time to dust off the 360. I think GTA DLC is the only thing thats going to bring me back now. I'm excited about this DLC, I hope it makes me want to replay it all and go achievement hunting, the sign of any great game!
Okay, I'm seeing something I REALLY like here: No achievements for certain difficulties. As someone thinking that Bioshock Ininfite handled difficulty scaling piss-poorly, I'm very glad about that. Easy it is! At least then I can enjoy using all these powers and weapons.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
And now, travelling to a dimension where she's died removes all her powers and magically heals her pinkie. BECAUSE THE STORY SAID SO.
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
Okay, I'm seeing something I REALLY like here: No achievements for certain difficulties. As someone thinking that Bioshock Ininfite handled difficulty scaling piss-poorly, I'm very glad about that. Easy it is! At least then I can enjoy using all these powers and weapons.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
And now, travelling to a dimension where she's died removes all her powers and magically heals her pinkie. BECAUSE THE STORY SAID SO.
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
What I'm getting from this
is that the story here, set in Rapture
is really deep, man.
Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
+1
KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
I just finished...
...Can someone explain to me what the fuck is going on? Please.
The DLC is pretty extraordinary. Well worth the wait, and 1000x better than the first piece. I just... I can't fathom what the hell happened and how it connects together.
DeadfallI don't think you realize just how rich he is.In fact, I should put on a monocle.Registered Userregular
Okay so I just finished. I had the day off so I powered through it.
I played a separate game, though. I had a fridge full of beers, and every time I got confused, something didn't make sense, or something goddamned awesome happened, I took a drink.
I am on my 7th beer (not lying.)
It had the exponential effect, however, of when I got confused, I took a drink. So the more I drank, the more I got confused.
It was worth it, though. I thought it was completely awesome.
So Elizabeth brought the downfall of Rapture, yes? She raised the part that was quarantined with the Splicers back up, which then fucked everything up? And she inadvertently created the Big Daddies/Little Sister dynamic?
Also
I literally yelled out like a tiny baby when I watched Cohen's video recording, "RIGHT BEHIND YOU" I was like haha, yeah nice try, I've been on the internet and seen my share of screamer vids. And then THAT LITTLE FUCKING RABBIT GUY IS SITTING RIGHT BEHIND YOU WITH A STROBE LIGHT
I also got spooked in the very beginning when you're in Paris and you turn around and there is that Little Sister with the huge white eyes just standing there HOLY SHIT.
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
+3
firewaterwordSatchitanandaPais Vasco to San FranciscoRegistered Userregular
I'm gonna have to play this soon looks like... Them spoilers be tempting.
Are both parts of the DLC still $15? How loong are they?
Their $15 a piece or $20 with the season pass. Or just wait for another 75% sale and get the pass for a fiver. Can't speak to the length I'm afraid. I hear the 2nd one is substantially longer though.
firewaterword on
Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu
0
DeadfallI don't think you realize just how rich he is.In fact, I should put on a monocle.Registered Userregular
edited March 2014
It took me roughly 6 hours to finish part 2.
But again
beers.
Deadfall on
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
0
DeadfallI don't think you realize just how rich he is.In fact, I should put on a monocle.Registered Userregular
Also because
It's mostly a slower, stealth game. You can't run 'n gun like the previous titles.
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
0
KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
edited March 2014
Alright. Imgur to the rescue. Complete BAS2 DLC spoilers based in specific screenshots and my thoughts on the ending.
Alright, so yeah. Elizabeth is the one responsible for bringing Jack to Rapture and saving the little sisters. She explicitly chooses to die and give Atlas(Fontaine) the activation code for Jack's brainwashing, which causes Jack to come down and play out all the events in Bioshock exactly how they were played out already without thousands of different realities from happening.
The only things that didn't read very well to me and confused the fuck out of me in the first place were A) The scene in the airplane where it cycles through all the Elizabeths in the mirror, B ) The other shot on the airplane that shows Jack killing some (what looked like) random woman, unless she was important and I don't remember or didn't catch it, and C) The cross-fade scene of Jack reaching for the little sisters out of the bathysphere to Elizabeth reaching for the little sister's hand when she died.
