Their are plenty of good reasons you could find though. Maybe everybody is stuck on a planet slowly being overrun by tyranids. Most of the leadership is dead or taken what interplanetary ships remain and run. All that is left are rag tag groups of men hiding out in jungle/desert/other terrain bases doing what they can to survive. Trying to build ships from the wreckage to run before the Tyranid swarm devours all life on the planet.
Fixed.
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I don't like the squad suggestions mainly because I think it takes me as a unique individual out of the world. If you are going to experience this ridiculously bloody and bleak existance, it is more engaging as a single entity grunt. In other words, I think it's a more bleaker and challenging existence to start me at as some shit grunt than to say, give you 6 grunts just so that I have 'fair odds' against some other opposing force. One of my favorite times in MMO games is when players have an unfair disadvantage and they band together to overcome it.
But, I also understand that the squad suggestions would go very far towards creating the illusion of an actual war instead of always teetering on the edge of 'small conflicts'.
I liked that EVE suggestion, where by you can lose your upgrades and start back at a base unit. I think any major war game of this nature needs to have some sort of risk of loss. Certain races will care more about what they lose on death than others based on their war strategies.
I don't like the squad suggestions mainly because I think it takes me as a unique individual out of the world. If you are going to experience this ridiculously bloody and bleak existance, it is more engaging as a single entity grunt. In other words, I think it's a more bleaker and challenging existence to start me at as some shit grunt than to say, give you 6 grunts just so that I have 'fair odds' against some other opposing force. One of my favorite times in MMO games is when players have an unfair disadvantage and they band together to overcome it.
But, I also understand that the squad suggestions would go very far towards creating the illusion of an actual war instead of always teetering on the edge of 'small conflicts'.
I liked that EVE suggestion, where by you can lose your upgrades and start back at a base unit. I think any major war game of this nature needs to have some sort of risk of loss. Certain races will care more about what they lose on death than others based on their war strategies.
Yes well, that is the point of doing that. And even with it squad based I wouldn't be surprised if one still needed to work with more than one squad.
Mmm, I'll remain pessimistic until we know more about what you can be. No, I don't want to play a game were everyone can play Space Marines. You will not make it work. I'm sorry for everyone who wants to dig chainswords into xenos scum, but playing a Space Marine should be boring for half of your time. A Space Marine's life isn't one of a wandering hero, taking quests from their superiors. It is regimented, it is structured, and you go where you are told. No deviation. Same for the general Guardsmen populace, same for much of the Eldar, same for many of the military organizations in the 40K universe.
You come back to me with tales of rogue traders, Inquisitors, hive gangers, and the like, and I might be interested. Otherwise, I have no interest in a game where N00bsauce can roll a Space Marine and fuck up my immersion in the universe.
There is no way you'd just be able to make a Space Marine immediatley. The whole point of these kinds of games is to spend ages levelling up to get better and better stuff. It wouldn't make sense to let you use one without a couple hundred hours played.
I'd expect a hell of a lot of toil (read: grinding for weeks solid) before you get in your first armour (if you go that route), with many, many more to get your Terminator etc. on. It's just good business.
There is no way you'd just be able to make a Space Marine immediatley. The whole point of these kinds of games is to spend ages levelling up to get better and better stuff. It wouldn't make sense to let you use one without a couple hundred hours played.
I'd expect a hell of a lot of toil (read: grinding for weeks solid) before you get in your first armour (if you go that route), with many, many more to get your Terminator etc. on. It's just good business.
You shouldn't be able to make a Space Marine at all, I feel. 'Grinding for weeks solid' shouldn't be put in the game, because it's not fun. Plus, you wouldn't be grinding on some random mobs--Marines have to go through countless crusades and campaigns to earn the right to Terminator armor. Again, all regimented, all structured, all thoroughly out of your hands.
And even if they put all the grinding in there and let people play Marines, they would have people actually acting out a Marine's part? No, of course they wouldn't. The people who camp Stranglethorn Vale at level 55 are going to be the same people ruining your immersion in the 40K universe by disco dancing in their Terminator armor.
I'm just hoping we can get some clarification soon. A Necromunda or Inquisitor MMO, I can get on board more easily.
I don't think it'll be a good thing if they go the route of "the generic, questing, wandering hero MMORPG" in general. That would be REALLY short-sighted and would do no honour to the license at all.
