I picked jax into irelia twice in a row and they played the exact same way and lost the exact same way to me
I find Jax/Irelia to be one of the truest 'skill matchups' in the game.
Whoever goes in on the other tends to lose the trades; if Irelia does her EW, then Jax can simply counterstrike and win the trade. When Jax goes in on Irelia, she can just Q juke his stun and chase him down.
I think I'd rather be Irelia, just because it's easier to get CS if you're behind.
she can't win. either she tries to trade with you and loses, or she dies to auto+empower poke because she knows she can't win a trade. then again these two didn't know that and would try to stun and fight back after I did my auto W on them. at which point I would pop e and take half their health because they could do nothing.
Is there some stigma about premades that I don't know about? Some random guy tonight got all bent out of shape because we were playing as a 4-man group. Before anyone chose any characters (we also start out by asking any of the randoms which role they prefer, and we're pretty polite to everyone too).
As someone who plays 95% 5 mans, "me and X bot" is a phrase that causes me to wake up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat.
Basically, multi-queuing bumps up the skill level of the enemy team. This means that your bronze bot lane will be going up against silvers and gold, and they're very likely to lose horribly.
Four mans also tend to be using voip, so they'll never communicate with you. They'll also never gank your lane and they'll scapegoat you as soon as they start losing.
I can see where you're coming from there. We do talk on voip, but we also try to make our intentions very clear both pre-game and in-game (with words and pings).
In this specific instance, Rend (as he does every game) starts out in chat during character select: "Hey bonerdude420* what is your preferred role?"
And from there,
bonerdude - "Are you guys a premade?"
us - "Yes"...
bonerdude - "oh **** dammit"... "I'll do **** whatever"
He then basically told us he "gave up" when he found out we were a premade.
The next game we played our random guy was a team player and a really cool dude.
*note: bonerdude420 probably wasn't his real name
(also, I have profanity filter on because substituting your own words for the **** can be hilarious)
crimsoncoyote on
0
KayWhat we need...Is a little bit of PANIC.Registered Userregular
If I find myself in a 4-man premade, nine times out of ten they call all roles but support. The other time, they tell me I'm jungling.
And I hate jungling for a 4-man premade, because you are highly unlikely to get ANY help. Though sometimes you do and it's all good.
I think once, just ONCE, they asked if I wanted to go top, and I said sure, just leave me up there to farm at the tower and gank them if they overextend, maybe. They agreed, ignored me for most of the game, I farmed up and was pretty strong. When it came around to teamfights it sorta gelled. I'd have been screwed if the opposing jungler had camped me a little more than he had done, though.
I do 3 and 4 man premades a lot. Our policy is generally let the odd man out choose his role and fill in around that. It's much calmer that way
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+1
VizardObserverThe Duke of Ridiculous PoppycockyRegistered Userregular
That's one of the most true points I've seen about Jax v Irelia, whoever goes in on the other tends to lose the trade.
I love playing the matchup on both sides of it, however if you get a kill with Jax the lane is over, but if irelia kills Jax Jax can still farm and eventually out trade her
I tried Udyr last night for the first time and wow did it not go well. I don't think I like his mechanic at all, I could never pick which form I wanted to be in or what items to build. He feels like a true jack of all trades master of none.
Is there some stigma about premades that I don't know about? Some random guy tonight got all bent out of shape because we were playing as a 4-man group. Before anyone chose any characters (we also start out by asking any of the randoms which role they prefer, and we're pretty polite to everyone too).
As someone who plays 95% 5 mans, "me and X bot" is a phrase that causes me to wake up in the middle of the night in a cold sweat.
Basically, multi-queuing bumps up the skill level of the enemy team. This means that your bronze bot lane will be going up against silvers and gold, and they're very likely to lose horribly.
Four mans also tend to be using voip, so they'll never communicate with you. They'll also never gank your lane and they'll scapegoat you as soon as they start losing.
For the record I always blame the random; it's always their fault we decided to play a non-appropriate poorly thought out team comp and not discuss anything before hand.
Seriously though it's better for morale if I point out what the random did wrong and don't berate my friends for their mistakes.
Other than my wife... dammit woman how many times I gots to tell you CDR is hard capped at 40%? Get Merc's if you're planning on building a frozen heart and a shurielia, not ionian boots.
I do 3 and 4 man premades a lot. Our policy is generally let the odd man out choose his role and fill in around that. It's much calmer that way
That's exactly why we do it. We're skilled enough to cover all the roles, so it's not really a big deal. Oddly enough, it feels like 8/10 times our 5th wants mid, where the rest of our team usually prefers other roles.
I will say that a vast majority of the random players we play with are positive and willing to work as a team. This one case just had a particularly negative player.
Seriously though it's better for morale if I point out what the random did wrong and don't berate my friends for their mistakes.
