I should mention that 399.99 price was in Euros , which I believe is comparable to USD.
Which also means it'll be 1100 bucks in Australia or something.
399(EUR) would be over 500(USD).
However, I'm not sure that we can draw any meaningful conclusions from Indian pricing, as the PS3 was priced significantly higher in that region at launch.
Yah Euro's most certainly do not equal dollars. But in crazy land (in which all manufacturers live) they usually do.
There I was, 3DS: 2621-2671-9899 (Ekera), Wii U: LostCrescendo
500 bucks for bleeding edge tech isn't that outrageous to me. Something like the WiiU deluxe price is actually more offensive to my consumer sensibilities.
500 is about what I expect to pay and isn't really a lot of money to me anymore.
You might be in the minority then. Spending half a grand on a video game console seems a bit outrageous to me. I could drop that money into my computer and get myself a top of the line graphics card and be set for quite a while.
But... To each their own, of course.
Or you could spend $250 to get a high end last-gen card and then do the same thing 2 years later and be set for even longer
I should mention that 399.99 price was in Euros , which I believe is comparable to USD.
Which also means it'll be 1100 bucks in Australia or something.
399(EUR) would be over 500(USD).
However, I'm not sure that we can draw any meaningful conclusions from Indian pricing, as the PS3 was priced significantly higher in that region at launch.
Unfortunately, they often price shit like that, US$99 = EU$99
And golly, the issue is not whether WE'RE willing to pay this or that amount for a 720 or a PS4. The issue is whether the MARKET is willing. That's the whole point.
I could make an argument that both the Tablet and the Kinect 2.0 are integral to the system and just because people don't want them now doesn't mean they won't want them after they've used them.
The problem is that the original Kinect was NOT integral to the system and was severely underpowered from its original specs. A full-powered, improved resolution Kinect 2.0 will be damned awesome, assuming people take the time to tailor their PS3/PC games to use it. But it does add $150 to the cost.
And because Microsoft needs to put their best foot forward with regards to the K2, I'm expecting it to be part of the design spec that every game must use it in some way.
And is why I'm going to go with the PS4 (on top of the fact that I absolutely hate* XBL).
Was there more to this, or...?
0
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I could make an argument that both the Tablet and the Kinect 2.0 are integral to the system and just because people don't want them now doesn't mean they won't want them after they've used them.
The problem is that the original Kinect was NOT integral to the system and was severely underpowered from its original specs. A full-powered, improved resolution Kinect 2.0 will be damned awesome, assuming people take the time to tailor their PS3/PC games to use it. But it does add $150 to the cost.
And because Microsoft needs to put their best foot forward with regards to the K2, I'm expecting it to be part of the design spec that every game must use it in some way.
And is why I'm going to go with the PS4 (on top of the fact that I absolutely hate* XBL).
Was there more to this, or...?
Guessing because they charge for it (and yet it's still bloated with ads)
I could make an argument that both the Tablet and the Kinect 2.0 are integral to the system and just because people don't want them now doesn't mean they won't want them after they've used them.
The problem is that the original Kinect was NOT integral to the system and was severely underpowered from its original specs. A full-powered, improved resolution Kinect 2.0 will be damned awesome, assuming people take the time to tailor their PS3/PC games to use it. But it does add $150 to the cost.
And because Microsoft needs to put their best foot forward with regards to the K2, I'm expecting it to be part of the design spec that every game must use it in some way.
There is no way they can require it. They would alienate too much of their audience. This applies to the PS4 and the PS Eye as well. Include it in the box if you must, have functionality for it in every game, sure. But the moment you REQUIRE it you just lost every person who plays in a bedroom or dorm room. Not to mention every single owner of a projector.
To me, this is the only thing that's a flat out deal breaker for a new system. I'm in for day one purchases but if you require me to use a Kinect/PS Eye I'm out. My setup just doesn't allow for it.
500 bucks for bleeding edge tech isn't that outrageous to me. Something like the WiiU deluxe price is actually more offensive to my consumer sensibilities.
500 is about what I expect to pay and isn't really a lot of money to me anymore.
You might be in the minority then. Spending half a grand on a video game console seems a bit outrageous to me. I could drop that money into my computer and get myself a top of the line graphics card and be set for quite a while.
