It's a risk based on faith. Yes. WE KNOW THIS AND ARE HAPPY TAKING THAT RISK.
Just because you aren't happy taking that risk doesn't mean that everyone else is misunderstanding the risk. They are just either less risk averse than you or have more faith in the guys involved than you do.
With this kind of budget, I want them to get some top-notch voice talent in.
Like... Eric Idle. And John Cleese. Carlos Alazraqui, Tara Strong, Mark Hamill. Mmm.
This post highlights an interesting aspect to look forward to with this entire project, just how many people are going to be butt-hurt when the game isn't what THEY wanted and THEY paid for. It's all so vague so far. OLD SCHOOL! POINT AND CLICK! ADVENTURE!
I can't wait for the shit-storm when details come out for this thing.
The thing is, this is Double Fine. They've been good to us and seem like stand up people. Nearly any other developer wouldn't find anywhere near this much success.
reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
edited February 2012
People are willing to pay money for an adventure game, but there are no new ones being made.
Double Fine wants to make an adventure game, but publishers won't finance an adventure game.
People finance an adventure game, Double Fine makes it.
I don't know where all these unscrupulous doomsday scenarios are coming from. The whole thing is a bunch of people who love adventure games getting together and getting an adventure game made, and thankfully one of the parties involved is a professional video game making crew.
reVerse on
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
Stacking is a puzzle game, Costume Quest is a jRPG lite.
^ this
Also, it's not like those are the ONLY two games Tim Schafer has ever put out -_-
(for the record, played and loved Costume Quest, never got around to Stacking)
Adventure games are puzzle games, though. Stacking just replaced "inventory" for "who are you possessing", like Phoenix Wright swaps inventory out for "Evidence" and "Use Item" for "Present Item". Plain "Adventure Gaming" is puzzles woven into a storyline. Stacking is still an adventure game, albeit a nontraditional one.
I never really followed that particular game that closely. Regardless though, it's not the same type of game as this one, which is a traditional point-and-click adventure. Saying you have to support games that are nothing like this to be able to support this is silly. Especially when Schafer has made quite a few excellent point & click adventure games in his career
To be honest, their "reputation" only matters to a tiny tiny number of their consumer base (mainly, people who post at forums). Not that they would take the money and piss it away but they totally could and it wouldn't mean a damn thing going forward to them.
You mean the same people who are donating? Yes, we're a relatively small number of people, but this shows what we can do. You think the masses you're talking about have donated a cent?
I just think its a terrible legal structure to make this game and because of that, it could lead to unscrupulous results. I am not saying it will.
In alot of ways I am happy that so many people supported the game, but I will never support a project with this set up through donations.
Will I order the game? Possibly. Will I have taken any risk? No. Should people understand the problems with how this is done? Yes. Should you donate? Its up to you, but please understand the risks you are taking.
Why do you keep using the word donate? It's not helping your argument to ignore all the people telling you it's not a donation.
It is entirely a donation. I mean thats what kickstarter is. Its for donations. Their rules expressly prohibit any return on investment or profit sharing. Its not an investment.
You are giving someone money and they have all the power to decide how to use that money to create something. I am not sure how else you can see it.
To repeat, you have no legal right to the product. Its not a pre-order. Its not an advanced sale.
Its a donation to a for profit company with the idea that they will take the money and create a product. If they do, they will send you one. If not, thanks for the donation.
It's not a donation. Find the word donation on that site.
It's a pledge to fund a creative project for which you receive a reward. That's what Kickstarter is. You aren't donating anything. This isn't a charity.
It's great because all the time people want these niche titles (2d Rayman, point and click Back to the Future) and they get made and then don't sell as expected. This forces the consumers hand - it says "we're willing to make this game you claim to want, but you need to ensure us that you truly will buy it".
People are willing to pay money for an adventure game, but there are no new ones being made.
Double Fine wants to make an adventure game, but publishers won't finance an adventure game.
People finance an adventure game, Double Fine makes it.
