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[Chaos] Chaos in the Old World - Discussion and signups - New-ish Thread
stever777
AFK most SaturdaysRegistered User regular
AFK most SaturdaysRegistered User regular
Chaos in the Old World is a boardgame set in the Warhammer Fantasy universe. Players take on the role of one of the gods of Chaos, seeking to corrupt the land and remake it in their own image. It plays best with exactly four players and offers is an interesting twist on area control games - each god has slightly different forces, their own thematic deck of Chaos cards to cast, and a victory track (dial) that marks progress befitting that god's priorities. The game can be won either by VP accumulation or by completing your dial.
Khorne - the Blood god - murder, maim, kill. Tends to win by dial victory, and earns advances by killing enemy figures. Straightforward to play, but must keep a close watch on everything that is happening to extend the game long enough to achieve victory (he needs nine dial ticks, so he has to double tick multiple times and prevent others from winning by VP before he gets there).
Nurgle - the Lord of Pestilence - spreading filth and disease among the cities and towns. Longest dial track, making a dial victory difficult, if not impossible. But Nurgle can benefit from others' ruinations and can shoot up the VP track in the mid-to-late game. Never out of contention.
Tzeentch - the Changer of Ways - making plans and reshaping reality to suit himself. Tzeentch is the most reliant of all the gods on his Chaos cards; his are cheaper and he gets to draw more of them than anyone else. Depending on the Old World deck, he can go for either a dial or VP victory, but he has to find Warpstones and cast magic spells in order to prepare regions for ideal corruption.
Slaanesh - the Prince of Pleasure (and pain) - seducing the nobility and heroes of the land, swaying them to his side. With the shortest dial track, Slaanesh can win without ever double-ticking, and by focusing on regions with nobles can build up VP quickly.
The Horned Rat - The Undying Schemer - rising from under the ground with his skittering horde. Rather than seeking to corrupt the Old World, the Horned Rat instead strains to overrun it, with more figures than any other god and abilities that enhance their mobility.
Here's a quick summary of the gods' followers and their abilities:
Previous games, aka recommended reading before playing, are linked from the CF Boardgame Index
As has been requested, this thread can be used as a general sign-up list for future CitOW games (starting with Darian's game 17). I'll keep lists in the second post of sign-ups. When you do sign up, please mention whether you have played in any of the previous games (vet) or not (noob). I think I can remember the hosts for myself.
Let's also use this thread for general discussion on Chaos in the Old World - rules questions, balance, complaining about the greenskins and electors that keep Khorne from winning, etc.
A new expansion brings with it new rules questions. As an aid to players and hosts, I offer you the following.
Darian's personal Unofficial FAQ for the Horned Rat (Now with some official rulings):
- Set up - how many Old World Cards should be used for a 3 player game including the Horned Rat? 4p? 5p?
[FAQ - 7 cards for 4 or 5 players, 8 for 3, regardless of the Horned Rat's presence.] - Dial advancement counters for Tzeentch, and Slaanesh -- are these once per region per phase, or can Tzeentch and Slaanesh spread out their corruption placement across phases? Can Tzeentch or Slaanesh earn more than one DAC from a single region during a round (e.g. from Havoc in battle then from corruption placement)?
[FAQ states that Tzeentch can earn a DAC during the summoning phase.
My ruling: One DAC may be earned in a region per phase per player. I'm going to interpret this as meaning that the condition must be met entirely within a phase. This was partially clarified by the FAQ but still leaves a bit of interpretation needed.] - Horned Rat's dial -- for Summon X, does the summoned figure need to be adjacent to your current figures?
[My ruling - Yes, it must be adjacent since it does not say "in any region".] - Rampage -- Essentially, does this act like the battle phase in all ways, or is it simply a battle?
[FAQ - This is just a battle, not acting like the battle phase. Things that specify "battle phase" do not trigger from a [COLOR="Red"]Rampage[/COLOR] battle, but things like Vengeance (which only mentions battle dice) do.
