Alternatively, they could tank their armor to 0 to cram in as much extra ammo as they could to make up for that downside, but now you're approaching -IIC levels of "yes, we could make a mech this ridiculously powerful but if anyone so much as looks in its direction it falls over".
Actually IIRC it moves at somewhere around 35 KPH with about 4.5 tons of armor. Which is extremely low, and still has only about 3 tons of ammo.
Yeah, I'm not saying it'll be anything for sure, but I hesitate to say there'll be enough of a downside. It just makes me a bit leery. The way the game handles crits through armor is still a bit weird and hard to be sure of; for all I know it might be possible that a single triple gauss can cause three crits in one location fully armored.
45 tons for the gauss, 7 for chassis. 18 tons for engine armor and ammo? Not at all worried about that being overpowered. Assuming the engine size you put in youll have to include independent heat sinks to reach the ten minimum.
Edit: Alright, lets look at this.
7 tons for chassis (7 total)
45 for Gauss (52 total)
4 tons of ammo (56 total)
5 tons of armor (61 total)
6 tons for 195XL (67 tons)
3 required heat sinks to reach ten (70 tons)
I don't remember the math but a Catapult with a 195 goes 48.6 so you'll be going slower than that with 155 armor. You could drop gauss ammo for more armor but since you're going the speed of molasses, you won't have the turning speed to hit shit, meaning any misses will be even more costly if you skimp on ammo. There is more than enough drawbacks that if I see a triple gauss 'phract the only thought will be "Free kill".
Yeah the cataphract is actually not a terrible platform (balance wise) for dual gauss. It can already be done with existing variants, its just as mentioned the cataphract doesn't have tiny side torsos to protect your rifles.
i must say. we did get crushed one match with a premade army of gaussapults and streak cats, but after that it was mostly smooth sailing. I think once you hit 1am EST, things get normal build wise. just a handfull of streak cats to be seen. Had a good time. Even tried to go to bed and got sucked back in for another hour... fuckers. On the plus side ULTRACAT IS BACK and im tearing shit up with it.
4ML, 2UAC5 with 150 rounds, DHS, 300XL, 368 armor and cammo as black as its soul.
when youre not getting stomped by an entire team of gauss or streak cats, the game is still extremely fun.
i cant wait to roll my jenner with ecm around A1s. gonna stick to them mofos like glue. finding room for the exta 1.5 tons wont be a problem either, just drop AMS.
Yeah, I'm not saying it'll be anything for sure, but I hesitate to say there'll be enough of a downside. It just makes me a bit leery. The way the game handles crits through armor is still a bit weird and hard to be sure of; for all I know it might be possible that a single triple gauss can cause three crits in one location fully armored.
You're already going to have convergence weirdness from two arm mounts. Add in a third torso-mounted gauss, and I don't know if you're going to be getting all three shots to consistently land on the same spot if your target is moving around at all.
So I haven't really been playing much lately with the new baby and all. I jump on last night, see only 4 people in Vent, and proceed to PUG for a bit. I played 5 games and died to streaks in every single one. And then CTD'd. Fuck you, PGI. I'm done until they start fixing this shit.
On the bright side, I finally have time to get back to my Steam GameBank™.
So I haven't really been playing much lately with the new baby and all. I jump on last night, see only 4 people in Vent, and proceed to PUG for a bit.
I am worried about this too. There have been fewer and fewer people on vent lately. Penny Oosik looks like its down about 2/3 its average attendance. Its probably a pretty good indication of the lack of interest from the rest of the player base.
PSN: Valiant_heartPC: Valiantheart99
0
FaranguI am a beardy manWith a beardy planRegistered Userregular
Not entirely unexpected, tbh. Tons of exciting winter releases + preexisting issues in MWO + those issues not really being looked at equals lots of people taking a break from MWO, myself included. We all like the game at some base level still, we just want to give PGI enough time to try and fix their shit. I know I'll eventually come back to it, still have the founders time to reactivate, but for right now other games have the spotlight.
