sanovahNerd of the WestSan Diego, CaliforniaRegistered Userregular
edited September 2012
I suggest that gangnam style be made the official PAX song and dance. I also suggest that attendees not be allowed past the queue room every morning until the entire room does the dance
TL;DR; Not-that-old-of-a-guy visits PAX for the first time, feels old and unremarkable in a sea of vigor and creativity, doesn't like loud flashing lights or the mewling of babes who dare question his most esteemed idols.
I had to cut that post to the TLDR. I just wanted to provide some insight to this: PAX Prime is in Seattle. Most of the attendees are Seattle locals. Seattle is a famously introverted city (we're all techies up here, or so it seems). The reason you didn't find a lot of conversations in lines is because of what we affectionately refer to as the "Seattle Freeze". It's not because the community is just not friendly.
That is an... interesting insight, particularly because I hadn't heard the term "Seattle Freeze" before. I guess every big city or region gets its own stereotype (e.g., "New Yorkers are rude," "Mid-westerners are milquetoast," "Alaskans talk like Sarah Palin"). I have trouble, however, subscribing to those ideas, particularly in a population of a sufficient size and diversity where, statistically speaking, any stereotype should be lost in the noise. The math of it says that perhaps some people would behave consistent with the "Seattle Freeze." Not the overwhelming majority, and I wouldn't necessarily expect the same properties to be represented in the population at PAX just because it was in Seattle.
That being said, the introverted behavior was still apparent, and while it doesn't overly bother yet another introvert like myself, it did make me wish that we could do better. That is less of a PAX change, and more of a cultural change. But PAX is a focus of such a culture, and would be a good place to implement change.
TL;DR; Not-that-old-of-a-guy visits PAX for the first time, feels old and unremarkable in a sea of vigor and creativity, doesn't like loud flashing lights or the mewling of babes who dare question his most esteemed idols.
I had to cut that post to the TLDR. I just wanted to provide some insight to this: PAX Prime is in Seattle. Most of the attendees are Seattle locals. Seattle is a famously introverted city (we're all techies up here, or so it seems). The reason you didn't find a lot of conversations in lines is because of what we affectionately refer to as the "Seattle Freeze". It's not because the community is just not friendly.
That is an... interesting insight, particularly because I hadn't heard the term "Seattle Freeze" before. I guess every big city or region gets its own stereotype (e.g., "New Yorkers are rude," "Mid-westerners are milquetoast," "Alaskans talk like Sarah Palin"). I have trouble, however, subscribing to those ideas, particularly in a population of a sufficient size and diversity where, statistically speaking, any stereotype should be lost in the noise. The math of it says that perhaps some people would behave consistent with the "Seattle Freeze." Not the overwhelming majority, and I wouldn't necessarily expect the same properties to be represented in the population at PAX just because it was in Seattle.
That being said, the introverted behavior was still apparent, and while it doesn't overly bother yet another introvert like myself, it did make me wish that we could do better. That is less of a PAX change, and more of a cultural change. But PAX is a focus of such a culture, and would be a good place to implement change.
I live in Seattle. This is my hometown, and it's all true. When I go to a bar and talk to a stranger he/she usually looks at me like I just sprouted a second head.
That said, the vast majority of PAX attendees aren't Seattleites, so I have a hard time justifying the unfriendliness of the lines this year to just the Seattle Freeze (yes, it's a common term). It's probably more to do with the prevalence of smart phones, as has been noted before.
That said, Seattleites will talk to you if you pester them enough. They might think you're crazy but they'll talk, so try killing them with kindness next year.
I know this is a bit pedantic, so maybe there is a better implementation to be had, but one of the issues I had with the map was lining up the birds-eye view with where I was on the floor. If there were a North on the map, and a big "North" sign on the wall, it would have been far easier to navigate. I could look at the map and see that the stairs to get to the annex were along one of the walls, but could not locate where in regards to my limited sight on the ground. It may have been easier had I been taller, but most of us are not head and shoulders above the others and are thus blind as a bat in such a crowd.
I wish something would be done about the constant media cutting throughout the convention. I understand there going to some of these games for articles, but people who paid just as much have to wait awhile, in some instances like 3 hours to get into the game. Thats dumb, A good balance though would be to give them a specified time for them to look at the games, and afterwards their passes are just like the three days.
I'm trying to read this thread page by page and I'm sure someone has already responded to this already since it was on the first page and now there's six, but...
Media badges DO function like three-day badges after the "media hour" on Friday. That's the only special time media gets during PAX. PAX was not made for media to cover, basically. Yes, there is a media room, but although the Enforcers running it are awesome, it's nothing compared to the media rooms (plural) at E3 and Gamescom.
Some publishers let media cut lines to see games on the show floor, but that's the publisher's decision, not Penny Arcade's.
PAX Prime 2013 Checklist ➤ ✔ Enforcer Badge ✔ Hotel ✔ Flight
There was a cosplay panel at one of the last two PAXen I attended, not sure which one.
Yeah, that was the Crabhat 'not a cosplay contest' panel, 2011. That was a nice informative panel with a cosplay lineup and walkby.
They did not get to have that panel this year. I dont know exactly why, but there was prolly a good enough reason.
I pulled my cosplay comments out of my post 'cause it was not constructive.