Reference summary:
Trigger: Vengeance, Bloodbath, Skulltaker, Bloodletters, Great Unclean One, Pleasure Shield, Strength in Numbers, Vermin Outbreak
Do not trigger: Choking Stench, Plaguebearers, Warpstorm, Havoc, Transmorgrify, Acolytes, Shroud of Secrets, Greenskins Invade, Electors Sue for Peace] - Skulltaker followed by Rampage - can the killed units be summoned away from the region?
[FAQ - No; the figures cannot be removed before the card is discarded in the end phase.] - Terror - can you choose to move only some cultists, leaving behind the cultists from another god?
[My ruling - Yes, you make the choice to move or not separately for each god. And all the ones you move must go to the same region.] - Bloodletter upgrade - Is it limited to once per region, or does every figure killed grant VP?
[FAQ - Each figure killed is worth 2 VP.] - Bloodthirster upgrade - Does this summoning get around the adjacency requirement? Do Warpstones count as corruption when determining whether a region is a valid target?
[FAQ - No. It changes the cost if the destination region matches the requirement, but it is missing the "any region" key phrase that usually indicates teleportation effects.
My ruling - No. Warpstones are considered as corruption only when checking for Ruination, not at other times.] - Does corruption placed by Filth or Blue Scribes grant a DAC? (For Filth, of course, it would take 2 of them in the same region)
[FAQ - Yes; move, place, same thing. As an errata, they changed Filth to be two separate events-remove, then place.] - Do Quicken Decay and Festival of Sinew trigger on figures that are moved by other effects? What if their own figures are moved out by an opponent (e.g., by Terror)?
[FAQ - Bolt of Change using a new key word "replace" which does not trigger Quicken or Festival.
My ruling - Yes; move, summon, place, same thing. And it looks for the source of the movement, not the owner of the figure.] - Can Convocation pull figures from more than one region?
[FAQ - They must come from the same region.] - How many corruption tokens will each warrior or greater daemon place if two Havoc cards are in the same region?
[My ruling - Havoc is a replacement effect--instead of rolling battle dice, the warriors place one corruption. I can see this one argued either way:
A. when the second Havoc resolves, they are no longer rolling battle dice, so it has no effect.
B. Havoc stops them from rolling battle dice then has them place a corruption; they would place one corruption for each Havoc card in the region.
I will go with interpretation A, so they will only place one corruption each.] - Warp Portal with an upgraded Horror -- is the newly placed Horror a valid target for the Portal's teleportation?
[FAQ - No, the new horror is not placed until the card has been resolved.] - Acolytes upgrade -- after you cancel a hit, can the opponent still kill your acolyte by applying their next hit to it? Can another opponent kill the acolyte with their hits?
[FAQ - This upgrade triggers after all powers assign their hits for the region, but before killed figures are removed.] - Lord of Change upgrade -- if it is moved by Warp Portal, can it place a Warpstone? What if it is moved by Lambs to the Slaughter?
[FAQ - Only triggers if Tzeentch does the summoning. Warp Portal, yes, Lambs to the Slaughter, no.] - Shroud of Secrets -- if a player does not have enough hits left to kill an opponent's figure, can they apply the remaining hits to Slaanesh's? (e.g., if a Rat Ogre is present with some Seductresses and no Peasants, and Khorne only rolls one hit, can he target the Seductress or must he waste the hit?)
[My ruling - No; the Slaanesh figures are not legal targets while anything else is alive.] - Daemonette upgrade -- if the Daemonette dies or is summoned away from the region, does the cultist remain under Slaanesh's control?
[My ruling - Since they didn't specify, as they did for the KoS in the base set, I'm going to guess they intended the control to persist, regardless, so I'll rule yes. This also implies that Slaanesh can summon the cultist away without losing control, just as with Soporific Musk in the base game.] - Can Slaanesh take advantage of the Leper upgrade if his Daemonette upgrade gives him control of one?
[My ruling - Yes. You in the Leper upgrade refers to the controller of the Leper, not just to Nurgle.] - What happens when Slaanesh takes control of a follower of the Horned Rat?