I don't know where all these unscrupulous doomsday scenarios are coming from. The whole thing is a bunch of people who love adventure games getting together and getting an adventure game made, and thankfully one of the parties involved is a professional video game making crew.
"There are no new adventure games being made" is pretty much bullshit. As the video points out, Germany's pumping out plenty, and if the Blackwell games, Gemeni Rue, The Next BIG Thing, The Book of Unwritten Tales, Gray Matter, everything Telltale makes (Monkey Island, BttF, Sam and Max, Jurassic Park, Law & Order, etc) are any indication, then no, the genre isn't dead.
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
People are willing to pay money for an adventure game, but there are no new ones being made.
Double Fine wants to make an adventure game, but publishers won't finance an adventure game.
People finance an adventure game, Double Fine makes it.
I don't know where all these unscrupulous doomsday scenarios are coming from. The whole thing is a bunch of people who love adventure games getting together and getting an adventure game made, and thankfully one of the parties involved is a professional video game making crew.
"There are no new adventure games being made" is pretty much bullshit. As the video points out, Germany's pumping out plenty, and if the Blackwell games, Gemeni Rue, The Next BIG Thing, The Book of Unwritten Tales, Gray Matter, everything Telltale makes (Monkey Island, BttF, Sam and Max, Jurassic Park, Law & Order, etc) are any indication, then no, the genre isn't dead.
I forgot about Telltale. Didn't the Internet decide that they're shit now?
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admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
I dunno about shit, but their formula has gotten a bit stale.
Jurassic Park went a little too far down the "Interactive Movie" route, by replacing puzzles with QTEs. And episodic adventure games end up a little narrow in scope, because of the bite-sizing going on.
I just think its a terrible legal structure to make this game and because of that, it could lead to unscrupulous results. I am not saying it will.
In alot of ways I am happy that so many people supported the game, but I will never support a project with this set up through donations.
Will I order the game? Possibly. Will I have taken any risk? No. Should people understand the problems with how this is done? Yes. Should you donate? Its up to you, but please understand the risks you are taking.
Why do you keep using the word donate? It's not helping your argument to ignore all the people telling you it's not a donation.
It is entirely a donation. I mean thats what kickstarter is. Its for donations. Their rules expressly prohibit any return on investment or profit sharing. Its not an investment.
You are giving someone money and they have all the power to decide how to use that money to create something. I am not sure how else you can see it.
To repeat, you have no legal right to the product. Its not a pre-order. Its not an advanced sale.
Its a donation to a for profit company with the idea that they will take the money and create a product. If they do, they will send you one. If not, thanks for the donation.
It's not a donation. Find the word donation on that site.
It's a pledge to fund a creative project for which you receive a reward. That's what Kickstarter is. You aren't donating anything. This isn't a charity.
Yeah, pledge is the right word to use here I think.
@Smaug6 I agree with you that legally, its very easy for the creator of a kickstarter to fuck over the pledgers and take the money. The thing is though that kickstarter doesn't use legality to enforce that creators carry through with the project, it uses reputation. For anyone in business(and hell, just about any other field) reputation is everything, and if you split on a kickstarter your reputation and career are likely ruined.
I just think its a terrible legal structure to make this game and because of that, it could lead to unscrupulous results. I am not saying it will.
In alot of ways I am happy that so many people supported the game, but I will never support a project with this set up through donations.
Will I order the game? Possibly. Will I have taken any risk? No. Should people understand the problems with how this is done? Yes. Should you donate? Its up to you, but please understand the risks you are taking.
Why do you keep using the word donate? It's not helping your argument to ignore all the people telling you it's not a donation.
It is entirely a donation. I mean thats what kickstarter is. Its for donations. Their rules expressly prohibit any return on investment or profit sharing. Its not an investment.
You are giving someone money and they have all the power to decide how to use that money to create something. I am not sure how else you can see it.
To repeat, you have no legal right to the product. Its not a pre-order. Its not an advanced sale.
Its a donation to a for profit company with the idea that they will take the money and create a product. If they do, they will send you one. If not, thanks for the donation.
It's not a donation. Find the word donation on that site.