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ClixThis guy I knowSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
I also think there's plenty of LOL and Halo folks who are perfectly nice people but the bottom line is that they're never going to stop in tabletop, and are never going to have that experience of discovery that Mike wants them to have. There are already plenty of people at PAX already who are just into one genre or another who will get an opportunity to have their own gamer ephiphanies without the need to invite 10,000 additional bodies to flood the convention.
As someone who is a huge Halo fan I can't stay quite on this point. I love tabletop gaming and other games too. I hate this sense that if you play any of the big three frequent titles (Halo, Call of Duty, Madden) that you have less credibility as a gamer. I was stoked for Halofest last year, but it's not like I ignored evrything else at the convention. MTG, the tabletop area, and the rest of the expo are just as important to me.
Excluding certain games or gaming groups would only serve to weaken PAX, not strenthen it.
Things I'd like to see next PAX:
- I would like to see the absence of any big game tournaments. I'm looking at you, LoL. I think this is partially why PAX sold out so quickly this year. I'd like for these kind of events to be separate from PAX.
- Not sure what was going on with the escalators. They seemed to be stopped half the time. I don't know if this was a safety issue or not, but I feel less safe having to walk down them, to be honest.
- I didn't get a swag bag. I didn't know anything about swag bags, much less WHERE to grab one. "Big deal, he missed out on something free". I would have liked to have grabbed one though.
- If the convention is going to 4 days next year, it might be cool to either have some repeat panels on different days or maybe at different times if there is any possibility.
I wish something would be done about the constant media cutting throughout the convention. I understand there going to some of these games for articles, but people who paid just as much have to wait awhile, in some instances like 3 hours to get into the game. Thats dumb, A good balance though would be to give them a specified time for them to look at the games, and afterwards their passes are just like the three days.
I'm trying to read this thread page by page and I'm sure someone has already responded to this already since it was on the first page and now there's six, but...
Media badges DO function like three-day badges after the "media hour" on Friday. That's the only special time media gets during PAX. PAX was not made for media to cover, basically. Yes, there is a media room, but although the Enforcers running it are awesome, it's nothing compared to the media rooms (plural) at E3 and Gamescom.
Some publishers let media cut lines to see games on the show floor, but that's the publisher's decision, not Penny Arcade's.
I dunno, maybe I was just lucky enough not to notice, but I felt like media line cutting was far less prominent this year than last Prime. There were times last year that I got bumped multiple times in a row, or at the Uncharted 3 booth in particular where I got bumped by a group of media folks about 6-10 people deep basically grabbing the entire booth for 15 or 20 mins. Shidoshi mentioned the appointment system, which I dunno how long has been in effect, but I first noticed it being used at East this year and I feel like its helped to cut down on some of the more rampant line jumping in my opinion. I did also notice at least one booth (I think it was Medal of Honor) turn away someone from media that did not have an appointment at that moment. So to stick to the theme of the thread, I think that system should continue to be used. I guess my biggest issue with media at PAX is not the ones that you can tell are there to do their job. Its the ones who, for instance, flash you their media badge during a conversation and brag, "You gotta get one of these! I don't have to wait in any lines!" (Yes, this actually happened to me at the airport at East earlier this year). But then again, I guess you can't really enforce Wheaton's Law either.
This talk of "hardcore PAX", priority passes, separate passes for different things is all rubbing me the wrong way. Someone brought this up during the first Q&A on Friday, and it angered me then too. The person in question seems to have completely ignored everyone who stood up before her to say that this was their first PAX and how awesome that was.
Guys. It doesn't matter where PAX goes, how big the venue gets, who you try to exclude (attendees or exhibitors), or who you let buy passes early. The word is out that PAX is the best con going, and no matter what someone isn't going to get to go. Thousands of people aren't going to get passes. Let's try harder not to fall into the "I've been here since the beginning! I loved PAX before you did, so I should get to go!" We're the most inclusive and supportive con community anywhere... Let's try to keep it that way.
Missing a PAX isn't going to be the end of the world. There will always be East, AUS, the next Prime. There will always be other neat cons to go to also.
This year was a Perfect Storm of Bad for badge sales. Let's review:
1) SDCC had huge problems with their ticketing, so lots of people went looking for a different "nerd vacation"
2) There was no BlizzCon this year. See #1
3) The PAX folks used a new ticketing provider this year that... Didn't work out. Badge sales were up and down for a week while it got fixed. The link was around, so the "passes sold out in 4 hours!" is wrong. Only Robert Khoo knows how many people were able to get passes while the original site was "down" (I know I was one of them)
We have no idea what impact the fourth day and PAXAUS is going to have on badge sales next year, so I'm ready to have a "let's wait and see" attitude about it.
I am fully against breaking the badges up into different events, or "tracks." One of the best things about PAX is the knowledge that your badge will get you in to anything that day. If you break it up, then next year the complaints will be "I didn't know I wanted to do the concerts, and I couldn't get in!"
Given the additions and lessons already learned from this year, let's just see how it goes next spring, eh?
I thought PAX this year was far better than last year. Lines were manageable, crowds were less (thanks, anti-counterfeiting!) and every [E] I encountered was awesome.
My only hopes for next year are:
Tabletop needs a much better location... Give that 6th floor "LoL Theatre" to TT next year. They'll be quieter and easier to find.
Khoo for another Khoo & A. (Or maybe Khoo After Hours?) I was pretty disappointed it got moved to a time I couldn't attend, and I know he said he won't do it again, but.. Please? Anyway?
I second the request for less "standing room" at the concerts.