[My ruling - A Slaanesh-controlled rat places no corruption, counts as participation for ruination, and counts as its PP cost in corruption when scoring 1st and 2nd ruination.] - Grey Seer with the Clan Rat upgrade - How many rats are summoned?
[FAQ - The upgrade gives one additional rat when you summon to a region with no rats present, so the Grey Seer will summon 3 rats instead of 2.] - Strength in Numbers and Verminous Horde -- what is the trigger condition for these? Are they the same, or is there a difference between them?
[FAQ - The same; the Horned Rat must have more figures than at least one opponent who is present in the region.
My ruling - Following this to its logical conclusion, the cards will give no effect if only the horned rat is in the region. That seems odd to me, so as a house rule it will also trigger if only the rat has figures present.] - The Under Empire -- are the figures moved before or after the ruination bonus VP are awarded for being present in the region? (Essentially, if HR moves all his figures out, does he still get the ruination bonus? I know he won't be eligible for 1st/2nd place if he uses this.)
Also, are regions with a Skaven token considered adjacent to all other regions, or just to other regions containing Skaven tokens?
[FAQ - Timing of this happens after the contributing bonus for presence, so that the same rat can take part in more than one ruination.
My ruling - Regions containing Skaven are adjacent to each other, not to all regions.] - The Light of Day/High Elf Protection -- can players choose a ruined region, to avoid placing the token? If so, can more than one player choose the same ruined region? Essentially, I'm wondering whether you meant "In order of Threat level (highest first), each player places one Event token in a different region."
[FAQ - Ruined regions cannot be chosen for Old World card effects. Only if there is not valid region can the placement be avoided.] - How do effects which grant additional dice or corruption interact with effects which limit or reduce? For example, if Choking Stench and another Nurgle card would reduce a bloodletter's dice to zero, will Vengeance still grant Khorne a battle die? If there is a single upgraded Leper in a region with Call to Arms! in play, does it place it's bonus corruption?
[FAQ - Old World effects are persistent and apply first; then, disabling effects are applied before enabling effects.
My ruling - "Additional" effects apply only if you would still have regular dice/corruption after all reductions. You can never have only the additional ones; in the examples above, Khorne would not roll any dice and Nurgle would not place any corruption.] - Does Vermin Outbreak apply a cost to free summons from upgraded figures? Does it change the cost of figures summoned or moved by spells?
[My ruling - Free summons are affected; a cost of 0 is still a cost. Upgraded horrors would cost 1 PP in addition to the cost of the spell; the Bloodthirster could be summoned once at a cost of 1 PP.
Chaos card effects are noted as being immune to Vermin Outbreak, so summons from Convocation or Grey Seer would not be affected.]
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There is a moderate exception for in-character text in role-playing threads, but that doesn't apply to our CitOW games or any discussion threads. Keep it civil, please.
Sign up in this thread if you are interested in playing in a game with us.
All players: (after getting into a game, you can sign up again at the bottom of the list; HR or B means the player only wants to play in expansion or base games, respectively)
Inactive players (can come back into the list at the top by re-posting their interest):
New players: (anyone who gets into a game is removed from this list)
Special inactive list for new players:
Hosts: (in reverse order of most recently played game - after getting into a game, you can get back on this list once you host another game. Multiple hostings will equal multiple returns to this list)
Extra special inactive hosts list, aka "Thank you for your kind service, sir (or madam), and feel free to let us know if you want to play again":
Explicit player preferences:
For future games, hosts will be encouraged to take the top n players from the list(s) of their choice, thus ensuring over time that everyone who wants to play will get a chance. Players may feel free to request a particular god (or one of two) as they sign up; hosts can take that into consideration to ensure no one is stuck playing as a power they despise.
For anyone interested, here is a spreadsheet of the results of our games.
Leaderboard:
(Jun 5th, 2013)
Game 78 - Split Win
Previous discussion thread
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
A minor announcement that I ought to have made some time ago:
Darian and stever777 both now have permissions to promote board app accounts from the default level to "official" CF Citow GM status (the difference being that official GM accounts can use save game numbers from the 1-1000 range reserved to CF games). So if you want to host a game in CF and you post as such in this thread, there's now a reasonable chance that someone will spot your request and actually do something about it!