Maybe it'll just be a giant army-simulator, with npc's sending players in waves onto the battlefield, in huge slaugerfests between the races.
People who distinct themselves in combat will earn promotion to squadleaders and more... Behaviour on the battlefield should be the most important character attribute.
I don't think it'll be a good thing if they go the route of "the generic, questing, wandering hero MMORPG" in general. That would be REALLY short-sighted and would do no honour to the license at all.
Maybe it'll just be a giant army-simulator, with npc's sending players in waves onto the battlefield, in huge slaugerfests between the races.
People who distinct themselves in combat will earn promotion to squadleaders and more... Behaviour on the battlefield should be the most important character attribute.
If the only part of the license we're worrying about doing honor to is the down-in-the-trenches skirmish warfare, then I wouldn't do an MMO at all. I just don't see it working.
However, there are plenty of parts of the license that can adhere to the questing hero archetype. And these parts are still very, very interesting to me. I, personally, would look forward to a Rogue Trader risking life and limb to search out treasures of the universe in the midst of gothic horror.
I don't think it'll be a good thing if they go the route of "the generic, questing, wandering hero MMORPG" in general. That would be REALLY short-sighted and would do no honour to the license at all.
Maybe it'll just be a giant army-simulator, with npc's sending players in waves onto the battlefield, in huge slaugerfests between the races.
People who distinct themselves in combat will earn promotion to squadleaders and more... Behaviour on the battlefield should be the most important character attribute.
If the only part of the license we're worrying about doing honor to is the down-in-the-trenches skirmish warfare, then I wouldn't do an MMO at all. I just don't see it working.
However, there are plenty of parts of the license that can adhere to the questing hero archetype. And these parts are still very, very interesting to me. I, personally, would look forward to a Rogue Trader risking life and limb to search out treasures of the universe in the midst of gothic horror.
Well, "MMO" is just a term. It could be a MMOFPS//MMOT(ird)PS for all i care.
At least it would have violence, death, tactics, ranks, experience, classes, vehicles, races, abilities...
And TBH, i don't like the idea of "treasure/relic hunting" in Warhammer 40k AT ALL.
You can get that kind of stuff in any other MMO. The sight of "indiana jones heroes in nazi space" is just.. wrong o_O (i am aware i'm simplifying a bit but still)
Also, there are no heroes in Warhammer 40k. in War, all heroes are dead.
Unless you want to have the Primarch class available...
And ditch questing, if war is all around you, the last thing on your mind is going to gather some herbs (so to speak).
The only thing that comes near a quest are the rites of passage to become a Space Marine.
To be honest a 3rd Person, squad-based MMO sounds pretty righteous. You play as some kind of platoon or squad leader, and as you level up you get access to either more or better squad mates. Say you're level 30 or whatever, and can command 4 people in your squad. You use your "valor points" or "kill points" or "xp" to buy equipment for them, stats, etc... You can specialize them for sniping, a medic, grenadier and just go out into some crazy battles.
If you are going to play as a Marine, it should we require weeks...nay, months to qualify for the Marine class at level 1.
After your done with some of the most mind grueling quests the MMO world has ever seem, you come out of it as a level 1 Marine Grunt badass.
However, if you die....ONCE, you die permentantly, the character is gone, forever, and you just wasted 3 months of your life earning it.
And, seeing as you have so much to lose, Every single character of every single faction will be wanting to kill your ass on site. Did I mention that there's no "real" PVE, and that you can, and will, be ganked at any(And every) opprotunity?
That, my friends, is how you do Marines.
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If you are going to play as a Marine, it should we require weeks...nay, months to qualify for the Marine class at level 1.
After your done with some of the most mind grueling quests the MMO world has ever seem, you come out of it as a level 1 Marine Grunt badass.
However, if you die....ONCE, you die permentantly, the character is gone, forever, and you just wasted 3 months of your life earning it.
And, seeing as you have so much to lose, Every single character of every single faction will be wanting to kill your ass on site. Did I mention that there's no "real" PVE, and that you can, and will, be ganked at any(And every) opprotunity?
That, my friends, is how you do Marines.
Alternatively, you can just crush your testicles in a clamp. Seriously, do you hate yourself that much to want to play that game?
On topic, I'd really like to see something in the vein of Hellgate: London mixed with some Guild Wars.
Well, "MMO" is just a term. It could be a MMOFPS//MMOT(ird)PS for all i care.
