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  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    you didn't write the word loot, but that's what that post is all about. Like, why is there any desire to run LFR for weeks and weeks, or gear up alts for it, or whatever? What they've done with LFR is remove (what I'm calling) the organizational requirement from raiding, which makes it into an individualistic treadmill similar to lots of other things in the game.

    That isn't a value judgment by the way; my goal isn't to talk down to people who don't want to commit time to more structured play. I just think the fundamental "the game is not giving me rewards fast enough" complaint is silly. Most of the game is just a series of repetitive tasks and if the tasks cease to be enjoyable on their own you might as well stop playing, because the rewards you get are just a ticket to more, similar repetitive tasks.

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  • IshtaarIshtaar Fun is underrated. Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Loot for many people is a means to an end, not the goal of the game, if that makes sense. I want to play with my friends, and I can't do the current tier across 6 different servers, so it's LFR for now. My actual issue is that the game is gating content in a way that's overbearingly long (pure VP gear for the chronically unlucky) or totally RNG.

    Buying your way to upgrades isn't necessarily an answer either. It took two weeks before someone posted Agi Mail gear on my old server so I could grab it for my buddy, he could not for the life of him get anything to drop in heroics. He's now two weeks of potential LFR drops behind. Since the next tier currently requires you to get an ilevel that's pretty much BiS "casualol" gear (including DO), there is the very real possibility that he wont be able to the next tier of raiding when it comes out, despite the more effort he's put in. People just want some kind of consistency, and I'm now 17 ilevels past him, and I've played like 2 /days less.

    Oh yeah, and the only real counterargument against relaxing the restrictions is epeen. It's like we need to sit the entirety of the official forums down and rewatch the original Willy Wonka and talk about what's wrong with Veruca Salt.

    Funny stuff: So the BMAH on Scilla hasn't had an items other than Blood-Soaked Invitations for the past few days; I think even Madam Goya has given up on the server.

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  • BlendtecBlendtec PittsburghRegistered User regular
    Nah, Brewing Storm has the thunderstorm and the panda house in Jade Forest as the loading screen; just did that one earlier. Looking at the list I can't think of any that would share the loading screen with Shado-pan; even Arena of Annihilation, the only one in Kun-lai has the White Tiger temple as its loading screen.

    It eventually let me into my DK; it had teleported me to the shrine since I don't think the game could even figure out what was going on. I should have left my ticket open, maybe they could have told me wtf happened.

    It is Arena of Annihilation.

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    you didn't write the word loot, but that's what that post is all about. Like, why is there any desire to run LFR for weeks and weeks, or gear up alts for it, or whatever? What they've done with LFR is remove (what I'm calling) the organizational requirement from raiding, which makes it into an individualistic treadmill similar to lots of other things in the game.

    That isn't a value judgment by the way; my goal isn't to talk down to people who don't want to commit time to more structured play. I just think the fundamental "the game is not giving me rewards fast enough" complaint is silly. Most of the game is just a series of repetitive tasks and if the tasks cease to be enjoyable on their own you might as well stop playing, because the rewards you get are just a ticket to more, similar repetitive tasks.

    I don't have any desire to run the current LFR for weeks on end on any future characters; but I'll have to with the current design of linear progression.

    Who knows, maybe they'll increase the drop rates so much with 5.2 that it'll be reasonable to actually gear up an alt in LFR; because right now it isn't.

    And as to why? That's an absurdly silly question in relation to an MMO. Why do anything right? I mean, hey, no matter what we do now, with the next xpack there'll be a new level cap so it's all wasted time, right?

    No. You do it because you're enjoying yourself. And right now? I am enjoying myself, or I wouldn't be playing. I have 11 characters now 85+, 3 of them are 90. It's obviously not reasonable to expect blizzard should accommodate someone like me specifically, and I have no intention of ever attempting to do much on more than a few of them, than the bare basic, get to 90, do the reps with patterns I want, etc. But on the ones I do? Its usually fun to run LFR/LFD right now. I've done it pretty frequently on all 3 of my 90's, though I've pretty much shelved my warrior for various reasons. But on the 4th or 5th character, particularly months and months, and several patches down the road? That won't be fun to go back and keep running HoF over and over hoping I can get the drops to get into the next tier.