Other than my wife... dammit woman how many times I gots to tell you CDR is hard capped at 40%? Get Merc's if you're planning on building a frozen heart and a shurielia, not ionian boots.
i just... yeh, i just can't see that happening in my house. i can tell you that bed time would be FUN that night....
I do 3 and 4 man premades a lot. Our policy is generally let the odd man out choose his role and fill in around that. It's much calmer that way
That's exactly why we do it. We're skilled enough to cover all the roles, so it's not really a big deal. Oddly enough, it feels like 8/10 times our 5th wants mid, where the rest of our team usually prefers other roles.
I will say that a vast majority of the random players we play with are positive and willing to work as a team. This one case just had a particularly negative player.
100% of the time, the first thing I say is
"Hey <5th person's name>, what is your preferred role?"
If they say a role, we give it to them basically immediately.
If they say X or Y, then I say,
"How about X? Does that work?"
Like, we really go out of our way to make life easier for the random in our 4-man premades. The guy we ran into last night was being a giant tool.
I tried Udyr last night for the first time and wow did it not go well. I don't think I like his mechanic at all, I could never pick which form I wanted to be in or what items to build. He feels like a true jack of all trades master of none.
Manbearpig excels at being a tank and being sustainy. Your team fight potential is great and you can do a lot of damage with pretty much all tank items.
Miniwolf on
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0
BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
Jax is still serious bullshit, and I stand by my comments that all those who whined about how 'underpowered' he was after the remake had absolutely no fucking clue what they were talking about.
Ah, the joys of turning on all chat. Had an Irelia angrily retort after a death that the only reason she died was because she got caught on a minion, I calmly informed her that all the minion did was save me from having to activate ghost.
Also, I absolutely hate premades that dont at least lane together, had a premade join up, pick Ashe into Taric/MF, and her rune page gave a total of 1 bonus AD, then the 3 bonus AD from masteries. She couldnt last hit, and because she was Ashe with no escapes, Taric/MF just man handled her.
All chat is the best. The Eve game I played last we started off horrible and the other team started talking trash in /all. Once me and Leona got rolling it was hilarious watching them get pissed. Leona Ult and grab and EVERY TIME the other team would collapse on Leona which let me catch the whole team in my Eve ult (which at that point was doing 26%). This happened every single team fight we had. Glorious.
Ah, the joys of turning on all chat. Had an Irelia angrily retort after a death that the only reason she died was because she got caught on a minion, I calmly informed her that all the minion did was save me from having to activate ghost.
Also, I absolutely hate premades that dont at least lane together, had a premade join up, pick Ashe into Taric/MF, and her rune page gave a total of 1 bonus AD, then the 3 bonus AD from masteries. She couldnt last hit, and because she was Ashe with no escapes, Taric/MF just man handled her.
All chat is the best. The Eve game I played last we started off horrible and the other team started talking trash in /all. Once me and Leona got rolling it was hilarious watching them get pissed. Leona Ult and grab and EVERY TIME the other team would collapse on Leona which let me catch the whole team in my Eve ult (which at that point was doing 26%). This happened every single team fight we had. Glorious.
Last night someone on the enemy team called our vlad "abortion tier". Seriously, wtf?
I tried Udyr last night for the first time and wow did it not go well. I don't think I like his mechanic at all, I could never pick which form I wanted to be in or what items to build. He feels like a true jack of all trades master of none.
Manbearpig excels at being a tank and being sustainy. Your team fight potential is great and you can do a lot of damage with pretty much all tank items.
So I would "e" to gap close and stun them, then "w" for a quick shield to protect from whatever nuke they would toss at me and then "q" and attack. Was I doing that right? I almost never used "r" it just seemed like "q" did a lot more damage and the extra attack speed was way better.
Edit: Also, I played Xerath a few times and it took until the third game that I realized that you could cancel your "w" before the spell was over haha
histronic on
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VizardObserverThe Duke of Ridiculous PoppycockyRegistered Userregular
jax was horrendously bad after his remake. they were shoveling buffs at him every patch because it was that bad
What buffs did he get?
Doesn't Jax have like the best base stats in the game
It's also weird how irelia is a hardcore late game top laner unless Jax is there.
Jax's scaling just seems like it's on a much sharper curve then irelias
I never know what priorities to put on abilities as Jarvan. I want ALL OF THEM.
I usually max W first via magic damage tops, E first via physical damage, or Q if I'm ahead and just want to HURT PEOPLE. (Or if they're low damage and are building armour.)
Maxing Q and E are the skills you should do first, so you can out-trade your opponent. Your W you only need one point into for the slow, plus the shield is mediocre at best. I take it at 8 or 10 or something like that.
The hardest part to playing Jarvan is your build choice. Since you can build him tanky, bruisery, or AD carry style, it can be hard to pinpoint what your role in the game should be.