A) was done to show that this happens in all realities of Elizabeth, B ) is to show that Jack is the one that caused the plane to crash in the first place in Bioshock 1, and C) is to show that Elizabeth is what causes Jack to even come down to Rapture and save the little sisters in the first place.
Ok, is there some trick to downloading this thing? I've gone into the season pass store in game, just like for the first part and Clash in the Clouds, but the new episode is nowhere to be seen. Anyone else having this issue, or am I doing something wrong?
Okay, I'm seeing something I REALLY like here: No achievements for certain difficulties. As someone thinking that Bioshock Ininfite handled difficulty scaling piss-poorly, I'm very glad about that. Easy it is! At least then I can enjoy using all these powers and weapons.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
And now, travelling to a dimension where she's died removes all her powers and magically heals her pinkie. BECAUSE THE STORY SAID SO.
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
Okay, I'm walking dangerously here with spoilers but I'm also 10 minutes in and I think I can answer some of your questions. No one click unless....let's say unless you have a weapon yet.
Elizabeth says that when she basically ended the whole Colombia thing, she retained all memories of all incarnations of her, including the ones who died. The monologue while she was staring at the doll's head? She remembered her head being cut off. Also, in Ep 1, I just assumed it was another Big Daddy that'd found a way in *shrug*
The Luteci refer to her as a Superposition - think Quantum Superposition. She exists partly in all theoretical states, all the alternate places and times, unless she does something which breaks that. Basically, she exists "outside" of Time in the typical sense, the same way the Luteci do. Now, think Doctor Who logic - Doctor Who cannot cross his own timeline (except for when he does, but there are consequences). Similarly, Elizabeth cannot be where she already is without consequences. In this case, she goes someplace she knows she has died in another self. By doing so, this causes her quantum superstate to collapse into a single position, known and fixed - this is now the ONLY Elizabeth. She no longer has access to the memories of all her other lives (or maybe does because Booker), she no longer can see into other realities/times and jump there at will, she is just a flesh and blood woman.
It's not a trainwreck of logic so much as "normal" logic for time travel stories. It makes sense if you look at it cross-ways, but think about it too much, too hard, and you'll start to see flaws" Primer is the only time travel story I can think of that doesn't fall into this hole, with the notable caveat that "the actual story, aside from the time travel mechanics, sucks" is not to be considered a flaw in the sense I mean. :P
e: Thought of a slightly cleaner way to explain this, I think.
So it's supposed to work like this:
Elizabeth, like the Lutece Twins, exists outside time. Every decision she makes causes branching parallel timelines (just like everyone else, mind you), but because she exists "outside" time, she retains memories of all possible outcomes. She decides not to eat a pie? She can still remember what the pie tasted like even when she chose not to have it.
In the timeline of Ep 1, the her which was so incensed from the memory of having her head chopped off when she was a child goes and causes the events which we see in Ep 1. Then she dies. That is a terminus of one of the paths, but it does not prevent the other paths from having occurred. However, one of the other hers feels remorse from that memory and decides to go back and make it right. So she has the Lutece twins take her to Rapture (because she can't go there herself, presumably because that would be crossing the old timeline but more likely because it's a great excuse to have the Lutece twins again) with the foreknowledge that, by observing herself, it would "fix" the point at which she exists - she would no longer be in a quantum superposition, but rather in a fixed, observed position.
So she finds her dead body, that happens, and the waveform that is her collapses into this single Elizabeth. No more multiple parallel hers who share memories (although hypothetically those decisions could also have been made, but they should ALSO be fixed positions and without powers now), but just the individual.
Like I said. It makes a certain amount of internal logic, but if you're going to cry foul over "man, this story is great except the scientific mechanics of the parallel earth/time travel is just wonky," I think you might be thinking about it a little too hard.
Right. So both DLCs are pointless. And basically Ken Levin trying to go "look how clever I am!" while trying to "improve" upon the original Bioshock (something uneeded, and he fails, too) and none of it makes any logical sense.
So if you have no problem with that in the base game, I don't think you're gonna mind it in the DLCs either. It's hard to recommend one over the other since you'll have to play both to get the story experience, but Episode 2 was better than Episode 1.