I've just finished a quick pass at how much the screen shakes for all weapons. I showed the results to Bryan and he was like "OMG this isn't an earthquake simulator!". So I went back and tuned the numbers down to something more respectible and they seem to be a lot better.
The amount of screen shake will be reduced quite a bit. The only "big" hit will be from the AC/20.
The next thing I want to tune before pushing these numbers out for testing is the amount of smoke generated by AC fire in general. Again, I'll be working with the artists on this one to see if we can come up with something that doesn't make you blind yourself when firing the ACs.
One other update... I've sped the AC/20 up from 750 to 900 m/s. This means the lead time you need to put on targets is about 20-30% less and you should be able to put more rounds on target when playing in a fast paced match. The other ACs will scale up from there.
On the SSRM direct front, another fix has gone in where the SSRMs will now use arm and leg joints as viable lock-on targets. This spreads damage out more. I'll be working with David B on testing to see if the current implementation of SSRMs along with the reduced cockpit shake and smoke reduction will be enough of a nerf to help counter the SSRM effectiveness without having to directly hit damage/cooldown/heat etc.
New numbers will be coming out soon and again.. I'm not giving you a direct date but we should be able to get this stuff into testing within the next week.
Really doubtful adding a few more lock targets will be enough to balance SSRMs, but I guess we'll see. At this point, anything will be an improvement.
Giving AC/20s a 20% projectile speed boost seems...unwise. But hilarious. If nothing else, this may be enough to get @Ninja Snarl P to take a step back from the ledge. ;-)
I haven't been playing much as my wife was nice enough to buy my XCOM during the steam sale. I may still pop on here and there, but MWO is not currently my go to game. When I do play, there are fewer of us than there were. However, I'm sure some of that is due to PS2, MWO not being as new as it was, and well, all the bugs currently in the game. I still have a good time playing with you folks though.
If they speed the AC/20 back up I'll probably run my Founder's Hunchback more. The 4SP currently wins out. I usually pull in more cash with the 4SP than I do with the Founder's bonus. So strange. Need to figure out a better way of piloting my Cataphract as well.
I've just finished a quick pass at how much the screen shakes for all weapons. I showed the results to Bryan and he was like "OMG this isn't an earthquake simulator!". So I went back and tuned the numbers down to something more respectible and they seem to be a lot better.
The amount of screen shake will be reduced quite a bit. The only "big" hit will be from the AC/20.
The next thing I want to tune before pushing these numbers out for testing is the amount of smoke generated by AC fire in general. Again, I'll be working with the artists on this one to see if we can come up with something that doesn't make you blind yourself when firing the ACs.
One other update... I've sped the AC/20 up from 750 to 900 m/s. This means the lead time you need to put on targets is about 20-30% less and you should be able to put more rounds on target when playing in a fast paced match. The other ACs will scale up from there.
On the SSRM direct front, another fix has gone in where the SSRMs will now use arm and leg joints as viable lock-on targets. This spreads damage out more. I'll be working with David B on testing to see if the current implementation of SSRMs along with the reduced cockpit shake and smoke reduction will be enough of a nerf to help counter the SSRM effectiveness without having to directly hit damage/cooldown/heat etc.
New numbers will be coming out soon and again.. I'm not giving you a direct date but we should be able to get this stuff into testing within the next week.
Really doubtful adding a few more lock targets will be enough to balance SSRMs, but I guess we'll see. At this point, anything will be an improvement.
Giving AC/20s a 20% projectile speed boost seems...unwise. But hilarious. If nothing else, this may be enough to get @Ninja Snarl P to take a step back from the ledge. ;-)
I'd imagine that adding 4 (or more, depending on what joints they added as targets) new potential targets should do a lot to weaken streaks, seeing as now they apparently have only the one. Having that damage spread out should limit the effectiveness of a streakapult. Also give people a reason to put some armor back on their legs.
I've just finished a quick pass at how much the screen shakes for all weapons. I showed the results to Bryan and he was like "OMG this isn't an earthquake simulator!". So I went back and tuned the numbers down to something more respectible and they seem to be a lot better.
The amount of screen shake will be reduced quite a bit. The only "big" hit will be from the AC/20.