But... To each their own, of course.
Or you could spend $250 to get a high end last-gen card and then do the same thing 2 years later and be set for even longer
Yeah I know. I was just trying to make a point... Jeeze @Phyphor!
I could make an argument that both the Tablet and the Kinect 2.0 are integral to the system and just because people don't want them now doesn't mean they won't want them after they've used them.
The problem is that the original Kinect was NOT integral to the system and was severely underpowered from its original specs. A full-powered, improved resolution Kinect 2.0 will be damned awesome, assuming people take the time to tailor their PS3/PC games to use it. But it does add $150 to the cost.
And because Microsoft needs to put their best foot forward with regards to the K2, I'm expecting it to be part of the design spec that every game must use it in some way.
And is why I'm going to go with the PS4 (on top of the fact that I absolutely hate* XBL).
Was there more to this, or...?
I had quite a few annoyances with XBL. I put the * there because I forgot the word and had to edit my post
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
That strikes me as a wholly misleading comparison. Microsoft took the original Xbox off the market altogether at the 5-year mark, and it seems pointless to compare the PS2's sales in 2006/2007 when it wasn't the flagship console on the market with the sales of the 360 and PS3 in 2011/2012 when they were the leading consoles.
0
HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
Well, I meant because he had the asterisk there. Seemed like he meant to follow up with details.
Man... 22 hours to go. I border between excitement and indifference.
This is myself as well. There are many announcements they might make that would make me extremely excited about the new console. Then there are a bunch of announcements they may make that would make me completely indifferent to the console. I'm probably leaning on indifferent currently just due to probable cost of the new console will push it out of purchase for a year or so, but they could still win me back. So excited to see what they do announce.
I've been saying $500 all along. Kinect 2.0 gonna be expensive, yo.
This is my major rage right now - if you add to the cost, it better damn well be something that your customers demand as a basic feature, not some bullshit part of your larger corporate 'strategy' that tags an extra Benjamin onto your launch price.
You see it with the Wii with that stupid tablet. You see it with Durango with the (presumed) stupid Kinect 2.0. GTFO here with that useless expensive crap no one wants - if the marlet doesnt want it trying to make hem pay for it just inflates the cost of the devide and kills your sales.
I'd probably buy a WiiU for $200 - which is what the basic would cost without that stupid tablet. I'd buy a 720 for $350 - which is about what it'd cost without that stupid Kinect if the rumors are true. Instead I'll buy neither and your analysts will moan about how the next gen is dying. Well sure it is, you drowned it in the bathtub with these stupid extra costs creating a barrier to entry.
I don't think you understand that the tablet is actually the entire point of the WiiU. It's not a peripheral, it's the core concept of the system that games are intended to be designed around.
No, I understand perfectly. I just don't particularly care, and judging by the consumer response I'm not alone. That's the problem: at a basic level, consumers looking to buy a console want to playgames on it. If you assume more than that (they want to play unique tablet games! They want motion control! They want 3D! They want it to make them a sandwich!) and you're wrong you've just added to the cost of your system for no reason.
I've said it before and ill ask again: how much would it cost to put together a bare minimum system that will easily accept ports of major 'next gen' games, with no bullshiy and no specs above that minimum? Because if it is ~$300, which I think is totally possible in my utterly uninformed mind, and Sony and MS and Nintendo aren't offering it for less than $500, someone else is missing out in a PS1 level cash explosion by not making it.
My launch 360 burned out on me about two years ago, but my launch Dreamcast is still chugging along. Everytime it reads from a disc or starts to load a level, the movement of the lens sounds like a car has just crashed through the wall and into my living room. That said, I don't fault Microsoft for a shoddy product, I beat the crap out of that 360 and it really was quite robust.
My Dreamcast does the same thing. I think my roommates PS3 makes even more terrifying noises though, and it's brand new. They really just do not make'em like they used to.
The way they used to make them was cartridges with solid-state storage; until disc media took over as the defacto standard due to it's cheap price and larger storage sizes.
What I'm saying is I miss cartridges. Simple, silent.
Given how absurdly cheap solid state media has gotten I'm kind of surprised we haven't seen a return to cartridges discussed.