Thanks to everyone for another awesome PAX. See you next year (I hope)!
Unless WOTC is willing to throw down big bucks, they aren't prying anything away from LoL. Plus TT has enough space as it is.
I suggest that gangnam style be made the official PAX song and dance. I also suggest that attendees not be allowed past the queue room every morning until the entire room does the dance
I filled out my Prime Survey this morning. I mentioned the idea of working with exhibitors to create 'demo sign-ups' so people can plan their Con more efficiently. I forgot all about the Press when I wrote the comment. I would have put a note about how the exhibitor could leave a slot reserved for media per each time period in my description of how the program could work.
I think I would check out more demos if I could plan around a reserved time rather than wait for hours in line, especially games I wouldn't normally be into but am curious about. Isn't that the whole point of demos, after all?
Unless WOTC is willing to throw down big bucks, they aren't prying anything away from LoL. Plus TT has enough space as it is.
I wasn't talking about WTOC, I'm talking about board/miniature gaming. TT does have a lot of space, but it's broken up all over the center, as well as several blocks away at the Red Lion. I haven't been to East, but as I understand it, TT is much more consolidated there and thus far easier to navigate.
We don't know for sure that a huge LoL tourney will be back next year, so of course we don't know what kind of space requirements there are.
TT is a consistently difficult "track" of PAX to manage at Prime, because it ends up scattered all over the place.
I wasn't talking about WTOC, I'm talking about board/miniature gaming. TT does have a lot of space, but it's broken up all over the center, as well as several blocks away at the Red Lion. I haven't been to East, but as I understand it, TT is much more consolidated there and thus far easier to navigate.
We don't know for sure that a huge LoL tourney will be back next year, so of course we don't know what kind of space requirements there are.
TT is a consistently difficult "track" of PAX to manage at Prime, because it ends up scattered all over the place.
Yes at East everything is in one area so anything TT related (from vendor demos to free play) is all right there. TT was one of my favorite parts of East and I was actually really disappointed with it at Prime. My husband and I only found two little rooms and were kind of hot and claustrophobic. It was only after we got back I read about the Red Lion area.
I have a good sense of direction and can follow maps well, but for some reason, year after year, I get turned around in the convention center and can't figure out which way I'm even facing until I get to certain landmarks. This happens whether it's at PAX or for other events I attend there. I would like to see some forms of landmarks marked on the map. Maybe put symbols high up on some of the walls and stick those on the map as well, so you can orient yourself better.
I'd also like to see the schedule, exhibitors list, Guidebook, and maps sooner. It felt like they were released last-minute. I didn't get the chance to review everything and research what I wanted to do in more detail.
This was my first PAX, not to mention my first real convention, and it was a really fun and tiring time. The advice gathered from the forums really made the experience better and less overwhelming - especially as a solo attendee.
My biggest struggle the first day was figuring out locations. I stared down maps and tried to visualize everything prior to attending, but it really took a good deal of wandering on-site before I got my bearings straight. The enforcers were always helpful when I did get turned around and answered even my dumbest questions. An interactive 3D map would be incredible.
For whatever reason, I avoided the expo hall like the plague until the final day. Swag did not interest me much and I think I had a preconceived notion that it would be a mess in there. Some areas were indeed over-the-top with displays and lines, so I spent very little time in the hall when I did wander through. The indie area was a pleasant surprise/respite and I'm glad to have visited, however. I agree with others who believe this was a better use of the hall than the grandiose displays of the larger companies. Then again, there must be people who love that side of the convention because the lines certainly showed it.
The LoL event seemed really big. I guess I never truly realized how popular that game was to spectate. The panels I had attended on the 6th floor suffered from the noise levels.
I did feel that at times the attendees were a bit locked to their personal screens when in lines, but they were happy to put the devices down and chat if you initiated the conversation. I'm not sure if it's something that PAX would bear any responsibility in trying to change. At most, it would be line entertainment and enforcers engaging with the audience more which in turn would increase the chances that people would interact with one another. Honestly, though, it's more up to you whether or not you say hello. I got to meet some fantastic people throughout the weekend with just a friendly introduction.
Someone mentioned their disappointment with the initial Q&A and I echo their sentiments. While I wasn't in line, it felt like some of the questions went on too long and were impolite in the sense that there were other people waiting in line. I feel guilty in admitting that at the time I felt a bit of exasperation at the young man who gushed of his relationship and emotional experiences, but it was only after PAX did I come across his story on the Penny Arcade Help & Advice forum and I got the full context. Now I felt like a jerk for being so cold to his struggles. However, it'd still be nice if perhaps questioners were reminded to try to be concise out of consideration for others.
Kropotkin and I are one the same boat regarding the escalator etiquette. I thought it was common knowledge to stand on the right and pass on the left, but maybe it wasn't as universal as I had thought. Simple signage may help. I can't say that I was ever severely inconvenienced because of the crowding on the escalators, however. The lack of "lanes" was just something that caught my eye.
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DrogithShe who runneth the BYOCPittsfield, NHRegistered Userregular
I've been to PAX East for two years in a row and wholeheartedly plan to go to 2013. That being said, most of the time I spend at PAX is networking with different companies there and promoting eSports and competitive gaming since outside of this, I also organize tournaments. That being said, I have some suggestions for running gaming tournaments that should make them a better experience for everyone. Note: This is more PC centric than console, but can be applied.