There weren't that many changes if I remember correctly. After the remake they saw that Counterstrike was a bit wonky so they buffed it a bit and let you end it early (Which was honestly the biggest problem I had) they also gave him better mana regen.
After that they realized he was too bursty with his ult so they turned it into a defensive buff instead, and gave him better health per level (This coul dbe a nerf or buff depending on your perspective). The next two patches just tweaked some bugs. Then they nerfed empower in the next one, and finally made it so you could use counterstrike properly against Shen.
So to review:
Remake happened > Changed Counterstrike and increased mana regen (Buff) > Fixed bug > Changed ult to defense and gave 25 range to Counterstrike (Buff)> passive stacks on miss > fixed bug > reduced empower damage (Nerf) > fixed bug.
Aside from the first change (3 days after remake) the rest happened at roughly month intervals over a 6 month period
In reverse order from the remake courtesy of lol-patch.com
v1.0.0.143 - 2012-07-19
Fixed: Counter Strike's dodge component now works properly against Shen
v1.0.0.140b - 2012-06-05
Empower damage reduced at later ranks to 40/75/110/145/180 from 40/85/130/175/220
v1.0.0.139 - 2012-05-01
Fixed a bug where Counterstrike was stunning through spell shields
v1.0.0.138 - 2012-04-17
Relentless Assault (Passive) will now stack even if Jax's attack misses or is dodged
v1.0.0.136 - 2012-03-20
Health per level increased to 98 from 88
Counterstrike area of effect radius increased to 375 from 350
Grandmaster's Might (New Active): Jax gains 25/35/45 (+30% of his bonus attack damage) armor and 25/35/45 (+20% of his ability power) magic resist for 8 seconds. 100 mana, 80 second cooldown.
v1.0.0.135 - 2012-02-29
Fixed a bug where Grandmaster's Might passive attack canceled if the buff ran out during the attack animation
v1.0.0.133 - 2012-02-01
Mana regen per level increased to 0.7 per 5 seconds from 0.45
Fixed a bug where Empower's cooldown was higher than stated at earlier ranks
Counter Strike
Dodge duration increased to 2 seconds from 1.5
Now additionally reduces the damage from area of effect abilities by 25% while Jax is dodging
Now can be activated again after 1 second to end the effect early
Damage adjusted to 50/75/100/125/150 (+0.5 bonus attack damage) from 40/70/100/130/160 (+0.8 bonus attack damage)
Now deals 20% increased damage for each attack dodged (up to a maximum of 100% increased damage) instead of 10/15/20/25/30 bonus damage per dodge
Cooldown reduced to 18/16/14/12/10 seconds from 22/20/18/16/14
Grandmaster’s Might duration increased to 8 seconds from 6
v1.0.0.132 - 2012-01-18
General
Base health increased to 551 from 506
Health per level increased to 88 from 83
Armor per level increased to 3.5 from 3.2
Added an animation to Jax's Joke
Relentless Assault - Passive (Remade)
Every time Jax attacks an enemy he gains 4-10% increased attack speed (stacks up to 6 times)
Leap Strike
Cooldown changed to 10/9/8/7/6 seconds from 13/11/9/7/5
Damage changed to 70/110/150/190/230 (+1.0 bonus attack damage)(0.6 ability power) from 20/45/70/95/120 (+1.0 total attack damage)(0.7 ability power)
Empower
Cooldown reduced to 7/6/5/4/3 seconds from 9/8/7/6/5
Damage changed to 40/85/130/175/220 from 60/95/130/165/200
Ability power ratio increased to 0.6 from 0.4
Mana cost increased to 30 from 20
Counter Strike (Remade)
Jax dodges all incoming basic attacks for 1.5 seconds. At the end of the effect, Jax deals 40/70/100/130/160 (+0.8 bonus attack damage) physical damage and stuns nearby enemies for 1 second. This spell deals an additional 10/15/20/25/30 damage for each attack dodged.
Grandmaster's Might (Remade)
Passive: Every third consecutive attack deals an additional 100/160/220 (+0.7 ability power) magic damage.
Active: Jax gains ability power equal to 25/45/65 (+ 20% of his ability power) and attack damage equal to 25/45/65 (+ 20% of his bonus attack damage) for 6 seconds.
He wasn't that bad off at all, and they mostly just gave him some QoL changes and fixed a couple bugs. The main reason people think he is strong now is because people actually learned how to play him properly. The only big thing that really needed to be fixed was counterstrike which they did 3 days after but the community had taken it into their head that he was "bad" already and that stuck with him for quite awhile.
