtually anything else. Ideally, they would also take skill to use.
This is THQ of course, so probably they'll just give them insane stats because they don't really understand the fluff at all.
I feel these squads should have a limitation in order to maintain balance.
Marines have 3 or 5 members, guardsmen have 15.. etc.. These squads should be pretty balanced. Maybe you could even have different jobs within the squads.
I'd also make that if one died, it'd cost you. So that playing Marines should be alot harder, then playing with "expendable" guardsmen.
About the marines: maybe you only become a lvl1 space marine once you get to lvl70 marine scout.