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Edinburgh Manor (Mini Phalla) Day 6: Mafia and Princess Victory!
So...on the sheet before last, grimmy's trap kill on obi went through even though he was roleblocked?
I'm a bit curious about that too - although as I had to set my traps so early I think it's possible that I had to be roleblocked a day out of sync. Obi's block would have taken effect the next day, is my thinking. Not sure though.
Also, operating on the (flawed) assumption that the Police Man was the seer had me seriously underestimating the village network all game long. I'd like to point out, however, that almost all of the traps that didn't go off were meant for B:L.
Thanks for a great game, Figgy. I found it very tense.
Mafia actions that happen during the day are always going to screw the village, and with two mafia kills plus a sk kill a night in a 25 man game, I can't believe that we lasted this long. The vote is always going to be cemented before 7, so the location provided nothing for the village and a permanent two kills for the mafia.
The trap went off just over half the time, so I guess it didn't? I know you guys felt powerless against it, but you really weren't trying much to avoid it. The mafia didn't have two kills. They had one collective kill, and one kill that they could sometimes get. They got it 4 out of 7 times.
If someone said, "hey, let's just change locations at the last second and see what happens!" you would have been able to almost nullify it. After three days of trapping, there'd be a 40% chance you'd get hit.
You can't analyze an arbitrary time limit, and the village lost around four people a night, a large percent of the max population each night. That's a huge disadvantage. The trap mechanic itself was nearly 20 percent of the village's deaths. Plus, it was directed, and they had a power seer, which meant they could kill two specials a night.
We also were trying to avoid traps, but no one would ever have guessed a during the day mechanic, because those are vanishingly rare. The times where we did switch after the cutoff, we did because we thought they wouldn't think to put a trap there. The during the day mechanic was never going to be guessed. I don't really know why you thought that would be easier to analyze, since it is a given that all actions are put in the night before, and is what we immediately thought the mechanic was.
Thanks for running, Figgy!
I really liked the narrations. I don't know if the balance was too bad. Just because the trap had an atypical mechanic doesn't mean it was broken
4 no village aligned may have been a stretch, but that would be my only real objection. For a first game I think you did really well.
Mafia actions that happen during the day are always going to screw the village, and with two mafia kills plus a sk kill a night in a 25 man game, I can't believe that we lasted this long. The vote is always going to be cemented before 7, so the location provided nothing for the village and a permanent two kills for the mafia.
The trap went off just over half the time, so I guess it didn't? I know you guys felt powerless against it, but you really weren't trying much to avoid it. The mafia didn't have two kills. They had one collective kill, and one kill that they could sometimes get. They got it 4 out of 7 times.
If someone said, "hey, let's just change locations at the last second and see what happens!" you would have been able to almost nullify it. After three days of trapping, there'd be a 40% chance you'd get hit.
You can't analyze an arbitrary time limit, and the village lost around four people a night, a large percent of the max population each night. That's a huge disadvantage. The trap mechanic itself was nearly 20 percent of the village's deaths. Plus, it was directed, and they had a power seer, which meant they could kill two specials a night.
We also were trying to avoid traps, but no one would ever have guessed a during the day mechanic, because those are vanishingly rare. The times where we did switch after the cutoff, we did because we thought they wouldn't think to put a trap there. The during the day mechanic was never going to be guessed. I don't really know why you thought that would be easier to analyze, since it is a given that all actions are put in the night before, and is what we immediately thought the mechanic was.
To be fair, you guys had a second vig in a 25 person game. If SLyM had been around long enough to hook up with the network, you guys would have romped through us. It's just, sometimes, luck.
Mafia actions that happen during the day are always going to screw the village, and with two mafia kills plus a sk kill a night in a 25 man game, I can't believe that we lasted this long. The vote is always going to be cemented before 7, so the location provided nothing for the village and a permanent two kills for the mafia.
The trap went off just over half the time, so I guess it didn't? I know you guys felt powerless against it, but you really weren't trying much to avoid it. The mafia didn't have two kills. They had one collective kill, and one kill that they could sometimes get. They got it 4 out of 7 times.