In general I find the majority of the community to be very unimaginative when it comes to remakes and new champions that maybe aren't straightforward in playstyle. They don't really take the time to consider how the champ works, what it can do, what you can build on it, etc. What ends up happening is that champions get pegged early on as bad, or weak, or a multitude of other things before anyone has really had a chance to really work with them and try and find the potential. And once enough time has passed and a few people have worked out some optimal builds and strats, suddenly the champ is good, or OP. (This is especially prominent when a High Elo player does good things with a supposedly weak or useless champ, and suddenly the community sees the light) It's why I really try to impress upon people not to jump to early snap judgments on new champs or remakes without really letting people get into the meat of the mechanics and work with it, and why comments like "Why would you choose new Champ X, it's just a crappy version of old Champ Y" are a bit inaccurate. It's all about finding the niche the champ fills, what sort of compositions they work in, what sort of goal they have, etc.
Delphinidaes on
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Delph - yeh, people tend to use the same old thing in the same old ways with the same old champs.
Someone mentioning Hecarim as someone that people needed to get their heads around, and it's going to take one tournament that Hecarim goes MLP-style and rampages through the tourny, and then he'll be FOTM and nerfed (deservedly so).
The "Euro lane" meta that seems to have hardened into cement that you can't run any comp in soloq that isn't Euro-lane.
There are overall archetypes of characters, and yes some are repetitive. AD character, with a steroid a poke, a little utility and a nuke ult? Yep, seen it. Sustain support, yep. Disengage support etc etc.
on an unrelated note, i'm looking at my S3 champ winrates... since i'm at 88% with Taric, should I just try to pink fuzzy boots my way up the ladder?
my favorite comp that i've played recently was elise top, heimer mid, kog lulu bot, any jungler. at least one promote
siege push is hilarious esp with kog and elise
0
Madpandasuburbs west of chicagoRegistered Userregular
edited November 2012
Switched from Dom to TT and broke a 6 game losing streak. First TT game I went warwick and dominated, then I went xerath and did just as well, did they change his ult though? I seem to remember it being a wide beam thing. Lost 3rd game as pantheon but the other team was playing better and our miss fortune kept trying to take all 3 of them on at once.
Is there a way to give those teamwork things after game lobby has closed? I keep forgetting and then I see a +1 pop up and feel like a jerkface.
Also what is a good way to see general item builds for champ groups. I realize this differs greatly from how you plan on playing a specific champ but I'm looking for something I can tab to while a match is loading for a general "x y z champs benefit from stacking the crap out of ad, or going for these items is a good idea on a b c champs".
I can most of the time make a workable build just by looking at champ abilities and building defense based off what the enemy team is. Just wondering if there is a decent quick reference card.
Switched from Dom to TT and broke a 6 game losing streak. First TT game I went warwick and dominated, then I went xerath and did just as well, did they change his ult though? I seem to remember it being a wide beam thing. Lost 3rd game as pantheon but the other team was playing better and our miss fortune kept trying to take all 3 of them on at once.
Is there a way to give those teamwork things after game lobby has closed? I keep forgetting and then I see a +1 pop up and feel like a jerkface.
Also what is a good way to see general item builds for champ groups. I realize this differs greatly from how you plan on playing a specific champ but I'm looking for something I can tab to while a match is loading for a general "x y z champs benefit from stacking the crap out of ad, or going for these items is a good idea on a b c champs".
I can most of the time make a workable build just by looking at champ abilities and building defense based off what the enemy team is. Just wondering if there is a decent quick reference card.
I typically take a glance at a solomid guide that's recent & featured or suggested if I'm really lost on what to build for a champ, then adjust for the game/enemies/etc.
jax was horrendously bad after his remake. they were shoveling buffs at him every patch because it was that bad
What buffs did he get?
Doesn't Jax have like the best base stats in the game
It's also weird how irelia is a hardcore late game top laner unless Jax is there.
Jax's scaling just seems like it's on a much sharper curve then irelias
no, his base stats sucked... until they buffed them after the remake
and they buffed his passive
and reworked some numbers
and they made his ult not stupid
the jax remake was a while ago. he was unplayably bad out the door
jax was horrendously bad after his remake. they were shoveling buffs at him every patch because it was that bad
What buffs did he get?
Doesn't Jax have like the best base stats in the game
It's also weird how irelia is a hardcore late game top laner unless Jax is there.
Jax's scaling just seems like it's on a much sharper curve then irelias
no, his base stats sucked... until they buffed them after the remake
and they buffed his passive
and reworked some numbers
and they made his ult not stupid
the jax remake was a while ago. he was unplayably bad out the door
wait, unplayably bad after remake, or when? Jax is the only champ to be outright pulled from the game for being hideously OP on release. Then they reworked with the removal of dodge, and damnit, he's at Kayle levels of reworks now.
Switched from Dom to TT and broke a 6 game losing streak. First TT game I went warwick and dominated, then I went xerath and did just as well, did they change his ult though? I seem to remember it being a wide beam thing. Lost 3rd game as pantheon but the other team was playing better and our miss fortune kept trying to take all 3 of them on at once.
Is there a way to give those teamwork things after game lobby has closed? I keep forgetting and then I see a +1 pop up and feel like a jerkface.
