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Cyberpunk 2077 - It Can't Get Darker Than Night City, Right?

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Posts

  • KarlKarl Registered User regular
    klemming wrote: »
    Xeddicus wrote: »
    Banzai5150 wrote: »
    Xeddicus wrote: »
    It was a veiled threat and stupid shit like this means no more Witcher stuff. So yay I guess for a law that doesn't even apply here because his ideas does not equal the games. I suppose we weren't getting ant more anyway probably, but this really kills it.

    Hopefully Cyberpunk takes off and is awesome and they continue that and pick up Mistborn.

    Please explain how this is going to stop more games? Also here? I’m so confused by your statement.

    People don't like getting sued? I mean in 20 years they may try again, but you think someone is going to look at this and think "Hot damn, we need to make a Witcher game!" any time soon?

    But they're already getting sued. However it shakes out, that threat has come and gone.
    If it's ruled that they do owe $ridiculous royalties and will continue to owe them in the future, they may think twice about a Witcher 4. But they originally offered royalties, so they were clearly happy with paying them at the time.

    Not an expert on Polish law and IANAL

    I would be very surprised if a court looks the author's case and sides with him. He had the opportunity to take royalties but decided that "video games are dumb, give me my money now". It's not the dev's fault he's a Luddite.

    I can see the dev's give him some cash as a goodwill gesture but not 16 million.

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  • Road BlockRoad Block Registered User regular
    It wouldn't shock me if he got some amount of money. But I suspect it will be far short of 16 million. If he got the full amount no company would ever offer the 1 time payment option again.

    NotoriusBEN
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Honestly, I think I’d be okay with him getting some more royalties... but he should be docked some for every time he made a mad disparaging rant in public against the video games.

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  • schussschuss Registered User regular
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

  • QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

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    Banzai5150Lucid_Seraph
  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    edited October 2018
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    Lucid_Seraph on
  • MassenaMassena Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    That's a great way to sum this whole stupid thing up. He's treating making a AAA game that won mad awards like it was some guy in his spare time with Notepad.

    I kind of hope the courts tell him to get bent. I never saw his books in bookstores until after W3, had never heard of him until after W2, and the same applies to literally everyone I know. Wonder how this will affect the Netflix series I've heard about, though I'd guess they have pretty robust policies for how to deal with international IP.

  • QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Massena wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    That's a great way to sum this whole stupid thing up. He's treating making a AAA game that won mad awards like it was some guy in his spare time with Notepad.

    I kind of hope the courts tell him to get bent. I never saw his books in bookstores until after W3, had never heard of him until after W2, and the same applies to literally everyone I know. Wonder how this will affect the Netflix series I've heard about, though I'd guess they have pretty robust policies for how to deal with international IP.

    Netflix is a big enough company that I'm sure they got their shit together before starting the process of making a series. As for Sapkowski, I can understand a guy in his 70's wanting to cement his legacy... but he's pretty much already done that. What he's doing now is only tarnishing it. He had a chance to be a larger part of the world embracing his books, and he decided to take some money and burrow back into Poland again.

    You don't see Mike Pondsmith doing the same thing with Cyberpunk. Clearly CDPR did the same thing with Pondsmith, only he was smart enough to embrace what they were doing and is a GIANT part of his IP gaining momentum again.

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    Elvenshae
  • PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Massena wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    That's a great way to sum this whole stupid thing up. He's treating making a AAA game that won mad awards like it was some guy in his spare time with Notepad.

    I kind of hope the courts tell him to get bent. I never saw his books in bookstores until after W3, had never heard of him until after W2, and the same applies to literally everyone I know. Wonder how this will affect the Netflix series I've heard about, though I'd guess they have pretty robust policies for how to deal with international IP.

    Netflix is a big enough company that I'm sure they got their shit together before starting the process of making a series. As for Sapkowski, I can understand a guy in his 70's wanting to cement his legacy... but he's pretty much already done that. What he's doing now is only tarnishing it. He had a chance to be a larger part of the world embracing his books, and he decided to take some money and burrow back into Poland again.

    You don't see Mike Pondsmith doing the same thing with Cyberpunk. Clearly CDPR did the same thing with Pondsmith, only he was smart enough to embrace what they were doing and is a GIANT part of his IP gaining momentum again.

    I also think longtime Microsoft employee Mike Poundsmith was able to negotiate a much better contract.