While I'm at it, a few words of reminder:
Next: instructions written by Darian, for applications designed by lazy documentation-averse developers!
Handtracker (created by admanb)
Once registered and logged in, you will see a list of the games you are hosting, then the games you are playing in, then the decks (Templates) you created, then a list of public decks.
To create a new game, click the "new game" link, name the game, choose the first deck, and click "Create". This will take you to the main page for the game, with you in the player list as host. (The host is the administrator of the game; they are able to see all actions and to view the order of cards in the decks.)
Next, use the "add deck" link to load any additional decks needed for the game; click the link, choose the deck, click add. At the moment, that will bring you to an Error screen; ignore it, click back, then repeat for the rest of the decks. When you are done, click back again to get back to the game.
Then, you need to set up permissions; for CitOW, I give each player permission to "draw to hand" for their own deck. As host, I let myself "shuffle" for all decks and "draw" from the Old World deck.
Finally, make sure you shuffle each deck before letting the players draw. From the main page for the game, click the "show/hide" link for each deck, then click to shuffle. While the game is in progress, I like to note the number of cards each player has in their hand and left in the deck each round, so I can tell if anything isn't happening the way it should.
After the game ends, you can delete it from the main page (after login) so that it doesn't continue to show up on the home page for yourself and your players.
On occasion, you may find yourself needing to replace a player in the midst of a game, grabbing the old player's hand. Here's how you do it:
1. From the main page for the game, click the radio button next to the player who will be replaced
2. Select the new player from the drop-down menu
3. Click the "add or replace player" button
That should bring a new player into the game with the original player's hand. I'm not sure whether all their permissions also inherit, but they should. I know I've done this in the past and had it work.
(Unnamed) CitOW Board App (created by FunkyWaltDogg)
New games can be created in one of two ways:
1. The preferred method: http://appliednerditry.com/chaos/ lets you choose which powers and decks are in play, create a fresh game, and randomize the tokens. Unofficial games use any available number over 1000, while official games use smaller numbers but can only be created by accounts which have been promoted. The other fields can be ignored, or you can fill them with player names and a link to the game thread.
2. From an existing board, type a number in the box then click "Save as new game"; this creates a new game with all the same decks/player choices as the original game (and the current board state, which would have to be cleared). This feature is most often used if someone new wants to take over a given game to update it while the original host is unavailable. (Normally, anyone can edit the game state and export the board, but only the host or an administrator can save any changes.)
Once the game is made, you can drag-and-drop figures to the board from the boxes at the bottom. Cards and Old World tokens are accessed through the drop-down box to the right of the board by clicking on the appropriate category then dragged to the proper location. To the left of the board are a few mouse-over tabs which reveal control panels for:
* toggling the state of Old World Cards (bright while in play/dim if discarded)
* adjusting corruption and marking regions as ruined (for ruination, put a number in the box in the region)
* adjusting the scoreboard area (peasant totals, PP, VP, Dial ticks, DACs, upgrades)
-- peasants can be dragged into the box to place one from the board, but the only way to decrement the number of peasants a power has is through the control panel
-- PP can be adjusted using the arrows visible above Estalia, without needing to open the control panel
* adding or removing figure effects (drag a figure into the box, toggle the effects, then drag it to its destination)
There are also some toggle switches with buttons on the board, used to reset everyone's PP to their starting value (including upgrades), reset DACs to 0, and to clear effects from all figures.
The buttons below the board are used for game-state management.
* The Game # box is a drop-down menu to select which game you want to work with, and the State # similarly chooses which save-state within that game is active. Changes to those menus are confirmed by clicking "go".
* The next box is an entry field for a new game number, which is used by the Save as New Game... button.
* The Save as button creates a new save state within the current game. It changes to read Save as Game #, State #+1 the first time that either it or Overwrite is used.
