They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
"No counterplay" is just a nonsense phrase. It's a lie, for one. You can substantially reduce his damage by correct play with many champs. And for two, broad stroke terms like that could be applied to any number of other champs or situations.
I've played against top lane Yorick myself on various champions. It's not that bad.
Jungling against Nunu isn't bad, either.
Its not fun.
There is a world of difference.
Laning against Jayce isn't 'bad', neither is Nidalee. neither is a Draven/Janna lane, honestly. It's just not fun.
In the end, Riot worries a lot about what is fun in the game, because people don't enjoy the game if it isn't fun. Surprising.
I'm not sure that you can claim that laning against said champions is objectively or universally regarded as unfun. I also have trouble seeing how Yorick can be boring/unfun for not just your lane opponent but also the rest of the players in the game. That doesn't even really make sense.
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
"No counterplay" is just a nonsense phrase. It's a lie, for one. You can substantially reduce his damage by correct play with many champs. And for two, broad stroke terms like that could be applied to any number of other champs or situations.
I think its a fair phrase, its just used badly. Making sure champions are fun to play against is important.
0
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
I've played against top lane Yorick myself on various champions. It's not that bad.
Jungling against Nunu isn't bad, either.
Its not fun.
There is a world of difference.
Laning against Jayce isn't 'bad', neither is Nidalee. neither is a Draven/Janna lane, honestly. It's just not fun.
In the end, Riot worries a lot about what is fun in the game, because people don't enjoy the game if it isn't fun. Surprising.
I'm not sure that you can claim that laning against said champions is objectively or universally regarded as unfun. I also have trouble seeing how Yorick can be boring/unfun for not just your lane opponent but also the rest of the players in the game. That doesn't even really make sense.
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
"No counterplay" is just a nonsense phrase. It's a lie, for one. You can substantially reduce his damage by correct play with many champs. And for two, broad stroke terms like that could be applied to any number of other champs or situations.
I think its a fair phrase, its just used badly. Making sure champions are fun to play against is important.
Well, that's not usually how it is used to mean. That's true though. Still, it's important to differentiate between truly terrible mechanics and QQ.
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
They were talking about Shen, who has been laning against Kennen and who was rushing Sunfire.
Which is still dumb because he should be rushing Shurelia's, since teamfights are going to come down to whether he can land clean taunts.
I don't even care if it's a good idea. I won't buy mana regen items on manaless champions (except for sometimes spirit stone stuff). It's just wrong.
Bleh, I enjoy playing Yorick, and its fucking annoying to see the Dev's start a thread like that and it takes 8 pages before anyone even mentions that you can counterpick Yorick in toplane with Nasus (and no one even mentions countering him with Cho'gath), or build your team to counter him (Blue Ezreal, Nidalee).
Yes, you can counterpick him, but he has absolutely no counterplay. Either you have enough sustain to survive him in lane, or you don't. That is what makes him so awful. He is an abomination who should not exist at all, and he wouldn't except Riot was extremely rushed when they created him, and then couldn't be bothered to do anything about it after they buffed him into being playable. DELETE YORICK
I was 0-7-0 because my bottom lane partner DC'd for 5 and then we got stomped over and over.
Then I figured her out sort of... ended the game 1-9-26. Highlights: E'd a Teemo so he could chase down annie - he hit his W at the same time and almost turbo'd completely past her.
R-E the team from the other side of a wall and watch them turn into the Speedmurder Squad. So satisfying!
Yorick buys a ward. Like, I have never seen one even in bronze not just buy a ward.
'Wait til his ghouls are down.'
He has three. He only uses one to harrass and keeps two on cooldown. (The healing one they harrass with. By the way. That leaves the slow and damage one on hand for hitting you. The war one being an AA reset as well.)
How is Yorick unfun?
As a jungle he's a boring gank. he just drops his slow and trundles off while outsustaining the top lane just by dropping the healing ghoul. For top lane he's boring because he just wards a bush then drops a ghoul and walks away. For the rest of his own team he's boring because he's just a lump who accomplishes nothing unless the ADC or jungle dies. Elsewise it's like a 4v5 the entire game. Basically his laning phase he's just a wall up there and once laning is over he's basically just a turd.