    SynthesisLucid_Seraph
  • SoundsPlushSoundsPlush yup, back. Registered User regular
    edited October 2018
    Quiotu wrote: »
    As for Sapkowski, I can understand a guy in his 70's wanting to cement his legacy... but he's pretty much already done that. What he's doing now is only tarnishing it. He had a chance to be a larger part of the world embracing his books, and he decided to take some money and burrow back into Poland again.

    You don't see Mike Pondsmith doing the same thing with Cyberpunk. Clearly CDPR did the same thing with Pondsmith, only he was smart enough to embrace what they were doing and is a GIANT part of his IP gaining momentum again.

    Eh, he's probably better off if has a realistic shot at tens of millions of dollars to go for that and just live rich and content for his final decades. His creation is obviously doing fine, mostly because of CDPR and now continuing beyond CDPR into other media, and only a fraction of people who are aware of Witcher are going to know or care about a minor legal dispute. As for whether it's a good thing to do, I feel pretty ambivalent about it. He signed off for a pittance, but he had no reason to imagine it would be more profitable—even looking at Witcher 1 as a gamer, no one would expect the massive success that followed. It'd be like STALKER erupting into Modern Warfare. Plus, I imagine it's very frustrating to work for years on a personal creation and then have its success largely credited to and known by (massively lucrative) derivative work. Still, it feels like sour grapes and it would have been better to start this process after W2 if he felt wronged, first through private dialogue with CDPR then courts as a last resort, rather than a few years after the game's conclusion.

    As for Cyberpunk, I'm pretty sure that it's got momentum because CDPR is making it on the heels of Witcher 3, plus a sick trailer, not because of an extremely niche role-playing game or its even more obscure designer (by which I mean few people who will buy Cyberpunk 2077 will be familiar with Pondsmith, not that he's not famous in the circle).

    Edit: Actually, rereading this it looks like I misunderstood you. You're just saying he's getting to play a big role in its revival because he's along for the ride from the beginning, not that his presence is contributing significantly to its momentum. My bad.

    SoundsPlush on
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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Quantronic Dreamgirl Registered User regular
    Cyberpunk 2077 absolutely has nothing to do with the brand for it's momentum.

    Like I read RPG books for fun and I still needed someone to prompt me and realize it was a 2020 follow up.

    SoundsPlushCorsiniLucid_Seraph
  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    Cyberpunk 2077 absolutely has nothing to do with the brand for it's momentum.

    Like I read RPG books for fun and I still needed someone to prompt me and realize it was a 2020 follow up.

    On the other hand, the trailer for 2077 has made me interested in learning more about the tabletop game.

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  • Albino BunnyAlbino Bunny Quantronic Dreamgirl Registered User regular
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    Cyberpunk 2077 absolutely has nothing to do with the brand for it's momentum.

    Like I read RPG books for fun and I still needed someone to prompt me and realize it was a 2020 follow up.

    On the other hand, the trailer for 2077 has made me interested in learning more about the tabletop game.

    I mean, the genuine answer is that they're not really similar past both being cyberpunk and sharing the same general setting outline.

    The tabletop game is much grittier and more brutal with how it does combat but it's actually pretty solid for a system that old and stands on its own merits compared to 2077's triple A 'nothing new but polished to look cool' gameplay.

    Bigity
  • dporowskidporowski Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Massena wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    That's a great way to sum this whole stupid thing up. He's treating making a AAA game that won mad awards like it was some guy in his spare time with Notepad.

    I kind of hope the courts tell him to get bent. I never saw his books in bookstores until after W3, had never heard of him until after W2, and the same applies to literally everyone I know. Wonder how this will affect the Netflix series I've heard about, though I'd guess they have pretty robust policies for how to deal with international IP.

    Netflix is a big enough company that I'm sure they got their shit together before starting the process of making a series. As for Sapkowski, I can understand a guy in his 70's wanting to cement his legacy... but he's pretty much already done that. What he's doing now is only tarnishing it. He had a chance to be a larger part of the world embracing his books, and he decided to take some money and burrow back into Poland again.

    You don't see Mike Pondsmith doing the same thing with Cyberpunk. Clearly CDPR did the same thing with Pondsmith, only he was smart enough to embrace what they were doing and is a GIANT part of his IP gaining momentum again.

    I also think longtime Microsoft employee Mike Poundsmith was able to negotiate a much better contract.