It's a pledge to fund a creative project for which you receive a reward. That's what Kickstarter is. You aren't donating anything. This isn't a charity.
Yeah, pledge is the right word to use here I think.
@Smaug6 I agree with you that legally, its very easy for the creator of a kickstarter to fuck over the pledgers and take the money. The thing is though that kickstarter doesn't use legality to enforce that creators carry through with the project, it uses reputation. For anyone in business(and hell, just about any other field) reputation is everything, and if you split on a kickstarter your reputation and career are likely ruined.
Yeah going over it, I think the reward may qualify as a unilateral contract, though its unclear. So there maybe some legal protection, but still zero guarantee on quality.
I guess in the end it front loads the risk on the pledgor's and gives them little protection. Yeah its an interesting idea to use reputation effects to enforce something. That said, this is a very big test of the kickstarter system.
People are willing to pay money for an adventure game, but there are no new ones being made.
Double Fine wants to make an adventure game, but publishers won't finance an adventure game.
People finance an adventure game, Double Fine makes it.
I don't know where all these unscrupulous doomsday scenarios are coming from. The whole thing is a bunch of people who love adventure games getting together and getting an adventure game made, and thankfully one of the parties involved is a professional video game making crew.
"There are no new adventure games being made" is pretty much bullshit. As the video points out, Germany's pumping out plenty, and if the Blackwell games, Gemeni Rue, The Next BIG Thing, The Book of Unwritten Tales, Gray Matter, everything Telltale makes (Monkey Island, BttF, Sam and Max, Jurassic Park, Law & Order, etc) are any indication, then no, the genre isn't dead.
I forgot about Telltale. Didn't the Internet decide that they're shit now?
It's not that "no new adventure games are made", I guess, it's that...
No new Tim Schafer adventure games are made. That's the distinction.
Imagine comi, but in 1080p, with 30fps hand drawn animations and watercolor painted backgrounds... that's what extra money could bring in. Full orchestrated score, with Michael land writing the music. There's a lot that a larger budget could bring to this... more money is more people doing development work. At 400000 they would be limited to 3d... with 2 to 3 million they could do 2d animations... or try to get liscencing rights... to monkey island.... and Gilbert could make mi3 his way. Who knows. All we know is money can help make a better game, and I trust them to spend it wisely.
No I don't.
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ShimshaiFlush with Success!Isle of EmeraldRegistered Userregular
I think Trust really is the key word in all this.
Steam/Origin: Shimshai
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MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
I'm honestly not understanding the level of quasi-hostility and negativity this project is garnering from select people.
I'm honestly not understanding the level of quasi-hostility and negativity this project is garnering from select people.
Agreed. It's a company with a great reputation asking for early preorders to fund one of their dream projects. And if you're a big fan with extra money, you can pay extra and get collector's items. Not seeing the problem.
Exactly. These guys, this company, has a reputation of making things I love. Consistantly through my life I've enjoyed their projects. I trust them. Their fans obviously trust them. And if they betray that trust with this, they're finished. These are their diehard fans pledging... they will turn on them if the fuck everyone over.
I'm honestly not understanding the level of quasi-hostility and negativity this project is garnering from select people.
Well, it can't be that much hostility if they've gotten A MILLION DOLLARS out of it.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
Tim should use the extra cash to buy the Maniac Mansion license from Lucas... not like they're fucking using it :P And he's already got Ron Gilbert over there :P Just need to get Grossman on board and bam, Adventure Game magic.
Tim should use the extra cash to buy the Maniac Mansion license from Lucas... not like they're fucking using it :P And he's already got Ron Gilbert over there :P Just need to get Grossman on board and bam, Adventure Game magic.
Don't remind people in power of old licenses... they may turn them into FPS'es.
GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited February 2012
I'm not understanding the quasi-hostility either. This isn't like Joe McJustboughtgamemakerpro asking for 400k to build a game. This is an established, successful, beloved and trusted company saying "We want to make this game we know you want, but publishers won't invest, help".
Obviously they struck a cord...nearly a million clams in two days 24 hours.
