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Where is [U.S. Politics] going?

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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    fyi the propensity to believe that governments are households that must tighten their belts in recessions is an instinct that predates Taylorism

    the arguments put forth during US panic of 1819 would be familiar to us today

    ronya on
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    Ethan SmithEthan Smith Origin name: Beart4to Arlington, VARegistered User regular
    Yeah it has its roots going back to classical economics my concern is more with the new economic justification for authoritarianism that's been popping up here and there the past couple of years.

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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    Yeah it has its roots going back to classical economics my concern is more with the new economic justification for authoritarianism that's been popping up here and there the past couple of years.

    erm

    disquiet over the hierarchical nature of the workplace has been a thing since the industrial revolution in the 1700s. From the right, too, even, because it was an unholy place that gave no respect to God and family, and encouraged the immorality of the urban slum, and enabled a new and ambitious class of rentiers with no respect for gentry.

    you are hardly the first person to argue that workplaces should be democratic. We already know what an economy of worked-owned cooperatives looks like, even: they look like conglomerates, with a mass of businesses constellated around an investment bank that jointly manages the worker's pensions. Mondragon still operates along this line, today. They're not functionally very different from conglomerates, because smaller businesses all die to the vagaries of chance and technological change eventually, so diversification and size is essential. And diversification and size directly contradicts any desire to give small units of the workplace any feeling of autonomy: it winds up feeling very much like national elections, where established factions with their established electoral campaigns tend to dominate the direction of the whole community.

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    Ethan SmithEthan Smith Origin name: Beart4to Arlington, VARegistered User regular
    ronya wrote: »
    Yeah it has its roots going back to classical economics my concern is more with the new economic justification for authoritarianism that's been popping up here and there the past couple of years.

    erm

    disquiet over the hierarchical nature of the workplace has been a thing since the industrial revolution in the 1700s. From the right, too, even, because it was an unholy place that gave no respect to God and family, and encouraged the immorality of the urban slum, and enabled a new and ambitious class of rentiers with no respect for gentry.

    Not arguing that it hasn't?
    you are hardly the first person to argue that workplaces should be democratic. We already know what an economy of worked-owned cooperatives looks like, even: they look like conglomerates, with a mass of businesses constellated around an investment bank that jointly manages the worker's pensions. Mondragon still operates along this line, today. They're not functionally very different from conglomerates, because smaller businesses all die to the vagaries of chance and technological change eventually, so diversification and size is essential. And diversification and size directly contradicts any desire to give small units of the workplace any feeling of autonomy: it winds up feeling very much like national elections, where established factions with their established electoral campaigns tend to dominate the direction of the whole community.

    We also see forms of democracy in Germany's betriebsrats which are doing fairly well. I'll have to look Mondragon up though, thanks for that tip.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    ronya wrote: »
    fyi the propensity to believe that governments are households that must tighten their belts in recessions is an instinct that predates Taylorism

    the arguments put forth during US panic of 1819 would be familiar to us today

    And Mellon still deserves dick punching.

    It seems that the outing of the fraud of the R&R paper has compromised the austerity movement, though.

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    chrisnlchrisnl Registered User regular
    ronya wrote: »
    fyi the propensity to believe that governments are households that must tighten their belts in recessions is an instinct that predates Taylorism

    the arguments put forth during US panic of 1819 would be familiar to us today

    And Mellon still deserves dick punching.

    It seems that the outing of the fraud of the R&R paper has compromised the austerity movement, though.

    As much as I dearly hope this is true, I remain skeptical. I must be a liberal, because I'm also apparently a pessimist.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    AbsalonAbsalon Lands of Always WinterRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    And in "We got one too-ism gone mad", we have Ted Cruz being touted as a 2016 contender. Wasn't he born in Canada?!

    Edit: I could have sworn that was relevant. I'm sorry - it's where his birth certificate is registered that matters, I got things messed up.

    Absalon on
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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Absalon wrote: »
    And in "We got one too-ism gone mad", we have Ted Cruz being touted as a 2016 contender. Wasn't he born in Canada?!

    Why does that matter?

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    LilnoobsLilnoobs Alpha Queue Registered User regular
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »
    And in "We got one too-ism gone mad", we have Ted Cruz being touted as a 2016 contender. Wasn't he born in Canada?!

    Why does that matter?

    Well, if he's referring to the presidency, the president has to be a born citizen of the US.