    Sapkowski: "No, no, I don't want the percentage, just a flat fee; video games are lame." (This is not a direct quote, but pretty much what happened, to my knowledge.)

    Pondsmith: "I AM A GIANT NERD YES YES YES LET'S DO THIS!"


    Pretty sure even if Pondsmith wasn't ever at MS, he'd have still made a noise like "hnk" if someone asked him if they could make his baby into a video game, and if he'd like to help.

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  • CampyCampy Registered User regular
    Also CDPR was a tad more established when he was negotiating. Making it a much easier decision to go for cash or a percentage.

    Nyysjan
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    edited October 2018
    Campy wrote: »
    Also CDPR was a tad more established when he was negotiating. Making it a much easier decision to go for cash or a percentage.

    On top of that, Pondsmith's field of fiction and game development is directly related to video gaming, so it's a given that he was familiar with CDPR or at least easily able to find out what he needed to know about them.

    Sapkowski is a fantasy writer from Cold War Poland and his background is in economics (and stopped in the 80s? So not really current economics at that), so it's a pretty safe bet that he had a pretty minimal knowledge of gaming and game development. He probably just looked at the original offer, went "they'll pay me that much to waste a bunch of effort on a video game?", and jumped right on the money without realizing how big a market games have now.

    Ninja Snarl P on
  • JazzJazz UKRegistered User regular
    This whole thing is reminding me of Lynda Carter trying to explain what Morrowind (which she did voice acting for) was to Larry King, who just could not conceive of video games being more advanced than Super Mario Bros.

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  • Dizzy DDizzy D NetherlandsRegistered User regular
    I can understand if Sapkowski's dislike was caused by the first game going:
    - we are undoing the death of your main character and give him amnesia.
    - we are splitting him up with the love of his life.
    - we will not talk about their daughter at all.
    - he will now have sex with every woman that breathes... and some that don't.

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  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    edited October 2018
    dporowski wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Massena wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    schuss wrote: »
    Also, how do you separate the additional effort, writing and content produced for the Witcher games from the source material?
    Games are a confluence of writing, art, gameplay and engineering - what portion attribution does IP get?

    And I could be wrong, but a lot of what's in the Witcher games are not what is in the books. They are spoken of, you see the results of them, but I don't believe the stories from the books are retold in the games. I think they mostly take reference from them and have made their stories after them.

    Again, could be wrong, but I think that's the case.

    they're basically very, very, very shiny fanfic with a huge budget

    *edit* y'know what? Sapkowski's attitude reminds me a great deal of the way that certain genre writers (ANNE RICE >| ANNE MCCAFFERY ... what is it with ppl named anne!?) treated fanfic writers :\a

    That's a great way to sum this whole stupid thing up. He's treating making a AAA game that won mad awards like it was some guy in his spare time with Notepad.

    I kind of hope the courts tell him to get bent. I never saw his books in bookstores until after W3, had never heard of him until after W2, and the same applies to literally everyone I know. Wonder how this will affect the Netflix series I've heard about, though I'd guess they have pretty robust policies for how to deal with international IP.

    Netflix is a big enough company that I'm sure they got their shit together before starting the process of making a series. As for Sapkowski, I can understand a guy in his 70's wanting to cement his legacy... but he's pretty much already done that. What he's doing now is only tarnishing it. He had a chance to be a larger part of the world embracing his books, and he decided to take some money and burrow back into Poland again.

    You don't see Mike Pondsmith doing the same thing with Cyberpunk. Clearly CDPR did the same thing with Pondsmith, only he was smart enough to embrace what they were doing and is a GIANT part of his IP gaining momentum again.

    I also think longtime Microsoft employee Mike Poundsmith was able to negotiate a much better contract.

    Sapkowski: "No, no, I don't want the percentage, just a flat fee; video games are lame." (This is not a direct quote, but pretty much what happened, to my knowledge.)

    Pondsmith: "I AM A GIANT NERD YES YES YES LET'S DO THIS!"


    Pretty sure even if Pondsmith wasn't ever at MS, he'd have still made a noise like "hnk" if someone asked him if they could make his baby into a video game, and if he'd like to help.