If someone said, "hey, let's just change locations at the last second and see what happens!" you would have been able to almost nullify it. After three days of trapping, there'd be a 40% chance you'd get hit.
You can't analyze an arbitrary time limit, and the village lost around four people a night, a large percent of the max population each night. That's a huge disadvantage. The trap mechanic itself was nearly 20 percent of the village's deaths. Plus, it was directed, and they had a power seer, which meant they could kill two specials a night.
We also were trying to avoid traps, but no one would ever have guessed a during the day mechanic, because those are vanishingly rare. The times where we did switch after the cutoff, we did because we thought they wouldn't think to put a trap there. The during the day mechanic was never going to be guessed. I don't really know why you thought that would be easier to analyze, since it is a given that all actions are put in the night before, and is what we immediately thought the mechanic was.
To be fair, you guys had a second vig in a 25 person game. If SLyM had been around long enough to hook up with the network, you guys would have romped through us. It's just, sometimes, luck.
The two vigs could only combine in the attic, so there was actually just one vig. We couldn't stay in the attic because we would have just been trapped every night for sure.
The two vigs could only combine in the attic, so there was actually just one vig. We couldn't stay in the attic because we would have just been trapped every night for sure.
Oh, man. Just read the soldier's description -- Cayrus was so always-stabby that I assumed that you had a vig-and-a-half. Yeah, that was pretty rough for you guys.
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AssuranIs swinging on the SpiralRegistered Userregular
Actually, just read the spreadsheet, so I know I wasn't seered. What made you choose me to kill of Cayrus?
Bl called it because of your location voting.
What is weird is that I would have voted the same way on the locations if I was a villager. I voted with the village head and was adamant about the study. Honestly, I was curious about if the Ghost had powers we could learn. True, I know we were trapping the study, but I would have wanted to go there anyways.
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
It was a good settings/naration situation. Also, I kind of enjoy now that I won by being evil basically, but my starting plan was to hook up the village with a d1 network head. Since they didn't want to risk it, I was okay going for survival too.
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
You guys were neutral? My role stated explicitly that I was village alligned.
To repeat my early post:
You are the royal Princess. You have escaped the palace in order to live a commoner’s life for an evening. What better way than to attend a dinner party? You have decided that your cover will be a farmhand. You’ve always thought farm life romantic, and the idea of tending beautiful horses and sleeping in hay lofts each day sounds wonderful. It’s much more believable than your brother’s foolish circus idea, that’s for certain.
You are allied with the townspeople, but your loyalties lie with your Queen. You were having fun at first, but now you’re scared and want to go home. You win by surviving until the end of the game. If only there was someone here who knew who you were?
You are masoned with Tayrun, the Prince.
I took that us being allied with the town let us win even if we were dead, so I planned to throw Tayrun under the bus D1, have him vouche for me, then lead the village to victory (or defeat). Everyone let people talk them out of trusting me, so I went quiet(er) and planned to ride it out til the end.
Also, what was your win-con Bedlam?
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
Yeah 2 mafia kills really aren't uncommon for minis anyway. It wasn't really that unbalanced, especially compared to some other recent games that will go nameless
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
Also, I asked Tayrun to verify me as NOT neutral, but he didn't wanna.
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
Also, I asked Tayrun to verify me as NOT neutral, but he didn't wanna.
Why would he? You were going to take him out in order to better your own standing, and it was already clear that the village did not trust you. You made a pretty bad move. Your role was intended to be an outlier "faction" of three who could effectively work with either side, but you'd most likely want to side with the village. If you would have teamed up from the start, you'd be three "confirmed" and bettered the odds for the village. Instead of wasting the first two nights of voting taking out your two team mates.
I don't know. It just seems to me like you said, "Fuck this. I'm gonna be a huge dick."
And then you were.
Edit: And in response to your inevitable "I still won!" reply, you did so by ruining the game for others (your two team mates), in my opinion. Your role was something I created in order to give a few people something 'extra' to do, and possibly as an RP opportunity should you want it.
