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[Star Control] Origins is out NOW. Be sure to enjoy the sauce.

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    Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Orogogus wrote: »
    Saw this on Blue's News:

    Ford and Reiche have announced an upcoming, technically unofficial sequel to Star Control 2, titled Ghosts of the Precursors.

    https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/307443/Star_Control_II_devs_unite_for_a_passion_project_sequel.php
    Toys for Bob cofounders Fred Ford and Paul Reiche III announced this week that they've begun working on a sequel to the 1992 space adventure game Star Control II called Ghosts of the Precursors.

    ...

    Since then Toys for Bob has had nothing to do with the series, and it appears that may hold true for this new game as well -- Reiche and Ford have established a new website and Twitter account that bears no Toys for Bob branding, and their announcement makes it clear that "this is a passion project for us and we have committed to dedicating some of our own time to creating a true sequel."

    ...

    Stardock chief Brad Wardell took to Twitter today to confirm that Stardock is not involved with this new Star Control game, but did work with Ford and Reiche ("we've been talking for four years") to ensure both sides were happy. As a result, Stardock is cool with Ghosts of the Precursors using the aliens that appear in Star Control II.

    It is kinda odd that we have two teams now, one which has the rights to the name Star Control but not to the content of SC1 and 2, and another that has access to all SC1 and 2 content but no right to the Star Control name. And it's honestly incredible that we have this situation at all where two devs are pretty much okay with it. It could've been a lot like Harvest Moon and Story of Seasons.

    Think they've said that Stardock's been interested in Ford and Reiche's input and that kind of cooperation goes a long way.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1bgnu-JTgc

    I'm very cautious of this. I really don't like the "mobile game"-y look to it - that cartoony, inoffensive, primary-colored art style that you see on phone games more often than not. I'm hoping the gameplay and the story make up for it, at least.

    Donnicton on
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    DrakeDrake Edgelord Trash Below the ecliptic plane.Registered User regular
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

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    Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L1bgnu-JTgc

    I'm very cautious of this. I really don't like the "mobile game"-y look to it - that cartoony, inoffensive, primary-colored art style that you see on phone games more often than not. I'm hoping the gameplay and the story make up for it, at least.

    Classic Star Control did use a lot of primary colors in its art style so that bit doesn't really bug me. The roundness of a lot of the design stands out a bit though, more so given that it otherwise looks a like like Stardock's other space stuff and transplanting the style of GalCiv might have fit better.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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    ZxerolZxerol for the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't do so i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

    I'm surprised they're yven allowed to do not-Star Control after Skylanders is done, because history has taught me that if you're a second-string Activision studio, you're just going to be put on the Call of Duty treadmill (see: Raven).

    Zxerol on
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    Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Zxerol wrote: »
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

    I'm surprised they're yven allowed to do not-Star Control after Skylanders is done, because history has taught me that if you're a second-string Activision studio, you're just going to be put on the Call of Duty treadmill (see: Raven).

    I mean, if Activision finds the right partner for a line of CoD action figures and vehicles that can have the right chips embedded in them . . .

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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    AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    Zxerol wrote: »
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

    I'm surprised they're yven allowed to do not-Star Control after Skylanders is done, because history has taught me that if you're a second-string Activision studio, you're just going to be put on the Call of Duty treadmill (see: Raven).

    I mean, if Activision finds the right partner for a line of CoD action figures and vehicles that can have the right chips embedded in them . . .

    Dude, if they partner with GI Joe. . . .

    Man, I actually might be down with this. :razz:

    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
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    OrogogusOrogogus San DiegoRegistered User regular
    Zxerol wrote: »
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

    I'm surprised they're yven allowed to do not-Star Control after Skylanders is done, because history has taught me that if you're a second-string Activision studio, you're just going to be put on the Call of Duty treadmill (see: Raven).

    My impression is that Ford and Reiche are doing this on their own without involving Toys for Bob. The announcement doesn't mention Toys for Bob, it's not mentioned on TfB's website or Twitter feed -- there's a separate feed for Ford & Reiche -- and there doesn't seem to be any official overlap at all.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Orogogus wrote: »
    Zxerol wrote: »
    Drake wrote: »
    I'm far more interested in what Toys For Bob is making, personally.

    I'm surprised they're yven allowed to do not-Star Control after Skylanders is done, because history has taught me that if you're a second-string Activision studio, you're just going to be put on the Call of Duty treadmill (see: Raven).

    My impression is that Ford and Reiche are doing this on their own without involving Toys for Bob. The announcement doesn't mention Toys for Bob, it's not mentioned on TfB's website or Twitter feed -- there's a separate feed for Ford & Reiche -- and there doesn't seem to be any official overlap at all.