Also what is a good way to see general item builds for champ groups. I realize this differs greatly from how you plan on playing a specific champ but I'm looking for something I can tab to while a match is loading for a general "x y z champs benefit from stacking the crap out of ad, or going for these items is a good idea on a b c champs".
I can most of the time make a workable build just by looking at champ abilities and building defense based off what the enemy team is. Just wondering if there is a decent quick reference card.
It used to be people would look up guides during loading on new champs to figure out what they should build, which you can still do at http://www.solomid.net/guides.php
What will happen eventually as you play more and more games though is that you will get a general sense for what the items do, what benefit they bring, and whther or not you want that for a specific champ.
In a BROAD sense though here are a few basics:
Ranged AD Carry: Infinity Edge, Phantom Dancer, Last Whisper, Guardian Angel, Bloodthirster.
reason: AD carry typically wants to auto attack a lot. So you want your Autos to not only hit hard, but often. AD damage items, crit, and attack speed are the key.
AD Bruiser: Maw, Frozen Mallet, Triforce, Atmas, Guardian Angel, Bloodthirster.
reason: AD Bruisers want to stick to a target and be very beefy to survive. Typically you want items that both increase your offensive and defensive capabilities. Hybridization and survivability is the key here.
AP Carry: Deathcap, Void Staff, Rylai's, Rod of Ages, Will of the Ancients, Abyssal Specter, Deathfire Grasp
reason: AP carry wants to pumps as much damage into their abilities as possible. Typically you want items that increase your AP but will also want some health to avoid being blown up too easily.
AD Assassin: Ghostblade, Bloodthirster, Maw, Last Whisper
reason: you are fragile, but you scale well with AD items so you want to focus primarily on maximum damage output to destroy your target
AP Assassin: Deathcap, Deathfire Grasp, Lichbane, Voidstaff, Will of the Ancients, Abyssal Scepter
reason: again you are pretty fragile but you scale well with AP, focus on damage
Tank: Randiuns, Frozen Heart, Sunfire, Force of Nature, Warmogs, Atmas, Banshee's veil, Aegis.
reason: your goal is to take damage, so you want to mitigate it as much as possible so you can take more of it. You want items that give you health and resistances
Support: Wards.
reason: you won't have enough money for anything else.
Support: ok for real you want Shurelia's, Aegis, Heart of Gold, zeke's herald
reason: you want items that boost your survivability a bit but mostly things that benefit your team with a passive aura.
Jungler: This is very champion specific and based on what role the jungler would fill and how they progress in the jungle.
Again this is just a quick and dirty list and i'm probably forgetting some items. Honestly though you want to tailor your item choices to be specific to the champion itself, and eventually get to the point where you are making your item choices on how they benefit your champ, what the enemy is doing, what your own goals are, etc.
Having a basic idea of a build is good, but it is ore important to be flexible than it is to stick to one build.
*edit* Oh and keep in mind all this will change in Season 3 as the new items will open up many more build choices for each role.
Delphinidaes on
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jax was horrendously bad after his remake. they were shoveling buffs at him every patch because it was that bad
What buffs did he get?
Doesn't Jax have like the best base stats in the game
It's also weird how irelia is a hardcore late game top laner unless Jax is there.
Jax's scaling just seems like it's on a much sharper curve then irelias
no, his base stats sucked... until they buffed them after the remake
and they buffed his passive
and reworked some numbers
and they made his ult not stupid
the jax remake was a while ago. he was unplayably bad out the door
Not...really.
The only change they needed to fix was the counterstrike which they did 3 days later. Everything after that was people not having a clue and not understanding how Jax worked now.
They also didn't change his passive at any point after the remake. It still is and always has been 4%-14% attack speed buff that stacks up to 6 times.
The only base stat change they made was a buff to his health per level by 10 (so an extra 170 at max level) and to increase mana regen from .45 per 5 to .7 per 5. While nice these are hardly that impactful, all the major base stat changes happened in the remake itself and aside from those two, have remained unchanged.
The ult change is a matter of opinion. Some people didn't want the defense and liked the burst, others loved the defense and how it made him much more durable (i'm in this camp, but also think it makes him too durable atm)
They also had a couple decent bug fixes in there.
Delphinidaes on
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Posts
I find Jax/Irelia to be one of the truest 'skill matchups' in the game.
Whoever goes in on the other tends to lose the trades; if Irelia does her EW, then Jax can simply counterstrike and win the trade. When Jax goes in on Irelia, she can just Q juke his stun and chase him down.
I think I'd rather be Irelia, just because it's easier to get CS if you're behind.
I can see where you're coming from there. We do talk on voip, but we also try to make our intentions very clear both pre-game and in-game (with words and pings).
In this specific instance, Rend (as he does every game) starts out in chat during character select: "Hey bonerdude420* what is your preferred role?"