    And to act like it's all a lie, all anyone really wants is loot is just silly. Maybe for you? I have no idea. I have no doubt for a number of players that is the case, but like @Ishtaar just said, for many players loot is simply a means to an end, and not the goal. My goal is to play as much of the game as I can and enjoy it, chat with friends and just experience it. And that's how I play. Loot is just a necessary evil, and when they make loot such a (imo obviously) unreasonable barrier to see more content as they're planning with their progression system this xpack, then it starts to chip away at the fun of other things.

    I'll readily admit that a decent amount of my desire to get the damn axe off Sha in Terrace is just stubbornness. I've done it so many times now and failed I feel like I have to keep doing it until I succeed or those previous attempts will just be wasted time. That's a personal problem; and I'd prefer systems not be designed explicitly to exploit that.

    WoW can be, and usually is, a lot of fun for various reasons. You make the claim that the entirety of the game is just grinding, just hidden different ways. Well so is life; I do the same damn thing every day in hopes that doing so will eventually result in good things. I take care of my kids, day by day, because when they do something new that surprises me it's really wonderful; so I put up with the 'grind' of life because of things like that. I prefer my entertainment to be the same way; thus I don't mind grind, because it is just the nature of anything. If I play WoW, or Halo, or name your game, in the end, you're doing the same damn thing over and over and over, but it's the surprises and other features that make it fun.

    I just feel like the idea of linear progression isn't even hidden grinding. It's blatant outright "grind because we say grind bitch" nonsense and really benefits no one; and in this case specifically it won't benefit Blizzard though they seem to think it will. And, it's not fun.

    Hence my key point on retention in my long ass post earlier: I think there will be a large player drop off not long after 5.2. Because the fun of current LFR's will be had. Blizzard saying "nope, sorry, keep doing it until we're satisfied and you can then see our new stuff", rinse and repeat for every alt, every new player, every returning player; for every patch...that's not even attempting to mask the grind with fun. So in that regard you're right; if it's not fun, why keep doing it? Exactly.

    The problem, personally, I really like WoW, I've always liked it and I want it to continue to be fun, and I think it could very easily, and a lot of the things they've done with MoP, not to mention other past content (specifically catch up stuff in relation to this conversation), prove that yes, in fact, it can be really fun, and not punish the players for wanting to play on their terms. I guess, honestly, I'm concerned once 5.2, 5.3 rolls around I won't want to play anymore specifically because of the system that requires me to do that unfun stuff (in this case running 5.0 LFR's on future characters ad naseum) in order to get to what I actually want to do.

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  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    mandokir hits for like a million, so probably not survivable even for most tanks. Which is really too bad because I'd like to solo for the raptor.

    and naxx may or may not have been defensible back at 60, but by the time wrath rolled around it was obviously terrible. Some of the bosses were okay (although lots were awful), but the trash was just abysmal, especially compared to the stuff their were designing fresh at the time.
    I don't remember Obsidian Sanctum's trash being not terrible. Every week I remember grinding through a dozen or so packs to kill one boss.

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    OS had hrmmm...8 packs. It was a pack of 4 dragonkin and then a pack of 2 of the dragon giants between each of the drakes so...yeah, 4 'trash' sections total for 8 packs.

    But the drakes were pretty annoying, if you weren't doing 3D (and most weren't when it was current), and made it take way longer than it probably should have for a '1 boss' instance. RS suffered from the same nonsense.

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  • SmrtnikSmrtnik job boli zub Registered User regular
    Grobian wrote: »
    Because I made the mistake of accidentally clicking on a link to the WoW forums instead of just a blue post...

    In case anyone was curious, we're all wrong. We should be thrilled that we have the privledge to see any content at all, and shouldn't complain about LFR loot drop rates, linear progression, or ilvl requirements (whatever it ends up being) for 5.2 raids. In fact LFR ruins the game for 'real raiders' and the fact that it gives plebs any loot at all is also ruining the game. Ruining!

    So says the official forums!

    I'm not sure if I should start this again, but: I hear that opinion a lot and I can understand it. I'm not saying it's right, or my opinion, but it's certainly not far out from any serious argument like you make it out to be. It is a fact that 'real raids' are dying. Even world-first raids (see paragon going 10man), but more importantly the mass of mediocre or weak raids. There are certainly more servers with like 1 or 2 progressing 25man raids per side than servers where there is a healthy raid scene. And a big reason (but not the only reason) for that is that people can progress without 'real raids' and see all the content through LFR. So from the perspective of someone who likes 'real raids', and they are decidedly different than LFR, LFR kills his game.

    It's really no different than people complaining about the removal of rep-tabards: They prefer one way to play and Blizz made it worse.