0
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
edited June 2013
Unless you're running like Yorick/Anivia/Vayne/Zilean/Zac in which case he actually brings something to the team.
Spectrum on
0
pyromaniac221this just might bean interestin YTRegistered Userregular
ah, man. client crashes at the beginning of a game and i can't reconnect until 9 minutes in and so i'm disastrously behind and then my team flames me the whole time and i get 4 reports
Yorick buys a ward. Like, I have never seen one even in bronze not just buy a ward.
'Wait til his ghouls are down.'
He has three. He only uses one to harrass and keeps two on cooldown. (The healing one they harrass with. By the way. That leaves the slow and damage one on hand for hitting you. The war one being an AA reset as well.)
How is Yorick unfun?
As a jungle he's a boring gank. he just drops his slow and trundles off while outsustaining the top lane just by dropping the healing ghoul. For top lane he's boring because he just wards a bush then drops a ghoul and walks away. For the rest of his own team he's boring because he's just a lump who accomplishes nothing unless the ADC or jungle dies. Elsewise it's like a 4v5 the entire game. Basically his laning phase he's just a wall up there and once laning is over he's basically just a turd.
Congrats, your Yoricks have more presence of mind than any other bronze player I've ever seen. More so than anytimes he has been in the competitive tournament scene in fact, which all sorts of players ape strategies from.
He doesn't need a ward because he has his W. Why ward when you reveal with a ghoul. (Hint: This is why you rush him to bait the slow ghoul, so he can't use it as vision and the ghouls can't follow you)
Or we can go with the fact Yorick won't have a ward to start the game, and if you're really worried about vision, pink it up. That's helpful for your jungler to do lane ganks anyways, which let you get much closer to Yorick.
For the number of ghouls, I didn't say wait until they are down, they will never be down (CD and life span of the ghouls gives you only a 2 second window of actual complete downtime). his E and W when he hits you with them, you duck into the bushes, wait for them to nearly die, then you hit Yorick. His ghouls will time out and he will only have his melee AA ghoul to use on you, depending on your champion, he may not get to even hit you with it. That lessens his free Damage reduction by 10%-15% (dependent on if he melees you), then you walk away, wait for the slow ghoul, then drop vision in the bushes again. He wasted 5 spells and you managed to get some harass down.
Every character has counterplay, just because you don't utilize it effectively doesn't mean it isn't there.
And his teamfight presence is great. I love having 6v5 teamfights with 2 adcs on my team. Or giving someone like Ryze ten seconds to destroy people with no interruption.
I'll give you he is hard to gank, but that applies to a lot of characters. You just have to get creative.
Yorick buys a ward. Like, I have never seen one even in bronze not just buy a ward.
'Wait til his ghouls are down.'
He has three. He only uses one to harrass and keeps two on cooldown. (The healing one they harrass with. By the way. That leaves the slow and damage one on hand for hitting you. The war one being an AA reset as well.)
How is Yorick unfun?
As a jungle he's a boring gank. he just drops his slow and trundles off while outsustaining the top lane just by dropping the healing ghoul. For top lane he's boring because he just wards a bush then drops a ghoul and walks away. For the rest of his own team he's boring because he's just a lump who accomplishes nothing unless the ADC or jungle dies. Elsewise it's like a 4v5 the entire game. Basically his laning phase he's just a wall up there and once laning is over he's basically just a turd.
Trynd has a slow (sometimes). Trundle has a ranged AOE slow. Cho has a ranged AOE popup. Kayle has a ranged slow. Nasus has a ranged slow. Malphite has a ranged slow. Singed is Singed. Etc.
And for what it is worth, all the ranged ghouls are magic damage, and yet I've rarely as hen's teeth seen people itemize MR against Yorick.
The fact that you can have a lengthy discussion about how to counter him and it pretty much comes down to 'play trundle/cho'gath or lose lane' is pretty lame.
