Yeah, I'm not going to dig through a bunch of old mafia proboards from when I was last playing regularly some nine or so months ago to find one where someone says "Yeah voting for Kime is pretty safe on day one". If there has been a big movement against voting for Kime in the last 9 months then I'd love to hear about it, but it sure doesn't seem like it.
Do you have stronger theories Figgy or is it just "throw up our hands and act like there's no possible way to figure anything out or work together" day?
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
Yeah, I'm not going to dig through a bunch of old mafia proboards from when I was last playing regularly some nine or so months ago to find one where someone says "Yeah voting for Kime is pretty safe on day one". If there has been a big movement against voting for Kime in the last 9 months then I'd love to hear about it, but it sure doesn't seem like it.
Do you have stronger theories Figgy or is it just "throw up our hands and act like there's no possible way to figure anything out or work together" day?
There go them goal posts.
You said "start." A bandwagon.
Mafia don't generally start bandwagons. Let alone on Kime. On day 1.
Nowhere did I indicate I'm just throwing my hands up because it's day 1. My comment was specifically to you. Not that there's "no possible way to figure anything out." Your posts smell like misdirection. I disagree with almost everything you've said in this thread.
The statements "voting for Kime" and "starting or perpetuating a bandwagon on Kime" mean the same thing. I don't see how I moved the goalposts there.
The notion that mafia don't start bandwagons on day one is ludicrous. Look back at the currently going phalla in D&D. Many of the very first people to vote in that phalla we now know were mafia.
The statements "voting for Kime" and "starting or perpetuating a bandwagon on Kime" mean the same thing. I don't see how I moved the goalposts there.
The notion that mafia don't start bandwagons on day one is ludicrous. Look back at the currently going phalla in D&D. Many of the very first people to vote in that phalla we now know were mafia.
3rd, 7th, 10th, and 12th (out of 65) for reference. I'm the host so I happened to have the spreadsheet open... on the island.
Whatever. Metagaming!
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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AssuranIs swinging on the SpiralRegistered Userregular
I would just like to say, I'm not mafia for a change.
It feels great, in case you're wondering.
I still don't agree with telling each other stats, even if I'm going along with it reluctantly. Too much info given to the mafia.
So, silly idea: would it be helpful for us to distinguish ourselves by tribe somehow in the thread? Like Team Wilson posts a Team Wilson at the top of their post while Team THB posts a Team THB at the top of theirs. It'd help me keep where everyone is straight.
enlightenedbum on
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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AssuranIs swinging on the SpiralRegistered Userregular
So, what you're saying is faction game is faction-ey?
So, silly idea: would it be helpful for us to distinguish ourselves by tribe somehow in the thread? Like Team Wilson posts a Team Wilson at the top of their post while Team THB posts a Team THB at the top of theirs. It'd help me keep where everyone is straight.
You could reference my spreadsheet. :rotate:
Basically, anyone voting kime is on Team Stinkbutt. Those voting Kilnaga are Classy Lads.
I could, but I'm lazy.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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FiggyFighter of the night manChampion of the sunRegistered Userregular
Nowhere did I indicate I'm just throwing my hands up because it's day 1. My comment was specifically to you. Not that there's "no possible way to figure anything out." Your posts smell like misdirection. I disagree with almost everything you've said in this thread.
So you're continuing your strategy of being negative and providing nothing of value? OK.
Providing suggestions or stop whinging.
You're always so hostile to everyone. I really hope you're a nicer person in real life.
Nowhere did I indicate I'm just throwing my hands up because it's day 1. My comment was specifically to you. Not that there's "no possible way to figure anything out." Your posts smell like misdirection. I disagree with almost everything you've said in this thread.
So you're continuing your strategy of being negative and providing nothing of value? OK.
Providing suggestions or stop whinging.
You're always so hostile to everyone. I really hope you're a nicer person in real life.
There's no actual segregation of population going on - unless MrT artificially arranged two mafia members on each team, any random elimination on either team is going have the same chance at hitting a bad guy.
And you want constructive analysis, so here you go:
It's far more likely that the mafia were evenly divided than it is they weren't.
In every phalla I've been in where there are separated teams/roles, mafia has been artificially assigned to be even across the board.
Take Obi's Star Wars Phalla, for example, mafia were spread across the Padawan, Sith, and Council evenly according to percentage. It makes perfect sense that half the mafia will be on one tribe and half on the other. In fact, if they weren't, the village would be at a pretty large disadvantage. Say 4 mafia end up on Wilsons, that's almost enough to control the private vote. Take out a couple non-mafia on that tribe and you might as well have a mafia-run tribe.