    There's also a huge cultural difference between sci-fi & fantasy writers (esp. of the older school) and tabletop RPG designers; speaking as someone who has worked in both industries. Even beyond a TTRPG designer even knowing what a dang video game is in the first place (the video game RPG genre literally would not exist without the tabletop RPG genre), a TTRPG designer is USED to other people playing in their sandbox. In fact, that is the entire point of a TTRPG. Where an old skool fantasy writer sees, say, people writing fanfic, they go "Arrgh! Don't touch my precious thing! My unique and perfect vision! How dare you play with my toys, cretins!?" A TTRPG designer, meanwhile, has LITERALLY MADE YOU A PRODUCT WITH WHICH YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO ESSENTIALLY "WRITE FANFIC" WITH. And even beyond the whole intent being to let players play with your stuff, TTRPGs above a certain size of "itty bitty indie" are ALWAYS creatures of collaboration. You ALWAYS have multiple people working on the same thing; different people writing different splatbooks, adventures, etc. Bit like how one comic book superhero may have lots and lots and LOTS and LOTS of people working on the same line.

    Like, to use another metaphor, the TTRPG designer goes, "Hey guys!!! I have this awesome box of LEGO bricks! Come the heck over and build stuff with me! Hell, bring your own LEGOs too! Whee!"

    While the particular brand of old skool fantasy writer that Sapowski seems to be is, "This is my perfect collection of action figures in original packaging THEY ARE NOT DOLLS they are ACTION FIGURES and you MAY NOT PLAY WITH THEM." And, admittedly, to be fair to that school, this attitude often comes from the fact that for most of the 20th century, assholes would come up, steal their toys out of their hands, and say THIS IS MY TOY NOW YEP, so they have reason to be protective of their stuff. But there's a difference between going, "... okay, you can play with my toys, but remember that they ARE my toys, and give them back when you're done, and don't break them," and "NO FUN ALLOWED." And to me, what it looks like Sapowski did was, "Ugh, fuck, fine, you can play with my fucking toys, jeez, I don't care, you don't even know how to play with them right," and then he turned around and went "Wait! You can't make them play like THAT. Hey!"

    Thus, because of this difference, of course when someone comes up to the TTRPG designer, they go "YES! YES! LET'S PLAY AROUND WITH THE THINGY! LET'S MAKE IT BETTER!"


    (There are exceptions to both of these. The newer school of SF&F writers are much more accepting of people playing in their sandbox as long as it doesn't screw with their livelihood; and even some older school authors are a bit more relaxed. And there are some TTRPG companies which are assholes and oddly No Fun Allowed for people making a product that other people are supposed to play with. But you can still see where I'm going here.)

    Lucid_Seraph on
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  • Rhan9Rhan9 Registered User regular
    That was some serious threading the needle with the analogies. It was exciting to follow along just to see if you could keep it under control or go off the cliff.

    Good job!

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  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    Rhan9 wrote: »
    That was some serious threading the needle with the analogies. It was exciting to follow along just to see if you could keep it under control or go off the cliff.

    Good job!

    I'm glad my Master of Fine Arts in Nonfiction Writing is good for something*

    *making me sound cool in forum posts**
    **it certainly hasn't led to gainful employment***
    ***can that skill be applied to becoming a cyberpunk? PROBABLY NOT

    ElvenshaeKadokenTaranis
  • BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    Rhan9 wrote: »
    That was some serious threading the needle with the analogies. It was exciting to follow along just to see if you could keep it under control or go off the cliff.

    Good job!

    I'm glad my Master of Fine Arts in Nonfiction Writing is good for something*

    *making me sound cool in forum posts**
    **it certainly hasn't led to gainful employment***
    ***can that skill be applied to becoming a cyberpunk? PROBABLY NOT

    *** Sure it can - wage slave

    76561198017303226.png
    ElvenshaeMegaMekRhan9
  • NotoriusBENNotoriusBEN Registered User regular
    tldr @Lucid_Seraph 's post

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  • Esteban5XGEsteban5XG Registered User new member
    Really love cyberpunk aesthetics. So cool for visuals and interesting narrative. Dystopia is so exciting.

  • Lucid_SeraphLucid_Seraph TealDeer MarylandRegistered User regular
    edited October 2018
    So, playing through the Blood and Wine expansion of Witcher 3, and I have to say: I really really REALLY hope there are at least some sort of proper stealth/infiltration mechanics in Cyberpunk 2077, and that they're simple to use and don't suck.

