Learning computer languages/possibly looking for a new job

ChillyWilly

This is a two part question for your techies out there.

1. What are the most common computer languages that are used these days and what would be the best way to go about learning them? Note that I didn't say fastest. I said best. I'm willing to take the time if I think it will be worth it.

2. What kind of jobs are out there for someone who learns Ruby, C++ or what have you? I'm possibly looking to branch out and get away from current job. I'm looking for ideas and any that can be offered would be fantastic.

admanb

What's your programming background?

L Ron Howard

1. There is no "best". Every company uses something different. Well, Microsoft obviously uses Microsoft products and languages exclusively, Sun uses Java, etc. But for the other companies, it differs.

2. This depends on what you want to do, sorta. You can do all sorts of things with the languages. For instance, with Ruby, the most common are things related to web services. But it's also used for support scripting, browser test automation, etc. You can also do most of those with C++. Or C#. Or Java. Or Python. Or VB Script.

I think you'll need to be a bit more specific as to what you're looking for.

ChillyWilly

@admanb - Zilch. I worked with HTML back in college for kicks, but I don't remember any of it.

@L Ron Howard - It's possible you misread my question. I'm not asking what the best program is. I'm asking what the best to learn such things is. School? Are there online tutorials? Are there programs out there I can put on my computer that will help me learn, like someone would use Rosetta Stone to learn another language? I'm a 100% newbie on this stuff and don't really know where to start.

And, yes. I realize this is vague. I've just realized that my current work experience is very focused on a few skills that can't really transfer to different professions. Learning computer languages (no matter which one, really) is something that all companies have a need for, so it's a much more useful and transferable skill. I'm just looking to learn something interesting and make myself more marketable. But I suppose if I had to narrow it down, I would be more concentrated on web services.

Bowen

C#, C\C++, PHP, Ruby and T-SQL(Microsoft SQL Server)/MySQL are the must know languages in the business world. Java if you government subcontracting.

Depending on your focus you may chose to specialize.

CelestialBadger

Learning programming is not easy. Take a night class in it and see if you like it.

The language is unimportant. The first language to learn is the hardest. Each subsequent one is easier.

Infidel

CelestialBadger wrote: »

The language is unimportant. The first language to learn is the hardest. Each subsequent one is easier.

This.

You don't learn languages and make a living from it. You learn to code, and the language is just the bullshit you deal with.

The biggest factor is what kind of development you think you want to do. Web applications, desktop applications, etc. Picture things that are tangible and interest you, then look into how they are made.

HR is notoriously bad for programmer positions, so while they might be asking for someone who knows X, what they really want and need is someone who can get results using X. "Knowing" a language will not get results. General training (Computer Science etc.) and developing programs are pretty language-independent and will set you up for an actual career, you use a specific X every time but the X isn't that relevant.

Bowen

ChillyWilly since you want to learn web services particularly, I'm assuming you want something like ASP.Net with C#, PHP, or ruby

L Ron Howard

I guess I totally misread your first question.
I hate to be of no more use, but the answer to your first question is how you learn best. Do you learn in schools? Do you learn in groups? Do you learn locking yourself in your room with a book for a weekend? I'd suggest you start out as CelestialBadger stated, and take a class.
The main idea behind many Computer Science degrees is not so much that you learn a specific language, but that you learn algorithms and best ways to solve the problems with the programming language. It is very easy to learn a new language, but learning the best way to tackle the problem is something that is universal.

In the short term, I would suggest learning something easy like Python or Ruby, possibly even VB Script. I say VB Script because with it you can become a Microsoft Office god, and become very valuable to any company, regardless of your position. However, VB is horrible. Python and Ruby are easier languages.
But yeah, totally take an into to computer programming class somewhere and see if it's something you want to do, and can learn more.

Jimmy King

The "best way to learn" is a difficult one. There's what works best for you, which could be any number of things, and then there's school, whether that's how you learn best or not because that's what will help you land a job the most.

The real answer is go to school AND do things on the side to teach yourself. School will help show you what you don't know, give you a base background, and make potential employers happy. Reading tutorials and doing projects on your own helps you stand out from the crowd, be better than the average code monkey, and truly know and understand what you're doing and lets you get experience with a wider range of things in the long run.

ChillyWilly

Thanks a bunch, folks. I think I'll start searching around my area for computer science classes.