    This must be an "evenings and weekends in the garage" kind of labor of love then, given how corporations adore binding employees to that "if you do anything using company time or resources, it's ours now". No doubt TfB's offices are considered Activision property at this point.

    Donnicton on
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    IslandDogIslandDog Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Ars Technica has a great article on Star Control: Origins. :)

    https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2017/10/stardock-ceo-talks-star-control-origins-player-crafting-and-upcoming-beta/

    More screenshots and pre-order info are available here.

    IslandDog on
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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Personally I'm okay with the unimpressive graphics if that means they can concentrate on a LOT of story and a massive not procedurally generated galaxy, just like SC2.

    Something also tells me that the look is them trying to keep with the look of the first two games while also not looking too much like say... No Man's Sky. And let's be honest... this game, if it comes out in the next few years, will be compared to No Man's Sky, no matter how different it is from that IP.

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    HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    I'm hoping that the procedural is jut to fill in the gaps between story and alien homeworlds. Maybe they will offer an off sandbox mode where all is procedural and allow user or future campaigns this way. But yeah keep the main story like SC2.

    Edit:
    Ok from the ars-technica article
    "We rely on the procedural generation to do 90 percent of the universe creation, and then the last 10 percent is we have tools to craft and design our own planets," said Wardell.

    Handkor on
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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Handkor wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the procedural is jut to fill in the gaps between story and alien homeworlds. Maybe they will offer an off sandbox mode where all is procedural and allow user or future campaigns this way. But yeah keep the main story like SC2.

    Edit:
    Ok from the ars-technica article
    "We rely on the procedural generation to do 90 percent of the universe creation, and then the last 10 percent is we have tools to craft and design our own planets," said Wardell.

    Hmm, well I like the idea of the game having replayability, but to have a lot of story elements and be procedural, it's gonna have to be done VERY well. The faith I have is that this is the developer of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations, so... they SHOULD be pretty good at this kind of thing.

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    ZxerolZxerol for the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't do so i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the procedural is jut to fill in the gaps between story and alien homeworlds. Maybe they will offer an off sandbox mode where all is procedural and allow user or future campaigns this way. But yeah keep the main story like SC2.

    Edit:
    Ok from the ars-technica article
    "We rely on the procedural generation to do 90 percent of the universe creation, and then the last 10 percent is we have tools to craft and design our own planets," said Wardell.

    Hmm, well I like the idea of the game having replayability, but to have a lot of story elements and be procedural, it's gonna have to be done VERY well. The faith I have is that this is the developer of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations, so... they SHOULD be pretty good at this kind of thing.

    Quick correction: Stardock published but did not develop Sins. /pedantryglasses

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    ErlkönigErlkönig Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Zxerol wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the procedural is jut to fill in the gaps between story and alien homeworlds. Maybe they will offer an off sandbox mode where all is procedural and allow user or future campaigns this way. But yeah keep the main story like SC2.

    Edit:
    Ok from the ars-technica article
    "We rely on the procedural generation to do 90 percent of the universe creation, and then the last 10 percent is we have tools to craft and design our own planets," said Wardell.

    Hmm, well I like the idea of the game having replayability, but to have a lot of story elements and be procedural, it's gonna have to be done VERY well. The faith I have is that this is the developer of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations, so... they SHOULD be pretty good at this kind of thing.

    Quick correction: Stardock published but did not develop Sins. /pedantryglasses

    The way the Steam page reads, Stardock co-developed Sins alongside Ironclad... I wonder how "co" the development process was.

    Erlkönig on
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    Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    I'm hoping that the procedural is jut to fill in the gaps between story and alien homeworlds. Maybe they will offer an off sandbox mode where all is procedural and allow user or future campaigns this way. But yeah keep the main story like SC2.

    Edit:
    Ok from the ars-technica article
    "We rely on the procedural generation to do 90 percent of the universe creation, and then the last 10 percent is we have tools to craft and design our own planets," said Wardell.

    Hmm, well I like the idea of the game having replayability, but to have a lot of story elements and be procedural, it's gonna have to be done VERY well. The faith I have is that this is the developer of Sins of a Solar Empire and Galactic Civilizations, so... they SHOULD be pretty good at this kind of thing.

    Just thinking about Star Control 2, just about everything would have still worked if the non-homeworld planets you had to visit for various tasks were procedurally generated. No reason the alien beast has to specifically be on the planet it is so long as you get adequate guidance to it.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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    IslandDogIslandDog Registered User regular
    Star Control: Origins Fleet Battles Beta begins today!

    Trailer:

    https://youtu.be/a-hhgTxiB8Y
    Star Control: Origins is a science-fiction adventure game set in an open universe that puts the player as the captain of Earth's first interstellar vessel on a mission to find allies to help save humanity from certain annihilation.