    There's this mechanic/quest in that expansion called Hanse Bases, where there's a lot of really well-armed, well prepared bandits. They can also summon reinforcements if one of them makes it to a bonfire before you murder his butt. Now, the first time I did one of these, they managed to summon extra mans, and I had a very hard time with it, and oh so many bodies. So many bodies. (I am also playing on easy mode, because bless you CDPR for letting me switch between "Argh fuck you I just want the story go away random enemies" and "Doop de doo normal mode is fine, I am an adult with adult responsibilities and no time for being HARDCOREZ")

    The second one I get to is in an old castle and I'm like okay, I'm not gonna fuck this up this time! Let me see if I can get to where the bonfire is at, so I can cut the guy off! It looks like there's actually a very nice gap in the wall there where I can sneak in and get to it.

    I find said gap. It is covered by invisible collision.

    "Bah," I say, "In another life, I was a QA tester! Surely I can get around this!"

    Nope, someone already QA'd that and made the invisible wall around this nice gap insurmountable. So, I am forced to go in through the front gate. I do get the runner this time, but the WHOLE TIME, I'm like "Why can't I just Asscreed my way up the damn wall? Why is there invisible collision on this? Blwarrrrghlgj!"

    And I know that the answer in this case is, "You are playing Geralt, not Hello Insert Name Here, and Geralt is of the kick in the door school of dungeoneering."

    But it reallllly makes me hope that there's way more options for 1. going nonlethal, 2. sneaking around, and 3. climbing over stuff in Cyberpunk 2077. Like, let me hack into the security cameras first, figure out guard patrols, engage my sweet dermal cameflouge, use my sticky fingers to climb up the outside, quietly stun/taze lone guards I come across, etc. And make that style easy to do and viable in most situations, yes I'm still mad at you Eidos Montreal for making DXHR's stealth so god damned counterintuitive to use (I still haven't gotten out of Detroit because I can't figure out how to properly get through the police station without setting off alarms...) and making stealth builds totally useless against the bossfights.

    But yeah, I guess TL;DR -- the *story* stuff and dialogue choices etc in Witcher 3 are excellent, and it's awesome how usually Geralt has the option of either Just Bloody Talk To People vs. Show 'Em Yer Stabs, but I wish there was the option 3 of "sneak around n take their stuff without any murder." And I'm... I'm not concerned, I guess, about how they'll handle it in Cyberpunk 2077, but I've been burned before by cyberpunkish games fucking that element up.

    Lucid_Seraph on
    Elvenshae
  • QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    But yeah, I guess TL;DR -- the *story* stuff and dialogue choices etc in Witcher 3 are excellent, and it's awesome how usually Geralt has the option of either Just Bloody Talk To People vs. Show 'Em Yer Stabs, but I wish there was the option 3 of "sneak around n take their stuff without any murder." And I'm... I'm not concerned, I guess, about how they'll handle it in Cyberpunk 2077, but I've been burned before by cyberpunkish games fucking that element up.

    I do agree that Witcher 3, and really the Witcher series in general, was really good at what it did... and what it did good was 'choose what kind of murder death blender Geralt becomes'. The games were about action and preparation and choosing your battles, and I dug the bandit bases because it was a new challenge in late game DLC that's honestly more challenging than anything in the main story. It did what it could with the options you were already given, and they were completely optional to do.

    Considering the CP2077 demo video, they basically showed off 3 combat styles in rapid succession towards the end: Tech Junkie, Silent Ninja, and Run & Gun. So yeah, I think they're stepping up their game and giving you a LOT more options with Cyberpunk. Specifically because while Witcher 3 was about Geralt first and the world second, Cyberpunk looks to be about Night City first and V second, and you have way more options to set up your blank slate rather than Geralt and his set personality.

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    Lucid_SeraphMoridin889FencingsaxElvenshae
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    I hope they pull it off. In my opinion, Geralt being a known quantity is what allowed the story to go a step above other games with their generic blank slate characters.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
    MassenaKanaMoridin889stopgap
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    I think it's a different kind of game. Geralt was a warrior, he hunted and killed monsters.

    V is trying to get Night City bucks and rep, by hook or by crook. So they can go as loud or quiet as they player wants

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    Disco11
  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    I would be surprised if total stealth was a possibility, but I would be shocked if a stealth focus wasn't an option.

    Thematically, being able to do total stealth doesn't fit the game setting well; you can put in the effort to sneak if you want, but it's a lot more interesting if you just can't avoid some situations and you have to cope with the tools you have on-hand.