You can get a 16GB USB 3.0 memory stick for like $20, retail. That probably boils down to maybe $3 without markup. Granted, that's an order of magnitude more expensive than discs, but it's also far faster and more secure if you use some kind of proprietary connector.
I'm sure there's a market for a leaner no frills machine with equal specs, the problem is that the market's future is so uncertain that no one really wants to throw their hat in the ring. This is really why they add all this crap to the console, to shore up their bets and make sure they have a little bit of everything so they can have more things to sell it with. You have your streaming device, your blu ray, your web access, your game streaming, video chat, and all round media command center. You can't really bring anything to market now that you can say 'it just plays' games because you'll be drowned out in ads saying how your device doesn't "do" anything.
I think Samsung would be a good competitor to the current market with just a bare bones machine.
My launch 360 burned out on me about two years ago, but my launch Dreamcast is still chugging along. Everytime it reads from a disc or starts to load a level, the movement of the lens sounds like a car has just crashed through the wall and into my living room. That said, I don't fault Microsoft for a shoddy product, I beat the crap out of that 360 and it really was quite robust.
My Dreamcast does the same thing. I think my roommates PS3 makes even more terrifying noises though, and it's brand new. They really just do not make'em like they used to.
The way they used to make them was cartridges with solid-state storage; until disc media took over as the defacto standard due to it's cheap price and larger storage sizes.
What I'm saying is I miss cartridges. Simple, silent.
Given how absurdly cheap solid state media has gotten I'm kind of surprised we haven't seen a return to cartridges discussed.
You can get a 16GB USB 3.0 memory stick for like $20, retail. That probably boils down to maybe $3 without markup. Granted, that's an order of magnitude more expensive than discs, but it's also far faster and more secure if you use some kind of proprietary connector.
I agree with you, and I think we're going to move that way at some point, but not this generation (obviously). After all, you can put up to 50GB of resources on a blu-ray disc and at this point it probably costs manufacturers around $0.10 per disc. A 64GB flash drive is still relatively expensive, and to be fair, developers have been figuring out a lot of interesting ways to do away with loading screens. If all systems have a hard drive and allow key assets/engine elements to be loaded to that hard drive, there's not much of a financial reason to switch "back to cartridge."
Most games on the PS3 are between 6-12GB compressed, at least according to the download size on the PSN, and part of the installation process for these games is uncompressing them back to their full size. So, the flash drives would have to accommodate the full, uncompressed sizes, so it would be a bit spendy considering the next gen is going to have higher-resolution resources.
However, I am looking forward to a point where they're as cheap as discs, for the heat and noise reasons. My PS3 gets pretty warm in my apartment and when the fan kicks on (which it always does), it's on the loud side.
It’s financial bragging time, when the industry’s big publishers wave around their massive accounts, trying to outdo each other with displays of fiscal acuity. Or not, as the case has increasingly been this year. Still, thanks to Bioshock Infinite, Take-Two saw a strong fourth quarter, shipping 3.7 million units of the Irrational sequel, and enjoying first month sales which they say “significantly” outperformed any previous Bioshock game.
Would SSDs be viable in a console? Those things have a pretty low "get bricked" bar.
Are they even financially viable at this point yet? I mean they've really come down in price in the last few years, but something like 250 gigs, you're still looking at around $150-ish on a good sale. And I'd qualify that amount of space somewhere on the "low" end of the scale. I thought 150 gigs was more than plenty on my PS3 a few years ago, but thanks to the likes of Plus, I'm seriously starting to feel the pinch.
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
Would SSDs be viable in a console? Those things have a pretty low "get bricked" bar.
Are they even financially viable at this point yet? I mean they've really come down in price in the last few years, but something like 250 gigs, you're still looking at around $150-ish on a good sale. And I'd qualify that amount of space somewhere on the "low" end of the scale. I thought 150 gigs was more than plenty on my PS3 a few years ago, but thanks to the likes of Plus, I'm seriously starting to feel the pinch.
Sell them as attachments. They don't have to be that big, just have to budget the space. No one is going to play all 250g worth of games they have installed, just swap stuff out as you're playing.
As far as Kinect 2.0 goes, this is my opinion on it.
If dev's can't be arsed enough to think of clever uses for the Wii U tablet, what makes anyone think they will for the Kinect?