The fact that you can have a lengthy discussion about how to counter him and it pretty much comes down to 'play trundle/cho'gath or lose lane' is pretty lame.
Thank you for reading the points made by both sides so well.
I like using Renekton myself, Tryndamere does pretty well too. Top lane isn't binary. Different champs require different playstyles to lane against. As a jungler, part of the skill is in knowing how to best gank one of these slippery folks.
For a similar experience to laning against Yorick, try Rumble. Same sphere of influence on the lane, same constant damage. Rumble just has more damage, and Yorick has more utility. I would not suggest charging right into Rumble either. You have to play around his Flamespitter to effectively trade. Does that make Rumble unfun?
+1
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
It's not necessary to draw comparisons to other champions, to try and ask other players if so and so is fun, but aha if you admit that he is fun then you must find Yorick fun too I have ensnared you in a logic trap!
Yorick isn't fun. This is a sentiment repeated by many, many people, on both sides of the lane. Nothing needs to be justified beyond why Yorick is unfun. It doesn't matter if other champions have slows or lifesteal or consistent damage or anything, what matters is what Yorick has, what the counterplay is, and how people feel doing it. And how people feel doing it is "bleh bleh bleh".
This isn't some new idea. Reds have acknowledged that an unusually high number of people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners for some time, but because he's not technically unbalanced adjusting him is no priority. With Xelnath appearing to want to aggressively tackle champions that Aren't Bad But Probably Could Be Better From A Gameplay Perspective, someone is finally positioning themselves in the area Yorick inhabits. Why wouldn't they want to do something with him?
+2
pyromaniac221this just might bean interestin YTRegistered Userregular
The fact that you can have a lengthy discussion about how to counter him and it pretty much comes down to 'play trundle/cho'gath or lose lane' is pretty lame.
Thank you for reading the points made by both sides so well.
I like using Renekton myself, Tryndamere does pretty well too. Top lane isn't binary. Different champs require different playstyles to lane against. As a jungler, part of the skill is in knowing how to best gank one of these slippery folks.
For a similar experience to laning against Yorick, try Rumble. Same sphere of influence on the lane, same constant damage. Rumble just has more damage, and Yorick has more utility. I would not suggest charging right into Rumble either. You have to play around his Flamespitter to effectively trade. Does that make Rumble unfun?
Yorick is a bit more annoying since he has built in sustain and doesn't have to commit as much to harass. Where Rumble would have to junk shield and rush at someone with flamespitter, Yorick presses a couple of buttons and goes back to last hitting while his stupid ghouls punch his opponent until they time out. Rumble is a really strong lane bully (though he has been nerfed and stuff) but he has to pay more attention to his positioning than Yorick does just to achieve the same level of unspeakably infuriating harass.
If they want to really fix some rage inducing unfun to play against champs, they could take another pass at Eve, as she is impossible to pin down outside of hard CC, and impossible to keep track of outside of face checking bushes and pink wards.
Or how about the master bullshit artist since time immortal, Shaco, who gets a blink with invis and a fear trap and a snare passive with ranged snare and great dueling.
The reason so many people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners is because he shits all over a lot of the tanky bruisers that go up there. I'm sorry that some people dislike fighting fatties, but there is no reason to remove those champs from the game or rework them to be just like every other top laner. Choice is good.
If they want to really fix some rage inducing unfun to play against champs, they could take another pass at Eve, as she is impossible to pin down outside of hard CC, and impossible to keep track of outside of face checking bushes and pink wards.
Or how about the master bullshit artist since time immortal, Shaco, who gets a blink with invis and a fear trap and a snare passive with ranged snare and great dueling.