    This is a long fucking post. Just a warning. Putting parts behind spoilers because seriously. Long. EDIT: Also all the 'you's are in the larger sense, not directed at you @Grobian

    Re: Raiding is dying because of LFR:

    snip

    this is kind of hilariously overwrought

    stuff is more accessible than pretty much any other previous time; gearing up is probably even faster than it has been in previous expansions, it just feels different because you have to do something other than grind five mans over and over (which you actually can still do, I guess, it just isn't a very efficient way to get VP.) Your continuous complaint seems to ultimately boil down to gear not dropping fast enough for you, but that's pretty much always been how it is. The game is about grinding; buy the ticket, take the ride.
    What is it, precisely, about raiding, that is so adverse to the majority of players...even some raiders, that LFR doesn't have that makes it so those same players who don't want to, or can't, raid, do LFR?

    the organizational requirement

    Hooray for responding to a post you didn't read! Because it really had nothing to do with loot drops. But anyway...

    I have said many times in the past; I wouldn't care at all if LFR didn't drop loot with stats, but simply dropped skinnable items (Lets be real, it has to drop something or people will only run it a few times). I am perfectly fine with my performance on my characters for stuff that I have ready access to (5mans, lfr, dailies, questing, old raids, and if I'm really bored, PvP) with gear from 5 mans. Playing my dk right now, he has 2 things from LFR. Actually, one, the other is from Sha. The rest is 450's and 463's. And I can do everything I want, as well as I want. And I imagine I'll continue to be able to do so with non instanced content for the rest of the xpack. But there's going to be plenty (dare I say most) of new content that will be instanced and have ilvl requirements.

    The only reason I care about shit not dropping? Because that magic ilvl requirement that will let me access new content when a new patch rolls around.

    I don't actually care that I've gone 8 weeks with gold/gold from Sha in Terrace because of the quality of the axe; I cared because up until Tuesday I didn't have the ilvl that would let me get into the 5.2 LFR's (on my pally) and the major stopping point was my 5man weapon which was bringing down my overall ilvl even though I had several 489's and 497's; but replacing my belt with the 5.1 VP one put me over the 486 mark.

    Will I stop worrying so much about running LFR on my pally now? Yep. I'm going to finish out the 6k VP I need for the next Wrathion quest, probably via LFR; but after that I'm good until 5.2 on him. I'll still run terrace in case that axe ever does drop, just to bump up my ilvl so I can continue to see more content; but it's not because it's "zomg epicz" or because I'll top meters with it. It's because it is how Blizzard has decided that I should be 'allowed' to see future stuff they put out. Maybe I'll start running LFR for tank gear, probably not though.

    But the problem I have with the drops in LFR, again, has has nothing to do with being more powerful or 'teh hardcorez'; it's that even though I've reached that ilvl threshold on my pally, I haven't on my DK, or any future character I'll want to level and do stuff with. Because, *shocker*, I like playing different classes because different classes are different. Doing content as a Hunter is a different experience than as Pally or a DK or whatever. It doesn't really do me any good to get my Hunter to 90 and then just park him because I can't get that magic number in order to play the game I pay for; without spending months trying to get LFR to drop enough items to get to the current content.

    Straight up, the only time I actually care about loot is when it's purdy. I'm not speaking for anyone else, just myself. With transmog, if I see a set I like, yeah, I'll work my ass off for it because I like to play pretty pretty dressup. Luckily I don't like much of T14 and the previews of T15, to me, were hilariously bad; so for the most part, I can play to experience the content and not worry too much about driving for loot; and that's how I'd prefer it always honestly.

    EDIT: Actually, and another thing; I think a decent option that Blizzard should consider is having LFR have a flat gear requirement. Make the 5.2 stuff have the same core difficulty as the 5.0 stuff and so on. Change the loot to a flat ilvl, or no ilvl at all and go with skinnable items mentioned above.

    That way alts can get into new content as soon as they can access LFR at all, it moves it completely outside of gear progression for raiders so they don't have to worry about it and it doesn't effect them should they choose to not run it, and it moves it back to what it was originally invisioned as: a way for the players at large to see and experience content. Make it still a source for VP, make the bosses give JP per kill, and just have the items be skins; or be tokens you can use to buy a skin for your class, even better.

    They'd still need some way to figure out a way for raiders to catch up on gear progression, but it would solve the problem of 'progression' for most of the playerbase. Lets be honest, your average person isn't going to notice much if they're not getting that incremental DPS increase every tier, when numbers are already so damn high right now.