Well if Sony also decides to package their camera with the Playstation 4, it may be worth the while of developers to add camera features to their multiplat games.
0
Dr_KeenbeanDumb as a buttPlanet Express ShipRegistered Userregular
2006 me could never have foreseen that I would be super excited about PS4 and not give 2 shits about the new xbox or that I would let my near-10-year-strong Live account lapse in favor of PS+.
As far as Kinect 2.0 goes, this is my opinion on it.
If dev's can't be arsed enough to think of clever uses for the Wii U tablet, what makes anyone think they will for the Kinect?
Well if Sony also decides to package their camera with the Playstation 4, it may be worth the while of developers to add camera features to their multiplat games.
Man, maybe it's just me, but I really, really, really don't want to see what other people look like while playing multiplayer games... Or, you know, have an integrated version of Chat Roulette. (and all that implies :P)
As far as Kinect 2.0 goes, this is my opinion on it.
If dev's can't be arsed enough to think of clever uses for the Wii U tablet, what makes anyone think they will for the Kinect?
Well if Sony also decides to package their camera with the Playstation 4, it may be worth the while of developers to add camera features to their multiplat games.
Man, maybe it's just me, but I really, really, really don't want to see what other people look like while playing multiplayer games... Or, you know, have an integrated version of Chat Roulette. (and all that implies :P)
Hopefully it has built in pixelation.
Nintendo Console Codes
Switch (JeffConser): SW-3353-5433-5137 Wii U: Skeldare - 3DS: 1848-1663-9345
PM Me if you add me!
2006 me could never have foreseen that I would be super excited about PS4 and not give 2 shits about the new xbox or that I would let my near-10-year-strong Live account lapse in favor of PS+.
Are these the end times?
I'm the same boat. I went from PS1 to PS2 to 360 (with some brief dips into DS and Wii) and after my console red ringed, I got super into PC gaming and Steam which has been my primary gaming method for the past few years.
Now I own a Vita and a PS3 (with PS+) as well, and I am looking to the PS4 for later down the road. It's been kind of nice to get into a console at the tail end of a generation, nab games for super cheap and catch up on stuff I missed. However, I never thought I'd be using Sony consoles again.
I'm super interested in what Microsoft is going to do but, I don't think I'll hop back on the Xbox wagon. Though, 6 years from now that could be very different.
It’s financial bragging time, when the industry’s big publishers wave around their massive accounts, trying to outdo each other with displays of fiscal acuity. Or not, as the case has increasingly been this year. Still, thanks to Bioshock Infinite, Take-Two saw a strong fourth quarter, shipping 3.7 million units of the Irrational sequel, and enjoying first month sales which they say “significantly” outperformed any previous Bioshock game.
It has, but there is a bit of spin to that. Bioshock, on one platform, sold 490,900 units in its first month. Bioshock 2 did 753,400 on two platforms. Bioshock Infinite did 878,000 on three. Since the first two don't include PC retail sales, it feels like a wash to me. None of them include digital sales which could be significant in Bioshock Infinite's case, but without hard numbers it's just speculation. Considering they are touting the units shipped figure, they might be trying to paint a rosy picture.
all of the misguided musings on the last few pages about the launch price of consoles are missing a vital factor: inflation.
Here are some console launch prices very crudely adjusted for inflation. This is in USD and is based on the US launch date.
NES: $432.21
GENESIS: $356.30
SNES: $341.46
Saturn: $627.61
Playstation 1: $470.71
Dreamcast: $279.15
Playstation 2: $405.11
XBox 1: $394.12
Xbox 360: $357.19 / $476.25
PS3: $576.71 / $692.06
Based on Sony's deeply fucked financial situation, I am expecting a minimum $500 price tag for their basic SKU. And I would not be at all surprised by $600. The PS3 premium SKU beat out even the Saturn for inflation adjusted launch price and the company is certainly not in any stronger of a financial situation now.
As for the next xbox, I have no idea. I think $350/$400 is most likely but they have the cash on hand to set the price basically wherever the hell they want and losses be damned.
Underpowered with performance and undelivered with software, Nintendo Wii U just cannot become popular. According to recent figures from market analysts, the Wii U remains an underdog on the U.S. market with monthly sales barely crossing the 50 thousand per month milestone. Microsoft Xbox 360 remains the top-selling game system among those available today.