The next thing I want to tune before pushing these numbers out for testing is the amount of smoke generated by AC fire in general. Again, I'll be working with the artists on this one to see if we can come up with something that doesn't make you blind yourself when firing the ACs.
One other update... I've sped the AC/20 up from 750 to 900 m/s. This means the lead time you need to put on targets is about 20-30% less and you should be able to put more rounds on target when playing in a fast paced match. The other ACs will scale up from there.
On the SSRM direct front, another fix has gone in where the SSRMs will now use arm and leg joints as viable lock-on targets. This spreads damage out more. I'll be working with David B on testing to see if the current implementation of SSRMs along with the reduced cockpit shake and smoke reduction will be enough of a nerf to help counter the SSRM effectiveness without having to directly hit damage/cooldown/heat etc.
New numbers will be coming out soon and again.. I'm not giving you a direct date but we should be able to get this stuff into testing within the next week.
Really doubtful adding a few more lock targets will be enough to balance SSRMs, but I guess we'll see. At this point, anything will be an improvement.
Giving AC/20s a 20% projectile speed boost seems...unwise. But hilarious. If nothing else, this may be enough to get @Ninja Snarl P to take a step back from the ledge. ;-)
I'd imagine that adding 4 (or more, depending on what joints they added as targets) new potential targets should do a lot to weaken streaks, seeing as now they apparently have only the one. Having that damage spread out should limit the effectiveness of a streakapult. Also give people a reason to put some armor back on their legs.
If they're going to balance Streaks by spreading out their damage, I'd really like to see each missile get a random lock location (or even just each launcher). For all I know, that might be what they're planning. But making a Streakcat function more like a lockable SRM shotgun would be a great step.
I've just finished a quick pass at how much the screen shakes for all weapons. I showed the results to Bryan and he was like "OMG this isn't an earthquake simulator!". So I went back and tuned the numbers down to something more respectible and they seem to be a lot better.
The amount of screen shake will be reduced quite a bit. The only "big" hit will be from the AC/20.
Anyone ever seen those Kitchen Nightmare shows where Gordon Ramsay is always asking the Chef, "Did you taste the food before you sent it out."? Well yeah maybe we need a Developers Nightmare show too it seems. We can send Woz or Hwil Hwheaton around to test these things for them and tell them its rubbish.
I was going solo with some trial mech yesterday and got an error code "match not found" after it did the search for a good and long time. Don't know if it was just a bug or there really are a lot less players these days and finding a good match was actually hard.
And yeah vent is so empty for mwo these days and ps2 is always full of ppl.
I blame Planetside 2 and the balancing issues. When things settle a bit, and when they FIX THE GODDAMN GAME, people will come back.
PS2 chat was PACKED last night! MWO... not so much. Ive been playing a good bit, but thats usually just jumping in a couple matches here and there to grind some bills. I dont have a whole lot of good quality time to hop in vent to really play.
I've just finished a quick pass at how much the screen shakes for all weapons. I showed the results to Bryan and he was like "OMG this isn't an earthquake simulator!". So I went back and tuned the numbers down to something more respectible and they seem to be a lot better.
The amount of screen shake will be reduced quite a bit. The only "big" hit will be from the AC/20.
Anyone ever seen those Kitchen Nightmare shows where Gordon Ramsay is always asking the Chef, "Did you taste the food before you sent it out."? Well yeah maybe we need a Developers Nightmare show too it seems. We can send Woz or Hwil Hwheaton around to test these things for them and tell them its rubbish.
Design in a vacuum confirmed? They seem to work in that naive/inexperienced developer approach of tuning something until it seems good by itself and then considering the task done, rather than taking a step back for that big-picture gut check of how things come together in the overall context before moving on to the next task. It's a good thing this Bryan guy spoke up with some common sense in this particular instance, but I think we've seen how much of that kind of stuff isn't getting caught.
Endo
300XL
1LLaser
2Mlaser
2 SRM6+Artemis 2 tons of ammo
Gauss 4 tons of ammo
13 DHS
Dropped the LLaser swapped to 3 Mpulse and 1 more DHS. Works great.