At least it would have violence, death, tactics, ranks, experience, classes, vehicles, races, abilities...
And TBH, i don't like the idea of "treasure/relic hunting" in Warhammer 40k AT ALL.
You can get that kind of stuff in any other MMO. The sight of "indiana jones heroes in nazi space" is just.. wrong o_O (i am aware i'm simplifying a bit but still)
Also, there are no heroes in Warhammer 40k. in War, all heroes are dead.
Unless you want to have the Primarch class available...
And ditch questing, if war is all around you, the last thing on your mind is going to gather some herbs (so to speak).
The only thing that comes near a quest are the rites of passage to become a Space Marine.
We're tossing around terminology like it's confetti here and I think we're confusing each other. :P Yes, treasure/relic hunting doesn't need to appeal to you, but it was just the only thing I could think of off the top of my head to attribute to the type of character I want to play. Rogue Traders could be concerned with economics, Inquisitors could be a research mechanic, and this is all still within context of a state of open war.
And again, heroes is just a term. Of course you're not a hero, but you'd be a character, an individual. I have no wish to play a member of a squad, because I know more than likely my other squad members aren't going to want to act like a squad. The majority of people who play these games are mouth-breathing knuckle-draggers who will have no concern for the mythos. That's why I see the individualized nature of the fringe being the best bet for this game.
As for quest, I just meant a series of linked gameplay situations. You honestly don't see how, say, the Eisenhorn novels can be replicated in a series of quests/missions? That's all I meant.
Yeah, that Marine suggesting sounds like beating your head into a wall over and over and over again.
I think this game is going to be nearly impossible to faithful to the fluff and fun, but I really hope they pull it off somehow. When I see a space marine, I want to think "Holy Mother of God, this dude is going to fuck some shit up!" and not "Gah, not another space-nub".
Though, if I can play as a warp-spider exarch, flaying flesh with my web spinners mounted on mechanical arms as I slice through power armor with my power blades...
On the other hand, if instead of recreating the 40K universe, they found a unique localized situation that wasn't completely contrived in how it was constructed, I'd be for it. For instance, take a world at a constant state of war, like Armageddon. Remove space-transport off world--in fact, remove all outside contact (warp storms!). Have each faction ground down by the war from before the player begins. If you want to have Marines, then they need to be an isolated, cut off segment of a single Chapter, or the remnants of a crusade force. Likewise for the rest of the armies. Play out your pitiful little war over a single planet, to the victor go no spoils. It's a stop-gap idea, but it sounds better to me than what I fear would happen.
Mmm, I'll remain pessimistic until we know more about what you can be. No, I don't want to play a game were everyone can play Space Marines. You will not make it work. I'm sorry for everyone who wants to dig chainswords into xenos scum, but playing a Space Marine should be boring for half of your time. A Space Marine's life isn't one of a wandering hero, taking quests from their superiors. It is regimented, it is structured, and you go where you are told. No deviation. Same for the general Guardsmen populace, same for much of the Eldar, same for many of the military organizations in the 40K universe.
You come back to me with tales of rogue traders, Inquisitors, hive gangers, and the like, and I might be interested. Otherwise, I have no interest in a game where N00bsauce can roll a Space Marine and fuck up my immersion in the universe.
Surely this is why god created roleplay servers and normal servers? So that ppl who want to immerse themselves in a character can do that in one place, and ppl who want to strip naked and skydive into a chaos fortress can do that too, without ruining each other's fun?
Personally, I think the generic WOW style mmorpg would work just fine if done correctly, they just have to get the setting right.
EG. no killing rats with a dagger. Instead maybe have instanced battles that trigger every half hour or so, ie defend a building or fight off a horde of genestealers inside a hive, with difficulty changing depending on people present? That kind of thing? I'd rather feel like part of an army than run one, thats what dawn of war is for.
Surely this is why god created roleplay servers and normal servers? So that ppl who want to immerse themselves in a character can do that in one place, and ppl who want to strip naked and skydive into a chaos fortress can do that too, without ruining each other's fun?
Have you been on a roleplaying server? The ratio of retards to normal people are more favorable than normal, but just because a server has 'RP' next to its name doesn't mean you're not going to find Smellykins and Jazzomancer ganking you for no reason. RP is rarely enforced, and even if it is, it's not like most people know how to RP anyway. (Cue the player who RPs a Space Marine who is actually an Eldar in disguise infected with a Genestealer implant which totally means he's going to go Super-Saiyan on us.)