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    SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Lilnoobs wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »
    And in "We got one too-ism gone mad", we have Ted Cruz being touted as a 2016 contender. Wasn't he born in Canada?!

    Why does that matter?

    Well, if he's referring to the presidency, the president has to be a born citizen of the US.

    pfft and? He's not black, that's all that matters

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    Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

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    silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    edited May 2013
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u4pB5_0AUVk

    E: The preview image is actually perfect.

    silence1186 on
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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Maybe...they're hedging against the possibility that in 2015, the Xnarthren will finally arrive and enslave us all?

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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
    SammyF wrote: »
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Maybe...they're hedging against the possibility that in 2015, the Xnarthren will finally arrive and enslave us all?
    I think there's a non-trivial who think the first revolution is not necessary, but the second revolution to overthrow the excessive first revolutionary regime is necessary

    11793-1.png
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    QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
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    TaramoorTaramoor Storyteller Registered User regular
    New GOP Bill.

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-113hr1638ih/pdf/BILLS-113hr1638ih.pdf

    Problem: Unemployment numbers look too good for the President

    Solution: Stop collecting unemployment numbers. In fact, let's stop census taking altogether except for the decennial one.

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    TwoQuestionsTwoQuestions Registered User regular
    Taramoor wrote: »
    New GOP Bill.

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-113hr1638ih/pdf/BILLS-113hr1638ih.pdf

    Problem: Unemployment numbers look too good for the President

    Solution: Stop collecting unemployment numbers. In fact, let's stop census taking altogether except for the decennial one.

    Don't our capitalist overlords need those numbers? This will go exactly nowhere.

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    SammyFSammyF Registered User regular
    PantsB wrote: »
    SammyF wrote: »
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Maybe...they're hedging against the possibility that in 2015, the Xnarthren will finally arrive and enslave us all?
    I think there's a non-trivial who think the first revolution is not necessary, but the second revolution to overthrow the excessive first revolutionary regime is necessary

    Huh.

    Now that I've read that sentence a couple of times, I think I might be inclined to agree with those people.

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    TaramoorTaramoor Storyteller Registered User regular
    Taramoor wrote: »
    New GOP Bill.

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-113hr1638ih/pdf/BILLS-113hr1638ih.pdf

    Problem: Unemployment numbers look too good for the President

    Solution: Stop collecting unemployment numbers. In fact, let's stop census taking altogether except for the decennial one.

    Don't our capitalist overlords need those numbers? This will go exactly nowhere.

    It would also hose gerrymandering.

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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
    SammyF wrote: »
    PantsB wrote: »
    SammyF wrote: »
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Maybe...they're hedging against the possibility that in 2015, the Xnarthren will finally arrive and enslave us all?
    I think there's a non-trivial who think the first revolution is not necessary, but the second revolution to overthrow the excessive first revolutionary regime is necessary

    Huh.

    Now that I've read that sentence a couple of times, I think I might be inclined to agree with those people.

    I left out "number." So it was like the Paul Ryan budget of posts.

    11793-1.png
    day9gosu.png
    QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Taramoor wrote: »
    New GOP Bill.

    http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/pkg/BILLS-113hr1638ih/pdf/BILLS-113hr1638ih.pdf

    Problem: Unemployment numbers look too good for the President

    Solution: Stop collecting unemployment numbers. In fact, let's stop census taking altogether except for the decennial one.

    It's less "Boo Obama!" and more anti-government, anti-census nuttery.

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    Salvation122Salvation122 Registered User regular
    PantsB wrote: »
    SammyF wrote: »
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Maybe...they're hedging against the possibility that in 2015, the Xnarthren will finally arrive and enslave us all?
    I think there's a non-trivial who think the first revolution is not necessary, but the second revolution to overthrow the excessive first revolutionary regime is necessary

    So, France, then

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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    The Republicans are taking notes from the Conservatives now

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    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Your depressing poll result of the day: a plurality of Republicans see armed revolt as necessary.

    I don't understand how "neither agree nor disagree" is an acceptable response to the statement "In the next few years, an armed revolution might be necessary in order to protect our liberties."

    Like, perhaps they should recode that as "Too stupid to breathe without being reminded."

    Its an option for those who agree but are too chickshit to admit it.

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    CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    My mom wants my opinion on this.
    http://www.ijreview.com/2013/04/48974-brutal-judge-jeanines-slapdown-of-jihadi-bomber-mother/

    I don't know what to tell her other than FOX is not news.

    3DS Friendcode 5413-1311-3767
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