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lady woes
snap
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Registered User regular
I've been with my girlfriend for nearly a year now. Early in the relationship things were amazing and I would have told you that I've never been happy in any relationship. But I began to notice that my girlfriend had a very sharp tongue. At first, this was directed at other people or things and I would usually just think, 'man, she takes stuff too seriously sometimes' or I'd laugh because I took it as an attempt at humor.
Then, she began turning it on me. It seemed as though she would nitpick everything about me. I didn't stand up straight enough. I walked behind her rather than in front of her in the store. Or, I would do or say something she didn't like and she'd lash out at me with a harsh tone of voice which I would interpret and react to as though she were angry with me. When I confronted her she would either say that she wasn't angry and that's just how she talks or that it was my fault because I did x/y.
x/y, by the way, can be something as simple as, literally, not seeing what I'm looking even though it was right in front of me.
"Jesus, did you EVEN look!"
"Why do you have to say it like that?"
"I would have opened the blah, blah and seen blah, blah."
I know that seems small perhaps, but stuff like that nonstop can start to wear on you. Eventually, I set her down and said, "Look, tone of voice matters. It's an important part of communication. I'm willing to accept that you have a habit of talking like that and don't realize the way it comes across, but I don't like it when you talk to me like that."
Her response: "I'm not used to being the man in the relationship, i guess." She literally called me the bitch in the relationship for having emotions.
She has physically struck me twice -- both with an open hand to the side of the head. Once when we were play wrestling and she fell on an x-box controller. The other a few weeks after an injury, i nudged the wound when we were about to get in the shower together.
Anytime my phone goes off she asks me who the text is from. She gets angry if the text is from my ex-wife, who I have to communicate with due to kids, or if it's a long-time female friend of mine. She doesn't outright tell me not to talk to them, but she makes my life hell if I do. Actually, she did this with all my friends and family. I used to go play D&D with my friends every wednesday. Once I got with her, every wednesday, without fail, she would get upset with me just before it was time to go -- then send me passive aggressive texts all night. I eventually was so anxious and worried over her I would leave and come home and then eventually stopped going altogether.
She obsesses over every little thing my mom does or says. "They don't accept me for who I am. They don't make me feel like I belong. They don't ask me any questions about who I am." She gets so anxious and angry every time we go over there that I barely see my family anymore. Then, she has the nerve to tell that me that between my kids and conservative family I come with "so much drama".
Nearly every facebook post she makes is passive aggressive, complaining or angry. Some of them outright calling me out on a public forum for things she thinks I've done wrong. For instance, she started looking into us buying a house together. I wasn't comfortable with the idea. I told her twice I didn't want to -- both during arguments, granted, but she didn't seem to listen or care. (I think maybe she thought it was just the fight talking)
Then a couple hours later I email her that I can't do the house thing. I'm not comfortable with it. (She was at work - hence, email rather than phonecall)
Her facebook posts that day: "Feels terrible to be lied to by someone you love." and "Had to cancel appointment to look at house. x didn't want to. been crying all day."
That's all the time.
I feel like I am in an abusive relationship. But then, I also feel that I am somehow at fault. Like, I don't empathize enough or listen enough -- or something. Or that I'm somehow abusing HER when she yells at me and I become distant and detached. I don't know. I think I read somewhere that detachment is a form of abuse. I think part of me just wants someone to confirm that this behavior is bullshit.
I would just leave but there are a couple problems: one, my kids LOVE her. And she really does take good care of them. She teaches them tons and talks to them and helps them with their problems. It will break their heart and I worry about it even more because of my divorce from their mother. On the other hand, my girlfriend tries to convince me to either a) go for full custody or b) give up my joint custody so that we can move away from the town we live in. Sometimes she implies that I am a bad father, and outright says their mother is awful. (not in front of the kids)
The other thing is that I don't have the money to move out right this minute. My car just broke down and depleted my savings. I feel like I should leave NOW but I can't see any possible way to do so for another month or two. Meanwhile, I'd feel like I was lying to her if I stayed her boyfriend just to save up money to move out whilst keeping a roof over mine and my kids head.
And then there's the other thing. I do love her. It's like there are two versions of her. Good and bad. The good one is the best relationship I've ever been in. The bad one is the worst relationship I've ever been in. It's a dichotomy.