Okay, I'm seeing something I REALLY like here: No achievements for certain difficulties. As someone thinking that Bioshock Ininfite handled difficulty scaling piss-poorly, I'm very glad about that. Easy it is! At least then I can enjoy using all these powers and weapons.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
And now, travelling to a dimension where she's died removes all her powers and magically heals her pinkie. BECAUSE THE STORY SAID SO.
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
Okay, I'm walking dangerously here with spoilers but I'm also 10 minutes in and I think I can answer some of your questions. No one click unless....let's say unless you have a weapon yet.
Elizabeth says that when she basically ended the whole Colombia thing, she retained all memories of all incarnations of her, including the ones who died. The monologue while she was staring at the doll's head? She remembered her head being cut off. Also, in Ep 1, I just assumed it was another Big Daddy that'd found a way in *shrug*
The Luteci refer to her as a Superposition - think Quantum Superposition. She exists partly in all theoretical states, all the alternate places and times, unless she does something which breaks that. Basically, she exists "outside" of Time in the typical sense, the same way the Luteci do. Now, think Doctor Who logic - Doctor Who cannot cross his own timeline (except for when he does, but there are consequences). Similarly, Elizabeth cannot be where she already is without consequences. In this case, she goes someplace she knows she has died in another self. By doing so, this causes her quantum superstate to collapse into a single position, known and fixed - this is now the ONLY Elizabeth. She no longer has access to the memories of all her other lives (or maybe does because Booker), she no longer can see into other realities/times and jump there at will, she is just a flesh and blood woman.
It's not a trainwreck of logic so much as "normal" logic for time travel stories. It makes sense if you look at it cross-ways, but think about it too much, too hard, and you'll start to see flaws" Primer is the only time travel story I can think of that doesn't fall into this hole, with the notable caveat that "the actual story, aside from the time travel mechanics, sucks" is not to be considered a flaw in the sense I mean. :P
e: Thought of a slightly cleaner way to explain this, I think.
So it's supposed to work like this:
Elizabeth, like the Lutece Twins, exists outside time. Every decision she makes causes branching parallel timelines (just like everyone else, mind you), but because she exists "outside" time, she retains memories of all possible outcomes. She decides not to eat a pie? She can still remember what the pie tasted like even when she chose not to have it.
In the timeline of Ep 1, the her which was so incensed from the memory of having her head chopped off when she was a child goes and causes the events which we see in Ep 1. Then she dies. That is a terminus of one of the paths, but it does not prevent the other paths from having occurred. However, one of the other hers feels remorse from that memory and decides to go back and make it right. So she has the Lutece twins take her to Rapture (because she can't go there herself, presumably because that would be crossing the old timeline but more likely because it's a great excuse to have the Lutece twins again) with the foreknowledge that, by observing herself, it would "fix" the point at which she exists - she would no longer be in a quantum superposition, but rather in a fixed, observed position.
So she finds her dead body, that happens, and the waveform that is her collapses into this single Elizabeth. No more multiple parallel hers who share memories (although hypothetically those decisions could also have been made, but they should ALSO be fixed positions and without powers now), but just the individual.
Like I said. It makes a certain amount of internal logic, but if you're going to cry foul over "man, this story is great except the scientific mechanics of the parallel earth/time travel is just wonky," I think you might be thinking about it a little too hard.
If the whole premise of the story - time- and dimension-travelling - do whatever they want and don't make any sense, what's the reason to resort to them in the first place?
The whole Bioshock Infinte might as well be some kind of magical multiverse where anything goes. Hell, half the time it does.
Okay, I'm seeing something I REALLY like here: No achievements for certain difficulties. As someone thinking that Bioshock Ininfite handled difficulty scaling piss-poorly, I'm very glad about that. Easy it is! At least then I can enjoy using all these powers and weapons.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
And now, travelling to a dimension where she's died removes all her powers and magically heals her pinkie. BECAUSE THE STORY SAID SO.