    Just a thought.
    retty sure if lfr just gave skins for transmog you and a few others would queue but you roil have 4 hour queries. People in this game don't do stuff unless there is a reward that makes their numbers go up generally. And that applies at all levels and skilsets.

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Smrtnik wrote: »
    Grobian wrote: »
    Because I made the mistake of accidentally clicking on a link to the WoW forums instead of just a blue post...

    In case anyone was curious, we're all wrong. We should be thrilled that we have the privledge to see any content at all, and shouldn't complain about LFR loot drop rates, linear progression, or ilvl requirements (whatever it ends up being) for 5.2 raids. In fact LFR ruins the game for 'real raiders' and the fact that it gives plebs any loot at all is also ruining the game. Ruining!

    So says the official forums!

    I'm not sure if I should start this again, but: I hear that opinion a lot and I can understand it. I'm not saying it's right, or my opinion, but it's certainly not far out from any serious argument like you make it out to be. It is a fact that 'real raids' are dying. Even world-first raids (see paragon going 10man), but more importantly the mass of mediocre or weak raids. There are certainly more servers with like 1 or 2 progressing 25man raids per side than servers where there is a healthy raid scene. And a big reason (but not the only reason) for that is that people can progress without 'real raids' and see all the content through LFR. So from the perspective of someone who likes 'real raids', and they are decidedly different than LFR, LFR kills his game.

    It's really no different than people complaining about the removal of rep-tabards: They prefer one way to play and Blizz made it worse.

    This is a long fucking post. Just a warning. Putting parts behind spoilers because seriously. Long. EDIT: Also all the 'you's are in the larger sense, not directed at you @Grobian

    Re: Raiding is dying because of LFR:

    snip

    this is kind of hilariously overwrought

    stuff is more accessible than pretty much any other previous time; gearing up is probably even faster than it has been in previous expansions, it just feels different because you have to do something other than grind five mans over and over (which you actually can still do, I guess, it just isn't a very efficient way to get VP.) Your continuous complaint seems to ultimately boil down to gear not dropping fast enough for you, but that's pretty much always been how it is. The game is about grinding; buy the ticket, take the ride.
    What is it, precisely, about raiding, that is so adverse to the majority of players...even some raiders, that LFR doesn't have that makes it so those same players who don't want to, or can't, raid, do LFR?

    the organizational requirement

    Hooray for responding to a post you didn't read! Because it really had nothing to do with loot drops. But anyway...

    I have said many times in the past; I wouldn't care at all if LFR didn't drop loot with stats, but simply dropped skinnable items (Lets be real, it has to drop something or people will only run it a few times). I am perfectly fine with my performance on my characters for stuff that I have ready access to (5mans, lfr, dailies, questing, old raids, and if I'm really bored, PvP) with gear from 5 mans. Playing my dk right now, he has 2 things from LFR. Actually, one, the other is from Sha. The rest is 450's and 463's. And I can do everything I want, as well as I want. And I imagine I'll continue to be able to do so with non instanced content for the rest of the xpack. But there's going to be plenty (dare I say most) of new content that will be instanced and have ilvl requirements.

    The only reason I care about shit not dropping? Because that magic ilvl requirement that will let me access new content when a new patch rolls around.

    I don't actually care that I've gone 8 weeks with gold/gold from Sha in Terrace because of the quality of the axe; I cared because up until Tuesday I didn't have the ilvl that would let me get into the 5.2 LFR's (on my pally) and the major stopping point was my 5man weapon which was bringing down my overall ilvl even though I had several 489's and 497's; but replacing my belt with the 5.1 VP one put me over the 486 mark.

    Will I stop worrying so much about running LFR on my pally now? Yep. I'm going to finish out the 6k VP I need for the next Wrathion quest, probably via LFR; but after that I'm good until 5.2 on him. I'll still run terrace in case that axe ever does drop, just to bump up my ilvl so I can continue to see more content; but it's not because it's "zomg epicz" or because I'll top meters with it. It's because it is how Blizzard has decided that I should be 'allowed' to see future stuff they put out. Maybe I'll start running LFR for tank gear, probably not though.