I think half of this ended up being rant. I didn't mean for it to be so long. I'm having to stop myself because there is so much bullshit. And I know I'm forgetting some of it too. I don't know what to do. Any advice is great.
TL;DR perhaps in abusive relationship, what should i do about it?
Then, she began turning it on me. It seemed as though she would nitpick everything about me. I didn't stand up straight enough. I walked behind her rather than in front of her in the store. Or, I would do or say something she didn't like and she'd lash out at me with a harsh tone of voice which I would interpret and react to as though she were angry with me. When I confronted her she would either say that she wasn't angry and that's just how she talks or that it was my fault because I did x/y.
x/y, by the way, can be something as simple as, literally, not seeing what I'm looking even though it was right in front of me.
"Jesus, did you EVEN look!"
"Why do you have to say it like that?"
"I would have opened the blah, blah and seen blah, blah."
I know that seems small perhaps, but stuff like that nonstop can start to wear on you. Eventually, I set her down and said, "Look, tone of voice matters. It's an important part of communication. I'm willing to accept that you have a habit of talking like that and don't realize the way it comes across, but I don't like it when you talk to me like that."
Her response: "I'm not used to being the man in the relationship, i guess." She literally called me the bitch in the relationship for having emotions.
She has physically struck me twice -- both with an open hand to the side of the head. Once when we were play wrestling and she fell on an x-box controller. The other a few weeks after an injury, i nudged the wound when we were about to get in the shower together.
Anytime my phone goes off she asks me who the text is from. She gets angry if the text is from my ex-wife, who I have to communicate with due to kids, or if it's a long-time female friend of mine. She doesn't outright tell me not to talk to them, but she makes my life hell if I do. Actually, she did this with all my friends and family. I used to go play D&D with my friends every wednesday. Once I got with her, every wednesday, without fail, she would get upset with me just before it was time to go -- then send me passive aggressive texts all night. I eventually was so anxious and worried over her I would leave and come home and then eventually stopped going altogether.
She obsesses over every little thing my mom does or says. "They don't accept me for who I am. They don't make me feel like I belong. They don't ask me any questions about who I am." She gets so anxious and angry every time we go over there that I barely see my family anymore. Then, she has the nerve to tell that me that between my kids and conservative family I come with "so much drama".
Nearly every facebook post she makes is passive aggressive, complaining or angry. Some of them outright calling me out on a public forum for things she thinks I've done wrong. For instance, she started looking into us buying a house together. I wasn't comfortable with the idea. I told her twice I didn't want to -- both during arguments, granted, but she didn't seem to listen or care. (I think maybe she thought it was just the fight talking)
Then a couple hours later I email her that I can't do the house thing. I'm not comfortable with it. (She was at work - hence, email rather than phonecall)
Her facebook posts that day: "Feels terrible to be lied to by someone you love." and "Had to cancel appointment to look at house. x didn't want to. been crying all day."
That's all the time.
I feel like I am in an abusive relationship. But then, I also feel that I am somehow at fault. Like, I don't empathize enough or listen enough -- or something. Or that I'm somehow abusing HER when she yells at me and I become distant and detached. I don't know. I think I read somewhere that detachment is a form of abuse. I think part of me just wants someone to confirm that this behavior is bullshit.
I would just leave but there are a couple problems: one, my kids LOVE her. And she really does take good care of them. She teaches them tons and talks to them and helps them with their problems. It will break their heart and I worry about it even more because of my divorce from their mother. On the other hand, my girlfriend tries to convince me to either a) go for full custody or b) give up my joint custody so that we can move away from the town we live in. Sometimes she implies that I am a bad father, and outright says their mother is awful. (not in front of the kids)
The other thing is that I don't have the money to move out right this minute. My car just broke down and depleted my savings. I feel like I should leave NOW but I can't see any possible way to do so for another month or two. Meanwhile, I'd feel like I was lying to her if I stayed her boyfriend just to save up money to move out whilst keeping a roof over mine and my kids head.
And then there's the other thing. I do love her. It's like there are two versions of her. Good and bad. The good one is the best relationship I've ever been in. The bad one is the worst relationship I've ever been in. It's a dichotomy.
I think half of this ended up being rant. I didn't mean for it to be so long. I'm having to stop myself because there is so much bullshit. And I know I'm forgetting some of it too. I don't know what to do. Any advice is great.
TL;DR perhaps in abusive relationship, what should i do about it?