And even if Bedlam did include me in your PM that last night before he died, it wouldn't have mattered since he was voted out. Basically, I truly feel you were a huge prick by voting out Tayrun at the start of the game.
"Hey buddy, I'm gonna throw you under the bus. Lie about our role in the thread so I can have fun at the expense of you getting booted out day 1, k?"
I wish I had more time to write up my thoughts on this game. It had some really awesome mechanics and ideas and the narration was top notch. When Phallance is over imma come back and give you detailed feedback.
I wish I had more time to write up my thoughts on this game. It had some really awesome mechanics and ideas and the narration was top notch. When Phallance is over imma come back and give you detailed feedback.
Also @egos WHY DID YOU KEEP TELLING US TO MOVE THE SEER OFF BL!
Believing his butchery lies!
you guys didn't listen to me when you were considering it that, so that's what matters :P
edit: the damage was already done, the day you were even considering it and I believe the seer was still on him and you died- so no results....
Also to be fair I was in favor of us getting the extra kill vs the fake out
Egos on
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
Honestly, for the narration, I was always super super worried I would out someone. I wanted to have the narration provide clues for those who cares to look, but I didn't want someone to be outed because of it. For example, I did not narrate Cayrus's vig hit on facetious because I couldn't without making it obvious he was the ghost. I also didn't want to turn all powers into seers by narrating blocks/roleblocks/bus drives too much. I realize I did narrate lonelyahava's bus drive that killed SLyM, but it was really only a true reveal to the mafia. Who already knew, because they seered her Day 1.
On a side note, at the start of the game, Retaba had PM'd me before I sent out the role PMs. He said he had reserved, but he'd like to instead "play along" with someone else. Basically, that person would share all info with him, but he'd still be out of the game and just an observer. That gave me an idea. The ghost was already going to be possessing the gardener to start, so what if the gardener was facetious but the ghost was Retaba? The game would play out like it did, but when facetious was hit the first time, he'd die (narration indicates the gardener was killed), and he'd be out of the game. But then Retaba would enter, as the ghost.
The problem of course being that people would just vote him out because he's the ghost. But I thought it'd be neat if killing the gardener would reveal the "true" ghost.
That trap/locking mechanic seemed a little overpowered though. Didn't seem too hard to predict the 1st/2nd room choices by 5 hours before closing. Throw in a serial killer and it seemed stacked against the village. It seemed the village did especially well yet still lost.
2 kills is pretty damn standard for the mafia to have and ours could have been taken away. Not sure why people are bitching about that. If anything it should be all of the mafia having powers. And the village having powers up the wazoo also- and the vigis being confined to rooms.
You’re here from the palace; one of the Queen's Royal Palace Guards. Oddly enough, no one seems to notice that you are a stranger. The prince and princess have escaped, and the Queen has tasked you with finding them. It will be your neck if a single hair on their head comes to harm. You know that if you could just find them, you could focus your attention on other things.
You are allied with the townspeople, but your loyalties lie with your Queen. You win when you find the Queen’s children and survive until the end of the game.
The bolded part makes me think we couldnt win with the mafia. But the survivor part does suggest neutrality.
Oh, right, Figgy. Yeah I can't honestly say that I had any fun playing in this one, but thank you for running it!
Yeah. wanted to say that despite some frustrations the location thing seemed really cool. As for me and @Tayrun I cant see anyway where we dont grudge sportzboy
Oh, most definitely @Bedlam. We will look back on this moment fondly as the time we went from being friends to being best phallabuddies, united against those who are assholes for no good reason.
Taya will be so jealous of the relationship we will forge.
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sportzboytjwsqueeeeeezzeeeesome more tax breaks outRegistered Userregular
What? I won, so the team won. It couldn't have gone any better! Also, the whole "were we village or were we neutral" thing was a little confusing. I guess we could have asked.
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
So you're admitting malice but also trying to blame incompetence? :P
I mean, my original plan was I start a vote on you, you out me as masoned partner, village allied, we win.