Jasconius

C++, C#, Python, Ruby

Which ones you pick sort of dictates what career path you take

With Ruby you're almost definitely going to end up in Web

Python similar but with maybe a few more interesting options which are too complicated to get into

C# and C++ can do almost anything

Pi-r8

Jasconius wrote: »

C++, C#, Python, Ruby

Which ones you pick sort of dictates what career path you take

With Ruby you're almost definitely going to end up in Web

Python similar but with maybe a few more interesting options which are too complicated to get into

C# and C++ can do almost anything

Can you elaborate more on what people use C or C++ for? My impression(as someone who is also seeking an entry-level programming job) is that the few ads looking for C++ programmers are only looking for senior-level developers to do very advanced stuff, and that most of the "easy" stuff doesn't use C++ at all anymore.

Also it seems like most of the ads I've seen for Python are looking for people to do web dev with Django.

Scooter

If you want to get a job programming, there's really only two paths: get a CS degree, or learn on your own and make something so awesome (an indie game or whatever) that people can use it as proof of your talents. And I'd wager that most of the people who go "man I'm gonna make such an awesome indie game!" end up failing miserably. Programming is something you can learn at home, but without proof that you know it there's not much reason for anyone to hire you.

Pi-r8

Scooter wrote: »

If you want to get a job programming, there's really only two paths: get a CS degree, or learn on your own and make something so awesome (an indie game or whatever) that people can use it as proof of your talents. And I'd wager that most of the people who go "man I'm gonna make such an awesome indie game!" end up failing miserably. Programming is something you can learn at home, but without proof that you know it there's not much reason for anyone to hire you.

Except you're much better off making 10 simple games/web pages/apps or whatever, rather than 1 massive super advanced game. That way you can have a whole portfolio rather than just 1 thing, and also just focus on programming in your choice of specialties rather than having to worry about all the graphics/sound/interface/design/marketing issues that go into making a game.

[Michael]

And likely your first game would be really, really terrible. Likely your first several games would be really terrible. If you're gonna go with this route, do what Pi-r8 says, make a bunch of stuff. You'll learn a bunch about programming, plus a bunch about software development, which is just as important as far as marketability goes.

If you decide to go with the school route, make sure they also offer a course or two in software development, because pure computer science will only get you so far. I know several computer science majors who can't really make software.

Bowen

Pi-r8 wrote: »

Jasconius wrote: »

C++, C#, Python, Ruby

Which ones you pick sort of dictates what career path you take

With Ruby you're almost definitely going to end up in Web

Python similar but with maybe a few more interesting options which are too complicated to get into

C# and C++ can do almost anything

Can you elaborate more on what people use C or C++ for? My impression(as someone who is also seeking an entry-level programming job) is that the few ads looking for C++ programmers are only looking for senior-level developers to do very advanced stuff, and that most of the "easy" stuff doesn't use C++ at all anymore.

Also it seems like most of the ads I've seen for Python are looking for people to do web dev with Django.

Everything.

c\c++ are used for integrated chip development, low level OS development, video games, high level OS development, video games, web programming, video games, application development, video games.

It's just the right blend of low level and high level that it is used in almost everything.

Application development in general has shifted to C# because it being a RAD language and being just as good as C++ in this regards. Plus it can be mixed with C++ rather easily.

c\c++, c# will land you the most jobs probably. Knowing C++ will make C# easy.

CelestialBadger

ChillyWilly wrote: »

If you decide to go with the school route, make sure they also offer a course or two in software development, because pure computer science will only get you so far. I know several computer science majors who can't really make software.

Yes, "Computer Science" can mean the logic, maths and theory behind computing.

A short course called "Computer science" is probably likely to be purely logic and maths. So the OP probably needs to look for something called "Introduction to software development in Java" or "C# for beginners" or whatever he ends up looking into. Otherwise he might end up knowing more about NAND gates than anyone particularly cares about.

Degrees are a different matter - a "Computer Science" degree should cover the whole field from theory to practice.

Ganluan

At least out here, .NET developers (i.e. C#) are in high demand. You can work on so many different aspects of a system with .NET, and it really lends itself well to working across large teams.

Plus, Java sucks.

minirhyder

Try some online free courses maybe?
http://www.programmerfish.com/45-free-online-computer-science-courses/

ChillyWilly

@minirhyder

That's an interesting website. Is all that stuff actually legal?

Bowen

Appears to be.

minirhyder

Most of these courses are on the actual schools' webpages, so there's no reason to assume they're not legit.

CelestialBadger

Real life courses are better than online notes if you can afford the money or time. If you can't, it is always possible to teach yourself with websites and mental sweat. That's how I learned (actually I learned before websites, damn kids!)