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when I confronted her about the yelling/tone of voice thing she also got very gloomy for a period and said I didn't accept her for who she was and was trying to change her.
The red flags are really more that she refuses to treat it as such, and implies you're a little bitch for not accepting this behavior.
Have another talk with her. Tell she's being abusive, no ifs, ands, or buts about it. Her behavior is textbook abusive and it's unacceptable. Find some websites online about abusive relationships and show her the signs, if that helps the cause. If she doesn't see what she's being and doesn't agree to try to turn this around, run far, far away man. It's difficult to fix people like this.
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The next hardest part is getting out of it. You deserve better, you deserve to go with your friends.
When people say "Don't check your S/O's texts or emails" they're specifically talking about situations like this, where you use it to berate and abuse someone.
Men can be abused too, you're not insignificant, or a wuss for wanting out of that. The only reason I say to get out of this is, there's really no fixing these. The person will say they'll change, and it'll get good for a while, but then it cycles back into abuse.
It's going to hurt. A lot. Especially if you love someone. But it's going to get better.
Two points pop into my mind. First, if she's abusive to other people, and was good to you but turned abusive over time, then I don't expect her to remain good to your kids forever. And second, if option B (give up the kids and move far away) is on the table for her, I see it as a red flag personally. You worry about the impact taking her away from your kids will have on them, and you're right to have your kids' well-being in mind. But she's willing to seriously suggest taking you away from your kids... and leave them behind with an "awful mother" to boot? Where's her concern for the impact that will have on your kids?
As for not having the money to move out right away, I'm sure you can find options. Move back in with your parents for a month or two, or find a good friend willing to give you a couch or a guest bedroom for that time and promise them to pay back rent later when you're back on your financial feet.
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/170944/clingycontrolling-girlfriend
Because if we're at the hitting stage already, well... put it this way, imagine what you wrote was a letter from your sister and she was talking about her boyfriend. What would your advice be?
This bears repeating. It can be pretty brave to say to someone you love "Talk to me with a minimum of respect or don't talk to me at all."
I should clarify that I'm not advocating you should break up with her. I'm not going to make that decision for you either way. I'm just pointing out problems with the "couple problems" you have keeping you with her.
I think you mean this thread:
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/170943/clingycontrolling-girlfriend
The one you linked to is a dupe. I just got caught up on that situation and wow that's just soul crushing. OP, don't let yourself get to @Paper Monitor's level
From what you've said, I can identify some of the problems that you are having:
1. You are communicating, but she is not listening to you.
2. Your girlfriend communicates in a passive-aggressive way to manipulate you instead of being up front and honest.
3. Your girlfriend does not respect your boundaries (not wanting to buy a house, becoming upset when she is passive-aggressive).
4. You have allowed your girlfriend to manipulate you instead of keeping those boundaries firm. You stopped communication with female friends and stopped playing D&D with friends as a result of her passive-aggressive behavior.
Having said all that, there are not any couples where all of the problems are one-sided. If this relationship is important to you, both of you need to see a couple's counselor together. It's helpful to have someone outside the relationship identify the problems and help you work on them together. If she refuses to go to counseling, you need to explain that these are things that have to change because they are destroying your relationship. She needs to understand that you aren't giving her an ultimatum because the relationship is already cracked. You want to mend it.
Understand that people don't break patterns easily. From your description, she might respond to this with passive-aggressive or aggressive behavior. She might be demonstrative about how much she is hurt to try to make you feel guilty or get on Facebook and complain about you. If she does these things, you should not let her see you get angry (if you can't control it, leave the house and go to the gym or go drink a beer and complain at a friend's house). When you can face her without being angry, explain that it hurts you when she behaves like that and that you don't expect her to change immediately, but that it does need to change for you to be happy together and that you think a counselor can help with that.
TL;DR - Go to a couples counselor.
Wow. Just... wow. I wonder what happened to Paper Monitor. I hope he's ok and out of there
If you're staying with her & enduring the abuse just because your children love her, don't. That could lead to all kinds of disasters down the road.
It sounds like your SO has trust issues... and honestly, something of a mean streak. I can't get a read, based on what you've posted, about whether she's specifically trying to manipulate you or just became comfortable enough around you that you were no longer considered specially exempt from her malice.
Are either or you currently seeing a therapist? If not, have you suggested therapy or couple's counseling?
