[Starcraft 2][Singleplayer Thread] Abathur's 5th Grade Science Project

LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
edited March 2013 in Games and Technology
Note: This thread is for the discussion of the singleplayer component of SC2 only. If you wish to discuss multiplayer, racial imbalance, esports, arcade, or something called "Barcraft" please visit our SC2 multiplayer thread. Link: http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/175213/starcraft-2-heart-of-the-swarm-arrives-march-12th/p1

Starcraft II: Heart of the Swarm
Singleplayer Discussion Thread

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Trailers!

Official Starcraft II Homepage
http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/

Lore Summary Video: (NOTE SPOILERS)
http://www.twitch.tv/nasltv/b/375704733

Game Info:
Heart of the Swarm release date: 3.12.13

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Posts

  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    Reserved. (Just in case).

  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    Ok so I'll get the singleplayer discussion going here.

    Dr. Ariel Hanson -- is she going to be back in this game? I feel like her zerg research might be important to the plot here, but she hasn't been shown or referenced at all in any of the promotional stuff I've seen.

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    She was killed though, wasn't she?

    I thought either path you chose she ends up going psycho Zerg mode.

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  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Also, Fenix needs to make a comback.

    There was no more bad-ass muther fucker than fucking Fenix.

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  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    I don't remember her going crazy OR dying. I thought she just up and left after her research was completed. She had feelings for Jim, but he only has eyes for Kerrigan, so she left. Or something.

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Oh, that might be if you chose her storyline then. It's been ages so I can't recall, but when Artosis chose the Protoss just a few days ago, she turns into a zerg and Raynor puts a bullet in her head (or some other vital organ).

    I've played through the campaign 3ish times and now that I think about it, you're right, if you choose her path she ends up leaving after a kiss.


    So it'll depend on which plot point they decide being cannon.
    The cure for the "Zerg" though is already identified as being that beacon though, isn't it?

    So having two ways to "cure" infestation might be a bit much.

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  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    Hah. I don't even remember that there was a choice. And with HotS coming out in like 5 days there's no way I'd be able to replay the WoL campaign to see what you're talking about. I've got to finish Tomb Raider in that time.

    Lucascraft on
  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Yeah in one of the Haven missions, you have to chose to either side with the Doc and save the colonists and fight off the Protoss air army trying to purge each base, or side with the Protoss and kill the infested colonies.

    It's the mission that introduces the viking.

    When you side with the toss though you don't technically have to slay the colonists if you kill the infestations before they hatch.

    One of the more interesting plot points is the Tosh vs Nova one.
    You have to choose one. Tosh dies if you go with Nova.


    Nova's seen in many of the HotS clips, but that doesn't mean you sided with her.
    Technically though, as far as multiplayer goes, you supposedly sided with Nova since you use ghosts rather than specters.

    It'd be cool to see Tosh return.

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  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    I NEVER GAVE UP ON YOU KERRIGAN

    ...except that time when I said I was going to, you know, kill you.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SCcnd1WJVCo

    By the time Legacy of the Void comes out, Starcraft 1 will effectively be retconned into some alternate timeline that never happened.

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  • PriscaPrisca Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    I NEVER GAVE UP ON YOU KERRIGAN

    ...except that time when I said I was going to, you know, kill you.

    Indeed, Metzen seems to have great difficulty keeping the lore coherent. There are rectons everywhere!

    After playing WoL, I'm just going to assume that the story concluded after Brood War, and SC2's plot is just fan fiction.

    Prisca on
  • JutranjoJutranjo Registered User regular
    Prisca wrote: »
    I NEVER GAVE UP ON YOU KERRIGAN

    ...except that time when I said I was going to, you know, kill you.

    Indeed, Metzen seems to have great difficulty keeping the lore coherent. There are rectons everywhere!

    After playing WoL, I'm just going to assume that the story concluded after Brood War, and SC2's plot is just fan fiction.

    Metzen is a fan of his own work, that's fine. I'm hoping the storyline will be better than WoL, I won't be surprised if it isn't but I hope it won't be worse. The gameplay is bound to be fun though, which is what I'll play the campaign for foremost.

  • Joe KJoe K Registered User regular
    Jutranjo wrote: »
    I'm hoping the storyline will be better than WoL, I won't be surprised if it isn't but I hope it won't be worse. The gameplay is bound to be fun though, which is what I'll play the campaign for foremost.

    damning with faint praise, eh?

    i'll bet that the storyline for HoTS will be better than ANYTHING done for Superfriends!

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Yeah I'm pretty excited at the customizations for single player

    Lings that can run up walls? Yes please!


    WoL had a lot of neat stuff for terran. All the mercenary units, all the special armory upgrades like buildings that repair themselves, reactored tech labs, a tower that slows down zerg units, etc. etc.

    Pretty excited to see what they came up with Zerg.
    Hopefully the infested bunker is a thing, and offensive nydus too.

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    wra
  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    Yeah, that's probably my biggest anticipation as well... all the meta-game stuff in between missions. The terrans were allowed to research fun new ways of killing the zerg. I want to be able to research fun new ways of killing everything.

  • JutranjoJutranjo Registered User regular
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    Yeah, that's probably my biggest anticipation as well... all the meta-game stuff in between missions. The terrans were allowed to research fun new ways of killing the zerg. I want to be able to research fun new ways of killing everything.

    What kinds of currency do you have though? You had 3 in WoL, this has mutagens or something for units. But units get some common upgrades like ling speed and 1 final choice that's binary?

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Prisca wrote: »
    I NEVER GAVE UP ON YOU KERRIGAN

    ...except that time when I said I was going to, you know, kill you.

    Indeed, Metzen seems to have great difficulty keeping the lore coherent. There are rectons everywhere!

    After playing WoL, I'm just going to assume that the story concluded after Brood War, and SC2's plot is just fan fiction.


    Metzen moonlights writing for Marvel.

    More at 11.

    l4lGvOw.png
    Witty signature comment goes here...

    wra
  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    Jutranjo wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    Yeah, that's probably my biggest anticipation as well... all the meta-game stuff in between missions. The terrans were allowed to research fun new ways of killing the zerg. I want to be able to research fun new ways of killing everything.

    What kinds of currency do you have though? You had 3 in WoL, this has mutagens or something for units. But units get some common upgrades like ling speed and 1 final choice that's binary?
    A couple of ideas:
    Genetic strains/codes
    Maybe, when you're in a mission you take the time to kill all the critters/track down odd fossils (or some other secondary objective) instead of just rushing to the mission objectives, if the critters had something that would make a useful mutation then it's applied to a unit or building upgrade. (similar to the Zerg/Protoss research points)

    Biomass
    Experimentation takes material. Minimize losses, maximize casualties on the other side, spawn as much stuff as possible and your biomass reserves go up at the end of the mission. Spend biomass for the ability to spawn experimental units (like Zerg mercs).

    I seem to recall reading somewhere Kerrigan will be able to accrue XP while on missions to improve her own abilities, so I guess that could count as a third resource.

  • kedinikkedinik Captain of Industry Registered User regular
    I'm looking forward to mutations.

    They probably won't have quite as big of a campaign tech tree as the terrans had in WoL, but as long as it's similar I'll have fun.

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  • TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    I'm inclined to wonder if they'll spend a significant amount of time in the HotS story revealing new Protoss characters, since at this point the only named Toss character is Zeratul, and it's tough to have a huge storyline with one guy talking to himself. Well I'm sure Raynor or someone will be there, and I guess they could use the Protoss guys they introduced in the final Ihan crystal mission and Selendis or whatever her name is.

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    WoL had 29 total missions.

    HotS will have around 20.

    :(

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    wra
  • 38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    They introduced a bunch more Protoss characters in WoL. Unfortunately, none were memorable. Seriously I can't remember the name of even one. If you play that protoss hold the base mission, they all warp in with air units though.

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  • JutranjoJutranjo Registered User regular
    see317 wrote: »
    Jutranjo wrote: »
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    Yeah, that's probably my biggest anticipation as well... all the meta-game stuff in between missions. The terrans were allowed to research fun new ways of killing the zerg. I want to be able to research fun new ways of killing everything.

    What kinds of currency do you have though? You had 3 in WoL, this has mutagens or something for units. But units get some common upgrades like ling speed and 1 final choice that's binary?
    A couple of ideas:
    Genetic strains/codes
    Maybe, when you're in a mission you take the time to kill all the critters/track down odd fossils (or some other secondary objective) instead of just rushing to the mission objectives, if the critters had something that would make a useful mutation then it's applied to a unit or building upgrade. (similar to the Zerg/Protoss research points)

    Biomass
    Experimentation takes material. Minimize losses, maximize casualties on the other side, spawn as much stuff as possible and your biomass reserves go up at the end of the mission. Spend biomass for the ability to spawn experimental units (like Zerg mercs).

    I seem to recall reading somewhere Kerrigan will be able to accrue XP while on missions to improve her own abilities, so I guess that could count as a third resource.

    Oh yeah, Kerrigen has 2 or 4 different things she can spec into? And some focus she has to swap between missions?

  • UrQuanLord88UrQuanLord88 Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    Rorus Raz wrote: »
    I NEVER GAVE UP ON YOU KERRIGAN

    ...except that time when I said I was going to, you know, kill you.

    Meh, that point isn't too big of an issue for me. It is entirely plausible that 4 years after the events of Brood War, that Jim Raynor's hatred for the Queen of Blades has waned especially when the Zerg went into hiding.

    Also, he did technically kill the Queen of Blades when he converted Kerrigan back to being human if you believe in the QoB/Kerrigan duality. He still has time to kill her again, etc.

    I did find that WoL's overall story was weak though. I'm still hating on Blizzard's trend of killing off characters every so often. I just hope they do a better job at the story this time.

    EDIT Also a very possible ending for Heart of Swarm was leaked when WoL was released: The third floor does digital work mostly for films

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  • TaranisTaranis Registered User regular
    No. No. No.

    Raynor made up with Kerrigan.

    Didn't you guys play Ghost?

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  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    i'm hoping against all signs to the contrary that redemption arc for Kerrigan is not the route they go down.

    I don't know why, but I just don't think it fits with sci-fi.

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  • RetabaRetaba A Cultist Registered User regular
    Based on the stuff I've seen, even if they do go down that route, I don't think she is going to be a softer character. It looks like she can get rough even in her current state.

  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    yea I just think its stupid to do a redemption arc for someone who led an army of genetic tooth monsters to kill millions of people. A bloo bloo bloo zerg corruption whatever man blizzard just let your iconic bad guy stay as a bad guy

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  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    I don't think they'll redeem her. Just looking at those trailers, I get the impression that she goes even more evil, now that she's got full control of her mental faculties. Before she was a slave of the hive mind or something. Now what she's doing is personal. That takes it to a whole new level. Before it was animalistic and primal. Now it's a vendetta.

  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    Taranis wrote: »
    No. No. No.

    Raynor made up with Kerrigan.

    Didn't you guys play Ghost?

    Also, I think Blizzard should give Ghost another chance. On the next generation consoles + PC. Only this time they should develop it all in-house rather than farming the project out to a 3rd party who cannot live up to their impossible standard of excellence.

    Give us a tactical stealth shooter with elements of Uncharted and Splinter Cell.

  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    i'm hoping against all signs to the contrary that redemption arc for Kerrigan is not the route they go down.

    I don't know why, but I just don't think it fits with sci-fi.
    Gotta agree, redeeming the bad guy is getting kind of played out in scifi and fantasy. Personally, I'd like to see her gradually twist Raynor around to her way of thinking so he comes to support the Zerg. Maybe even getting infested himself and seeing himself as some kind of King of Blades or somehow Kerrigan's equal.
    Then, she kills him. No preamble, no long speech, just "fuck you, you're dead now". Maybe do it in front of some of Raynor's Protoss buddies so he can come back as a human/zerg hybrid in a dragoon body in the next expansion.

    ...maybe not.

  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Isn't the story pretty laid out though?

    Kerrgina's the key to stopping the xel'naga

    kinda done deal?

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  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    MMMig wrote: »
    Isn't the story pretty laid out though?

    Kerrgina's the key to stopping the xel'naga

    kinda done deal?

    yeah but that's so.....

    bad.

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  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    Heh

    agreed twice

    ^_^

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  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    you're very right though

    with the 'foreshadowing' in WoL and the leaked HotS ending from ages there really isn't much point in speculating on the story because it's all pretty much laid out in the most boring way possible.

    At least the gameplay will probably be awesome. WoL was the most fun RTS campaign I've ever played.

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  • fatalspoonsfatalspoons Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    You guys are making it more simple than it really is, though. I liked the idea that Kerrigan was a loop-hole the overmind was using to prevent the dark one (or whatever) from using the zerg to his own means. The overmind knew what was going to happen if the xel'naga took control of the zerg, but was prevented from actively trying to prevent it. So he created Kerrigan because technically she could still help him overthrow the protoss, so it wasn't against his programming so-to-speak, while knowing full well that she could be the undoing of the dark one.

    I think that's neat. Much more interesting than just "kerrigan's going to stop the xel'naga".

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  • MMMigMMMig Registered User regular
    True

    Hopefully Raynor realizes this after all of Zeratul's "you idiot!" and stops being a damn cry baby

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  • LucascraftLucascraft Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    Jeez. I'm starting to wonder if I played the same game as you guys or if I just have a really bad memory.

    Other than the Xel'Naga artifact that you assembled and used in the final mission, I don't recall a single other mention of the Xel'naga in all of WoL.

    You know what I do remember though? The secret ending of Brood War. With the black guy. Back when that game came out, I was probably only like 14 years old, but the "oh shit! that just happened" factor of the hidden ending stuck with me. However, nothing at all from SC2 stuck with me.

    Except for Tychus. That's like all I remember.

    Lucascraft on
  • fatalspoonsfatalspoons Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    Lucascraft wrote: »
    However, nothing at all from SC2 stuck with me.

    Glad your in charge of the sc2 campaign thread, then. :P

    That was Duran, and he was working for the dark one to create the zerg protoss hybrids that you fight in the protoss missions of WOL.

    My guess, though it isn't confirmed, is that the dark one is responsible for the xel'naga's extinction (and yes, he was a xel'naga himself). He probably used the zerg to accomplish it. He knew he could someday be reincarnated with the zergs help, and then use the zerg to dominate the universe. That's what I'm guessing will be revealed over the next two games, but who knows.

    fatalspoons on
  • DodgeBlanDodgeBlan PSN: dodgeblanRegistered User regular
    You guys are making it more simple than it really is, though. I liked the idea that Kerrigan was a loop-hole the overmind was using to prevent the dark one (or whatever) from using the zerg to his own means. The overmind knew what was going to happen if the xel'naga took control of the zerg, but was prevented from actively trying to prevent it. So he created Kerrigan because technically she could still help him overthrow the protoss, so it wasn't against his programming so-to-speak, while knowing full well that she could be the undoing of the dark one.

    I think that's neat. Much more interesting than just "kerrigan's going to stop the xel'naga".

    It seems silly to me because a terrifying race of bug monsters needs an overriding directive to be interesting. Whether it's 'kill mengsk' or 'kill protoss' or 'obey scary smoke man' doesn't matter much to me. The overmind wanted to be free? to do what? What are free zergs going to do? build fleshy office buildings and run a call center?

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  • fatalspoonsfatalspoons Registered User regular
    edited March 2013
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    You guys are making it more simple than it really is, though. I liked the idea that Kerrigan was a loop-hole the overmind was using to prevent the dark one (or whatever) from using the zerg to his own means. The overmind knew what was going to happen if the xel'naga took control of the zerg, but was prevented from actively trying to prevent it. So he created Kerrigan because technically she could still help him overthrow the protoss, so it wasn't against his programming so-to-speak, while knowing full well that she could be the undoing of the dark one.

    I think that's neat. Much more interesting than just "kerrigan's going to stop the xel'naga".

    It seems silly to me because a terrifying race of bug monsters needs an overriding directive to be interesting. Whether it's 'kill mengsk' or 'kill protoss' or 'obey scary smoke man' doesn't matter much to me. The overmind wanted to be free? to do what? What are free zergs going to do? build fleshy office buildings and run a call center?

    See, I find conflicted characters to be much more interesting than just characters who are good or bad simply for the sake of being good or bad. I feel there's more emotional reward if you are emotionally invested in the characters, and what's more emotional than an enemy struggling with his own destiny. It's hard to hate someone you sympathize with, but it's hard to have mercy on someone whose done atrocious things. If a story can walk that line carefully, I find myself on the edge of my seat waiting to see what happens next.

    fatalspoons on
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