-Having signups the morning of creates a lot of chaos for organizing an event. Having signups the day before in the PC area, and then the morning of from 8-9a in the lobby/foodcourt is more beneficial. This gives players with a one day pass to still sign up, while giving tournament admins enough time to organize brackets/groups/etc before hand.
-Randomization is key. A lot of New England gamers noted that they were stuck competing against friends because they signed up at the same time. Adding names to a randomizer, like the bracket setups on Challonge.org (don't have to use the system), will make it fair across the board as well as preventing bracket manipulation.
-Groups before bracket. If you have 100 PCs, you can run 25, 4 person groups at once where each person plays at least 3 times(Bo1). It gives you a fair idea of who the best players are, as well as giving people enough playing time for it to be enjoyable. This works well with single player and group games, you just have to think about how long matches can take and adjust tournament size according to that.
-Bracket visibility. A dry erase board just won't due. A big screen is really ideal for listing everything off and asking vendors to show this at their booths is beneficial when it's related. ex:Kingston is big on SC2. If they have 1 monitor showing a bracket at their booth, players will be able to peruse the floor while waiting for a match and still be able to send when/who they need to play instead of blocking aisles while sitting around and waiting. Having one off to the side of the PC area: good idea. Right at the entrance of the PC area
-Admin/organizer staff. Make sure you have staff that is experienced and organized. There is a big difference between running a small tournament and a large one. The difference is hours apart in my ~3 years of organizing experience.
I'll also be applying for an Enforcer specifically for helping/running these tournaments.
I've been to PAX East for two years in a row and wholeheartedly plan to go to 2013. That being said, most of the time I spend at PAX is networking with different companies there and promoting eSports and competitive gaming since outside of this, I also organize tournaments. That being said, I have some suggestions for running gaming tournaments that should make them a better experience for everyone. Note: This is more PC centric than console, but can be applied.
-Having signups the morning of creates a lot of chaos for organizing an event. Having signups the day before in the PC area, and then the morning of from 8-9a in the lobby/foodcourt is more beneficial. This gives players with a one day pass to still sign up, while giving tournament admins enough time to organize brackets/groups/etc before hand.
-Randomization is key. A lot of New England gamers noted that they were stuck competing against friends because they signed up at the same time. Adding names to a randomizer, like the bracket setups on Challonge.org (don't have to use the system), will make it fair across the board as well as preventing bracket manipulation.
-Groups before bracket. If you have 100 PCs, you can run 25, 4 person groups at once where each person plays at least 3 times(Bo1). It gives you a fair idea of who the best players are, as well as giving people enough playing time for it to be enjoyable. This works well with single player and group games, you just have to think about how long matches can take and adjust tournament size according to that.
-Bracket visibility. A dry erase board just won't due. A big screen is really ideal for listing everything off and asking vendors to show this at their booths is beneficial when it's related. ex:Kingston is big on SC2. If they have 1 monitor showing a bracket at their booth, players will be able to peruse the floor while waiting for a match and still be able to send when/who they need to play instead of blocking aisles while sitting around and waiting. Having one off to the side of the PC area: good idea. Right at the entrance of the PC area
-Admin/organizer staff. Make sure you have staff that is experienced and organized. There is a big difference between running a small tournament and a large one. The difference is hours apart in my ~3 years of organizing experience.
I'll also be applying for an Enforcer specifically for helping/running these tournaments.
I understand that this really applies to both Prime and East, but this is the suggestion thread for Prime and it looks like you're specifying that you attend PAX East specifically.
The kirby event was by far to worst event i have ever attended at pax. For one despite there being numerous enforcers in the room none of them were doing much of anything other than standing around. Then at some point a random enforcers shows up and closes off the line and then seems to do nothing else then stand there with a sign, they seemed to be oblivious to the rampant line cutting that was going on directly behind them. Then the real mess begins first they ran out of shirts with hundreds of people still in line then the gum was gone and by the end of the line posters were in short supply as well.
The fact of the matter is that all of this could have been prevented by a hand clicker and a pair of engaged enforcers. The thing is many people spent a few hours in line for what they though was going to be a fun event and they would help break a world record yet were turned away even from even doing that!
<ZeroHourHero> I have a tiny penis
<Qs23> I just need to get my dicks in a row
<prox> i work for dicks #paforums_pax, all about the dicks.
The kirby event was by far to worst event i have ever attended at pax. For one despite there being numerous enforcers in the room none of them were doing much of anything other than standing around. Then at some point a random enforcers shows up and closes off the line and then seems to do nothing else then stand there with a sign, they seemed to be oblivious to the rampant line cutting that was going on directly behind them. Then the real mess begins first they ran out of shirts with hundreds of people still in line then the gum was gone and by the end of the line posters were in short supply as well.
The fact of the matter is that all of this could have been prevented by a hand clicker and a pair of engaged enforcers. The thing is many people spent a few hours in line for what they though was going to be a fun event and they would help break a world record yet were turned away even from even doing that!
I didn't go to that event, but I generally find that line management *seems* understaffed and undertrained. Also there never seems to be much communication from LM about why they're asking people to do a certain thing. I've heard from some Es after PAX about why they make the decisions they make, but that info isn't nearly as effective after the fact since people want to know what's going on while it's going on.
zerzhul on
+1
jaberwockynmtPAX Info Booth ManagerRenton, WARegistered Userregular
The kirby event was by far to worst event i have ever attended at pax. For one despite there being numerous enforcers in the room none of them were doing much of anything other than standing around. Then at some point a random enforcers shows up and closes off the line and then seems to do nothing else then stand there with a sign, they seemed to be oblivious to the rampant line cutting that was going on directly behind them. Then the real mess begins first they ran out of shirts with hundreds of people still in line then the gum was gone and by the end of the line posters were in short supply as well.