On the other hand, couples counseling can make an abusive situation worse by validating the abuser and reinforcing the victim's feeling that the abuse is their own fault. Also, abusers often put on a good face for the counselor, but then retaliate viciously once they are alone with their victim.
2) If she hit you, she will eventually hit the kids (along with the manipulation and verbal lashing).
3) It is not your fault.
You have a right to be happy, you also have a right to be treated with respect. She is giving you neither, and is not willing to change. A healthy relationship is about respect, and she clearly has no respect for you.
Like normally, counseling, give communication another try, whatever makes you happier, but not this time. You need to think of the influence the significant person in your life is going to have on them, and also if the "you" you become when you're having a hard time with her is the "you" you want to your kids to see, because it is the person you will be an increasing percentage of the time as things in your relationship progress. If you are not 100% sure you like the person you become better with her than without her, just end it. You have so much to lose for someone who doesn't make you feel good about yourself or even about being in a relationship with her, and it is not even a little bit worth it.
1. Get person to trust you
2. Tell person they cannot trust anyone else
3. Belittle the person so they no longer want to trust anyone else
4. Ta da! Now you have a subservient, abused person of your own!
It shows a true disdain for other individuals, and abusers believe their behavior is desirable, which is why they never want to change. Why would they? They can manipulate people to do what they want. They don't even recognize that their behavior drives others away.
Leave.
He has issues and takes medication, and is much better now, but in the past my mom has nearly divorced him at least twice, and moved out of the house. once because she could see me slipping into depression due to his bullshit, so she moved us out (but she basically stayed). now she is still unhappy a lot of the time, but stays with him because it's too much of a pain to split up essentially.
I'm not sure how bad he was with her that i didn't see/notice, but i guarantee this kind of treatment will more than likely spill over onto your kids if you guys get really serious and she has any parental powers at all. Not to mention how horrible she is to you. i'd say get counseling or get out, and it seems like she doesn't want counseling... sooo....
I understand that you love her, but it doesn't sound like she is able to love you in the way that you need to be loved to be truly happy in a relationship. A relationship where you are miserable 1 out of every 10 days or whatever the ratio may be is not going to be good for your long-term health. And I don't see this as being something that will get better if you just "hang in there" for a while longer. All it will become is harder to leave, because your lives will become more intertwined.
It is not going to be an easy break, but based on what you've told us here, I think it is something you should do.
That first voice is your bullshit detector, and it's working accurately to protect you. You should listen to it. That second voice is emotional manipulation.
Hitting you is abuse.
Getting upset when you have to communicate with your ex-wife or want to hang out with friends once a week is something an abusive person does.
You do not owe it to this person to allow her to treat you like this. Your health and your children's health come above all else, and it sucks that you're in a difficult financial position, but there exists someone who loves you enough to put a roof over your head until you can work out a living situation away from her.
When I was eight-years-old, my mother re-married a guy who was really, really nice to us. He brought us presents. My brother and I had different biological fathers, and I never knew mine. His would send him gifts in the mail from time to time because he lived across the country. When this guy my mom was seeing saw that, he sent me gifts in the mail and pretended they were from my father. He was really nice to us.
Then they got married and he physically and emotionally abused my brother and I for eight years until they finally divorced.
Get out. Her behaviour towards you is not exclusive.
Backstory: last night my ex called me furious because my girlfriend told the kids that "daddy was happy living with you, ask your mom why they divorce" (the answer is my ex wife had multiple affairs)
I totally understood her anger, so I asked my girlfriend what happened. She said that she only meant that I was happy living with the kids so that they wouldn't feel as though I left because of them.
I accepted this answer. Then, this morning, she gets up to go to work. I go in to collect my laptop from the kitchen. She's got a dude's picture on phone and I say, "Who is that?"
"Aaron, my gay friend from work," she says, very angrily. Now, I decide to ignore this. She's mad because she views this question as me prying into her life. I've only ever asked her this or similar questions two or three times throughout or nearly year together. She asks me who i'm talking to anytime my phone goes off, facebook bloops or my phone rings. I didn't care much for the double standard. But I let it go and went back to the bedroom. I hear her mutter something sarcastic like : "Don't worry, I'm not cheating on you."
I come back out and say, "Hey, I just asked who that guy was. I know you're not cheating on me."