The fallback plan once you didn't out me as village, and once people were like (mostly mafia iirc?) "HERP DERP YEA JUST GIVE THE MAFIA THE GAME" was screw you all I'm just laying low.
Walkerdog on MTGO
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
1. I asked you in a PM if you wanted me to out you as my survival neutral mason partner. You said yes. So I did.
2. Outing you as village seemed utterly unbelievable after I saw that my death colour was clearly not village-green.
So what you're saying is that you decided without consultation to kill your mason partner, in order to convince the village that even though your mason died not-village, you were totally village aligned and hence trustworthy. Then for an encore you had Bedlam, the faction guard your role PM told you existed, killed.
This was your brilliant plan?
I agree with Figgy, your victory here is an illustration of the fact that even a blind squirrel will occasionally find a nut.
I'm glad you've realised that you deserve the gruding you'll get, though.
I'm also in favour of anything that brings @Bedlam and I closer together, and I wish I knew how to do that raising-eyebrows smiley.
Posts
I'm a bit curious about that too - although as I had to set my traps so early I think it's possible that I had to be roleblocked a day out of sync. Obi's block would have taken effect the next day, is my thinking. Not sure though.
Also, operating on the (flawed) assumption that the Police Man was the seer had me seriously underestimating the village network all game long. I'd like to point out, however, that almost all of the traps that didn't go off were meant for B:L.
Thanks for a great game, Figgy. I found it very tense.
You can't analyze an arbitrary time limit, and the village lost around four people a night, a large percent of the max population each night. That's a huge disadvantage. The trap mechanic itself was nearly 20 percent of the village's deaths. Plus, it was directed, and they had a power seer, which meant they could kill two specials a night.
We also were trying to avoid traps, but no one would ever have guessed a during the day mechanic, because those are vanishingly rare. The times where we did switch after the cutoff, we did because we thought they wouldn't think to put a trap there. The during the day mechanic was never going to be guessed. I don't really know why you thought that would be easier to analyze, since it is a given that all actions are put in the night before, and is what we immediately thought the mechanic was.
I really liked the narrations. I don't know if the balance was too bad. Just because the trap had an atypical mechanic doesn't mean it was broken
4 no village aligned may have been a stretch, but that would be my only real objection. For a first game I think you did really well.
Bl called it because of your location voting.
Believing his butchery lies!
To be fair, you guys had a second vig in a 25 person game. If SLyM had been around long enough to hook up with the network, you guys would have romped through us. It's just, sometimes, luck.
The two vigs could only combine in the attic, so there was actually just one vig. We couldn't stay in the attic because we would have just been trapped every night for sure.
Oh, man. Just read the soldier's description -- Cayrus was so always-stabby that I assumed that you had a vig-and-a-half. Yeah, that was pretty rough for you guys.
What is weird is that I would have voted the same way on the locations if I was a villager. I voted with the village head and was adamant about the study. Honestly, I was curious about if the Ghost had powers we could learn. True, I know we were trapping the study, but I would have wanted to go there anyways.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I was supposed to convince the village specials to reveal to someone who could win with the mafia?
So, taking me out of the game for no good reason wasn't enough, but you wanted me to help you win while you did it?
Exactly!
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
To repeat my early post:
You are the royal Princess. You have escaped the palace in order to live a commoner’s life for an evening. What better way than to attend a dinner party? You have decided that your cover will be a farmhand. You’ve always thought farm life romantic, and the idea of tending beautiful horses and sleeping in hay lofts each day sounds wonderful. It’s much more believable than your brother’s foolish circus idea, that’s for certain.
You are allied with the townspeople, but your loyalties lie with your Queen. You were having fun at first, but now you’re scared and want to go home. You win by surviving until the end of the game. If only there was someone here who knew who you were?
You are masoned with Tayrun, the Prince.
I took that us being allied with the town let us win even if we were dead, so I planned to throw Tayrun under the bus D1, have him vouche for me, then lead the village to victory (or defeat). Everyone let people talk them out of trusting me, so I went quiet(er) and planned to ride it out til the end.