The reason so many people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners is because he shits all over a lot of the tanky bruisers that go up there. I'm sorry that some people dislike fighting fatties, but there is no reason to remove those champs from the game or rework them to be just like every other top laner. Choice is good.
eve isn't that bad. she has to be up close to do anything and she's pretty fragile. her strengths lie in picking her own fights, but if she does it wrong then she's useless.
i'll grant that her ganks can be strong but if unpredictable ganks are your problem, well, let me tell you about zac, a dude almost equally impossible to ward against AND he's tanky AND he has multiple forms of cc
If they want to really fix some rage inducing unfun to play against champs, they could take another pass at Eve, as she is impossible to pin down outside of hard CC, and impossible to keep track of outside of face checking bushes and pink wards.
Or how about the master bullshit artist since time immortal, Shaco, who gets a blink with invis and a fear trap and a snare passive with ranged snare and great dueling.
The reason so many people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners is because he shits all over a lot of the tanky bruisers that go up there. I'm sorry that some people dislike fighting fatties, but there is no reason to remove those champs from the game or rework them to be just like every other top laner. Choice is good.
I'm not really sure I'd call Shaco a great duelist, since he doesn't even come close to being able to duel most of the good duelist champions. He's just too squishy for it.
The difference is that a bad Shaco and Eve are bad. Like, really, horribly, worthlessly bad. Dying to buff mobs bad because they are just that bad.
A bad Yorick might like, die or something. Maybe. If he forgets how to press buttons.
A bad Shaco or Eve will spend the whole game being invisible, only to try to drop a box in the brush not knowing that the orange smoke is actually quite visible thank you very much or that the giant ! over your head actually means something and I'll just stand right over here and not walk into that Eve standing in the middle of the lane.
A good Shaco player either plays that champ pretty hardcore or has some inbuilt hate-engine that gives them savant levels of bullshit ability.
A good Yorick player probably played the champ for the first time two games ago, learned what the QWER keys do, and can now safely zone out half the roster.
OK so I got a forum avatar. Many thanks to @eeSang for teaching me how to do it.
We need to go deeper.
it is done
Deeper.
In other news. Landing Morgana's Dark Binding has been as gratisfying as Blitzcrank's Rocket Grab.
Eventually something is going to collapse.
I just had a terrible game. This Ashe could not avoid blitz grabs. The enemy team went 3 bot with Blitz, tree guy and Cait. Left and right Ashe was getting grabbed. Even obvious bait grabs. Blitz dropped a ward within range of the tower and Ashe stood still to shoot it and got hooked. She ended 1/13/something. So bad. Also, the Ashe was queued up with the Rammus and Jax on my team. They all reported me. I'm getting reported a lot lately. Mostly for negative attitude because I get bored when my team is being mercilessly destroyed and I'd rather move onto a new game.
I always thought duoing was supposed to help me win but when I duo with a friend I get a massive loss streak. I think I need to stop duoing.
Duoing only helps you if you a) work well together with your duo partner and b) your duo partner can compete (or you can compete...) at whatever Elo the two of you end up at when queuing together. If both of those are not true, do not queue together.
Agreed! Another way to think of this is this: You have duo queued and now the game has given your MMR a boost to reflect that you and your queue partner are better coordinated than your opponents. Knowing that you now have better opponents, duo queuing is only worthwhile if either 1) You guys are so far above this elo shit don't matter anyways, or 2) the two of you are playing roles that can compliment each other.
Examples of #2 might be ADC + support and mid/top + jungle. Again the person I have most successfully duo queued with is @Roz and at that time I would play top and he would play jungle and make me snowball my lane.
@eeSang this shit has gone about as deep as it can get
Ye of little faith. Deeper.
Also, I hate playing with duo queue bottom lanes on my team. Most I've seen on either team ends up losing.
And deeper
Edit: weird I have been sizing all the images to the same size but this one is randomly cut off at the edges. Will fix it I guess.
UGHHHHHHHHHH I have not changed image size but the forum avatar thing is suddenly cutting things off for no reason
Posts
Counterplay against yorick. Step in bushes.
Also, wait for right before his ghouls die, then hit him so he cant win the trades with his free dr
"No counterplay" is just a nonsense phrase. It's a lie, for one. You can substantially reduce his damage by correct play with many champs. And for two, broad stroke terms like that could be applied to any number of other champs or situations.
