someone explain to me the lady on NBC who said that part of Obama's deficit reduction plan was a cheat because like $1T was from winding down the wars and "those were deficit financed to begin with"
Basically he's counting the money we "save" by not spending money on the wars that we weren't going to spend anyway
The same concept as saying we saved infinity dollars by not being at war forever
His argument is that someone like Bush probably would have kept the wars going and thus spent that money but it's not like it's a spending cut
Just generally dubious to talk about at all
I recently read more on this and there's a bit more to it than that. The Obama administration has a habit of double-counting cuts as "savings" and/or "offsets" that can be used somewhere else. Since the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were paid for with borrowed money it means that their expiration doesn't create a new pool of money that can be used on something else. Thus Obama's statement to take some of the money that we're saving as we wind down two wars to rebuild America" means he'd be continuing the same level of deficit spending just not on wars.
I'm not sure that should be surprising. Deficit spending during a recession is sort of the point of Keynesian economics. Maybe not the level of deficits that we're carrying right now, that's certainly arguable.
CorporateLogoThe toilet knowshow I feelRegistered Userregular
The Economist's debate live-blogs are pretty good reads
Do not have a cow, mortal.
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EncA Fool with CompassionPronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered Userregular
Ross Perot
That's the thing, really. Romney can "win" all three of the debates and if there isn't something incredibly damning about Obama's performance he will likely still lose the elections. What he needs to really gain traction is for Obama to say something incredibly stupid. Obama could sit back and "lose" all three with mild, but safe, rebuttals and still win simply by playing the 47% video incessantly until the election.
Two weeks after the debates they will be forgotten UNLESS someone messes up hugely. Both performing well, or one performing well and the other only moderately decent, won't change the results overmuch.
That said, Romney performed really great and it would probably have done him well to speak with that level of confidence (and coaching) throughout his campaign. He might have avoided his larger gaffes that way.
Feel free to wrap yourself in the warm blanket of "the media is only favoring Romney's debate performance because it helps their narrative"
their narrative for four months has been Romney is a buffoon, why change it?
The media blows everything out of proportion but ultimately there is a grain of truth under it all
Romney won almost unanimously among pundits
As far as "can a debate swinging an election", I'm confident Nate Silver will tell us by 3PM today
Maybe if y'all were voting immediately after this debate Romney would have a shot. There will be time to reflect on the details however. Already there are links to some of the lies he spewed. This isn't a snap decision, there is more to consider than a guy who can't wait his turn.
Actually i could go vote right now if i wanted. Early voting started here on monday.
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ButtersA glass of some milksRegistered Userregular
edited October 2012
Ross Perot
Yeah I agree that Romney needs an Obama "Read my lips!" level of a screw up to win.
MrMonroepassed outon the floor nowRegistered Userregular
Kang
That's what I said, but they have 430 respondents, 33% republican, 37% democrat, and 29% "independent", and yet they can't declare any statistically significant inferences about non-whites, people from the northeast, people from the midwest, people from the west, people under 50, people who did not attend college, people who identify as liberal, or people who live in rural areas.
Some things to consider, this poll only went out to:
-Voters in the south (No other regions of the US were sampled)
-Voters over 50 (no voters under age 50 participated)
-Voters that were white (no minorities of any kind participated)
-Voters that Attended College (No non-college participants recorded)
This poll is insanely skewed. You can see the data for yourself on page 15 of the pdf.
I personally think Romney did better in the debate, but this sort of polling is grossly misleading and shameful.
Old white folks are the only ones with free time and no caller ID, so they're happy to participate in polls. It is a good substitute for their loneliness because their good-fer-nothin children never call.
Some things to consider, this poll only went out to:
-Voters in the south (No other regions of the US were sampled)
-Voters over 50 (no voters under age 50 participated)
-Voters that were white (no minorities of any kind participated)
-Voters that Attended College (No non-college participants recorded)
This poll is insanely skewed. You can see the data for yourself on page 15 of the pdf.
I personally think Romney did better in the debate, but this sort of polling is grossly misleading and shameful.
It's less the poll exists - for example if they did several polls of several demographics and this was one of them that were meant to be correlated - and more that its results were bandied about the news channels and assumed to be a standard poll with a standard demographic spread that troubles me.
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Caulk Bite 6One of the multitude of Dans infesting this placeRegistered Userregular
Posts
yeah, I'm saying romney took this one fair and square
He was able to project himself decently, which was the most important part
don't think it's going to have a huge affect on the outcome though
I recently read more on this and there's a bit more to it than that. The Obama administration has a habit of double-counting cuts as "savings" and/or "offsets" that can be used somewhere else. Since the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan were paid for with borrowed money it means that their expiration doesn't create a new pool of money that can be used on something else. Thus Obama's statement to take some of the money that we're saving as we wind down two wars to rebuild America" means he'd be continuing the same level of deficit spending just not on wars.
Two weeks after the debates they will be forgotten UNLESS someone messes up hugely. Both performing well, or one performing well and the other only moderately decent, won't change the results overmuch.
That said, Romney performed really great and it would probably have done him well to speak with that level of confidence (and coaching) throughout his campaign. He might have avoided his larger gaffes that way.
Actually i could go vote right now if i wanted. Early voting started here on monday.
I just went and double checked CNN's website because I didn't believe my eyes at first
but then it was there, plain as day
CNN: still completely incompetent
CNN!
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2012/images/10/03/top12.pdf
Some things to consider, this poll only went out to:
-Voters in the south (No other regions of the US were sampled)
-Voters over 50 (no voters under age 50 participated)
-Voters that were white (no minorities of any kind participated)
-Voters that Attended College (No non-college participants recorded)
This poll is insanely skewed. You can see the data for yourself on page 15 of the pdf.
I personally think Romney did better in the debate, but this sort of polling is grossly misleading and shameful.
It's less the poll exists - for example if they did several polls of several demographics and this was one of them that were meant to be correlated - and more that its results were bandied about the news channels and assumed to be a standard poll with a standard demographic spread that troubles me.
didn't I hear somewhere that he started off by saying that day was his and his wife's anniversary?
in '08 the first debate was Obama 47%, McCain 20-something.... so while Obama "won", it doesn't have that eye popping number that CNN was looking for
so they rigged it
this one is probably better
http://www.google.com/insights/consumersurveys/view?survey=pbkrqpd3opyqc&question=2&filter=geo:US&rw=1
What spring does with the cherry trees.
Steam
It's my primary election concern.
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current tv
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we're still pretty progressive over on this coast. ny has gay marriage and cali still doesn't.
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Please tell me this is real.
For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction, resulting in two steps forward and then two steps back.
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Damn, I guessed Onion link.
Does Gore use his environmentalist funds to keep the lights on at Current TV? Because there is no way in hell that network operates in the black.
I do not think that word means what you think it means.
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i bet it's a welfare phone
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My ringtone is the despaired cries of all the people whose guns have been taken from them by my President.
Steam