If you are going to play as a Marine, it should we require weeks...nay, months to qualify for the Marine class at level 1.
After your done with some of the most mind grueling quests the MMO world has ever seem, you come out of it as a level 1 Marine Grunt badass.
However, if you die....ONCE, you die permentantly, the character is gone, forever, and you just wasted 3 months of your life earning it.
And, seeing as you have so much to lose, Every single character of every single faction will be wanting to kill your ass on site. Did I mention that there's no "real" PVE, and that you can, and will, be ganked at any(And every) opprotunity?
That, my friends, is how you do Marines.
This guy is stupid. If you die, you are incarcerated into a dreadnaught, an engine of pure death. Then you spend the rest of eternity either in comatose sleep or controlling your Dreadnought in battle, crushing your enemies under your wierd three-pronged metal feet thingies.
Well, "MMO" is just a term. It could be a MMOFPS//MMOT(ird)PS for all i care.
At least it would have violence, death, tactics, ranks, experience, classes, vehicles, races, abilities...
And TBH, i don't like the idea of "treasure/relic hunting" in Warhammer 40k AT ALL.
You can get that kind of stuff in any other MMO. The sight of "indiana jones heroes in nazi space" is just.. wrong o_O (i am aware i'm simplifying a bit but still)
Also, there are no heroes in Warhammer 40k. in War, all heroes are dead.
Unless you want to have the Primarch class available...
And ditch questing, if war is all around you, the last thing on your mind is going to gather some herbs (so to speak).
The only thing that comes near a quest are the rites of passage to become a Space Marine.
We're tossing around terminology like it's confetti here and I think we're confusing each other. :P Yes, treasure/relic hunting doesn't need to appeal to you, but it was just the only thing I could think of off the top of my head to attribute to the type of character I want to play. Rogue Traders could be concerned with economics, Inquisitors could be a research mechanic, and this is all still within context of a state of open war.
And again, heroes is just a term. Of course you're not a hero, but you'd be a character, an individual. I have no wish to play a member of a squad, because I know more than likely my other squad members aren't going to want to act like a squad. The majority of people who play these games are mouth-breathing knuckle-draggers who will have no concern for the mythos. That's why I see the individualized nature of the fringe being the best bet for this game.
As for quest, I just meant a series of linked gameplay situations. You honestly don't see how, say, the Eisenhorn novels can be replicated in a series of quests/missions? That's all I meant.
Hehe, I knew the Heroes thing would get this reaction, what you say is true.
But, the point I was trying to make was that there should be no "individual" as in a character that stands on it's own, having his/her own agenda.
Players SHOULD be squad members BECAUSE they are in the army. The whole idea of warhammer revolves around armies.
IMO, have the stubborn individualists shot by commissars. (no running off the battlefield, not shooting allies, not going all leeroy)
But ok, it's not like you would have no free will, as long as you stay true to your objectives.
If you don't like armies, this game should not be for you.
However, I could imagine the army having a vast backbone of "civilians" which support the armies and realms by crafting, gathering, looting, reseaching and yes, treasure/relic hunting. Or maybe have those proffesions on a soldier char, because i can imagine you'd like to do something else but fight battles all the time.
I don't see why you couldn't have the best of two worlds.
Play civilian now and then, and when the mood strikes you, put on your body armor and go to war.
"Logging in... I'm in. Oh, just a few minor skirmishes. Uh, you guys go ahead, no point in waiting around for me. I'll just be here... staring at a black screen... listening to my sluggish heartbeat."
Hehe, I knew the Heroes thing would get this reaction, what you say is true.
But, the point I was trying to make was that there should be no "individual" as in a character that stands on it's own, having his/her own agenda.
Players SHOULD be squad members BECAUSE they are in the army. The whole idea of warhammer revolves around armies.
IMO, have the stubborn individualists shot by commissars. (no running off the battlefield, not shooting allies, not going all leeroy)
But ok, it's not like you would have no free will, as long as you stay true to your objectives.
If you don't like armies, this game should not be for you.
But, the Warhammer universes aren't just focused on armies. They're gothic horror settings that make sure you understand the individual is pitiful and weak and uncared-for by the universe. However, that doesn't mean you can't play the individual--in fact, that's the best way to convey the hopelessness.