    The beta unlocks the Fleet Battles feature, where you'll assemble ships in a fleet and engage in battle with fleets controlled by either the computer, humans via the Internet, or even friends sitting at the same PC.

    You can literally design your own ships to use in combat using the Ship Crafting system, or you can download ships designed by others to play with. Ship Crafting not only allows you to decide what weapons and defenses a ship has, but allows total control of how a ship looks.

    More info here: https://forums.starcontrol.com/485611

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    ErlkönigErlkönig Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Yup, that sure looks like HSM. How many minutes do you figure it'll take until people cobble together the entire SC1-3 ship lineup with those ship parts?

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    HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    Tried the BETA last night and the ships control and feel about right. There is one alliance ship that shoots a helix bolo and has a speed boost. The bolo is short range but you can shoot it really far with a speedboost for really high damage.

    Constructing ships is easy and quite flexible.

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    There will also be a sequel.

    https://dogarandkazon.squarespace.com/
    Our answer was always, “We really want to do this, we just need to wait until the time is right” -- kind of like Cthulhu awakening, but less end-of-the-worldy. Well, the stars have finally aligned -- we are now working on a direct sequel to The Ur-Quan Masters, called Ghosts of the Precursors™.

    I didn't know about Origins, although I find it odd to be doing a prequel for Star Control 2 when there IS a Star Control 1. Granted it had no story elements.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Our answer was always, “We really want to do this, we just need to wait until the time is right”

    Aka "When Activision finally lets us ease up on the Skylanders production".

    MuddBudd wrote: »
    There will also be a sequel.

    https://dogarandkazon.squarespace.com/
    Our answer was always, “We really want to do this, we just need to wait until the time is right” -- kind of like Cthulhu awakening, but less end-of-the-worldy. Well, the stars have finally aligned -- we are now working on a direct sequel to The Ur-Quan Masters, called Ghosts of the Precursors™.

    I didn't know about Origins, although I find it odd to be doing a prequel for Star Control 2 when there IS a Star Control 1. Granted it had no story elements.

    Where'd you read prequel? It looks like they said direct sequel.

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    Our answer was always, “We really want to do this, we just need to wait until the time is right”

    Aka "When Activision finally lets us ease up on the Skylanders production".

    MuddBudd wrote: »
    There will also be a sequel.

    https://dogarandkazon.squarespace.com/
    Our answer was always, “We really want to do this, we just need to wait until the time is right” -- kind of like Cthulhu awakening, but less end-of-the-worldy. Well, the stars have finally aligned -- we are now working on a direct sequel to The Ur-Quan Masters, called Ghosts of the Precursors™.

    I didn't know about Origins, although I find it odd to be doing a prequel for Star Control 2 when there IS a Star Control 1. Granted it had no story elements.

    Where'd you read prequel? It looks like they said direct sequel.

    I was referring to Origins there. I thought Origins was a prequel?

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Origins is kind of its own thing that takes place in the same galaxy but a different and unrelated part of it, since they don't have the rights to relate it to any of the core story. I'm not sure of the timeline of it - it could be a prequel - but oddly enough given the circumstances it could really be dated at any point and it won't matter much.

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    Origins is kind of its own thing that takes place in the same galaxy but a different and unrelated part of it, since they don't have the rights to relate it to any of the core story. I'm not sure of the timeline of it - it could be a prequel - but oddly enough given the circumstances it could really be dated at any point and it won't matter much.

    Ah, well, that's what I get for not paying attention. I didn't even know Origins was happening until I spotted this thread.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Yeah it's currently a bit of an odd situation where Stardock owns the Star Control name but Toys for Bob(Activision) owns the rights to all of the characters and core story, but both developers want to make a Star Control game. So they're working with eachother to make Star Controls without stepping on eachothers' toes. It's a weird situation but it's gonna get us two Star Controls so it's fine with me.

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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Supposedly SC Origins is a prequel about Earth when it first starts to explore the galaxy, except they have to come up with brand new races. Toys For Bob's Star Control game will be a sequel to SC2 with all the races intact, but it can't use the Star Control name because Stardock currently owns it. That's my understanding of both games.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    https://kotaku.com/star-control-s-creators-call-on-stardock-to-stop-sellin-1821028506

    Looks like it was a bit too good to be true, only a matter of time before bickering over rights ownership kicks up. And as expected it's going to be playing out in a way where the gamers are the real losers in the dispute by the time this all ends.

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    HandkorHandkor Registered User regular
    This whole thing with how the licencing was split up was always gonna get ugly.

    Hopefully an agreement can be reached but at least if you already bought 1,2 and 3 they can't take it away from you.