Oh, and the Cataphract nerf to arm tracking? Fucking sucks.
does the XL make you... squishy?
I only ever run XLs, so if it makes me die significantly more than a non XL then I don't notice it.
i run a standard in my 4X and i lose my side torsos pretty frequently.
Appropriately cautious play keeps you alive for quite some time. Balls to the wall diving ends with you getting wrecked. But even with the fire of four or so mechs at once, you can lay down a hurting before you bite it. Going 1 on 2 or 3 is actually not the worst thing ever provided they aren't cheese builds.
Did you atler your 4X starting armor? Cause I know all the 'phracts I've bought have been frontloaded, with nothing but hopes and dreams protecting their rear torsos by default.
4X runs a whole slew of explosive ammo too, doesn't it? All I've ever used is inert gauss ammo, and the SRM ammo is in the legs, so I don't worry much about crits.
Docshifty on
0
CarbonFireSee youin the countryRegistered Userregular
I blame Planetside 2 and the balancing issues. When things settle a bit, and when they FIX THE GODDAMN GAME, people will come back.
Yup. Waiting for either hit detection improvements or knockdown to come back. Taking a break saves me from getting too soured on the game.
Plus rolling in a 100-man tank column to assault a base defended by another 100 dudes is just something this game can't compare to atm. I still love stompy robots though 8->
Endo
300XL
1LLaser
2Mlaser
2 SRM6+Artemis 2 tons of ammo
Gauss 4 tons of ammo
13 DHS
Dropped the LLaser swapped to 3 Mpulse and 1 more DHS. Works great.
Oh, and the Cataphract nerf to arm tracking? Fucking sucks.
does the XL make you... squishy?
I only ever run XLs, so if it makes me die significantly more than a non XL then I don't notice it.
i run a standard in my 4X and i lose my side torsos pretty frequently.
Appropriately cautious play keeps you alive for quite some time. Balls to the wall diving ends with you getting wrecked. But even with the fire of four or so mechs at once, you can lay down a hurting before you bite it. Going 1 on 2 or 3 is actually not the worst thing ever provided they aren't cheese builds.
Did you atler your 4X starting armor? Cause I know all the 'phracts I've bought have been frontloaded, with nothing but hopes and dreams protecting their rear torsos by default.
4X runs a whole slew of explosive ammo too, doesn't it? All I've ever used is inert gauss ammo, and the SRM ammo is in the legs, so I don't worry much about crits.
i upped my total armor to 400. 20 on the back sides and 24 back center. didnt put in case, becase screw paying for it. Ammo in the legs. Standard 210 engine. Sloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow.
Now that my cats are Mastered (well all the elites unlocked) i can mess with my 4X. i have my 1X just about where i want it. Then i get to decide if i want the 2X, the D or the Hero next week. Once i get another phract i can move on to commandos, jenners or hunches.
i really need another XL300 so i can quickly swap between my C1 and K2 to grind cash.
i upped my total armor to 400. 20 on the back sides and 24 back center. didnt put in case, becase screw paying for it. Ammo in the legs.
I would need a 4-legged 'Mech to fit all the ammo I carry on my 4X.
I'd love to see quad mechs in the game.
No idea how they'd actually work, just that I like the quad mechs and want to see more of them around in assorted mech warrior stuff.
I blame Planetside 2 and the balancing issues. When things settle a bit, and when they FIX THE GODDAMN GAME, people will come back.
Yeah, I've still definitely got plenty of gaming left in MWO. Once the really glaring bugs are fixed then our banner call of Weiner Dick Butt will ring out and once more will our enemies feel the taste of our pew pew.
Also, in one strange way, I quite like that the paint jobs are a one shot thing. It means that peoples colour schemes will become recognisable as they won't change often. It'll be pretty cool to be able to identify a player just by their paint job alone.
Maybe they could bring out a clan liveries when we get into community warfare. Dunno what the setup would be though.
I blame Planetside 2 and the balancing issues. When things settle a bit, and when they FIX THE GODDAMN GAME, people will come back.