And there are plenty of people in the 40K universe who aren't part of an army--like I said, rogue traders, Inquisitors, gangers in a hive, mercenaries, etc. And you're not going to have a Rogue Trader be shot by the Commissar, because they wouldn't be in the same room unless they were benefiting each other. :P
If you are going to play as a Marine, it should we require weeks...nay, months to qualify for the Marine class at level 1.
After your done with some of the most mind grueling quests the MMO world has ever seem, you come out of it as a level 1 Marine Grunt badass.
However, if you die....ONCE, you die permentantly, the character is gone, forever, and you just wasted 3 months of your life earning it.
And, seeing as you have so much to lose, Every single character of every single faction will be wanting to kill your ass on site. Did I mention that there's no "real" PVE, and that you can, and will, be ganked at any(And every) opprotunity?
That, my friends, is how you do Marines.
Alternatively, you can just crush your testicles in a clamp. Seriously, do you hate yourself that much to want to play that game?
On topic, I'd really like to see something in the vein of Hellgate: London mixed with some Guild Wars.
Who said I wanted to play a Marine . You see, no one in their right mind would try and attempt to make a marine, unless it was for sheer bragging right's. And, even then, there is still every opprotunity to lose said bragging rights.
Seriously, if your going to have a class that can stomp over pretty much every goddamn class in the game 1 on 1, it SHOULD be hard to attain, and hard to keep, as well.
Therefore, you won't have 85 million of these overpowerd bastards running around, and, in a way, it stays true to the lore.
Thier powerful as hell, but, outnumbered at almost every side. Seeing a Marine should bring of sense of pity for that mans sanity, which is more then likley gone, and, a feeling OH FUCK OH FUCK IM FUCKED OH FUCK. Just like the real thing!
Similar but different, at least now there is no need to burn down the developers if they don't make it a FPS or fail to include Tau.
I think it would be perfectly easy to include marines in - sure they are miles above and beyond a guardsman but they are pretty equal to everyone else's elites. Like in WAR where you don't play a basic trooper, seems the best way to handle the problems with elite and horde armies is to set all the PCs at a similar level (Orc Nob/Mek, Tau 'suit pilot, Space marine, Traitor Legionaire, Aspect Warrior, Storm Trooper, Necron Warrior and Tyranid Warrior) and have the mass of faceless grunts be the monsters. The mid range stuff is fairly even.
If its not entirely PvP then you don't want to be fighting spacebears and spacerats, you're going to be tearing through cultists, guardsman and gaunts whilst trying to get into combat with the more powerful warriors and marines.
They could release a limited edition (of ten million) version of the game that allows you to make a marines for the low, low price of $699 (£499)!
That, good sirs, is how business is done.
Seriously, though, there are so many directions they could go with this at this point. Let's not get too deep in discussing viabilities, and just shout out random awesome thoughts we have.
I'm telling you guys, it's all about being a warp-spider.
Warping around with all your friends, and then suddenly your drive malfunctions from over use and you are sucked into the warp getting your brain picked clean by all sorts of monstrosities.
But as long as I can be a Chaos-worshiping bastard who will at some point in time drive a ludicrously large spiky thing into your weak Imperial brains... I'm sold.
I mean, there really are so many ways it could go wrong, and however it's done half the potential playerbase will be alienated.
As much as I like the idea of, say, finding myself as a Terminator once I hit max level after god-knows how many missions, it's still not true to "canon". Most of the fluff indicates that Marine recruits are sifted through Hive worlds and trained from a young age: and after years of unbelievably difficult exercises you start getting your implants, and learn the ways of your Chapter and the God Emperor of Mankind. A lot of mind-hurting discipline and prayer.
...but Chaos? Yeah, we just burn/maim/rape/kill. Rinse and repeat.
It's been forever since I've played 40K tabletop, but as long as Space Wolves are still the shit, I'm on this like white on rice.
I want to see a fully realized 40K world. I want massive hive worlds and spires. Gang wars in the slums, Vindicare and Eversor assassins, opportunity to be dropped into a space hulk to clear out the Genestealers and so on.
Will I get that? Absolutely not, but I can dream can't I?
One space Marine could easily kill a thousand Orks on his own.
Hence the problem, already fluff wise that one race is massively overpowering. Considering there are untold billions upond billions of Orks in the galaxy and, say, a few thousand space marines total, and the marines are effectively 'winning' most of the time, thats horrible.