And from there,
bonerdude - "Are you guys a premade?"
us - "Yes"...
bonerdude - "oh **** dammit"... "I'll do **** whatever"
He then basically told us he "gave up" when he found out we were a premade.
The next game we played our random guy was a team player and a really cool dude.
*note: bonerdude420 probably wasn't his real name
(also, I have profanity filter on because substituting your own words for the **** can be hilarious)
And I hate jungling for a 4-man premade, because you are highly unlikely to get ANY help. Though sometimes you do and it's all good.
I think once, just ONCE, they asked if I wanted to go top, and I said sure, just leave me up there to farm at the tower and gank them if they overextend, maybe. They agreed, ignored me for most of the game, I farmed up and was pretty strong. When it came around to teamfights it sorta gelled. I'd have been screwed if the opposing jungler had camped me a little more than he had done, though.
3DS FCode: 1993-7512-8991
FFXIV: Tchel Fay
Nintendo ID: Tortalius
Steam: Tortalius
Stream: twitch.tv/tortalius
I love playing the matchup on both sides of it, however if you get a kill with Jax the lane is over, but if irelia kills Jax Jax can still farm and eventually out trade her
PSN: rlinkmanl
For the record I always blame the random; it's always their fault we decided to play a non-appropriate poorly thought out team comp and not discuss anything before hand.
Seriously though it's better for morale if I point out what the random did wrong and don't berate my friends for their mistakes.
Other than my wife... dammit woman how many times I gots to tell you CDR is hard capped at 40%? Get Merc's if you're planning on building a frozen heart and a shurielia, not ionian boots.
I will say that a vast majority of the random players we play with are positive and willing to work as a team. This one case just had a particularly negative player.
i just... yeh, i just can't see that happening in my house. i can tell you that bed time would be FUN that night....
Joe's Stream.
100% of the time, the first thing I say is
"Hey <5th person's name>, what is your preferred role?"
If they say a role, we give it to them basically immediately.
If they say X or Y, then I say,
"How about X? Does that work?"
Like, we really go out of our way to make life easier for the random in our 4-man premades. The guy we ran into last night was being a giant tool.
Manbearpig excels at being a tank and being sustainy. Your team fight potential is great and you can do a lot of damage with pretty much all tank items.
All chat is the best. The Eve game I played last we started off horrible and the other team started talking trash in /all. Once me and Leona got rolling it was hilarious watching them get pissed. Leona Ult and grab and EVERY TIME the other team would collapse on Leona which let me catch the whole team in my Eve ult (which at that point was doing 26%). This happened every single team fight we had. Glorious.
Last night someone on the enemy team called our vlad "abortion tier". Seriously, wtf?
So I would "e" to gap close and stun them, then "w" for a quick shield to protect from whatever nuke they would toss at me and then "q" and attack. Was I doing that right? I almost never used "r" it just seemed like "q" did a lot more damage and the extra attack speed was way better.
Edit: Also, I played Xerath a few times and it took until the third game that I realized that you could cancel your "w" before the spell was over haha
PSN: rlinkmanl
What buffs did he get?
Doesn't Jax have like the best base stats in the game
It's also weird how irelia is a hardcore late game top laner unless Jax is there.
Jax's scaling just seems like it's on a much sharper curve then irelias
Maxing Q and E are the skills you should do first, so you can out-trade your opponent. Your W you only need one point into for the slow, plus the shield is mediocre at best. I take it at 8 or 10 or something like that.
The hardest part to playing Jarvan is your build choice. Since you can build him tanky, bruisery, or AD carry style, it can be hard to pinpoint what your role in the game should be.
There weren't that many changes if I remember correctly. After the remake they saw that Counterstrike was a bit wonky so they buffed it a bit and let you end it early (Which was honestly the biggest problem I had) they also gave him better mana regen.
After that they realized he was too bursty with his ult so they turned it into a defensive buff instead, and gave him better health per level (This coul dbe a nerf or buff depending on your perspective). The next two patches just tweaked some bugs. Then they nerfed empower in the next one, and finally made it so you could use counterstrike properly against Shen.
So to review:
Remake happened > Changed Counterstrike and increased mana regen (Buff) > Fixed bug > Changed ult to defense and gave 25 range to Counterstrike (Buff)> passive stacks on miss > fixed bug > reduced empower damage (Nerf) > fixed bug.