    But the problem I have with the drops in LFR, again, has has nothing to do with being more powerful or 'teh hardcorez'; it's that even though I've reached that ilvl threshold on my pally, I haven't on my DK, or any future character I'll want to level and do stuff with. Because, *shocker*, I like playing different classes because different classes are different. Doing content as a Hunter is a different experience than as Pally or a DK or whatever. It doesn't really do me any good to get my Hunter to 90 and then just park him because I can't get that magic number in order to play the game I pay for; without spending months trying to get LFR to drop enough items to get to the current content.

    Straight up, the only time I actually care about loot is when it's purdy. I'm not speaking for anyone else, just myself. With transmog, if I see a set I like, yeah, I'll work my ass off for it because I like to play pretty pretty dressup. Luckily I don't like much of T14 and the previews of T15, to me, were hilariously bad; so for the most part, I can play to experience the content and not worry too much about driving for loot; and that's how I'd prefer it always honestly.

    EDIT: Actually, and another thing; I think a decent option that Blizzard should consider is having LFR have a flat gear requirement. Make the 5.2 stuff have the same core difficulty as the 5.0 stuff and so on. Change the loot to a flat ilvl, or no ilvl at all and go with skinnable items mentioned above.

    That way alts can get into new content as soon as they can access LFR at all, it moves it completely outside of gear progression for raiders so they don't have to worry about it and it doesn't effect them should they choose to not run it, and it moves it back to what it was originally invisioned as: a way for the players at large to see and experience content. Make it still a source for VP, make the bosses give JP per kill, and just have the items be skins; or be tokens you can use to buy a skin for your class, even better.

    They'd still need some way to figure out a way for raiders to catch up on gear progression, but it would solve the problem of 'progression' for most of the playerbase. Lets be honest, your average person isn't going to notice much if they're not getting that incremental DPS increase every tier, when numbers are already so damn high right now.

    Just a thought.
    retty sure if lfr just gave skins for transmog you and a few others would queue but you roil have 4 hour queries. People in this game don't do stuff unless there is a reward that makes their numbers go up generally. And that applies at all levels and skilsets.

    I think that's the generally accepted theory, yes; but I simply don't agree that it's true...but there's no real way of knowing because no one has really tried. The base assumption since the inception of MMO's is that numbers drive 'progress', so players always have to be given something that will increase their mystical numbers or they won't want to stick around.

    But has anyone tried anything differently; at least on a large scale like WoW? There's ample evidence in all sorts of other genres and games, and other activities that linear progression isn't necessary in order to keep people interested in <thing>. A stamp collector doesn't need to have ever increasing value stamps in order to keep collecting, someone who religiously watches <sport> doesn't need to have every new season have higher and higher scores in order to be 'fun' and keep watching and buying shit. Soccer (football) is one of the most popular things on the planet and games often end 0-0. People aren't losing interest or becoming less invested.

    I think, and I've said it before, that the mindset simply needs to change. WoW has enough content and fun to be had to not try to design every new aspect around a carrot and stick.

    EDIT: I will say though, that even in the MMO space, there are various F2P games that subsist entirely on those 'cosmetic' things that don't alter players numbers, but increase their enjoyment and make them keep playing. None that are even remotely as successful or as profitable as WoW...but I think that WoW has maybe one more xpack with its current subscription system before it has to find some way to alter, potentially drastically, it's revenue system.

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  • SmrtnikSmrtnik job boli zub Registered User regular
    Soooooo...

    I queued for a Scenario on my DK.

    Then it tried to load me into Shado-pan Monastary (I'm assuming from the loading screen), and it gets stuck; probably because, you know, it's not a scenario. It sits at the loading screen for a few minutes and then boots me back to the login screen.

    Over and over.

    I can't get to my DK now.

    WTF?

    The Arena of Annihilation scenario has the same loading screen. Doesn't explain the crash though.

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  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    I'd prefer a WoW where, say, I play 10 hours a week and 9 out of 10 of those hours are pretty enjoyable rather than one where I play 20 hours a week and 9 out of 20 of those hours are pretty enjoyable. MoP seems to have shifted the game more toward the latter version.

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  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Attack Power gained from Vengeance is now capped at the player's maximum health

    Was...this not already the case?

    I swear they put a cap like that in back in Cata? What am I thinking of?

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  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    I think the Cata cap was something like 5% or 10% of max health. Perhaps they got rid of an explicit hard cap since MoP changed Vengeance from a stacking/incrementing system to an average rate of incoming damage system. They probably figured they didn't need the cap anymore.