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
Yeah I'm completely fucking sick of the writing at this point, Levine is terrible. This is like some high school fanfic or something. Just give me something real, not all this nonsense that tries so hard to be clever without actually being so. Christopher Nolan and the Wachowski's know how to do this kind of thing and quickly get to meaty and genuine conflicts, Levine and his writers don't. It's like they took an idea that sucks and makes emotional beats insignificant in the first place, and then overthought and overworked it because... look at us guys were so clever.
- Stealth. The stealth system, with now powers, isn't that great, but they had exactly the right idea: Give you powers to make it faster and more fun. This proves the point that something doesn't have to be hard or challenging to be enjoyable. Well done!
- Graphics. Pretty much everything looked fantastic, especially the opening.
- The backstory on Columbia. I like the setting of Columbia. More backstory, especially when presented well without being forced on you.
Story seems nonsense so far, but this is among the best bits of gameplay I've ever gotten from a BioShock game. Elizabeth's fragility and the focus on stealth are both a blast to play. Don't get me wrong - I loved the hell out of being a drill-handed, bee-slinging, spear chucking powerhouse, but my actions here have to be so much more thoughful that I find myself enjoying it more. I still wish I could legit hack things, but I feel like I've worn out that particular gripe about Infinite.
Posts
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Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
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STEAM | XBL | PSN
I SHOULDN'T HAVE READ THE SPOILER!
The next 9 hours are going to be rough.
Edit:
Sigh. They've done it again. Not 10 minutes in and they've done it again.
STORY SPOILERS
Also, unless I'm playing as an alternate version of Elizabeth, then why is she alive when she died to the Big Daddy? And how exactly did the Big Daddy magically resurrect after being killed by Booker and kill Elizabeth? And since she had her powers back then, why didn't she leave through a tear or something?
Also, Booker talking to her doesn't make sense yet. I was hoping they'd explain that later but after this trainwreck of logic I don't expect it to get better.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
What I'm getting from this
is that the story here, set in Rapture
is really deep, man.
...Can someone explain to me what the fuck is going on? Please.
The DLC is pretty extraordinary. Well worth the wait, and 1000x better than the first piece. I just... I can't fathom what the hell happened and how it connects together.
I've never felt my avatar more than right now.
I played a separate game, though. I had a fridge full of beers, and every time I got confused, something didn't make sense, or something goddamned awesome happened, I took a drink.
I am on my 7th beer (not lying.)
It had the exponential effect, however, of when I got confused, I took a drink. So the more I drank, the more I got confused.
It was worth it, though. I thought it was completely awesome.
Also
I literally yelled out like a tiny baby when I watched Cohen's video recording, "RIGHT BEHIND YOU" I was like haha, yeah nice try, I've been on the internet and seen my share of screamer vids. And then THAT LITTLE FUCKING RABBIT GUY IS SITTING RIGHT BEHIND YOU WITH A STROBE LIGHT
I also got spooked in the very beginning when you're in Paris and you turn around and there is that Little Sister with the huge white eyes just standing there HOLY SHIT.
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
Penny Arcade Rockstar Social Club / This is why I despise cyclists
But again
beers.
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
Alright, so yeah. Elizabeth is the one responsible for bringing Jack to Rapture and saving the little sisters. She explicitly chooses to die and give Atlas(Fontaine) the activation code for Jack's brainwashing, which causes Jack to come down and play out all the events in Bioshock exactly how they were played out already without thousands of different realities from happening.
The only things that didn't read very well to me and confused the fuck out of me in the first place were A) The scene in the airplane where it cycles through all the Elizabeths in the mirror, B ) The other shot on the airplane that shows Jack killing some (what looked like) random woman, unless she was important and I don't remember or didn't catch it, and C) The cross-fade scene of Jack reaching for the little sisters out of the bathysphere to Elizabeth reaching for the little sister's hand when she died.
A) was done to show that this happens in all realities of Elizabeth, B ) is to show that Jack is the one that caused the plane to crash in the first place in Bioshock 1, and C) is to show that Elizabeth is what causes Jack to even come down to Rapture and save the little sisters in the first place.
Either way...
DLC1 took me about 2-2 1/2 hours. Where DLC2 took me about 4 hours.