* Export as PNG creates an image file of the current board, to save to your local computer
* Overwrite or Overwrite Game #, State # updates the active saved state with the current board
I generally create a new state for each round, then overwrite during the round, but some hosts create a new state each time they update the game in the thread.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
Tip: if your post is so obnoxious and/or large that you need to put it in spoilers, then delete it and start over again.
"Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room. "
A caged bird does not sing.
Rorus Raz, This is the only post I will ever make in this thread. (except for "sign me back up please")
We all do.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
Thx!
Sneak a win in there for me...
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
You may continue to post, but I do not want to see giant walls of texts that look like they came from a research paper generator with the words "Khorne" thrown in.
Edit: That's a 6.2% chance of failure AFTER Tzeentch vacated his troops from under 2 more dice and Bolt of Change'd one of my Warriors in yet another region. I really really don't know why I continue to agree to Khorne.
Inquisitor77: Rius, you are Sisyphus and melee Wizard is your boulder
Tube: This must be what it felt like to be an Iraqi when Saddam was killed
Bookish Stickers - Mrs. Rius' Etsy shop with bumper stickers and vinyl decals.
Time to go for anti combat domination Khorne?
Somehow that doesn't sound as fun...
Try it now, pesky.
If not, ask FunkyWaltDogg.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
Well, you should have Khorne or the regions get ruined too fast.
If The Rat is in, the regions get ruined too slowly, without K of course.
So, IMHO K & 2 of the other base gods.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
I would say for the base game, Khorne plus any of the others. For Morrs I would say Khorne, Tzeentch and Slaanesh. It is hard to say with any certainty as I've not played enough to make a safe call but these would be my gut feels.
I think you may be better off with the base game if balance is key as I think that Khorne and Tzeentch as slightly stronger than Nurgle and Slaanesh but I think this can be balanced out with 5 players. But I'm not sure how easy it would be to pull someone from a strong lead with less players.
I presume that you are asking as you plan on playing, I'd be interested to hear what combo you go for and how you find it as I may give it a try at some point.
Khorne: @Zombie Hero from the New Player List
Nurgle: @blahmcblah from the Host List
Tzeentch: @Magic Geek from the regular List
Slaanesh: @MrBody from the regular List
Horned Rat: @SeGaTai from the regular List
@Nought , @visiblehowl and @Lykouragh all refused the invitation or did not respond, please mark as inactive.
I would like to use this chance to ask everybody to speak up by yourself if you don't want to be invited in the near future before you get an invitation, so the invitation process at the beginning of a new game does not drag itself as much.
stever777
Gorden858
Illpalazo
jakobagger
BoardGamer
BlackRaider
Tayrun
mi-go hunter
doldari - me,
Styyx
pesky
Game 96 and Game 97
OK, OK.
Calm down.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
stever777 as Khorne (red)
Illpalazo as Nurgle (limegreen)
jakobagger as Tzeentch (dodgerblue)
Gorden858 as Slaanesh (mediumorchid)
BoardGamer The Horned Rat (gray)
Game 97 has started with:
mi-go hunter as Khorne (red)
Tayrun as Nurgle (limegreen)
BlackRaider as Tzeentch (dodgerblue)
styyx as Slaanesh (mediumorchid)
pesky The Horned Rat (gray)
Just noticed, that you only invited from the regular list. I don't even know if it's a written rule and even in the opening post it's written elsewise:
But I thought we agreed to invite:
- The first person on the host list
- One Newbie (if there is one)
- The rest from the regulars list
Don't get me wrong @doldari. I still love you with the whole of my heart for that incredible amount of games you host ;-) , but if we don't invite from the host list our new incentives are quite useless.
But you probably don't really care since you will probably farm those "extra lives" faster than you can spend them anyhow ^^
Yup, that's me on Steam.
If you are interested in playing, discussing, or hosting Arkham Horror, click here!
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
Anyway, signup
Yup, that's me on Steam.
If you are interested in playing, discussing, or hosting Arkham Horror, click here!
I tried to invite from host list.
but, most were duplicate in active list or no response.
so I has a bad opinion of host list.(same inactive list)
Next time I'll invite from host list (If no duplicate in active list).