I got back to bed, she goes to work. Then the text convo happens. This is the verbatim part. I promise this shit is all related somehow.
Me: are you still upset with me from this morning?
Her: No.
Me: Ok - good. What was it I did to upset you?
Her:Yesterday after I got off work.
Me: I understand how that conversation was probably uncomfortable for you. Why did it bother you so much, though, that you needed to lash out at me? How can I bring up topics like that in the future without getting such a negative response.
Her: I had just gotten off work and BAM
Me: Ok, do you think your response was fair to me?
Her: That stuff isn't my burden to bare.
Her: You've just spent too much time on your computer. Just haven't felt intimate when you get it out and play all night. I came home, made dinner, watched a movie. What else did I do?
Me: Ok, but that's not what I asked you.
Her: Sorry
Me: We can talk about the computer thing if you would like, but do answer my question.
Her: My response this morning?
Me: Yes, did I deserve to be treated like that?
Her: I just don't like when I ask you to look after my dogs and I found that wet spot on the carpet and thought well he was up late, did he even let them out and i got mad
Her: because i asked you to feed them and you forgot that one day and then I woke up after asking you to take them out and you hadn't.
Me:Do you or do you not think I deserve to be treated that way? You didn't say ANY of this this morning.
Her: so you got out of bed, grabbed your computer and I just go tupset. And no, but I shouldn't have to worry about my dogs and whether you listen to me. WHen are you paying me back for Skyrim?
Me: THat's a reasonable reason to be upset, but you didn't mention any of that this morning. You just snapped at me and left me wondering what I did wrong all day.
So classic they write scientific papers on this shit.
Another thing that happens with people who are abused. You start to feel sorry for them, that it's not their fault they're abusive, maybe it was something you did. Maybe you weren't man enough. Maybe you're a giant wuss for this. Really it's not that bad, a little slap. Surely couldn't get worse. You love them. You must have deserved this.
Don't think like that. This is what causes a lot of issues with spousal abuse. It's terrible and no one deserves to be treated like that. Man nor woman.
So you have to decide if this is a relationship worth working on or not. There certainly are other girls out there who don't have these issues and you may decide that it's not worth it to work on this. You are the only one who knows how much you like her and how much it hurts you when she does these things. What is absolutely true is that you can't continue the relationship this way. Get counseling or get out.
This is not meant to start a conversation, so please do not attempt to continue one here. This is a warning. It will be your only one.
The facebook shit? That is immature. The fact that she is trying to undermine your kids' mother to them is a terrible sign.
Look, it's up to you if you want to use the a-word here. But you can see that you aren't happy, that she doesn't talk to you, and is incredibly resentful of.. everything about you. You can SEE that. I know you can, because you're telling us you do. If you're not happy, and you can't even communicate facilitated or otherwise, then your relationship isn't a good one. Your kids will get over it. Trust me, they will be more appreciative of having a happy, healthy dad than watching him deteriorate in an unhappy relationship with a woman who treats them okay for now.
Okay. Yeah.
How old are the two of you?
This is sort-of why I didn't want to jump on the 'abuse' bandwagon: you've been neglecting your SO, who in turn may or may not be a mean-spirited person anyway and is responding in kind. You now have a big clusterfuck on your hands.
1) If I had that extremely weird response from anyone after asking, "Who's that?" I'd be a bit suspicious of infidelity, but that's just me.
2) If your SO really asked your kids to do that to your ex-wife, she is totally fucked-up.
3) If you are up so late playing video games that are are neglecting to do basic tasks around the house like letting the dogs go outside to pee or, y'know, give them food, you are playing video games way, way, way too compulsively.
4) Like Ceres said, you have kids dude. They don't need all this shit.
You aren't nearly ready for a relationship, and neither is your SO. Break it off, and don't date again until you've had some therapy and sorted your shit out. Nobody is perfect, but you don't have to be perfect in order to let household pets have bathroom breaks. :P
THe video games? I played until 2 in the morning two nights in a row. That's it. Civ V. I didn't start playing until after she had already fallen asleep with me laying next to her watching tv.
Please, please listen to the people in this thread, especially @Ceres.
Read the thread that was linked to you if you have the time.
Okay, if that's true, then your SO is being abusive. In any case, you need to bail.
It's not the most honest thing to do, but I'd prioritize the health of your children over honesty to your SO any day of the week.