My least favorite parts of the DLC?
jaysus
xbl - HowYouGetAnts
steam - WeAreAllGeth
105 4k Screens. In case you couldn't get enough.
See you guys in a couple of days, because those spoilers are calling out to me with a siren's song, and my will is growing weak.
Okay, I'm walking dangerously here with spoilers but I'm also 10 minutes in and I think I can answer some of your questions. No one click unless....let's say unless you have a weapon yet.
The Luteci refer to her as a Superposition - think Quantum Superposition. She exists partly in all theoretical states, all the alternate places and times, unless she does something which breaks that. Basically, she exists "outside" of Time in the typical sense, the same way the Luteci do. Now, think Doctor Who logic - Doctor Who cannot cross his own timeline (except for when he does, but there are consequences). Similarly, Elizabeth cannot be where she already is without consequences. In this case, she goes someplace she knows she has died in another self. By doing so, this causes her quantum superstate to collapse into a single position, known and fixed - this is now the ONLY Elizabeth. She no longer has access to the memories of all her other lives (or maybe does because Booker), she no longer can see into other realities/times and jump there at will, she is just a flesh and blood woman.
It's not a trainwreck of logic so much as "normal" logic for time travel stories. It makes sense if you look at it cross-ways, but think about it too much, too hard, and you'll start to see flaws" Primer is the only time travel story I can think of that doesn't fall into this hole, with the notable caveat that "the actual story, aside from the time travel mechanics, sucks" is not to be considered a flaw in the sense I mean. :P
e: Thought of a slightly cleaner way to explain this, I think.
Elizabeth, like the Lutece Twins, exists outside time. Every decision she makes causes branching parallel timelines (just like everyone else, mind you), but because she exists "outside" time, she retains memories of all possible outcomes. She decides not to eat a pie? She can still remember what the pie tasted like even when she chose not to have it.
In the timeline of Ep 1, the her which was so incensed from the memory of having her head chopped off when she was a child goes and causes the events which we see in Ep 1. Then she dies. That is a terminus of one of the paths, but it does not prevent the other paths from having occurred. However, one of the other hers feels remorse from that memory and decides to go back and make it right. So she has the Lutece twins take her to Rapture (because she can't go there herself, presumably because that would be crossing the old timeline but more likely because it's a great excuse to have the Lutece twins again) with the foreknowledge that, by observing herself, it would "fix" the point at which she exists - she would no longer be in a quantum superposition, but rather in a fixed, observed position.
So she finds her dead body, that happens, and the waveform that is her collapses into this single Elizabeth. No more multiple parallel hers who share memories (although hypothetically those decisions could also have been made, but they should ALSO be fixed positions and without powers now), but just the individual.
Like I said. It makes a certain amount of internal logic, but if you're going to cry foul over "man, this story is great except the scientific mechanics of the parallel earth/time travel is just wonky," I think you might be thinking about it a little too hard.
So if you have no problem with that in the base game, I don't think you're gonna mind it in the DLCs either. It's hard to recommend one over the other since you'll have to play both to get the story experience, but Episode 2 was better than Episode 1.
If the whole premise of the story - time- and dimension-travelling - do whatever they want and don't make any sense, what's the reason to resort to them in the first place?
The whole Bioshock Infinte might as well be some kind of magical multiverse where anything goes. Hell, half the time it does.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
Yeah I'm completely fucking sick of the writing at this point, Levine is terrible. This is like some high school fanfic or something. Just give me something real, not all this nonsense that tries so hard to be clever without actually being so. Christopher Nolan and the Wachowski's know how to do this kind of thing and quickly get to meaty and genuine conflicts, Levine and his writers don't. It's like they took an idea that sucks and makes emotional beats insignificant in the first place, and then overthought and overworked it because... look at us guys were so clever.
- Stealth. The stealth system, with now powers, isn't that great, but they had exactly the right idea: Give you powers to make it faster and more fun. This proves the point that something doesn't have to be hard or challenging to be enjoyable. Well done!
- Graphics. Pretty much everything looked fantastic, especially the opening.
- The backstory on Columbia. I like the setting of Columbia. More backstory, especially when presented well without being forced on you.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird