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The new [Nintendo] Thread: Screens, screens as far as the eye can see.

1246

Posts

  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    Mblackwell wrote: »
    Stop the used game market when you can still buy a new copy of Space Station Silicon Valley.

    This is a good point. I think that a moratorium on used sales for maybe 6 months after release would protect the developers sufficiently, so maybe that's the way to go.

    Or, adding to this (since I don't think you could actually enforce this), require activation codes within the first six months of those games' releases.

    Once they have their foot in the door, six months will eventually become eight months. Eight months will eventually become a year. A year will eventually become two years.

  • AtomikaAtomika Brought to you by Technicolor™ Registered User regular
    emnmnme wrote: »
    Mblackwell wrote: »
    Stop the used game market when you can still buy a new copy of Space Station Silicon Valley.

    This is a good point. I think that a moratorium on used sales for maybe 6 months after release would protect the developers sufficiently, so maybe that's the way to go.

    Or, adding to this (since I don't think you could actually enforce this), require activation codes within the first six months of those games' releases.

    Once they have their foot in the door, six months will eventually become eight months. Eight months will eventually become a year. A year will eventually become two years.

    Maybe. But market forces will dictate that more than arbitrary desires for profit will. If activation license sales drop to nothing while new game sales remain static, you'll see them walk that back pretty quickly.

  • AtomikaAtomika Brought to you by Technicolor™ Registered User regular
    Some "industry insider" named Billy Pidgeon thinks the PS4 might be released at $299.


    I'll eat my goddamned hat.

    Linespider5
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    I'm going to guess $449 for a core system, $549 for the deluxe.

    Atomika
  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    Some "industry insider" named Billy Pidgeon thinks the PS4 might be released at $299.


    I'll eat my goddamned hat.

    They could force you to subscribe to three years of Playstation network to make up for it.

    15 bucks a month adds up.

    I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
  • AtomikaAtomika Brought to you by Technicolor™ Registered User regular
    Some "industry insider" named Billy Pidgeon thinks the PS4 might be released at $299.


    I'll eat my goddamned hat.

    They could force you to subscribe to three years of Playstation network to make up for it.

    15 bucks a month adds up.

    They couldn't "force" me unless they brick the box without online connectivity, which I don't feel is likely.

    I would just play single-player games and never buy anything from their online store. That hurts them a lot more than me.

  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    edited February 2013
    Some "industry insider" named Billy Pidgeon thinks the PS4 might be released at $299.


    I'll eat my goddamned hat.

    They could force you to subscribe to three years of Playstation network to make up for it.

    15 bucks a month adds up.

    They couldn't "force" me unless they brick the box without online connectivity, which I don't feel is likely.

    I would just play single-player games and never buy anything from their online store. That hurts them a lot more than me.

    umm, sure they can.

    xbox 360 has a thing where you get it for 99 bucks, but you have to sign a 2 year contract enforced with early cancellation fees.

    I could see a next gen console going for 299 with a similar structure.

    In fact, thats almost preferable to shelling out 500 up front.

    If live is 100 bucks for two years normally, and contract live is 360 dollars for two years...

    Thats comes out to 560 dollars over two years, along with the 100 for online.

    I'd totally do that.

    syndalis on
    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • CptHamiltonCptHamilton Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    Some "industry insider" named Billy Pidgeon thinks the PS4 might be released at $299.


    I'll eat my goddamned hat.

    They could force you to subscribe to three years of Playstation network to make up for it.

    15 bucks a month adds up.

    They couldn't "force" me unless they brick the box without online connectivity, which I don't feel is likely.

    I would just play single-player games and never buy anything from their online store. That hurts them a lot more than me.

    umm, sure they can.

    xbox 360 has a thing where you get it for 99 bucks, but you have to sign a 2 year contract enforced with early cancellation fees.

    I could see a next gen console going for 299 with a similar structure.

    In fact, thats almost preferable to shelling out 500 up front.

    If live is 100 bucks for two years normally, and contract live is 360 dollars for two years...

    Thats comes out to 560 dollars over two years, along with the 100 for online.

    I'd totally do that.