My hope is that MMO just meant Online. Something of a FPS type game would be a lot better. Shit, something like the crossing could be awesome, and while it is a persistent world there is NO questing, no character progression except rudimentary weapons and ammo selection and just one huge non stop battlefield, with tanks, dropships orbital bombardment etc. Just Quake Wars but persistent.
One marine can not kill a thousand orcs on his own, he could probably shoot a few and then take one on in close combat. Two would kill him though. Its only in inspirational quotes that they are that good and they are hardly a good basis for a competive game.
Marines are super human, but so is almost everything else. Humans are pretty much rubbish in 40K compared the other species.
Some people are being really silly. They're not going to make the game exactly like the fluff or anything, they can't.
Then why the fuck bother? The fluff's the only reason to get excited at this point.
Though you know what I think they could do reasonably well and would make me cream my pants immediately? A Gorkamorka MMO. Though I imagine we'd get tired of deserts eventually...
I think a Necromunda MMO would be more interesting, but I'm not really an Ork fan anyway..
It'd be pretty easy to do though there probably wouldn't be a whole lot of variety as far as races go. It'd just be a bunch of humans fighting each other, albeit in the 40k setting.
Collect 10 skulls for the skull throne, and return to me when you are done your task.
I don't think anyone in their right mind wants that kind of MMO for 40k.
But that kind of MMO is what's profitable. Does anyone trust THQ and GW to not go that route? It would probably be wildly successful with everyone except existing 40k fans.
Posts
Fixed.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
But, I also understand that the squad suggestions would go very far towards creating the illusion of an actual war instead of always teetering on the edge of 'small conflicts'.
I liked that EVE suggestion, where by you can lose your upgrades and start back at a base unit. I think any major war game of this nature needs to have some sort of risk of loss. Certain races will care more about what they lose on death than others based on their war strategies.
If they do it right.
As with everything, we have a big margin to fuck up here.
You come back to me with tales of rogue traders, Inquisitors, hive gangers, and the like, and I might be interested. Otherwise, I have no interest in a game where N00bsauce can roll a Space Marine and fuck up my immersion in the universe.
I'd expect a hell of a lot of toil (read: grinding for weeks solid) before you get in your first armour (if you go that route), with many, many more to get your Terminator etc. on. It's just good business.
You shouldn't be able to make a Space Marine at all, I feel. 'Grinding for weeks solid' shouldn't be put in the game, because it's not fun. Plus, you wouldn't be grinding on some random mobs--Marines have to go through countless crusades and campaigns to earn the right to Terminator armor. Again, all regimented, all structured, all thoroughly out of your hands.
And even if they put all the grinding in there and let people play Marines, they would have people actually acting out a Marine's part? No, of course they wouldn't. The people who camp Stranglethorn Vale at level 55 are going to be the same people ruining your immersion in the 40K universe by disco dancing in their Terminator armor.
I'm just hoping we can get some clarification soon. A Necromunda or Inquisitor MMO, I can get on board more easily.
Maybe it'll just be a giant army-simulator, with npc's sending players in waves onto the battlefield, in huge slaugerfests between the races.
People who distinct themselves in combat will earn promotion to squadleaders and more... Behaviour on the battlefield should be the most important character attribute.
You should know by now, it is not a question about if it is fun. The question is: Will people pay to do it?
And they probably will.
If the only part of the license we're worrying about doing honor to is the down-in-the-trenches skirmish warfare, then I wouldn't do an MMO at all. I just don't see it working.
However, there are plenty of parts of the license that can adhere to the questing hero archetype. And these parts are still very, very interesting to me. I, personally, would look forward to a Rogue Trader risking life and limb to search out treasures of the universe in the midst of gothic horror.
Well, "MMO" is just a term. It could be a MMOFPS//MMOT(ird)PS for all i care.
At least it would have violence, death, tactics, ranks, experience, classes, vehicles, races, abilities...
And TBH, i don't like the idea of "treasure/relic hunting" in Warhammer 40k AT ALL.
You can get that kind of stuff in any other MMO. The sight of "indiana jones heroes in nazi space" is just.. wrong o_O (i am aware i'm simplifying a bit but still)
Also, there are no heroes in Warhammer 40k. in War, all heroes are dead.
Unless you want to have the Primarch class available...
And ditch questing, if war is all around you, the last thing on your mind is going to gather some herbs (so to speak).