Based on the data from NPD Group, a market tracking company, and Michael Pachter, an analyst with Wedbush Securities, sales of Nintendo Wii U console in April got lower compared to March and February. According to Mr. Pachter, Nintendo sold through 55 thousand of Wii U units in April. Keeping in mind that Microsoft sold only 130 thousand of Xbox 360 – which was the highest amount among all consoles sold in April – actual sales of Wii U could be even lower and Mr. Pachter could seem overoptimistic.
Nintendo Wii U’s market performance suffers because of several factors: its low performance, incoming consoles from major rivals, relatively high price amid lack of games, including those that actually take advantage of Nintendo Wii U’s controller with built-in screen.
As of March 31, the Wii U has sold 3.45 million units since its launch, below Nintendo's initial forecast of 5.5 million, and even January's adjustment to 4 million, reports Joystiq web-site.
Posts
Yah Euro's most certainly do not equal dollars. But in crazy land (in which all manufacturers live) they usually do.
Or you could spend $250 to get a high end last-gen card and then do the same thing 2 years later and be set for even longer
Unfortunately, they often price shit like that, US$99 = EU$99
And golly, the issue is not whether WE'RE willing to pay this or that amount for a 720 or a PS4. The issue is whether the MARKET is willing. That's the whole point.
Was there more to this, or...?
Guessing because they charge for it (and yet it's still bloated with ads)
There is no way they can require it. They would alienate too much of their audience. This applies to the PS4 and the PS Eye as well. Include it in the box if you must, have functionality for it in every game, sure. But the moment you REQUIRE it you just lost every person who plays in a bedroom or dorm room. Not to mention every single owner of a projector.
To me, this is the only thing that's a flat out deal breaker for a new system. I'm in for day one purchases but if you require me to use a Kinect/PS Eye I'm out. My setup just doesn't allow for it.
Yeah I know.
I had quite a few annoyances with XBL. I put the * there because I forgot the word and had to edit my post
http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/192546/Markets_ready_for_new_consoles_but_oldgen_surprisingly_viable.php
Man... 22 hours to go. I border between excitement and indifference.
That strikes me as a wholly misleading comparison. Microsoft took the original Xbox off the market altogether at the 5-year mark, and it seems pointless to compare the PS2's sales in 2006/2007 when it wasn't the flagship console on the market with the sales of the 360 and PS3 in 2011/2012 when they were the leading consoles.
This is myself as well. There are many announcements they might make that would make me extremely excited about the new console. Then there are a bunch of announcements they may make that would make me completely indifferent to the console. I'm probably leaning on indifferent currently just due to probable cost of the new console will push it out of purchase for a year or so, but they could still win me back. So excited to see what they do announce.
I've said it before and ill ask again: how much would it cost to put together a bare minimum system that will easily accept ports of major 'next gen' games, with no bullshiy and no specs above that minimum? Because if it is ~$300, which I think is totally possible in my utterly uninformed mind, and Sony and MS and Nintendo aren't offering it for less than $500, someone else is missing out in a PS1 level cash explosion by not making it.
Given how absurdly cheap solid state media has gotten I'm kind of surprised we haven't seen a return to cartridges discussed.
You can get a 16GB USB 3.0 memory stick for like $20, retail. That probably boils down to maybe $3 without markup. Granted, that's an order of magnitude more expensive than discs, but it's also far faster and more secure if you use some kind of proprietary connector.
I think Samsung would be a good competitor to the current market with just a bare bones machine.
If dev's can't be arsed enough to think of clever uses for the Wii U tablet, what makes anyone think they will for the Kinect?
I agree with you, and I think we're going to move that way at some point, but not this generation (obviously). After all, you can put up to 50GB of resources on a blu-ray disc and at this point it probably costs manufacturers around $0.10 per disc. A 64GB flash drive is still relatively expensive, and to be fair, developers have been figuring out a lot of interesting ways to do away with loading screens. If all systems have a hard drive and allow key assets/engine elements to be loaded to that hard drive, there's not much of a financial reason to switch "back to cartridge."