    I'm curious how the 360 contract thing works in conjunction with Live subscription cards. I work for Microsoft (not anywhere near the xbox division, even geographically) and get my Live Gold at a pretty significant discount from the company store. I wonder if I could pick up a subscription 360 and use my discounted subscription code cards?

    Regardless, though, plenty of people are opposed to recurring fees and contract terms. And then there's hardware failure or just wanting a second machine. They'll have to offer a subscription-free PS4 SKU at some price or another just for the many situations where a person can't or won't sign a contract. Assuming that a PSN+ subscription-subsidized PS4 is even a thing.

    PSN,Steam,Live | CptHamiltonian
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    The 360+Contract thing is apparently selling like gangbusters.

    Which makes sense. "No money down + fees" type offers have always worked well.

    Plus, for the more informed customers, Live is something they were gonna get anyway.

  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    599 off contract, 299 with a 2 year live / PSPlus sub at 15/month

    If I were marketing the next generation, I would aim for this. Especially since it makes the off contract one marginally more expensive than the contract one, ensuring people who can do math will buy into using the online services for at least couple years.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • GodfatherGodfather Registered User regular
    I'm actually looking forward to getting into this upcoming generation of games. I've more-or-less completely skipped out on this current one; the last console I bought was the Wii on release day.

    So basically if I get my hands on one, I have an entire backlog of games to play during that first year dry spell 8-)

    0WBv0.png
  • AtomikaAtomika Brought to you by Technicolor™ Registered User regular
    Godfather wrote: »
    I'm actually looking forward to getting into this upcoming generation of games. I've more-or-less completely skipped out on this current one; the last console I bought was the Wii on release day.

    So basically if I get my hands on one, I have an entire backlog of games to play during that first year dry spell 8-)

    Unless old games aren't backwards compatible.

    Then you're screwed.

  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    If Microsoft is going to go the subscription route next Gen, you can bet your ass the price will be $150-200 with the 15/mo subscription over 2 years. Any higher and they lose the reduced cost illusion.

    No I don't.
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    If Microsoft is going to go the subscription route next Gen, you can bet your ass the price will be $150-200 with the 15/mo subscription over 2 years. Any higher and they lose the reduced cost illusion.

    if that 299 includes a fuckload of space, a kinect 2.0 and whatever new bells and whistles next gen entails...

    People pay 299 for an iPhone with a 100/mo contract, they can do 299 with a 15/mo contract for that.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    If Microsoft is going to go the subscription route next Gen, you can bet your ass the price will be $150-200 with the 15/mo subscription over 2 years. Any higher and they lose the reduced cost illusion.

    if that 299 includes a fuckload of space, a kinect 2.0 and whatever new bells and whistles next gen entails...

    People pay 299 for an iPhone with a 100/mo contract, they can do 299 with a 15/mo contract for that.

    Bullshit. If it's not less than the lowest wii u sku it's not worth Microsoft's time. If Microsoft goes above $200 for this, it's not worth doing.

    No I don't.
  • override367override367 ALL minions Registered User regular
    Here's a thought but why does the console have to be $500 or $600 in the first place

  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    Here's a thought but why does the console have to be $500 or $600 in the first place

    It doesn't. I firmly suspect the next Xbox will be 399, just like the 360 at launch.

    No I don't.
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    If Microsoft is going to go the subscription route next Gen, you can bet your ass the price will be $150-200 with the 15/mo subscription over 2 years. Any higher and they lose the reduced cost illusion.

    if that 299 includes a fuckload of space, a kinect 2.0 and whatever new bells and whistles next gen entails...

    People pay 299 for an iPhone with a 100/mo contract, they can do 299 with a 15/mo contract for that.

    Bullshit. If it's not less than the lowest wii u sku it's not worth Microsoft's time. If Microsoft goes above $200 for this, it's not worth doing.

    you DO realize the current gen subsidized xbox 360, which is now 7 years old, is going for 99-149, and there isnt an option for a kinect + big HDD, even at the higher price point, right?

    Microsoft was perfectly happy being more expensive than the Wii last generation and still winning the generation.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    syndalis wrote: »
    If Microsoft is going to go the subscription route next Gen, you can bet your ass the price will be $150-200 with the 15/mo subscription over 2 years. Any higher and they lose the reduced cost illusion.

    if that 299 includes a fuckload of space, a kinect 2.0 and whatever new bells and whistles next gen entails...