    Now maybe they discovered some funny business with insane damage attacks that you cooldown through or reduce with encounter mechanics (or the paladin cheat death ability, if it still exists) that gave way too much AP or something. That said, a cap of max health is still pretty nuts, since that's like 600-700k AP for a decently geared tank.

    forty on
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  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    I raid for the fun of learning a strategy and then beating the fight. If I had my way I'd raid with people who refused to look up strats and were okay with incrementally figuring out the fight. I've avoided looking up strats for Fight Club stuff for this very reason. I don't care about the gear outside of the fact that I need it sometimes to get to the level the fight expects. For example, the fight I'm stuck on in fight club is the fen strider boss that as a moonkin the only hope I have of killing it is popping all my cooldowns and bursting it down before it can cast Torrent a second time. Unfortunately my gear's not good enough to do that, so I keep doing LFR and gathering VP for better gear so I can beat it, since I have no other gear-based drive due to not being able to reliably normal raid.

  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    forty wrote: »
    I think the Cata cap was something like 5% or 10% of max health. Perhaps they got rid of an explicit hard cap since MoP changed Vengeance from a stacking/incrementing system to an average rate of incoming damage system. They probably figured they didn't need the cap anymore.

    Now maybe they discovered some funny business with insane damage attacks that you cooldown through or reduce with encounter mechanics (or the paladin cheat death ability, if it still exists) that gave way too much AP or something. That said, a cap of max health is still pretty nuts, since that's like 600-700k AP for a decently geared tank.

    On Wind Duder, in the second part of HoF LFR, tanks regularly top the meters by a massive amount. Last week a warrior solo tanked it because no new tanks were queueing or something, and he ended up with like 400k dps and the nearest person was 180k.

    It was nuts. I have no clue what his AP from Vengeance must have been at; but I suspect the cap will limit things like that happening.

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  • LorahaloLorahalo Registered User regular
    Wind Lord is definitely a tank topping fight. Our druid tank tops the DPS by a good 50-80k every week in normal mode and we're VERY well geared DPS. I'm the second best geared mage on the server and can't touch his damage.

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  • Enosh20Enosh20 Registered User regular
    look at the 80 pala soloing stone guard due to some vengeance abuse bug
    that's why they capped it now

    it's still some 600k+ vengance (my DK for instance is some 710k raid buffed), don't think i ever hit that tanking windlord, so it will have no real effect on anything beyond that bug

  • SmrtnikSmrtnik job boli zub Registered User regular
    Attack Power gained from Vengeance is now capped at the player's maximum health

    Was...this not already the case?

    I swear they put a cap like that in back in Cata? What am I thinking of?

    probably to curtail things like my 25m heroic doing wind lord with a single warrior tank who then process to some 20% or so total raid dmg

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  • MegatinMegatin Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    New 5.2 build listed on MMO-Champion.
    Blade Flurry now hits 4 extra targets, which is maybe cool? Still sucks for 2 target cleaving, but at least it helps out Combat's AOE.

    Megatin on
  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. i'm the bat guy (bluh)Registered User regular
    http://media.mmo-champion.com/images/news/2013/january/JungleTrollCouncilor.jpg

    One hopes that this is using the work they've done on new character models in some way.

    liEt3nH.png
  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    But does she blink?

  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Ok, so on the PTR:

    I think we're looking at the source of teh Mogu and (based on the in-game lore) the Divine Bell.

    The question is...
    given the model name is Titan Captured; who captured the 'Titan' and got it to do their bidding? Also, it doesn't look so much like a Titan really, as one of the caretakers like Loken that was left behind.

    Steam: Galedrid - XBL: Galedrid - PSN: Galedrid
    Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
    Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand

    adejaan
  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    Well a lot of the caretakers in northrend could do some rather amazing things withthier limited power

  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Ok, so on the PTR:

    I think we're looking at the source of teh Mogu and (based on the in-game lore) the Divine Bell.

    The question is...
    given the model name is Titan Captured; who captured the 'Titan' and got it to do their bidding? Also, it doesn't look so much like a Titan really, as one of the caretakers like Loken that was left behind.


    Smart money's on....
    The Old Gods, perhaps even Y'haarj, and yeah, that's definitely a caretaker model, and he's got both hands so it's not Tyr either (unless that was also retconned)

  • LarsLars Registered User regular
    One of the caretakers (Tyr, I think) was missing from Ulduar. I think a CM or someone insinuated that he might have been corrupted into General Vezax but then at a Blizzcon the writers shot that down and said he was elsewhere doing something secret.