The fact of the matter is that all of this could have been prevented by a hand clicker and a pair of engaged enforcers. The thing is many people spent a few hours in line for what they though was going to be a fun event and they would help break a world record yet were turned away even from even doing that!
I didn't go to that event, but I generally find that line management *seems* understaffed and undertrained. Also there never seems to be much communication from LM about why they're asking people to do a certain thing. I've heard from some Es after PAX about why they make the decisions they make, but that info isn't nearly as effective after the fact since people want to know what's going on while it's going on.
Line Management communication issues are a big problem and I know that the LM managers are trying to make it better.
The Kirby event wasn't communicated to the Enforcers until a few hours before it was set to occur. It was directly managed by the Nintendo people and the Enforcers were there just to help them and to help the crowd stay safe. It was a mess because Nintendo didn't give us the time and information needed to do it right.
--Jarrod "Jaberwocky" Lombardo, PAX Enforcer: Info Booth Manager.
"We know that the moment we slip, it will be taken away... and so it is of the utmost importance to be worthy of it constantly."
PAX will always be held on the best weekend for PAX. Sometimes that will be a bad weekend for you; I'm sorry.
The expo was packed at times, but still felt much less crowded than Prime 2011. I'm guessing fewer counterfeit badges?
The Kirby event could have used a lot more organization but Jarrod already spoke to that.
Raffles:
They're fun, but they don't always use microphones, and on Saturday afternoon there were two booths in the same area raffling at the same time. It locked up a whole corner of the expo floor and it was impossible to hear them. Not Penny Arcade's fault in any way but if anyone is passing feedback to exhibitors, some coordination (and amplification) would be nice.
Concerts:
Love them. Love the Paramount. However, I really wish the PAX Twitter feed would send the order of performers - they sometimes don't match the program - and update as each gets ready to go on stage.
I had a great time again this year and am looking forward to 2013
However, I really wish the PAX Twitter feed would send the order of performers - they sometimes don't match the program
I can only remember one PAX in the last 8 or so that the order has not matched the program. That was a last minute change. While the programs are printed in the final week or 2 before PAX, changes do still happen. As always, if you have concerns about accurate information come by the Information Booth, or ask the theatre staff directly.
I think my biggest beef were the lines. I know space is a premium within the convention center, but something needs to be done about the masses of humans standing about like cattle waiting to be slaughtered.
I wanted to get the Oswald hat for my nephew and the only way to get the hat was to wait in the line for the Disney Artist (each artist took about 10 to 30 mins to do a drawing). I waited until Sunday to do this since the lines have been ridiculously long Friday and Saturday. Even when I got there just after the doors open, there was already a 3hr long line. We were told, at the end of the line to come back at the next hr to get in line. This caused quite a few people to start "stalking" the line as the time got closer. It made the walk ways messier to traverse. People got pushier to try to get a space in line. Which made it all not very fun.
I would like to suggest to give out line tickets. You know, like the Fast Pass at Disney! Have people come back at a different time with the ticket to have a spot waiting for them. No pressure of wasting time in line. This way, people can plan out their visit and not miss panels or raffles or food or other games/exhibits they wanted to check out.
I feel this would make it a lot more organized and keep everyone safe.
♥ Properly Pleased Participant of Past PAX PrimeWest: '10, '12, '13, '14, '15, '16Ω ♥
I think my biggest beef were the lines. I know space is a premium within the convention center, but something needs to be done about the masses of humans standing about like cattle waiting to be slaughtered.
I wanted to get the Oswald hat for my nephew and the only way to get the hat was to wait in the line for the Disney Artist (each artist took about 10 to 30 mins to do a drawing). I waited until Sunday to do this since the lines have been ridiculously long Friday and Saturday. Even when I got there just after the doors open, there was already a 3hr long line. We were told, at the end of the line to come back at the next hr to get in line. This caused quite a few people to start "stalking" the line as the time got closer. It made the walk ways messier to traverse. People got pushier to try to get a space in line. Which made it all not very fun.
I would like to suggest to give out line tickets. You know, like the Fast Pass at Disney! Have people come back at a different time with the ticket to have a spot waiting for them. No pressure of wasting time in line. This way, people can plan out their visit and not miss panels or raffles or food or other games/exhibits they wanted to check out.
I feel this would make it a lot more organized and keep everyone safe.
With the exception of panels, the individual exhibitors manage their own lines (with enforcer help). You could always try bringing up those suggestions with those exhibitors.
My apologies if a thread like this already exists, but I just want to throw my vote in for MC Lars as a musical guest
. He'd be a perfect fit for PAX imho. That is all!
The kirby event was by far to worst event i have ever attended at pax. For one despite there being numerous enforcers in the room none of them were doing much of anything other than standing around. Then at some point a random enforcers shows up and closes off the line and then seems to do nothing else then stand there with a sign, they seemed to be oblivious to the rampant line cutting that was going on directly behind them. Then the real mess begins first they ran out of shirts with hundreds of people still in line then the gum was gone and by the end of the line posters were in short supply as well.