    People pay 299 for an iPhone with a 100/mo contract, they can do 299 with a 15/mo contract for that.

    Bullshit. If it's not less than the lowest wii u sku it's not worth Microsoft's time. If Microsoft goes above $200 for this, it's not worth doing.

    you DO realize the current gen subsidized xbox 360, which is now 7 years old, is going for 99-149, and there isnt an option for a kinect + big HDD, even at the higher price point, right?

    Microsoft was perfectly happy being more expensive than the Wii last generation and still winning the generation.

    You do realize the subsidized version isn't going to be the only model, correct? Sorry man, if you're going to say I'm wrong here I'm going to say you're wrong.

    Microsoft isn't the iPhone here, they're the galaxy s III. They won't go over 200 for the subsidized system.

    No I don't.
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    http://engadget.com/2012/10/23/microsoft-subsidized-xbox-360-offer-to-250gb/ also yes, the 149 360 comes with kinect and a large HD.

    Death of Rats on
    No I don't.
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    If they sell the Durango for $200 + a monthly Live subscription, then the subscription is going to be a lot more than $15. I'd peg it closer to $30-50. As much as we all bemoan it, Live isn't really free. There is cost in the infrastructure, the development, content hosting.. all that stuff. A year costs $60.. The $15 subsidy equals out to $180, so that means $120 of extra money a year on top of the top of the line Live cost. So 2 years of that would get you to a little over $400. So either the contract would need to be longer (4-5 years) or the base price needs to be $300 to match up to the $500-600 price of the Xbox Next and still provide a decent profit.

    And believe me, they won't sell a subsidized plan unless it turned them a profit versus a non-subsidized console.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    If they sell the Durango for $200 + a monthly Live subscription, then the subscription is going to be a lot more than $15. I'd peg it closer to $30-50. As much as we all bemoan it, Live isn't really free. There is cost in the infrastructure, the development, content hosting.. all that stuff. A year costs $60.. The $15 subsidy equals out to $180, so that means $120 of extra money a year on top of the top of the line Live cost. So 2 years of that would get you to a little over $400. So either the contract would need to be longer (4-5 years) or the base price needs to be $300 to match up to the $500-600 price of the Xbox Next and still provide a decent profit.

    And believe me, they won't sell a subsidized plan unless it turned them a profit versus a non-subsidized console.

    What makes you think the next Xbox will launch for more that the 360 did? At the 360 launch price, 200 with a 15 a month contract would net them more than the price of the console retail.

    I'm basing my predictions on what Microsoft has done in the past, not just lumping them in with Sony.

    No I don't.
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    I'm thinking the next Xbox will launch for more than the 360 because every version of it is going to include a Kinect 2.0, the evolution of a device that had dedicated processors that were removed for cost reasons and still cost $150. So I'm pegging the next Xbox at $400 + $100 for the Kinect 2.0. And that's baseline and assuming Microsoft will sell it for a loss at a time when they are not doing so hot.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    http://engadget.com/2012/10/23/microsoft-subsidized-xbox-360-offer-to-250gb/ also yes, the 149 360 comes with kinect and a large HD.

    it looks like they got rid of that bundle.

    http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox360/consoles/entertainment-for-all

    so 99 for current gen, 299 for next gen.

    This doesnt seem wildly wrong to me - but I guess we will wait and see for the real pricing announcements.

    Sony and Microsoft aren't making game consoles any more; they are making high powered content delivery consoles of which gaming is a core feature.

    Blu Ray + Netflix + Hulu + On demand rentals + content delivery from the computer + a broad variety of other high end features like second screen experience from HBO Go, etc. AND it has hardware that runs circles around Nintendo's current offering.

    This can afford to be priced higher, and people can justify it. Even in this economy. But ONLY if the on-contract pricing is attractive, and I think that falls somewhere between 249-299. Probably 299.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    I'm thinking the next Xbox will launch for more than the 360 because every version of it is going to include a Kinect 2.0, the evolution of a device that had dedicated processors that were removed for cost reasons and still cost $150. So I'm pegging the next Xbox at $400 + $100 for the Kinect 2.0. And that's baseline and assuming Microsoft will sell it for a loss at a time when they are not doing so hot.