I'm not sure that you can claim that laning against said champions is objectively or universally regarded as unfun. I also have trouble seeing how Yorick can be boring/unfun for not just your lane opponent but also the rest of the players in the game. That doesn't even really make sense.
I think its a fair phrase, its just used badly. Making sure champions are fun to play against is important.
I like laning with and against him personally.
Well, that's not usually how it is used to mean. That's true though. Still, it's important to differentiate between truly terrible mechanics and QQ.
Your opponents don't have cooldowns or mana costs? Weird. Maybe submit a bug report?
R, E, R, E,
Win teamfight through sheer utility bullshit.
I was 0-7-0 because my bottom lane partner DC'd for 5 and then we got stomped over and over.
Then I figured her out sort of... ended the game 1-9-26. Highlights: E'd a Teemo so he could chase down annie - he hit his W at the same time and almost turbo'd completely past her.
R-E the team from the other side of a wall and watch them turn into the Speedmurder Squad. So satisfying!
Yorick buys a ward. Like, I have never seen one even in bronze not just buy a ward.
'Wait til his ghouls are down.'
He has three. He only uses one to harrass and keeps two on cooldown. (The healing one they harrass with. By the way. That leaves the slow and damage one on hand for hitting you. The war one being an AA reset as well.)
How is Yorick unfun?
As a jungle he's a boring gank. he just drops his slow and trundles off while outsustaining the top lane just by dropping the healing ghoul. For top lane he's boring because he just wards a bush then drops a ghoul and walks away. For the rest of his own team he's boring because he's just a lump who accomplishes nothing unless the ADC or jungle dies. Elsewise it's like a 4v5 the entire game. Basically his laning phase he's just a wall up there and once laning is over he's basically just a turd.
that sucks
shoot AP Yi into the sun
Congrats, your Yoricks have more presence of mind than any other bronze player I've ever seen. More so than anytimes he has been in the competitive tournament scene in fact, which all sorts of players ape strategies from.
He doesn't need a ward because he has his W. Why ward when you reveal with a ghoul. (Hint: This is why you rush him to bait the slow ghoul, so he can't use it as vision and the ghouls can't follow you)
Or we can go with the fact Yorick won't have a ward to start the game, and if you're really worried about vision, pink it up. That's helpful for your jungler to do lane ganks anyways, which let you get much closer to Yorick.
For the number of ghouls, I didn't say wait until they are down, they will never be down (CD and life span of the ghouls gives you only a 2 second window of actual complete downtime). his E and W when he hits you with them, you duck into the bushes, wait for them to nearly die, then you hit Yorick. His ghouls will time out and he will only have his melee AA ghoul to use on you, depending on your champion, he may not get to even hit you with it. That lessens his free Damage reduction by 10%-15% (dependent on if he melees you), then you walk away, wait for the slow ghoul, then drop vision in the bushes again. He wasted 5 spells and you managed to get some harass down.
Every character has counterplay, just because you don't utilize it effectively doesn't mean it isn't there.
And his teamfight presence is great. I love having 6v5 teamfights with 2 adcs on my team. Or giving someone like Ryze ten seconds to destroy people with no interruption.
I'll give you he is hard to gank, but that applies to a lot of characters. You just have to get creative.
Trynd has a slow (sometimes). Trundle has a ranged AOE slow. Cho has a ranged AOE popup. Kayle has a ranged slow. Nasus has a ranged slow. Malphite has a ranged slow. Singed is Singed. Etc.
And for what it is worth, all the ranged ghouls are magic damage, and yet I've rarely as hen's teeth seen people itemize MR against Yorick.
The fact that you can have a lengthy discussion about how to counter him and it pretty much comes down to 'play trundle/cho'gath or lose lane' is pretty lame.
Thank you for reading the points made by both sides so well.
I like using Renekton myself, Tryndamere does pretty well too. Top lane isn't binary. Different champs require different playstyles to lane against. As a jungler, part of the skill is in knowing how to best gank one of these slippery folks.