The only thing that comes near a quest are the rites of passage to become a Space Marine.
After your done with some of the most mind grueling quests the MMO world has ever seem, you come out of it as a level 1 Marine Grunt badass.
However, if you die....ONCE, you die permentantly, the character is gone, forever, and you just wasted 3 months of your life earning it.
And, seeing as you have so much to lose, Every single character of every single faction will be wanting to kill your ass on site. Did I mention that there's no "real" PVE, and that you can, and will, be ganked at any(And every) opprotunity?
That, my friends, is how you do Marines.
Alternatively, you can just crush your testicles in a clamp. Seriously, do you hate yourself that much to want to play that game?
On topic, I'd really like to see something in the vein of Hellgate: London mixed with some Guild Wars.
We're tossing around terminology like it's confetti here and I think we're confusing each other. :P Yes, treasure/relic hunting doesn't need to appeal to you, but it was just the only thing I could think of off the top of my head to attribute to the type of character I want to play. Rogue Traders could be concerned with economics, Inquisitors could be a research mechanic, and this is all still within context of a state of open war.
And again, heroes is just a term. Of course you're not a hero, but you'd be a character, an individual. I have no wish to play a member of a squad, because I know more than likely my other squad members aren't going to want to act like a squad. The majority of people who play these games are mouth-breathing knuckle-draggers who will have no concern for the mythos. That's why I see the individualized nature of the fringe being the best bet for this game.
As for quest, I just meant a series of linked gameplay situations. You honestly don't see how, say, the Eisenhorn novels can be replicated in a series of quests/missions? That's all I meant.
I think this game is going to be nearly impossible to faithful to the fluff and fun, but I really hope they pull it off somehow. When I see a space marine, I want to think "Holy Mother of God, this dude is going to fuck some shit up!" and not "Gah, not another space-nub".
Though, if I can play as a warp-spider exarch, flaying flesh with my web spinners mounted on mechanical arms as I slice through power armor with my power blades...
Well, that's something I can get behind.
Surely this is why god created roleplay servers and normal servers? So that ppl who want to immerse themselves in a character can do that in one place, and ppl who want to strip naked and skydive into a chaos fortress can do that too, without ruining each other's fun?
Personally, I think the generic WOW style mmorpg would work just fine if done correctly, they just have to get the setting right.
EG. no killing rats with a dagger. Instead maybe have instanced battles that trigger every half hour or so, ie defend a building or fight off a horde of genestealers inside a hive, with difficulty changing depending on people present? That kind of thing? I'd rather feel like part of an army than run one, thats what dawn of war is for.
Have you been on a roleplaying server? The ratio of retards to normal people are more favorable than normal, but just because a server has 'RP' next to its name doesn't mean you're not going to find Smellykins and Jazzomancer ganking you for no reason. RP is rarely enforced, and even if it is, it's not like most people know how to RP anyway. (Cue the player who RPs a Space Marine who is actually an Eldar in disguise infected with a Genestealer implant which totally means he's going to go Super-Saiyan on us.)
This guy is stupid. If you die, you are incarcerated into a dreadnaught, an engine of pure death. Then you spend the rest of eternity either in comatose sleep or controlling your Dreadnought in battle, crushing your enemies under your wierd three-pronged metal feet thingies.
=awesome.
Hehe, I knew the Heroes thing would get this reaction, what you say is true.
But, the point I was trying to make was that there should be no "individual" as in a character that stands on it's own, having his/her own agenda.
Players SHOULD be squad members BECAUSE they are in the army. The whole idea of warhammer revolves around armies.
IMO, have the stubborn individualists shot by commissars. (no running off the battlefield, not shooting allies, not going all leeroy)
But ok, it's not like you would have no free will, as long as you stay true to your objectives.
If you don't like armies, this game should not be for you.
However, I could imagine the army having a vast backbone of "civilians" which support the armies and realms by crafting, gathering, looting, reseaching and yes, treasure/relic hunting. Or maybe have those proffesions on a soldier char, because i can imagine you'd like to do something else but fight battles all the time.
I don't see why you couldn't have the best of two worlds.
Play civilian now and then, and when the mood strikes you, put on your body armor and go to war.
"Logging in... I'm in. Oh, just a few minor skirmishes. Uh, you guys go ahead, no point in waiting around for me. I'll just be here... staring at a black screen... listening to my sluggish heartbeat."