    Actually, the kinect costs about $90 on amazon if you were to look. Microsoft has a history of selling their consoles at a loss. $399, maybe $459 is where I see it retailing at.

    I think everyone is missing the point of the subscription model. It's less about moving systems, and more about getting people who typically wouldn't subscribe to live to be forced to subscribe to live for 2 years. At the end of those two years, those people have a choice between losing the functionality live offers, or going on silver. Considering they've been paying $15 a month for two years for the service, it dropping down to a third of that will more than likely keep them on the service.

    Microsoft sells their consoles at a loss, and makes up the money through subscriptions to live. That's the way they've done it this entire generation. Making it so the subscription model is seen as economical as possible to people is going to be a huge priority for them. Again, the subsidized console isn't about moving consoles, but getting people onboard xbox live for the entire span of the generation.

    No I don't.
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    I don't think selling consoles at a loss is a viable tactic in an economic downturn; I'm well aware of the current cost of a Kinect, I'm referring to the cost it launched at.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Athenor wrote: »
    I don't think selling consoles at a loss is a viable tactic in an economic downturn; I'm well aware of the current cost of a Kinect, I'm referring to the cost it launched at.

    And I'm saying you're wrong and basing your reasoning on speculation and rumors, instead of the history of the company. Microsoft would be insane to sell the thing for more that $450, and Microsoft isn't insane.

    And again, a contract for 2 years of live at 15/mo is more than enough to make up for the losses on the console. Especially if they keep those people on live well into the console's lifespan.

    Death of Rats on
    No I don't.
  • RedTideRedTide Registered User regular
    If Microsoft does go for a reasonable subsidized route ill be tempted to buy my first Xbox ever. But not until I find out what the replacement policy is for when it dies halfway through the mandatory subscription period.

    RedTide#1907 on Battle.net
    Come Overwatch with meeeee
    Atomika
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    Okay, fine, let me put it this way.

    My phone was a $600 piece of kit when it came out. I got it for $300, plus a $48 monthly cost that included the digital subscription plan, the cost of the phone, and the full coverage insurance. I got it at that price because I was on a family plan. When that plan got shifted to a Share Anything plan, the price went up to $52. I know that if I were not on my family's plan, the price would be much higher.

    What you are suggesting is that Microsoft is going to sell a piece of kit that will probably average $450-500* for $200 and at a smaller price than most cell phone plans have for their subsidies.

    I'm sorry, I just can't see that being viable. If you'd change your thesis to $300 + $15/mo subscription I'd be 100% behind you. But not at $200. Microsoft can't afford to lose that much money.

    Note that this is not including any of the rumors of a "Games-free" Xbox versus an "Enthusiast" Xbox.


    * - The $450-500 figure is the price breakdown of the PS3, which rumors state had its specs upped to match Microsoft's at the last moment. Again, everything I've heard about the Kinct 2.0 makes it sound like it will be much more expensive than the original Kinect is now.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
  • a5ehrena5ehren AtlantaRegistered User regular
    Godfather wrote: »
    I'm actually looking forward to getting into this upcoming generation of games. I've more-or-less completely skipped out on this current one; the last console I bought was the Wii on release day.

    So basically if I get my hands on one, I have an entire backlog of games to play during that first year dry spell 8-)

    I doubt either console will have good backwards compatibility. Sony has already all but confirmed that the PS4 won't, so I doubt Microsoft even bothers.

  • Death of RatsDeath of Rats Registered User regular
    RedTide wrote: »
    If Microsoft does go for a reasonable subsidized route ill be tempted to buy my first Xbox ever. But not until I find out what the replacement policy is for when it dies halfway through the mandatory subscription period.

    This right here is exactly why I think I'm right.

    No I don't.
  • AtomikaAtomika Brought to you by Technicolor™ Registered User regular
    Kotaku is reporting that the reason that we didn't see the PS4 console at the press conference this week is because it doesn't exist yet, at least not in a finalized form factor.


    So there you go.

  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    Kotaku is reporting that the reason that we didn't see the PS4 console at the press conference this week is because it doesn't exist yet, at least not in a finalized form factor.