For a similar experience to laning against Yorick, try Rumble. Same sphere of influence on the lane, same constant damage. Rumble just has more damage, and Yorick has more utility. I would not suggest charging right into Rumble either. You have to play around his Flamespitter to effectively trade. Does that make Rumble unfun?
Yorick isn't fun. This is a sentiment repeated by many, many people, on both sides of the lane. Nothing needs to be justified beyond why Yorick is unfun. It doesn't matter if other champions have slows or lifesteal or consistent damage or anything, what matters is what Yorick has, what the counterplay is, and how people feel doing it. And how people feel doing it is "bleh bleh bleh".
This isn't some new idea. Reds have acknowledged that an unusually high number of people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners for some time, but because he's not technically unbalanced adjusting him is no priority. With Xelnath appearing to want to aggressively tackle champions that Aren't Bad But Probably Could Be Better From A Gameplay Perspective, someone is finally positioning themselves in the area Yorick inhabits. Why wouldn't they want to do something with him?
Yorick is a bit more annoying since he has built in sustain and doesn't have to commit as much to harass. Where Rumble would have to junk shield and rush at someone with flamespitter, Yorick presses a couple of buttons and goes back to last hitting while his stupid ghouls punch his opponent until they time out. Rumble is a really strong lane bully (though he has been nerfed and stuff) but he has to pay more attention to his positioning than Yorick does just to achieve the same level of unspeakably infuriating harass.
yorick looks dumb
feels dumb
plays dumb
is dumb
Or how about the master bullshit artist since time immortal, Shaco, who gets a blink with invis and a fear trap and a snare passive with ranged snare and great dueling.
The reason so many people dislike Yorick compared to other top laners is because he shits all over a lot of the tanky bruisers that go up there. I'm sorry that some people dislike fighting fatties, but there is no reason to remove those champs from the game or rework them to be just like every other top laner. Choice is good.
MWO: Adamski
Fighting Yorick is like trying to punch a brick wall.
There are 'rage' champions that are good and fun and then there are people like Blitz, Nunu or Yorick who feel cheap and aggravating constantly.
eve isn't that bad. she has to be up close to do anything and she's pretty fragile. her strengths lie in picking her own fights, but if she does it wrong then she's useless.
i'll grant that her ganks can be strong but if unpredictable ganks are your problem, well, let me tell you about zac, a dude almost equally impossible to ward against AND he's tanky AND he has multiple forms of cc
"TEAM ARAM IS BULLSHIT!"
Jayce, Lux, Draven, Brand(me) and Lulu. I was not only going to commit crimes against man, but of GOD.
And then at the 20 second mark... someone on the other team dodges. Why must you hate me ARAM?
I'm not really sure I'd call Shaco a great duelist, since he doesn't even come close to being able to duel most of the good duelist champions. He's just too squishy for it.
Steam: Drokmir
First time I've ever actually played him in a real SR game. And yes, my CS sucks because I was too busy farming champions
A bad Yorick might like, die or something. Maybe. If he forgets how to press buttons.
A bad Shaco or Eve will spend the whole game being invisible, only to try to drop a box in the brush not knowing that the orange smoke is actually quite visible thank you very much or that the giant ! over your head actually means something and I'll just stand right over here and not walk into that Eve standing in the middle of the lane.
A good Shaco player either plays that champ pretty hardcore or has some inbuilt hate-engine that gives them savant levels of bullshit ability.
A good Yorick player probably played the champ for the first time two games ago, learned what the QWER keys do, and can now safely zone out half the roster.
he'd just meditate through it....
Joe's Stream.
No, the sun knocks him out of meditate with half her moves.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
And deeper
Edit: weird I have been sizing all the images to the same size but this one is randomly cut off at the edges. Will fix it I guess.
UGHHHHHHHHHH I have not changed image size but the forum avatar thing is suddenly cutting things off for no reason
He skips Tiger entirely until last, going R-E-R-W and then Phoenix > Turtle > Bear > Tiger.
It turns you into a massive wrecking ball late game if you get on a carry and Q-R