Further, it didn't even have to be an artificial mafia assignment. Roles were sent out in advance, before the tribes were created. That means, mafia was assigned at random, perfectly legitimately, and MrT then just put two on one tribe, two on the other, and RNGed the village into the tribes. Easy.
I'm not saying we should kill off one tribe to increase our chances of finding mafia, because it's going to be pretty damn hard to get 8/20 players to agree to become cannon fodder, but I think it's fairly safe to say we're looking at even mafia distribution. Mafia wouldn't want us to assume that, of course, because any info we gain is harmful to them. Right now, all the village has is numbers, and even that is tarnished by the tribal split.
I don't want to assume the intentional 2/2 split because as you correctly point out that distribution would be a significant advantage for the village and our gracious host might have avoided it for balance purposes.
That being said, because it's possible he did arrange things this way we can use it to create leads down the road. For example, I think if we manage to kill two mafia members from one tribe we should focus on the other one, unless we've got a really good reason not to.
I'm almost certain that some of the people who were posting in the thread and didn't get directly involved in the discussion of public versus private action and immunity idols were mafia. Kilnaga fits that bill and has the vote lead despite a strange switch by Void Slayer to Kime.
To my memory in these games the mafia also starts or perpetuates day 1 kimewagons sometimes, on the theory that they basically go unnoticed.
There really wasn't much to discuss pre-tribe separation. I also didn't start a kime wagon. Kime had votes because no matter the game he is in he has the special power: vote magnet. Other people started the wagon on top of those votes and I'm swapping to the person with the next votes to me as a self-preservation measure.
Also, if we could be sure the mafia were spread evenly between the tribes I'd advocate voting out a person from the tribe who didn't lose the challenge so we can whittle down the tribes evenly (even though that vote would currently land on myself ). However, since there is no way to be sure of the distribution of the mafia I'm not sure that is the route to take here.
Kilnaga on
"The psychedelic mind is a higher dimensional mind, it is not fit for three dimensional space time."
- Terence McKenna
tzeentchlingDoctor of RocksOaklandRegistered Userregular
I'll mention that Kilnaga started the proboard for Team Tom Hanks Beard. In itself it proves nothing, but typically mafia don't take that kind of initiative, and I'd argue it ought to be enough to spare him a day-1ing (considering there's nothing else to go on right now).
During the ropes course, though, there were some that clearly fell behind. Langly and Fabulon Gayowski (Sir Fabulous) could not make their way across, hampering everyone behind them. Though there were stragglers on Tribe Tom Hanks’ Beard, they were fewer and less egregious. Tribe Wilson fell behind, losing their grasp on Immunity.
not indicate that Langly and Sir Fab were weak in the primary stat related to this challenge? Basically, did you just pick these two guys for funsies or can I analyze these narration bits?
No, you can analyze that.
It's just not... vital.
I probably shouldn't have made that statement, originally.
I'd have to disagree to some extent with silence benefits the mafia. It doesn't just benefit the mafia. As you stated the mafia are better served by sewing dissent. Everybody thinks "ohh hey, that guy isn't talking, he must be mafia." The mafia think this, and know everybody else does as well. It behooves them to involve themselves in the conversation to avoid that obvious association.
"The psychedelic mind is a higher dimensional mind, it is not fit for three dimensional space time."
- Terence McKenna
There's no actual segregation of population going on - unless MrT artificially arranged two mafia members on each team, any random elimination on either team is going have the same chance at hitting a bad guy.
And you want constructive analysis, so here you go:
It's far more likely that the mafia were evenly divided than it is they weren't.
In every phalla I've been in where there are separated teams/roles, mafia has been artificially assigned to be even across the board.
Take Obi's Star Wars Phalla, for example, mafia were spread across the Padawan, Sith, and Council evenly according to percentage. It makes perfect sense that half the mafia will be on one tribe and half on the other. In fact, if they weren't, the village would be at a pretty large disadvantage. Say 4 mafia end up on Wilsons, that's almost enough to control the private vote. Take out a couple non-mafia on that tribe and you might as well have a mafia-run tribe.
Further, it didn't even have to be an artificial mafia assignment. Roles were sent out in advance, before the tribes were created. That means, mafia was assigned at random, perfectly legitimately, and MrT then just put two on one tribe, two on the other, and RNGed the village into the tribes. Easy.