I'm not understanding the quasi-hostility either. This isn't like Joe McJustboughtgamemakerpro asking for 400k to build a game. This is an established, successful, beloved and trusted company saying "We want to make this game we know you want, but publishers won't invest, help".
Obviously they struck a cord...nearly a million clams in two days.
Correction here: A million dollars in less than 24 hours.
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
If giving Tim Schafer money is wrong, then quite frankly there is no need to ever be right in this world again.
Posts
Just because you aren't happy taking that risk doesn't mean that everyone else is misunderstanding the risk. They are just either less risk averse than you or have more faith in the guys involved than you do.
This post highlights an interesting aspect to look forward to with this entire project, just how many people are going to be butt-hurt when the game isn't what THEY wanted and THEY paid for. It's all so vague so far. OLD SCHOOL! POINT AND CLICK! ADVENTURE!
I can't wait for the shit-storm when details come out for this thing.
Change Nolan North to Steve Blum and I'm doubling my investment.
Except... he'd actually pull it off somehow.
Steam: MightyPotatoKing
Double Fine wants to make an adventure game, but publishers won't finance an adventure game.
People finance an adventure game, Double Fine makes it.
I don't know where all these unscrupulous doomsday scenarios are coming from. The whole thing is a bunch of people who love adventure games getting together and getting an adventure game made, and thankfully one of the parties involved is a professional video game making crew.
I never really followed that particular game that closely. Regardless though, it's not the same type of game as this one, which is a traditional point-and-click adventure. Saying you have to support games that are nothing like this to be able to support this is silly. Especially when Schafer has made quite a few excellent point & click adventure games in his career
You mean the same people who are donating? Yes, we're a relatively small number of people, but this shows what we can do. You think the masses you're talking about have donated a cent?
Steam: MightyPotatoKing
It's not a donation. Find the word donation on that site.
It's a pledge to fund a creative project for which you receive a reward. That's what Kickstarter is. You aren't donating anything. This isn't a charity.
Just.
Holy shit.
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Twitter 3DS: 0860 - 3257 - 2516
Via twitter:
Via PC Gamer:
Edit: Just looked, people have tossed $899,626 their way, more than double their goal ... :O
Also I owe them for Brutal Legend, I bought a second copy for a mate, even new, that only cost £5.
Five freaking pounds.
If all my $30 gets me is the soundtrack and being part of this as a way of saying thank you, I'm happy.
If the game is even half as good as Brutal Legend or Iron Brigade I'll be chuffed and feel quids in mate.
I forgot about Telltale. Didn't the Internet decide that they're shit now?
Yeah, pledge is the right word to use here I think.
@Smaug6 I agree with you that legally, its very easy for the creator of a kickstarter to fuck over the pledgers and take the money. The thing is though that kickstarter doesn't use legality to enforce that creators carry through with the project, it uses reputation. For anyone in business(and hell, just about any other field) reputation is everything, and if you split on a kickstarter your reputation and career are likely ruined.
Yeah going over it, I think the reward may qualify as a unilateral contract, though its unclear. So there maybe some legal protection, but still zero guarantee on quality.
I guess in the end it front loads the risk on the pledgor's and gives them little protection. Yeah its an interesting idea to use reputation effects to enforce something. That said, this is a very big test of the kickstarter system.
It's not that "no new adventure games are made", I guess, it's that...
No new Tim Schafer adventure games are made. That's the distinction.
Agreed. It's a company with a great reputation asking for early preorders to fund one of their dream projects. And if you're a big fan with extra money, you can pay extra and get collector's items. Not seeing the problem.
Zeboyd Games Development Blog
Steam ID : rwb36, Twitter : Werezompire, Facebook : Zeboyd Games
Ri-goddamn-diculous.
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
Don't remind people in power of old licenses... they may turn them into FPS'es.
EDIT: Damn you @Caedere
8-) I'm just awesome like that.
Obviously they struck a cord...nearly a million clams in two days 24 hours.
twitch.tv/Taramoor
@TaramoorPlays
Taramoor on Youtube
This is fantastic.
What was the first one?