    So there you go.

    Well duh. If they just threw the extra RAM in within the last couple of months, then they'll need to redesign the case in order to make sure proper heat/ventilation issues are taken into consideration.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
  • AllforceAllforce Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    I really don't get the furor over them not showing the box and the gall people are expressing that games shown were running on a PC. It IS a PC with a custom operating system, what difference does it make what the shape of the box is in its current form? The dev kit for every console is always like a desktop PC with custom ports on it for controllers, etc.

    Just release a rectangular box with minimal or no lights on the thing, and a disc slot. Please keep it black. All inputs/outputs on the back plz.

    Allforce on
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    Allforce wrote: »
    I really don't get the furor over them not showing the box and the gall people are expressing that games shown were running on a PC. It IS a PC with a custom operating system, what difference does it make what the shape of the box is in its current form? The dev kit for every console is always like a desktop PC with custom ports on it for controllers, etc.

    Just release a rectangular box with minimal or no lights on the thing, and a disc slot. Please keep it black. All inputs/outputs on the back plz.

    A black shoebox with a disc tray is not something Joe American wants in his home entertainment setup.

  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    I'm thinking the next Xbox will launch for more than the 360 because every version of it is going to include a Kinect 2.0, the evolution of a device that had dedicated processors that were removed for cost reasons and still cost $150. So I'm pegging the next Xbox at $400 + $100 for the Kinect 2.0. And that's baseline and assuming Microsoft will sell it for a loss at a time when they are not doing so hot.

    Actually, the kinect costs about $90 on amazon if you were to look. Microsoft has a history of selling their consoles at a loss. $399, maybe $459 is where I see it retailing at.

    I think everyone is missing the point of the subscription model. It's less about moving systems, and more about getting people who typically wouldn't subscribe to live to be forced to subscribe to live for 2 years. At the end of those two years, those people have a choice between losing the functionality live offers, or going on silver. Considering they've been paying $15 a month for two years for the service, it dropping down to a third of that will more than likely keep them on the service.

    Microsoft sells their consoles at a loss, and makes up the money through subscriptions to live. That's the way they've done it this entire generation. Making it so the subscription model is seen as economical as possible to people is going to be a huge priority for them. Again, the subsidized console isn't about moving consoles, but getting people onboard xbox live for the entire span of the generation.

    I think they'd rather do both actually. It's all a question of what their research says the market will bear.

    The Wii launched at, what, $250? That seems a good target. I don't see much reason to go below that. That price certainly didn't seem to put anyone off.

  • XobyteXobyte Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    I don't think selling consoles at a loss is a viable tactic in an economic downturn; I'm well aware of the current cost of a Kinect, I'm referring to the cost it launched at.

    I think selling a $600 console in an economic downturn is an even less viable tactic. People weren't willing to do that 8 years ago, when the economy was marginally better. What makes you think that's a viable price now?

  • spacekungfumanspacekungfuman Poor and minority-filled Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited February 2013
    Um, guys? The PS3 was very successful, you know. It's not like their launch strategy killed the system's long term success.

    spacekungfuman on
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  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Um, guys? The PS3 was very successful, you know. It's not like their launch strategy killed the system's long term success.

    It definitely wasn't.

    Its done well since the launch but the console has not done Sony many favors. Its been redesigned to cut costs at least twice and the fact that it's still the most expensive current generation console is just sad.

    The Vita was a disaster as well just like its predecessor too boot.

    Sony needs this to go well right off the bat or they'll be in a pretty bad position this generation.

    King Riptor on
    I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
  • AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist Registered User regular
    Xobyte wrote: »
    Athenor wrote: »
    I don't think selling consoles at a loss is a viable tactic in an economic downturn; I'm well aware of the current cost of a Kinect, I'm referring to the cost it launched at.

    I think selling a $600 console in an economic downturn is an even less viable tactic. People weren't willing to do that 8 years ago, when the economy was marginally better. What makes you think that's a viable price now?

    I agree, but I'm on the side of launching a less powerful console with fewer shinies and stopping trying to use these machines to compete with AppleTV or other home entertainment boxes.

    Official member of the Grilling Gentry
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    Rarely-updated Collecting blog
    He/Him
This discussion has been closed.