The fact of the matter is that all of this could have been prevented by a hand clicker and a pair of engaged enforcers. The thing is many people spent a few hours in line for what they though was going to be a fun event and they would help break a world record yet were turned away even from even doing that!
I didn't go to that event, but I generally find that line management *seems* understaffed and undertrained. Also there never seems to be much communication from LM about why they're asking people to do a certain thing. I've heard from some Es after PAX about why they make the decisions they make, but that info isn't nearly as effective after the fact since people want to know what's going on while it's going on.
On one hand this is a necro post, but on the other, this thread is still technically near the top of the first page and my advice is pretty relevant and worth passing on so whatever.
I was a port security guard for two tourist seasons in Ketchikan. Beyond just general security guard shit like making sure nobody goes where they're not supposed to and drinking copious amounts of coffee, one of my big responsibilities was line management. There are always hundreds of people showing up at roughly the same time to get back on their cruise ship because they wanted to make the most of their time port (which is understandable). Some berths have the space where it's not an issue but in a couple others we have to get a little creative. In my experience, I found that when shifting a line to better organize it as more people show up the crowds were more cooperative and responded better when you made it a point of briefly mentioning why you need them to move. "Hey, everybody, we need to start wrapping this line around because we're running around of room, could you all please move over here" or whatever. Otherwise they think you're just some prick ordering them around for the hell of it.
Hell, I did line management and even when I've got Enforcers hollaring at us to move up and tighten up the line when there's still a mile of room to play around with I felt kinda indignant. A quick little mention of the reasoning people need to move does a great job of changing the reaction from "fuck that guy" to "oh, that makes sense, ok." Granted, there's always a couple assholes in any crowd but you can't help that.
I think my biggest beef were the lines. I know space is a premium within the convention center, but something needs to be done about the masses of humans standing about like cattle waiting to be slaughtered.
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With the exception of panels, the individual exhibitors manage their own lines (with enforcer help). You could always try bringing up those suggestions with those exhibitors.
I've wondered how this could be improved. One idea would require that badges that go out have unique barcodes/QR Codes on them that would uniquely identify them. If that happened, then exhibitors could potentially "schedule" their demos and have people come up and reserve a slot in a demo at a later time. That would help reduce lines if you could walk up to a booth, or even pre-register, to attend a demo at a specific time. Not something every exhibitor would want to do, but there have been a few insanely popular exhibits the last few years where the lines to get into them were literally 6+ hours long.
Unique codes on badges that could be scanned would also serve to help reduce the number of fake badges and scalping. Granted though, changing the way badges are done and having a database where exhibitors could scan badges and access data (maybe name/picture) would increase the cost of creating the badges and probably increase the cost to attend. Not sure the benefit is worth it or not. Just floating ideas...
Wait... Where was the swag line? I waited with everyone else and all I remember was getting a lanyard and booklet. It'd be nice to have more directions.
Also, costume contest with a sign up online instead of the day of. Things should be advertised more online.
I think that they have decided they won't be doing the swag bags like that ever again It was a big mess.
Pretty sure the costume contest was not PAX sponsored; I think it was done by some exhibitor. PAX can't really control what those people choose to advertise or not.
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That is an... interesting insight, particularly because I hadn't heard the term "Seattle Freeze" before. I guess every big city or region gets its own stereotype (e.g., "New Yorkers are rude," "Mid-westerners are milquetoast," "Alaskans talk like Sarah Palin"). I have trouble, however, subscribing to those ideas, particularly in a population of a sufficient size and diversity where, statistically speaking, any stereotype should be lost in the noise. The math of it says that perhaps some people would behave consistent with the "Seattle Freeze." Not the overwhelming majority, and I wouldn't necessarily expect the same properties to be represented in the population at PAX just because it was in Seattle.
That being said, the introverted behavior was still apparent, and while it doesn't overly bother yet another introvert like myself, it did make me wish that we could do better. That is less of a PAX change, and more of a cultural change. But PAX is a focus of such a culture, and would be a good place to implement change.
I live in Seattle. This is my hometown, and it's all true. When I go to a bar and talk to a stranger he/she usually looks at me like I just sprouted a second head.
That said, the vast majority of PAX attendees aren't Seattleites, so I have a hard time justifying the unfriendliness of the lines this year to just the Seattle Freeze (yes, it's a common term). It's probably more to do with the prevalence of smart phones, as has been noted before.
That said, Seattleites will talk to you if you pester them enough. They might think you're crazy but they'll talk, so try killing them with kindness next year.
Media badges DO function like three-day badges after the "media hour" on Friday. That's the only special time media gets during PAX. PAX was not made for media to cover, basically. Yes, there is a media room, but although the Enforcers running it are awesome, it's nothing compared to the media rooms (plural) at E3 and Gamescom.
Some publishers let media cut lines to see games on the show floor, but that's the publisher's decision, not Penny Arcade's.
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Yeah, that was the Crabhat 'not a cosplay contest' panel, 2011. That was a nice informative panel with a cosplay lineup and walkby.
They did not get to have that panel this year. I dont know exactly why, but there was prolly a good enough reason.
I pulled my cosplay comments out of my post 'cause it was not constructive.
Excluding certain games or gaming groups would only serve to weaken PAX, not strenthen it.
- I would like to see the absence of any big game tournaments. I'm looking at you, LoL. I think this is partially why PAX sold out so quickly this year. I'd like for these kind of events to be separate from PAX.