Yeah, I've still definitely got plenty of gaming left in MWO. Once the really glaring bugs are fixed then our banner call of Weiner Dick Butt will ring out and once more will our enemies feel the taste of our pew pew.
Also, in one strange way, I quite like that the paint jobs are a one shot thing. It means that peoples colour schemes will become recognisable as they won't change often. It'll be pretty cool to be able to identify a player just by their paint job alone.
Maybe they could bring out a clan liveries when we get into community warfare. Dunno what the setup would be though.
i like that aspect too... but still make me grumpy needing cash money for EVERY change. Ill be rocking the PC gamer skin colors on the default skin for a while.
i upped my total armor to 400. 20 on the back sides and 24 back center. didnt put in case, becase screw paying for it. Ammo in the legs.
I would need a 4-legged 'Mech to fit all the ammo I carry on my 4X.
I'd love to see quad mechs in the game.
No idea how they'd actually work, just that I like the quad mechs and want to see more of them around in assorted mech warrior stuff.
I know I've said it before, but honestly, I'd lose my shit if someone made an online mech game with a Chromehounds-style mech builder. Even free-to-play, they'd make $50+ off me through microtransactions... if not double that.
Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
I've also stopped playing this altogether, but for all my consumer rage about how things are being handled, I would be back so fast it would suck the paint off of my house if/when they got the game fixed. But PS2 is looking neat if for no other reason than MASSIVE BATTLES, so hopefully that will last me until MWO i fixed up.
I'd also be pretty irritated about the whole thing with the devs going "GAME IS BROKEN! WHY NO ONE TELL US!", but I'd already more or less figured they had no freaking clue that the balance was this bad.
Posts
The solution here is clear: we must go deeper
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
Edit: Alright, lets look at this.
7 tons for chassis (7 total)
45 for Gauss (52 total)
4 tons of ammo (56 total)
5 tons of armor (61 total)
6 tons for 195XL (67 tons)
3 required heat sinks to reach ten (70 tons)
I don't remember the math but a Catapult with a 195 goes 48.6 so you'll be going slower than that with 155 armor. You could drop gauss ammo for more armor but since you're going the speed of molasses, you won't have the turning speed to hit shit, meaning any misses will be even more costly if you skimp on ammo. There is more than enough drawbacks that if I see a triple gauss 'phract the only thought will be "Free kill".
Dropped the LLaser swapped to 3 Mpulse and 1 more DHS. Works great.
Oh, and the Cataphract nerf to arm tracking? Fucking sucks.
4ML, 2UAC5 with 150 rounds, DHS, 300XL, 368 armor and cammo as black as its soul.
when youre not getting stomped by an entire team of gauss or streak cats, the game is still extremely fun.
does the XL make you... squishy?
You're already going to have convergence weirdness from two arm mounts. Add in a third torso-mounted gauss, and I don't know if you're going to be getting all three shots to consistently land on the same spot if your target is moving around at all.
On the bright side, I finally have time to get back to my Steam GameBank™.
I am worried about this too. There have been fewer and fewer people on vent lately. Penny Oosik looks like its down about 2/3 its average attendance. Its probably a pretty good indication of the lack of interest from the rest of the player base.
Chicago Megagame group
Watch me struggle to learn streaming! Point and laugh!
Really doubtful adding a few more lock targets will be enough to balance SSRMs, but I guess we'll see. At this point, anything will be an improvement.
Giving AC/20s a 20% projectile speed boost seems...unwise. But hilarious. If nothing else, this may be enough to get @Ninja Snarl P to take a step back from the ledge. ;-)
If they speed the AC/20 back up I'll probably run my Founder's Hunchback more. The 4SP currently wins out. I usually pull in more cash with the 4SP than I do with the Founder's bonus. So strange. Need to figure out a better way of piloting my Cataphract as well.
PSN : Bolthorn
If they're going to balance Streaks by spreading out their damage, I'd really like to see each missile get a random lock location (or even just each launcher). For all I know, that might be what they're planning. But making a Streakcat function more like a lockable SRM shotgun would be a great step.