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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Handkor wrote: »
    This whole thing with how the licencing was split up was always gonna get ugly.

    Hopefully an agreement can be reached but at least if you already bought 1,2 and 3 they can't take it away from you.

    If you bought 3, you probably want someone to take it away from you.

    wbee62u815wj.png
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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    This whole thing with how the licencing was split up was always gonna get ugly.

    Hopefully an agreement can be reached but at least if you already bought 1,2 and 3 they can't take it away from you.

    If you bought 3, you probably want someone to take it away from you.

    I enjoy Three.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    ZxerolZxerol for the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't do so i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered User regular
    Knowing absolutely zero about the legal tangle of the situation, I'm not totally against anything that spites Wardell, because I'm petty like that.

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    MadpoetMadpoet Registered User regular
    I liked Star Control 3 better when they reused the plot in Mass Effect.

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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    And BTW, I'd like to add here that I really don't mind that Toys For Bob are asking Stardock to stop selling games that... I'm pretty sure the creators threw out to the internet and made open source years ago. It's why The Ur-Quan Masters is still a thing and can still be downloaded for free. Technically Stardock has access to the Star Control name, but not to anything that was actually used in Star Control 1 or 2. They could theoretically sell SC3, but since Toys For Bob still owns basically everything within SC1 and 2, and are basically freeware you can get whenever you want, trying to sell other versions of it is a cash grab dick move and should stop.

    wbee62u815wj.png
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    ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor changed Registered User regular
    edited December 2017
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    Quiotu wrote: »
    Handkor wrote: »
    This whole thing with how the licencing was split up was always gonna get ugly.

    Hopefully an agreement can be reached but at least if you already bought 1,2 and 3 they can't take it away from you.

    If you bought 3, you probably want someone to take it away from you.

    I enjoy Three.

    ASSERTION: Daktaklakpak speech patterns provide this unit unbounded amusement

    QUALIFICATION: Star Control 2 is still my favorite of the series, and among my favorite storylines of all time.

    ArbitraryDescriptor on
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    IslandDogIslandDog Registered User regular
    The February Dev Diary for Star Control: Origins is out! It has updates on the game's progress, answers to your frequently asked questions, and some discussion on the lore and how it fits in with the classic series. :)

    https://www.stardock.com/games/article/487303/

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    ErlkönigErlkönig Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    https://kotaku.com/star-control-s-creators-call-on-stardock-to-stop-sellin-1821028506

    Looks like it was a bit too good to be true, only a matter of time before bickering over rights ownership kicks up. And as expected it's going to be playing out in a way where the gamers are the real losers in the dispute by the time this all ends.

    Well...that escalated:

    https://www.pcgamer.com/star-control-creators-file-lawsuit-against-stardock

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    IslandDogIslandDog Registered User regular
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    QuiotuQuiotu Registered User regular
    Yep, this kinda sucks. I will be the first to suggest that P&F's sudden involvement in this just as information about Origins becomes visible... is a little dickish. Stardock asked them if they'd like to be involved in the games, and they politely declined at the time. Then P&F magically announce a sequel of their own, and then later start throwing out DMCA claims on all 3 Star Control games being sold, even though they didn't work on 3 at all.

    Now it seems like Stardock is done being nice, and I kinda don't blame them. They were working around P&F's claims of all IPs within SC1 and 2, but were using the Star Control name. Now Stardock is set to prove in court that P&F legally have no claim to anything Star Control, because they weren't the only designers for the games. P&F meanwhile are counterclaiming that Accolade had a License Agreement which gave P&F all rights to Star Control when it expired back in 2001.

    Basically it looks like the end result will be one of these two entities losing all rights to anything concerning Star Control, and that's a fucking shame. I can't say I like P&F's antics here... if they knew they had exclusive rights to Star Control way back in 2001, why the hell did they wait 16 years to do anything about it if they could in any way validate it. And Stardock's attempt to discredit P&F's involvement and rights to anything concerning the games is equally shitty, but I also get it's probably one of the only legal ways of getting P&F to stop.

    The whole lawsuit is dildos...

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Wardell is known to be an ass so I'm hesitant to immediately side with Stardock, but early impressions are Ford and Reiche's historically erratic behavior with the property are what escalated things. We'll see what happens as things unfold in court - no doubt we'll start seeing who actually did what as the court starts poring through the paper trail.

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    IslandDogIslandDog Registered User regular
    There are about 3,000 unique planets that are split into roughly 75 different classes. The newest dev journal shows how we create our planet classes through a mixture of procedural generation and designer balance.

    https://www.stardock.com/games/article/488103/star-control-so-you-want-to-build-a-planet

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