Also, what was your win-con Bedlam?
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
Why would he? You were going to take him out in order to better your own standing, and it was already clear that the village did not trust you. You made a pretty bad move. Your role was intended to be an outlier "faction" of three who could effectively work with either side, but you'd most likely want to side with the village. If you would have teamed up from the start, you'd be three "confirmed" and bettered the odds for the village. Instead of wasting the first two nights of voting taking out your two team mates.
I don't know. It just seems to me like you said, "Fuck this. I'm gonna be a huge dick."
And then you were.
Edit: And in response to your inevitable "I still won!" reply, you did so by ruining the game for others (your two team mates), in my opinion. Your role was something I created in order to give a few people something 'extra' to do, and possibly as an RP opportunity should you want it.
And even if Bedlam did include me in your PM that last night before he died, it wouldn't have mattered since he was voted out. Basically, I truly feel you were a huge prick by voting out Tayrun at the start of the game.
"Hey buddy, I'm gonna throw you under the bus. Lie about our role in the thread so I can have fun at the expense of you getting booted out day 1, k?"
Gee, why didn't Tayrun play along?
I wish I had more time to write up my thoughts on this game. It had some really awesome mechanics and ideas and the narration was top notch. When Phallance is over imma come back and give you detailed feedback.
Actually, yeah, I forgot to mention it - but the narration really was great.
I'd appreciate that!
you guys didn't listen to me when you were considering it that, so that's what matters :P
edit: the damage was already done, the day you were even considering it
Also to be fair I was in favor of us getting the extra kill vs the fake out
On a side note, at the start of the game, Retaba had PM'd me before I sent out the role PMs. He said he had reserved, but he'd like to instead "play along" with someone else. Basically, that person would share all info with him, but he'd still be out of the game and just an observer. That gave me an idea. The ghost was already going to be possessing the gardener to start, so what if the gardener was facetious but the ghost was Retaba? The game would play out like it did, but when facetious was hit the first time, he'd die (narration indicates the gardener was killed), and he'd be out of the game. But then Retaba would enter, as the ghost.
The problem of course being that people would just vote him out because he's the ghost. But I thought it'd be neat if killing the gardener would reveal the "true" ghost.
Steam: Chagrin LoL: Bonhomie
That trap/locking mechanic seemed a little overpowered though. Didn't seem too hard to predict the 1st/2nd room choices by 5 hours before closing. Throw in a serial killer and it seemed stacked against the village. It seemed the village did especially well yet still lost.
You are allied with the townspeople, but your loyalties lie with your Queen. You win when you find the Queen’s children and survive until the end of the game.
The bolded part makes me think we couldnt win with the mafia. But the survivor part does suggest neutrality.
Taya will be so jealous of the relationship we will forge.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I mean, if I win, the team wins. Right? Right?????
I deserve a pretty good grudging though, but I thought you'd let me get us a village head going for a win for you.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
I mean, my original plan was I start a vote on you, you out me as masoned partner, village allied, we win.
The fallback plan once you didn't out me as village, and once people were like (mostly mafia iirc?) "HERP DERP YEA JUST GIVE THE MAFIA THE GAME" was screw you all I'm just laying low.
TylerJ on League of Legends (it's free and fun!)
1. I asked you in a PM if you wanted me to out you as my survival neutral mason partner. You said yes. So I did.
2. Outing you as village seemed utterly unbelievable after I saw that my death colour was clearly not village-green.
So what you're saying is that you decided without consultation to kill your mason partner, in order to convince the village that even though your mason died not-village, you were totally village aligned and hence trustworthy. Then for an encore you had Bedlam, the faction guard your role PM told you existed, killed.
This was your brilliant plan?
I agree with Figgy, your victory here is an illustration of the fact that even a blind squirrel will occasionally find a nut.
I'm glad you've realised that you deserve the gruding you'll get, though.
I'm also in favour of anything that brings @Bedlam and I closer together, and I wish I knew how to do that raising-eyebrows smiley.