Anyone ever seen those Kitchen Nightmare shows where Gordon Ramsay is always asking the Chef, "Did you taste the food before you sent it out."? Well yeah maybe we need a Developers Nightmare show too it seems. We can send Woz or Hwil Hwheaton around to test these things for them and tell them its rubbish.
I only ever run XLs, so if it makes me die significantly more than a non XL then I don't notice it.
And yeah vent is so empty for mwo these days and ps2 is always full of ppl.
Also reduced screen shake from SSRMs would be great.
i run a standard in my 4X and i lose my side torsos pretty frequently.
PS2 chat was PACKED last night! MWO... not so much. Ive been playing a good bit, but thats usually just jumping in a couple matches here and there to grind some bills. I dont have a whole lot of good quality time to hop in vent to really play.
Design in a vacuum confirmed? They seem to work in that naive/inexperienced developer approach of tuning something until it seems good by itself and then considering the task done, rather than taking a step back for that big-picture gut check of how things come together in the overall context before moving on to the next task. It's a good thing this Bryan guy spoke up with some common sense in this particular instance, but I think we've seen how much of that kind of stuff isn't getting caught.
Appropriately cautious play keeps you alive for quite some time. Balls to the wall diving ends with you getting wrecked. But even with the fire of four or so mechs at once, you can lay down a hurting before you bite it. Going 1 on 2 or 3 is actually not the worst thing ever provided they aren't cheese builds.
Did you atler your 4X starting armor? Cause I know all the 'phracts I've bought have been frontloaded, with nothing but hopes and dreams protecting their rear torsos by default.
4X runs a whole slew of explosive ammo too, doesn't it? All I've ever used is inert gauss ammo, and the SRM ammo is in the legs, so I don't worry much about crits.
Yup. Waiting for either hit detection improvements or knockdown to come back. Taking a break saves me from getting too soured on the game.
Plus rolling in a 100-man tank column to assault a base defended by another 100 dudes is just something this game can't compare to atm. I still love stompy robots though 8->
i upped my total armor to 400. 20 on the back sides and 24 back center. didnt put in case, becase screw paying for it. Ammo in the legs. Standard 210 engine. Sloooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooow.
Now that my cats are Mastered (well all the elites unlocked) i can mess with my 4X. i have my 1X just about where i want it. Then i get to decide if i want the 2X, the D or the Hero next week. Once i get another phract i can move on to commandos, jenners or hunches.
i really need another XL300 so i can quickly swap between my C1 and K2 to grind cash.
I would need a 4-legged 'Mech to fit all the ammo I carry on my 4X.
not all my ammo fits in my legs. so a couple tons go in the sides. but it wasnt worth dropping 200K on CASE.
I'd love to see quad mechs in the game.
No idea how they'd actually work, just that I like the quad mechs and want to see more of them around in assorted mech warrior stuff.
Yeah, I've still definitely got plenty of gaming left in MWO. Once the really glaring bugs are fixed then our banner call of Weiner Dick Butt will ring out and once more will our enemies feel the taste of our pew pew.
Also, in one strange way, I quite like that the paint jobs are a one shot thing. It means that peoples colour schemes will become recognisable as they won't change often. It'll be pretty cool to be able to identify a player just by their paint job alone.
Maybe they could bring out a clan liveries when we get into community warfare. Dunno what the setup would be though.
http://steamcommunity.com/id/pablocampy
i like that aspect too... but still make me grumpy needing cash money for EVERY change. Ill be rocking the PC gamer skin colors on the default skin for a while.
though i do so want to do an Orange Dip on my K2.
I know I've said it before, but honestly, I'd lose my shit if someone made an online mech game with a Chromehounds-style mech builder. Even free-to-play, they'd make $50+ off me through microtransactions... if not double that.
PSN: ShogunGunshow
Origin: ShogunGunshow
I don't even want to actually play that bad, I just really want to get at the paint jobs!
http://steamcommunity.com/id/pablocampy
I'd also be pretty irritated about the whole thing with the devs going "GAME IS BROKEN! WHY NO ONE TELL US!", but I'd already more or less figured they had no freaking clue that the balance was this bad.