  • DacDac Registered User regular
    This is so old news to everyone, but why the fuck are pet battles disabled in raid?

    It's like just such an obvious way to kill time while waiting for organization/pugging and shit. What possible reason is there for disallowing it?

    Steam: catseye543
    PSN: ShogunGunshow
    Origin: ShogunGunshow
  • InvisibleInvisible Registered User regular
    I'm not familiar with the lore that much but
    what do titans look like? Is it possible they made care takers in their image and that could really be a Titan?

  • SmrtnikSmrtnik job boli zub Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Megatin wrote: »
    New 5.2 build listed on MMO-Champion.
    Blade Flurry now hits 4 extra targets, which is maybe cool? Still sucks for 2 target cleaving, but at least it helps out Combat's AOE.

    and I still never need go combat again. Except perversely enough for wind lord, for which mutilate was better with multidotting rupture

    Edit: new thread time?

    Smrtnik on
    steam_sig.png
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Invisible wrote: »
    I'm not familiar with the lore that much but
    what do titans look like? Is it possible they made care takers in their image and that could really be a Titan?
    The "real" titans look like more ornate versions of the watchers from Ulduar. See here

  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    Ok, so on the PTR:

    I think we're looking at the source of teh Mogu and (based on the in-game lore) the Divine Bell.

    The question is...
    given the model name is Titan Captured; who captured the 'Titan' and got it to do their bidding? Also, it doesn't look so much like a Titan really, as one of the caretakers like Loken that was left behind.


    Smart money's on....
    The Old Gods, perhaps even Y'haarj, and yeah, that's definitely a caretaker model, and he's got both hands so it's not Tyr either (unless that was also retconned)

    Well
    It could be Tyr. It states in the lore that he could have regenerated his hand but chose not to but instead fashioned a hand of silver.

    Maybe the Divine Bell was forged from his hand, and afterward in his corruption fixed himself?

    Or maybe it's still an early model and the 'real' one will have no hand?

    Or maybe it's not Tyr. It would make sense though, if it were.

    Steam: Galedrid - XBL: Galedrid - PSN: Galedrid
    Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
    Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand

  • HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    Well, from the new PTR push I've seen something that strikes terror into my soul, and it ain't a raid boss.

    http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=94295
    Primal Egg
    Item Level 1
    Binds when picked up
    Unique
    Duration: 3 days (real time)
    "This egg is hatching into something."

    and

    http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=94296
    Cracked Primal Egg
    Item Level 1
    Binds when picked up
    "The egg has hatched!"
    <Right Click to Open>

    If we have another Oracle Egg situation I'm going to be quite unhappy. Loved the Oracles, haaaaaaaaaaaaaated that fucking weekly RNG.

  • LarsLars Registered User regular
    I think it took me around three years to get the Green Proto Drake from the Oracle egg, and I only missed a handful of weeks during that time.

  • Kipling217Kipling217 Registered User regular
    Is there some kind of add-on that automatically ques you up for LFD shit? Because I just had the weirdest thing happen to me. I got over a dozen calls to go to dungeon, only for the healer to always refuse. Every damn time! Not in a once or twice way, but 12 times in a row. Every time it was a time out too, the healer didn't actively refuse, but the request timed out.

    Once I can believe, but 12 times? In a row?

    Communicating from the last of the Babylon Stations.
  • JediNightJediNight Registered User regular
    I would say that raiding "dying" out is being affected as much by outside factors, as those directly related to the game. While perceived grinding, feelings that the rewards aren't worth the effort as much anymore, or that when 10man gives the same rewards as 25 then why do the extra logistics, and more are factors. I would say this has a lot to do with it too:

    The demographics of MMO players are getting older without as many new ones taking up genre. Real life factors such as getting a job after college, starting a family, etc. are taking a large chunk of the old raiding force out of play. The game has been out for 8 years now -- people that may have been 16 when it first came out are now 24+, got married, and have a full-time job. Or just the factor of raiding for umpteen years gets old and you move on.

    forty
  • BlendtecBlendtec PittsburghRegistered User regular
    Lars wrote: »
    I think it took me around three years to get the Green Proto Drake from the Oracle egg, and I only missed a handful of weeks during that time.

    My singular stroke of loot luck in WoW was getting the drake on my first, and only, Oracle egg. It took me years to farm Thunderfury. The game knows and reacts accordingly I suppose.