Most games on the PS3 are between 6-12GB compressed, at least according to the download size on the PSN, and part of the installation process for these games is uncompressing them back to their full size. So, the flash drives would have to accommodate the full, uncompressed sizes, so it would be a bit spendy considering the next gen is going to have higher-resolution resources.
However, I am looking forward to a point where they're as cheap as discs, for the heat and noise reasons. My PS3 gets pretty warm in my apartment and when the fan kicks on (which it always does), it's on the loud side.
Steam: BrocksMullet http://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561197972421669/
As opposed to many much thinner sheets of magnetic metal?
Because Kinect 2.0 is for an actual next gen system! 8->
Even that is old hat. SSDs are the thing up all ins.
I've been using the same one since about 2009, no problems at all
The 8GB/32GB flash memory inside of the Wii U SKUs are both basically SSDs.
Are they even financially viable at this point yet? I mean they've really come down in price in the last few years, but something like 250 gigs, you're still looking at around $150-ish on a good sale. And I'd qualify that amount of space somewhere on the "low" end of the scale. I thought 150 gigs was more than plenty on my PS3 a few years ago, but thanks to the likes of Plus, I'm seriously starting to feel the pinch.
Sell them as attachments. They don't have to be that big, just have to budget the space. No one is going to play all 250g worth of games they have installed, just swap stuff out as you're playing.
Well if Sony also decides to package their camera with the Playstation 4, it may be worth the while of developers to add camera features to their multiplat games.
Are these the end times?
3DS: 1650-8480-6786
Switch: SW-0653-8208-4705
Man, maybe it's just me, but I really, really, really don't want to see what other people look like while playing multiplayer games... Or, you know, have an integrated version of Chat Roulette. (and all that implies :P)
Hopefully it has built in pixelation.
Switch (JeffConser): SW-3353-5433-5137 Wii U: Skeldare - 3DS: 1848-1663-9345
PM Me if you add me!
I'm the same boat. I went from PS1 to PS2 to 360 (with some brief dips into DS and Wii) and after my console red ringed, I got super into PC gaming and Steam which has been my primary gaming method for the past few years.
Now I own a Vita and a PS3 (with PS+) as well, and I am looking to the PS4 for later down the road. It's been kind of nice to get into a console at the tail end of a generation, nab games for super cheap and catch up on stuff I missed. However, I never thought I'd be using Sony consoles again.
I'm super interested in what Microsoft is going to do but, I don't think I'll hop back on the Xbox wagon. Though, 6 years from now that could be very different.
Steam: abunchofdaftpunk | PSN: noautomobilesgo | Lastfm: sjchszeppelin | Backloggery: colincummings | 3DS FC: 1392-6019-0219 |
It has, but there is a bit of spin to that. Bioshock, on one platform, sold 490,900 units in its first month. Bioshock 2 did 753,400 on two platforms. Bioshock Infinite did 878,000 on three. Since the first two don't include PC retail sales, it feels like a wash to me. None of them include digital sales which could be significant in Bioshock Infinite's case, but without hard numbers it's just speculation. Considering they are touting the units shipped figure, they might be trying to paint a rosy picture.
Here are some console launch prices very crudely adjusted for inflation. This is in USD and is based on the US launch date.
NES: $432.21
GENESIS: $356.30
SNES: $341.46
Saturn: $627.61
Playstation 1: $470.71
Dreamcast: $279.15
Playstation 2: $405.11
XBox 1: $394.12
Xbox 360: $357.19 / $476.25
PS3: $576.71 / $692.06
Based on Sony's deeply fucked financial situation, I am expecting a minimum $500 price tag for their basic SKU. And I would not be at all surprised by $600. The PS3 premium SKU beat out even the Saturn for inflation adjusted launch price and the company is certainly not in any stronger of a financial situation now.
As for the next xbox, I have no idea. I think $350/$400 is most likely but they have the cash on hand to set the price basically wherever the hell they want and losses be damned.
OTOH, MS is all about that fucking "trojan in your living room"... And leveraging Windows 8 and all kinds of secondary shit.
Of course, the interesting thing is going to be how the market reacts to that.
Sales of Nintendo Wii U Hit Another Low in the U.S.
Switch (JeffConser): SW-3353-5433-5137 Wii U: Skeldare - 3DS: 1848-1663-9345
PM Me if you add me!