- Not sure what was going on with the escalators. They seemed to be stopped half the time. I don't know if this was a safety issue or not, but I feel less safe having to walk down them, to be honest.
- I didn't get a swag bag. I didn't know anything about swag bags, much less WHERE to grab one. "Big deal, he missed out on something free". I would have liked to have grabbed one though.
- If the convention is going to 4 days next year, it might be cool to either have some repeat panels on different days or maybe at different times if there is any possibility.
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I dunno, maybe I was just lucky enough not to notice, but I felt like media line cutting was far less prominent this year than last Prime. There were times last year that I got bumped multiple times in a row, or at the Uncharted 3 booth in particular where I got bumped by a group of media folks about 6-10 people deep basically grabbing the entire booth for 15 or 20 mins. Shidoshi mentioned the appointment system, which I dunno how long has been in effect, but I first noticed it being used at East this year and I feel like its helped to cut down on some of the more rampant line jumping in my opinion. I did also notice at least one booth (I think it was Medal of Honor) turn away someone from media that did not have an appointment at that moment. So to stick to the theme of the thread, I think that system should continue to be used. I guess my biggest issue with media at PAX is not the ones that you can tell are there to do their job. Its the ones who, for instance, flash you their media badge during a conversation and brag, "You gotta get one of these! I don't have to wait in any lines!" (Yes, this actually happened to me at the airport at East earlier this year). But then again, I guess you can't really enforce Wheaton's Law either.
Unless WOTC is willing to throw down big bucks, they aren't prying anything away from LoL. Plus TT has enough space as it is.
No
I think I would check out more demos if I could plan around a reserved time rather than wait for hours in line, especially games I wouldn't normally be into but am curious about. Isn't that the whole point of demos, after all?
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I wasn't talking about WTOC, I'm talking about board/miniature gaming. TT does have a lot of space, but it's broken up all over the center, as well as several blocks away at the Red Lion. I haven't been to East, but as I understand it, TT is much more consolidated there and thus far easier to navigate.
We don't know for sure that a huge LoL tourney will be back next year, so of course we don't know what kind of space requirements there are.
TT is a consistently difficult "track" of PAX to manage at Prime, because it ends up scattered all over the place.
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Yes at East everything is in one area so anything TT related (from vendor demos to free play) is all right there. TT was one of my favorite parts of East and I was actually really disappointed with it at Prime. My husband and I only found two little rooms and were kind of hot and claustrophobic. It was only after we got back I read about the Red Lion area.
I'd also like to see the schedule, exhibitors list, Guidebook, and maps sooner. It felt like they were released last-minute. I didn't get the chance to review everything and research what I wanted to do in more detail.
My biggest struggle the first day was figuring out locations. I stared down maps and tried to visualize everything prior to attending, but it really took a good deal of wandering on-site before I got my bearings straight. The enforcers were always helpful when I did get turned around and answered even my dumbest questions. An interactive 3D map would be incredible.
For whatever reason, I avoided the expo hall like the plague until the final day. Swag did not interest me much and I think I had a preconceived notion that it would be a mess in there. Some areas were indeed over-the-top with displays and lines, so I spent very little time in the hall when I did wander through. The indie area was a pleasant surprise/respite and I'm glad to have visited, however. I agree with others who believe this was a better use of the hall than the grandiose displays of the larger companies. Then again, there must be people who love that side of the convention because the lines certainly showed it.
The LoL event seemed really big. I guess I never truly realized how popular that game was to spectate. The panels I had attended on the 6th floor suffered from the noise levels.
I did feel that at times the attendees were a bit locked to their personal screens when in lines, but they were happy to put the devices down and chat if you initiated the conversation. I'm not sure if it's something that PAX would bear any responsibility in trying to change. At most, it would be line entertainment and enforcers engaging with the audience more which in turn would increase the chances that people would interact with one another. Honestly, though, it's more up to you whether or not you say hello. I got to meet some fantastic people throughout the weekend with just a friendly introduction.
Someone mentioned their disappointment with the initial Q&A and I echo their sentiments. While I wasn't in line, it felt like some of the questions went on too long and were impolite in the sense that there were other people waiting in line. I feel guilty in admitting that at the time I felt a bit of exasperation at the young man who gushed of his relationship and emotional experiences, but it was only after PAX did I come across his story on the Penny Arcade Help & Advice forum and I got the full context. Now I felt like a jerk for being so cold to his struggles. However, it'd still be nice if perhaps questioners were reminded to try to be concise out of consideration for others.
Kropotkin and I are one the same boat regarding the escalator etiquette. I thought it was common knowledge to stand on the right and pass on the left, but maybe it wasn't as universal as I had thought. Simple signage may help. I can't say that I was ever severely inconvenienced because of the crowding on the escalators, however. The lack of "lanes" was just something that caught my eye.
-Having signups the morning of creates a lot of chaos for organizing an event. Having signups the day before in the PC area, and then the morning of from 8-9a in the lobby/foodcourt is more beneficial. This gives players with a one day pass to still sign up, while giving tournament admins enough time to organize brackets/groups/etc before hand.
-Randomization is key. A lot of New England gamers noted that they were stuck competing against friends because they signed up at the same time. Adding names to a randomizer, like the bracket setups on Challonge.org (don't have to use the system), will make it fair across the board as well as preventing bracket manipulation.
-Groups before bracket. If you have 100 PCs, you can run 25, 4 person groups at once where each person plays at least 3 times(Bo1). It gives you a fair idea of who the best players are, as well as giving people enough playing time for it to be enjoyable. This works well with single player and group games, you just have to think about how long matches can take and adjust tournament size according to that.
-Bracket visibility. A dry erase board just won't due. A big screen is really ideal for listing everything off and asking vendors to show this at their booths is beneficial when it's related. ex:Kingston is big on SC2. If they have 1 monitor showing a bracket at their booth, players will be able to peruse the floor while waiting for a match and still be able to send when/who they need to play instead of blocking aisles while sitting around and waiting. Having one off to the side of the PC area: good idea. Right at the entrance of the PC area
-Admin/organizer staff. Make sure you have staff that is experienced and organized. There is a big difference between running a small tournament and a large one. The difference is hours apart in my ~3 years of organizing experience.
I'll also be applying for an Enforcer specifically for helping/running these tournaments.
I understand that this really applies to both Prime and East, but this is the suggestion thread for Prime and it looks like you're specifying that you attend PAX East specifically.
The fact of the matter is that all of this could have been prevented by a hand clicker and a pair of engaged enforcers. The thing is many people spent a few hours in line for what they though was going to be a fun event and they would help break a world record yet were turned away even from even doing that!
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I didn't go to that event, but I generally find that line management *seems* understaffed and undertrained. Also there never seems to be much communication from LM about why they're asking people to do a certain thing. I've heard from some Es after PAX about why they make the decisions they make, but that info isn't nearly as effective after the fact since people want to know what's going on while it's going on.
The Kirby event wasn't communicated to the Enforcers until a few hours before it was set to occur. It was directly managed by the Nintendo people and the Enforcers were there just to help them and to help the crowd stay safe. It was a mess because Nintendo didn't give us the time and information needed to do it right.
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The Kirby event could have used a lot more organization but Jarrod already spoke to that.
Raffles:
They're fun, but they don't always use microphones, and on Saturday afternoon there were two booths in the same area raffling at the same time. It locked up a whole corner of the expo floor and it was impossible to hear them. Not Penny Arcade's fault in any way but if anyone is passing feedback to exhibitors, some coordination (and amplification) would be nice.
Concerts:
Love them. Love the Paramount. However, I really wish the PAX Twitter feed would send the order of performers - they sometimes don't match the program - and update as each gets ready to go on stage.
I had a great time again this year and am looking forward to 2013
I can only remember one PAX in the last 8 or so that the order has not matched the program. That was a last minute change. While the programs are printed in the final week or 2 before PAX, changes do still happen. As always, if you have concerns about accurate information come by the Information Booth, or ask the theatre staff directly.
I wanted to get the Oswald hat for my nephew and the only way to get the hat was to wait in the line for the Disney Artist (each artist took about 10 to 30 mins to do a drawing). I waited until Sunday to do this since the lines have been ridiculously long Friday and Saturday. Even when I got there just after the doors open, there was already a 3hr long line. We were told, at the end of the line to come back at the next hr to get in line. This caused quite a few people to start "stalking" the line as the time got closer. It made the walk ways messier to traverse. People got pushier to try to get a space in line. Which made it all not very fun.
I would like to suggest to give out line tickets. You know, like the Fast Pass at Disney! Have people come back at a different time with the ticket to have a spot waiting for them. No pressure of wasting time in line. This way, people can plan out their visit and not miss panels or raffles or food or other games/exhibits they wanted to check out.
I feel this would make it a lot more organized and keep everyone safe.
With the exception of panels, the individual exhibitors manage their own lines (with enforcer help). You could always try bringing up those suggestions with those exhibitors.
. He'd be a perfect fit for PAX imho. That is all!
On one hand this is a necro post, but on the other, this thread is still technically near the top of the first page and my advice is pretty relevant and worth passing on so whatever.
I was a port security guard for two tourist seasons in Ketchikan. Beyond just general security guard shit like making sure nobody goes where they're not supposed to and drinking copious amounts of coffee, one of my big responsibilities was line management. There are always hundreds of people showing up at roughly the same time to get back on their cruise ship because they wanted to make the most of their time port (which is understandable). Some berths have the space where it's not an issue but in a couple others we have to get a little creative. In my experience, I found that when shifting a line to better organize it as more people show up the crowds were more cooperative and responded better when you made it a point of briefly mentioning why you need them to move. "Hey, everybody, we need to start wrapping this line around because we're running around of room, could you all please move over here" or whatever. Otherwise they think you're just some prick ordering them around for the hell of it.
Hell, I did line management and even when I've got Enforcers hollaring at us to move up and tighten up the line when there's still a mile of room to play around with I felt kinda indignant. A quick little mention of the reasoning people need to move does a great job of changing the reaction from "fuck that guy" to "oh, that makes sense, ok." Granted, there's always a couple assholes in any crowd but you can't help that.
Unique codes on badges that could be scanned would also serve to help reduce the number of fake badges and scalping. Granted though, changing the way badges are done and having a database where exhibitors could scan badges and access data (maybe name/picture) would increase the cost of creating the badges and probably increase the cost to attend. Not sure the benefit is worth it or not. Just floating ideas...
Also, costume contest with a sign up online instead of the day of. Things should be advertised more online.
Pretty sure the costume contest was not PAX sponsored; I think it was done by some exhibitor. PAX can't really control what those people choose to advertise or not.