But, the Warhammer universes aren't just focused on armies. They're gothic horror settings that make sure you understand the individual is pitiful and weak and uncared-for by the universe. However, that doesn't mean you can't play the individual--in fact, that's the best way to convey the hopelessness.
And there are plenty of people in the 40K universe who aren't part of an army--like I said, rogue traders, Inquisitors, gangers in a hive, mercenaries, etc. And you're not going to have a Rogue Trader be shot by the Commissar, because they wouldn't be in the same room unless they were benefiting each other. :P
Who said I wanted to play a Marine
Seriously, if your going to have a class that can stomp over pretty much every goddamn class in the game 1 on 1, it SHOULD be hard to attain, and hard to keep, as well.
Therefore, you won't have 85 million of these overpowerd bastards running around, and, in a way, it stays true to the lore.
Thier powerful as hell, but, outnumbered at almost every side. Seeing a Marine should bring of sense of pity for that mans sanity, which is more then likley gone, and, a feeling OH FUCK OH FUCK IM FUCKED OH FUCK. Just like the real thing!
I think it would be perfectly easy to include marines in - sure they are miles above and beyond a guardsman but they are pretty equal to everyone else's elites. Like in WAR where you don't play a basic trooper, seems the best way to handle the problems with elite and horde armies is to set all the PCs at a similar level (Orc Nob/Mek, Tau 'suit pilot, Space marine, Traitor Legionaire, Aspect Warrior, Storm Trooper, Necron Warrior and Tyranid Warrior) and have the mass of faceless grunts be the monsters. The mid range stuff is fairly even.
If its not entirely PvP then you don't want to be fighting spacebears and spacerats, you're going to be tearing through cultists, guardsman and gaunts whilst trying to get into combat with the more powerful warriors and marines.
That, good sirs, is how business is done.
Seriously, though, there are so many directions they could go with this at this point. Let's not get too deep in discussing viabilities, and just shout out random awesome thoughts we have.
Looks like I am going to have to adopt one of you gents as my Heir to the throne.
Warping around with all your friends, and then suddenly your drive malfunctions from over use and you are sucked into the warp getting your brain picked clean by all sorts of monstrosities.
At this point, even World of Warcraft 2 would be fairly doomed.
But as long as I can be a Chaos-worshiping bastard who will at some point in time drive a ludicrously large spiky thing into your weak Imperial brains... I'm sold.
I mean, there really are so many ways it could go wrong, and however it's done half the potential playerbase will be alienated.
As much as I like the idea of, say, finding myself as a Terminator once I hit max level after god-knows how many missions, it's still not true to "canon". Most of the fluff indicates that Marine recruits are sifted through Hive worlds and trained from a young age: and after years of unbelievably difficult exercises you start getting your implants, and learn the ways of your Chapter and the God Emperor of Mankind. A lot of mind-hurting discipline and prayer.
...but Chaos? Yeah, we just burn/maim/rape/kill. Rinse and repeat.
I want to see a fully realized 40K world. I want massive hive worlds and spires. Gang wars in the slums, Vindicare and Eversor assassins, opportunity to be dropped into a space hulk to clear out the Genestealers and so on.
Will I get that? Absolutely not, but I can dream can't I?
Yeah, me too, I think. About the same percent.
Hence the problem, already fluff wise that one race is massively overpowering. Considering there are untold billions upond billions of Orks in the galaxy and, say, a few thousand space marines total, and the marines are effectively 'winning' most of the time, thats horrible.
My hope is that MMO just meant Online. Something of a FPS type game would be a lot better. Shit, something like the crossing could be awesome, and while it is a persistent world there is NO questing, no character progression except rudimentary weapons and ammo selection and just one huge non stop battlefield, with tanks, dropships orbital bombardment etc. Just Quake Wars but persistent.
Marines are super human, but so is almost everything else. Humans are pretty much rubbish in 40K compared the other species.
Then why the fuck bother? The fluff's the only reason to get excited at this point.
Though you know what I think they could do reasonably well and would make me cream my pants immediately? A Gorkamorka MMO. Though I imagine we'd get tired of deserts eventually...
It'd be pretty easy to do though there probably wouldn't be a whole lot of variety as far as races go. It'd just be a bunch of humans fighting each other, albeit in the 40k setting.
But that kind of MMO is what's profitable. Does anyone trust THQ and GW to not go that route? It would probably be wildly successful with everyone except existing 40k fans.