    I also go by Twinkie in some games. Add me on Steam!
    steam_sig.png
  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    http://media.mmo-champion.com/images/news/2013/january/JungleTrollCouncilor.jpg

    One hopes that this is using the work they've done on new character models in some way.

    It would be awesome if that was what the new player characters will look like. Higher polycount, neat textures that show some muscle and definition, while at the same time being very reminiscent of the old model.

  • The Dude With HerpesThe Dude With Herpes Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    reVerse wrote: »
    http://media.mmo-champion.com/images/news/2013/january/JungleTrollCouncilor.jpg

    One hopes that this is using the work they've done on new character models in some way.

    It would be awesome if that was what the new player characters will look like. Higher polycount, neat textures that show some muscle and definition, while at the same time being very reminiscent of the old model.

    Vol'jin is similar in that respect, his redesign.

    Jaina's redesign didn't really result in anything much different than the current human female; but was somewhat more detailed. I'd have to go to Dal and get a closer look at her sometime I suppose.

    If Thrall is a hint at Orc's...well that'll be something. I actually like the subdued look of the shaman thrall; though I'd fucking love to see a redesigned Thrall in Doomhammers armor; and even though they've hinted that Thrall won't retake the mantle of warchief, a guy can dream I suppose. Either way it'd be odd for Orcs to be 'upright' instead of the hunched over versions we've had in WoW forever.
    Kipling217 wrote: »
    Is there some kind of add-on that automatically ques you up for LFD shit? Because I just had the weirdest thing happen to me. I got over a dozen calls to go to dungeon, only for the healer to always refuse. Every damn time! Not in a once or twice way, but 12 times in a row. Every time it was a time out too, the healer didn't actively refuse, but the request timed out.

    Once I can believe, but 12 times? In a row?

    I've actually seen this a lot lately. Honestly, all I can figure is some dickhead is trolling. When it happens over and over again for people with normally instant queues, there's just no way healer after healer (or tank after tank) just isn't accepting a queue the second after they queue up.

    The Dude With Herpes on
    Steam: Galedrid - XBL: Galedrid - PSN: Galedrid
    Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
    Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand

  • GrobianGrobian What's on sale? Pliers!Registered User regular
    edited January 2013
    Ishtaar wrote: »
    bump recruitment post

    That was a great post. And just to stress this point: Currently in the German raid-recruitment forums on the official site, a recruitment thread falls to page 2 in 5-10 minutes, so even the insane number of bumps you mentioned wouldn't cut it.

    Grobian on
    PoGo friend code: 7835 1672 4968
    Ishtaar
  • dporowskidporowski Registered User regular
    Dac wrote: »
    This is so old news to everyone, but why the fuck are pet battles disabled in raid?

    It's like just such an obvious way to kill time while waiting for organization/pugging and shit. What possible reason is there for disallowing it?

    Because a raid will wipe to things like "Look guys, Murky is dancing!", followed by literally half the raid dancing with Murky and not like... Healing. Chromaggus fed well that day.

    Imagine the effect Pokemon would have.

  • tarnoktarnok Registered User regular
    Kipling217 wrote: »
    Kipling217 wrote: »
    Is there some kind of add-on that automatically ques you up for LFD shit? Because I just had the weirdest thing happen to me. I got over a dozen calls to go to dungeon, only for the healer to always refuse. Every damn time! Not in a once or twice way, but 12 times in a row. Every time it was a time out too, the healer didn't actively refuse, but the request timed out.

    Once I can believe, but 12 times? In a row?

    There is an addon I used for a while in cata that queues you automatically when there is a cta bag available and declines the queue automatically if it does not show up in the rewards window when the queue pops.

    Wii Code:
    0431-6094-6446-7088
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Halfmex wrote: »
    Well, from the new PTR push I've seen something that strikes terror into my soul, and it ain't a raid boss.

    http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=94295
    Primal Egg
    Item Level 1
    Binds when picked up
    Unique
    Duration: 3 days (real time)
    "This egg is hatching into something."

    and

    http://ptr.wowhead.com/item=94296
    Cracked Primal Egg
    Item Level 1
    Binds when picked up
    "The egg has hatched!"
    <Right Click to Open>

    If we have another Oracle Egg situation I'm going to be quite unhappy. Loved the Oracles, haaaaaaaaaaaaaated that fucking weekly RNG.

    I noticed different colors of "Primal Raptors" listed in the new mounts, I'd hazard a guess that we have an idea of what could be in those eggs....

This discussion has been closed.