    But the recent footage gave plenty of indicators that you should be able to play stealthy quite a bit. Something like sticking to a wall is great for a leap attack, sure, but it's also great for hiding up and out of the way of a patrol. Seems like alerted enemies cue to seeing the player as well, rather than just knowing where there are at all times after being alerted.

  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    I would laugh so hard if you could play the entire thing out from your apartment or cafes if you play as a netrunner

    ElvenshaeNyysjanFencingsaxIgpx407NightslyrTaranisschussBobbleJoolander
  • NyysjanNyysjan FinlandRegistered User regular
    I don't really think being unable to avoid all combat is more interesting.
    In a stealth playstyle, avoiding combat should in itself be interesting.

    Like, for example, DX:Mankind Divided, just straight shooting everyone would have been easy if you felt like abusing pathing and cover.
    But sneaking in, never being seen, not killing anyone, that was lot more interesting.
    On the opposite spectrum, you have Dishonored, where full sneak was lot less interesting because most of the fun powers and gadgets were about murderizing everyone in horrifying and interesting ways.

  • XeddicusXeddicus Registered User regular
    They have so much to live up to. Hope they pull it off!

    "For no one - no one in this world can you trust. Not men. Not women. Not beasts...this you can trust."
    Taranis
  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    The optimal response from CDproject red in this instance would be to Counter sue the offer for a cut of the royalties on his novels since the game likely drove up sales.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
    Elvenshae
  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    edited October 2018
    Gaddez wrote: »
    The optimal response from CDproject red in this instance would be to Counter sue the offer for a cut of the royalties on his novels since the game likely drove up sales.

    My catty thought is that a cut of the royalties on the novels wouldn't cover the legal fees.

    Commander Zoom on
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  • manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    Jazz wrote: »
    This whole thing is reminding me of Lynda Carter trying to explain what Morrowind (which she did voice acting for) was to Larry King, who just could not conceive of video games being more advanced than Super Mario Bros.

    Old people.

    TheStigJazz
  • GaddezGaddez Registered User regular
    Gaddez wrote: »
    The optimal response from CDproject red in this instance would be to Counter sue the offer for a cut of the royalties on his novels since the game likely drove up sales.

    My catty thought is that a cut of the royalties on the novels wouldn't cover the legal fees.

    Like seriously though, I can all but guarantee that this guy saw a spike in sales of his novels after the first witcher game with international audiences owing to the fact that eastern european fantasy novels weren't that hot of an item in the mid nineties and there was a 14 year gap between the two most recent and coincidentally 4 years after the first game though.

    Dude is just mad that he isn't making all of the money all of the time.

    Richy wrote: »
    But I think the resistance I’m getting more has to do with “rawr! Loklar said it! Rage!” than anything else.

    No, it has to do with the fact that you're done nothing but throw lies, blatant flasehoods, and downright dumb statements at us so far.
    TheStigMoridin889
  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    I mean, if I'm being fair to him and myself, if I invented a world and a bunch of characters, and someone liked them so much they wanted to make their own project featuring them, and after the deal went through, they made way more money and praise and attention than I did in many parts of the world for what I saw as a fan project, I would be bitter about it, and not just because of the money-envy.

    But then you look at something like Game of Thrones, where GRRM positioned himself in a central role in the TV adaptation of his novels, where he's open to the idea, and works with it, and isn't salty about it, and people still associate the property chiefly with him, and not the showrunners or HBO. There's a lesson there. That lesson is don't be a crusty old man when it comes to new media!

    ElvenshaeTalithMoridin889Mr RayCampyBobble
  • BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    Jazz wrote: »
    This whole thing is reminding me of Lynda Carter trying to explain what Morrowind (which she did voice acting for) was to Larry King, who just could not conceive of video games being more advanced than Super Mario Bros.

    Old people.

    Some old people anyway. Folks like that would have the same reaction to say, VR or cell phones back in the 90s.

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Bigity wrote: »
    Jazz wrote: »
    This whole thing is reminding me of Lynda Carter trying to explain what Morrowind (which she did voice acting for) was to Larry King, who just could not conceive of video games being more advanced than Super Mario Bros.

    Old people.

    Some old people anyway. Folks like that would have the same reaction to say, VR or cell phones back in the 90s.

    Also possible this guy is too much of a purist to have taken the video game thing seriously. He would be far from the first person to take their craft too seriously and scoff at "lesser" mediums as being too inferior to take notice.

    Moridin889ElvenshaeBigityCommander Zoom
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