I'm not saying we should kill off one tribe to increase our chances of finding mafia, because it's going to be pretty damn hard to get 8/20 players to agree to become cannon fodder, but I think it's fairly safe to say we're looking at even mafia distribution. Mafia wouldn't want us to assume that, of course, because any info we gain is harmful to them. Right now, all the village has is numbers, and even that is tarnished by the tribal split.
No village specials. Let's keep that in mind.
The ther thing to consider is that this is not a pure faction game; at the very least, we know that the tribes will be merging at some point in the future. There may even be team switching like in the show, but that's speculation.
True.
But I still stand by my opinion that there is an equal number of mafia (probably 2) on each tribe. The fact that roles were sent out before the tribes were created means that this could have been achieved without gaming the RNG.
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The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
I guess you've just lost your touch. When was the last time you were evil? I mean, really evil?
I've just grown accustomed to the nicer, kinder, gooder Kime.
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Do you have stronger theories Figgy or is it just "throw up our hands and act like there's no possible way to figure anything out or work together" day?
There go them goal posts.
You said "start." A bandwagon.
Mafia don't generally start bandwagons. Let alone on Kime. On day 1.
Nowhere did I indicate I'm just throwing my hands up because it's day 1. My comment was specifically to you. Not that there's "no possible way to figure anything out." Your posts smell like misdirection. I disagree with almost everything you've said in this thread.
*grabs popcorn*
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
The notion that mafia don't start bandwagons on day one is ludicrous. Look back at the currently going phalla in D&D. Many of the very first people to vote in that phalla we now know were mafia.
3rd, 7th, 10th, and 12th (out of 65) for reference. I'm the host so I happened to have the spreadsheet open... on the island.
Whatever. Metagaming!
It feels great, in case you're wondering.
I still don't agree with telling each other stats, even if I'm going along with it reluctantly. Too much info given to the mafia.
Who would have thunk it.
I could, but I'm lazy.
You're always so hostile to everyone. I really hope you're a nicer person in real life.
What'd you expect from a Scion of Chaos?
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
And you want constructive analysis, so here you go:
It's far more likely that the mafia were evenly divided than it is they weren't.
In every phalla I've been in where there are separated teams/roles, mafia has been artificially assigned to be even across the board.
Take Obi's Star Wars Phalla, for example, mafia were spread across the Padawan, Sith, and Council evenly according to percentage. It makes perfect sense that half the mafia will be on one tribe and half on the other. In fact, if they weren't, the village would be at a pretty large disadvantage. Say 4 mafia end up on Wilsons, that's almost enough to control the private vote. Take out a couple non-mafia on that tribe and you might as well have a mafia-run tribe.
Further, it didn't even have to be an artificial mafia assignment. Roles were sent out in advance, before the tribes were created. That means, mafia was assigned at random, perfectly legitimately, and MrT then just put two on one tribe, two on the other, and RNGed the village into the tribes. Easy.
I'm not saying we should kill off one tribe to increase our chances of finding mafia, because it's going to be pretty damn hard to get 8/20 players to agree to become cannon fodder, but I think it's fairly safe to say we're looking at even mafia distribution. Mafia wouldn't want us to assume that, of course, because any info we gain is harmful to them. Right now, all the village has is numbers, and even that is tarnished by the tribal split.
No village specials. Let's keep that in mind.
That being said, because it's possible he did arrange things this way we can use it to create leads down the road. For example, I think if we manage to kill two mafia members from one tribe we should focus on the other one, unless we've got a really good reason not to.
There really wasn't much to discuss pre-tribe separation. I also didn't start a kime wagon. Kime had votes because no matter the game he is in he has the special power: vote magnet. Other people started the wagon on top of those votes and I'm swapping to the person with the next votes to me as a self-preservation measure.
Also, if we could be sure the mafia were spread evenly between the tribes I'd advocate voting out a person from the tribe who didn't lose the challenge so we can whittle down the tribes evenly (even though that vote would currently land on myself
- Terence McKenna
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No, you can analyze that.
It's just not... vital.
I probably shouldn't have made that statement, originally.
Yes.
Now who's the brains of the outfit?
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
- Terence McKenna
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
True.
But I still stand by my opinion that there is an equal number of mafia (probably 2) on each tribe. The fact that roles were sent out before the tribes were created means that this could have been achieved without gaming the RNG.
Lots of private orders missing... Remember that these count towards inactivus!
but right after my post you did!
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Wait, wait. Let's not be hasty he-
waitasecond
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