Aside from the first change (3 days after remake) the rest happened at roughly month intervals over a 6 month period
In reverse order from the remake courtesy of lol-patch.com
Fixed: Counter Strike's dodge component now works properly against Shen
v1.0.0.140b - 2012-06-05
Empower damage reduced at later ranks to 40/75/110/145/180 from 40/85/130/175/220
v1.0.0.139 - 2012-05-01
Fixed a bug where Counterstrike was stunning through spell shields
v1.0.0.138 - 2012-04-17
Relentless Assault (Passive) will now stack even if Jax's attack misses or is dodged
v1.0.0.136 - 2012-03-20
Health per level increased to 98 from 88
Counterstrike area of effect radius increased to 375 from 350
Grandmaster's Might (New Active): Jax gains 25/35/45 (+30% of his bonus attack damage) armor and 25/35/45 (+20% of his ability power) magic resist for 8 seconds. 100 mana, 80 second cooldown.
v1.0.0.135 - 2012-02-29
Fixed a bug where Grandmaster's Might passive attack canceled if the buff ran out during the attack animation
v1.0.0.133 - 2012-02-01
Mana regen per level increased to 0.7 per 5 seconds from 0.45
Fixed a bug where Empower's cooldown was higher than stated at earlier ranks
Counter Strike
Dodge duration increased to 2 seconds from 1.5
Now additionally reduces the damage from area of effect abilities by 25% while Jax is dodging
Now can be activated again after 1 second to end the effect early
Damage adjusted to 50/75/100/125/150 (+0.5 bonus attack damage) from 40/70/100/130/160 (+0.8 bonus attack damage)
Now deals 20% increased damage for each attack dodged (up to a maximum of 100% increased damage) instead of 10/15/20/25/30 bonus damage per dodge
Cooldown reduced to 18/16/14/12/10 seconds from 22/20/18/16/14
Grandmaster’s Might duration increased to 8 seconds from 6
v1.0.0.132 - 2012-01-18
General
Base health increased to 551 from 506
Health per level increased to 88 from 83
Armor per level increased to 3.5 from 3.2
Added an animation to Jax's Joke
Relentless Assault - Passive (Remade)
Every time Jax attacks an enemy he gains 4-10% increased attack speed (stacks up to 6 times)
Leap Strike
Cooldown changed to 10/9/8/7/6 seconds from 13/11/9/7/5
Damage changed to 70/110/150/190/230 (+1.0 bonus attack damage)(0.6 ability power) from 20/45/70/95/120 (+1.0 total attack damage)(0.7 ability power)
Empower
Cooldown reduced to 7/6/5/4/3 seconds from 9/8/7/6/5
Damage changed to 40/85/130/175/220 from 60/95/130/165/200
Ability power ratio increased to 0.6 from 0.4
Mana cost increased to 30 from 20
Counter Strike (Remade)
Jax dodges all incoming basic attacks for 1.5 seconds. At the end of the effect, Jax deals 40/70/100/130/160 (+0.8 bonus attack damage) physical damage and stuns nearby enemies for 1 second. This spell deals an additional 10/15/20/25/30 damage for each attack dodged.
Grandmaster's Might (Remade)
Passive: Every third consecutive attack deals an additional 100/160/220 (+0.7 ability power) magic damage.
Active: Jax gains ability power equal to 25/45/65 (+ 20% of his ability power) and attack damage equal to 25/45/65 (+ 20% of his bonus attack damage) for 6 seconds.
He wasn't that bad off at all, and they mostly just gave him some QoL changes and fixed a couple bugs. The main reason people think he is strong now is because people actually learned how to play him properly. The only big thing that really needed to be fixed was counterstrike which they did 3 days after but the community had taken it into their head that he was "bad" already and that stuck with him for quite awhile.
In general I find the majority of the community to be very unimaginative when it comes to remakes and new champions that maybe aren't straightforward in playstyle. They don't really take the time to consider how the champ works, what it can do, what you can build on it, etc. What ends up happening is that champions get pegged early on as bad, or weak, or a multitude of other things before anyone has really had a chance to really work with them and try and find the potential. And once enough time has passed and a few people have worked out some optimal builds and strats, suddenly the champ is good, or OP. (This is especially prominent when a High Elo player does good things with a supposedly weak or useless champ, and suddenly the community sees the light) It's why I really try to impress upon people not to jump to early snap judgments on new champs or remakes without really letting people get into the meat of the mechanics and work with it, and why comments like "Why would you choose new Champ X, it's just a crappy version of old Champ Y" are a bit inaccurate. It's all about finding the niche the champ fills, what sort of compositions they work in, what sort of goal they have, etc.
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Someone mentioning Hecarim as someone that people needed to get their heads around, and it's going to take one tournament that Hecarim goes MLP-style and rampages through the tourny, and then he'll be FOTM and nerfed (deservedly so).
The "Euro lane" meta that seems to have hardened into cement that you can't run any comp in soloq that isn't Euro-lane.
There are overall archetypes of characters, and yes some are repetitive. AD character, with a steroid a poke, a little utility and a nuke ult? Yep, seen it. Sustain support, yep. Disengage support etc etc.
on an unrelated note, i'm looking at my S3 champ winrates... since i'm at 88% with Taric, should I just try to pink fuzzy boots my way up the ladder?
Joe's Stream.
siege push is hilarious esp with kog and elise
Is there a way to give those teamwork things after game lobby has closed? I keep forgetting and then I see a +1 pop up and feel like a jerkface.
Also what is a good way to see general item builds for champ groups. I realize this differs greatly from how you plan on playing a specific champ but I'm looking for something I can tab to while a match is loading for a general "x y z champs benefit from stacking the crap out of ad, or going for these items is a good idea on a b c champs".
I can most of the time make a workable build just by looking at champ abilities and building defense based off what the enemy team is. Just wondering if there is a decent quick reference card.
Steam/PSN/XBL/Minecraft / LoL / - Benevicious | WoW - Duckwood - Rajhek
I typically take a glance at a solomid guide that's recent & featured or suggested if I'm really lost on what to build for a champ, then adjust for the game/enemies/etc.
no, his base stats sucked... until they buffed them after the remake
and they buffed his passive
and reworked some numbers
and they made his ult not stupid
the jax remake was a while ago. he was unplayably bad out the door
wait, unplayably bad after remake, or when? Jax is the only champ to be outright pulled from the game for being hideously OP on release. Then they reworked with the removal of dodge, and damnit, he's at Kayle levels of reworks now.
Joe's Stream.
It used to be people would look up guides during loading on new champs to figure out what they should build, which you can still do at http://www.solomid.net/guides.php
What will happen eventually as you play more and more games though is that you will get a general sense for what the items do, what benefit they bring, and whther or not you want that for a specific champ.
In a BROAD sense though here are a few basics:
Ranged AD Carry: Infinity Edge, Phantom Dancer, Last Whisper, Guardian Angel, Bloodthirster.
reason: AD carry typically wants to auto attack a lot. So you want your Autos to not only hit hard, but often. AD damage items, crit, and attack speed are the key.
AD Bruiser: Maw, Frozen Mallet, Triforce, Atmas, Guardian Angel, Bloodthirster.
reason: AD Bruisers want to stick to a target and be very beefy to survive. Typically you want items that both increase your offensive and defensive capabilities. Hybridization and survivability is the key here.
AP Carry: Deathcap, Void Staff, Rylai's, Rod of Ages, Will of the Ancients, Abyssal Specter, Deathfire Grasp
reason: AP carry wants to pumps as much damage into their abilities as possible. Typically you want items that increase your AP but will also want some health to avoid being blown up too easily.
AD Assassin: Ghostblade, Bloodthirster, Maw, Last Whisper
reason: you are fragile, but you scale well with AD items so you want to focus primarily on maximum damage output to destroy your target
AP Assassin: Deathcap, Deathfire Grasp, Lichbane, Voidstaff, Will of the Ancients, Abyssal Scepter
reason: again you are pretty fragile but you scale well with AP, focus on damage
Tank: Randiuns, Frozen Heart, Sunfire, Force of Nature, Warmogs, Atmas, Banshee's veil, Aegis.
reason: your goal is to take damage, so you want to mitigate it as much as possible so you can take more of it. You want items that give you health and resistances
Support: Wards.
reason: you won't have enough money for anything else.
Support: ok for real you want Shurelia's, Aegis, Heart of Gold, zeke's herald
reason: you want items that boost your survivability a bit but mostly things that benefit your team with a passive aura.
Jungler: This is very champion specific and based on what role the jungler would fill and how they progress in the jungle.
Again this is just a quick and dirty list and i'm probably forgetting some items. Honestly though you want to tailor your item choices to be specific to the champion itself, and eventually get to the point where you are making your item choices on how they benefit your champ, what the enemy is doing, what your own goals are, etc.
Having a basic idea of a build is good, but it is ore important to be flexible than it is to stick to one build.
*edit* Oh and keep in mind all this will change in Season 3 as the new items will open up many more build choices for each role.
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i would've thought that the charge system on BFT would screw over soraka just as hard as it screws over the DoT people
Not...really.
The only change they needed to fix was the counterstrike which they did 3 days later. Everything after that was people not having a clue and not understanding how Jax worked now.
They also didn't change his passive at any point after the remake. It still is and always has been 4%-14% attack speed buff that stacks up to 6 times.
The only base stat change they made was a buff to his health per level by 10 (so an extra 170 at max level) and to increase mana regen from .45 per 5 to .7 per 5. While nice these are hardly that impactful, all the major base stat changes happened in the remake itself and aside from those two, have remained unchanged.
The ult change is a matter of opinion. Some people didn't want the defense and liked the burst, others loved the defense and how it made him much more durable (i'm in this camp, but also think it makes him too durable atm)
They also had a couple decent bug fixes in there.
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He is a great champ and I can't wait for Ohmbreaker
Please no. I don't mind MLP the show, but I can't stand the cultism that surrounds it. I don't want it trickling into league of legends.
I think he has an MLP themed joke though, which is all he really needs.
"Suffering is Magic"
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Agreed. I love the show but that would be a bit much.
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