Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Isn't Valve technically losing money on TF2 (and also DOTA2, as they serve the same purpose)? I mean, hat sales can't possibly offbalance the costs of continuous maintenance and constant updating on a game for seven-odd years. Besides, even if they're making money on TF2, that amount is vastly dwarfed by what they make from their cut of the fifteen bazillion daily game sales on Steam. TF2 and DOTA serve the purpose as 'really good free game that you can only get if you have Steam', so people get Steam for the really good free stuff on it then are suckered into giving Valve all their money during sales.
(but I'd very much like to see a TF2.5 when their new engine is done, which is something I could definitely see them doing as a sort of tech demo thing that everyone can try)
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Shortytouching the meatIntergalactic Cool CourtRegistered Userregular
tf2 is also a testbed for new ideas
i.e. the entire free-to-play model that is now standard industry wide
Isn't Valve technically losing money on TF2 (and also DOTA2, as they serve the same purpose)? I mean, hat sales can't possibly offbalance the costs of continuous maintenance and constant updating on a game for seven-odd years.
If they weren't making money off of a game, they wouldn't still be updating them regularly. Portal 2 (which also had hats) only saw the one post-launch DLC update before they released the level creator and left any further updates up to the community; if Valve were selling lots of P2 hats (or, like, any P2 hats at all) I'm sure they'd still be releasing a new DLC pack each year.
They've got a few servers, but it's nothing like say an MMO has to deal with
they occasionally release patches, but it's not like they've got any kind of major staff to pay to maintain it
they host downloading the free client it on their own very profitable service, so it's really a drop in the bucket there
Meanwhile they charge 10 bucks a hat. Or better yet, sell keys for stranges, items that people pay cash dollars for which are functionally identical to what's already in the game, except it has a kill counter!
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
This is actually fake. If you look in his console, there's stuff in there that shows he is using a charge turn script. ("Advanced Joystick Settings Initialized") I assume that this is supposed to be some kind of a prank, hoping this doesn't backfire too hard on him or Valve.
Most extreme charge turning examples are people using controllers. Something about the way the game takes controller input allows you to turn with the charge much sharper than possible with a mouse.
There's a female professional player known for doing insane dumb charge stunts out there whose name I can't remember
I refuse to believe that Valve isn't making money of TF2, considering the absolutely ludicrous amount of money they have been paying out to community content creators. Nerds making 6 figure a year off their weapons and hats. And that's only a fraction of what Valve is taking in from them.
Also, come on, someone's gotta have an opinion. :rotate:
Two new routes I'm considering for access to CP2:
Yellow already exists but may be deleted if I pick one of the other routes because it doesn't seem to do much to improve access. Purple would be a low cliff route that comes up on the other side of the point. It would be fairly well covered like that cliff route near the CP2 on Upward. Cyan would cut in through the building and give access to the room right behind the point.
I can't decide which idea would work the best, what do you nerds think?
What if you made an upper route above the cyan line with a drop down just before the point around the corner? It'd give defenders a higher route option and jumpers could get up there for another route towards final, maybe?
This is actually fake. If you look in his console, there's stuff in there that shows he is using a charge turn script. ("Advanced Joystick Settings Initialized") I assume that this is supposed to be some kind of a prank, hoping this doesn't backfire too hard on him or Valve.
Why on earth would he bother with a prank like this? It has no punchline and it's just confusing most people who watch it and tricking them into having a higher frame rate.
One of my main goals for the map was single spawn rooms and short runs. The short runs are slowly disappearing, the map has grown enough that from round start scouts get to the center point at 9:33 (so once you subtract the 5 second freeze it's about a 22 second run). But the single spawn room is still there and I think it's working okay.
I think dropping yellow and adding in purple and cyan would be the way to go.
Yeah, I think I like that. That provides three distinct routes for both teams to fight over. Now to decide if cyan "stays high" with a drop like Crash suggested.
That also generates some new options with the cave that yellow is currently using, some of which might be fun.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Now, I've not played that map in quite a while, so I don't know if this has been changed in any way, but I remember that snipers sitting on last had ridiculous sightlines at people coming around the corner from 2nd, and there was one match where two good snipers were essentially fending off the entire attacking team. The cyan route certainly seems like it'd help the attacking team get a lot closer to the chokepoint without having to run headlong into a sightline, so I'd be all for that.
I brought down the roof of that archway quite a bit for the upcoming release, there is a tiny sliver of a crack you can shoot through that I haven't yet decided to keep or not. Once the displacements are in I'll use that to fine tune the visibility as well, sometimes just a few pixels of height difference is enough.
It's tough finding that sweet spot where snipers can be effective without dominating the map. My plan was to have sniper fights between snipers standing on the balcony against snipers on that little structure on the cliff and I'd like to find a way to keep that but it hasn't yet worked out that way.
Worst case, that archway will become more of a wall with a walking route along the cliff, which would completely change the feel of that chokepoint but would certainly fix the sightline issues.
There's also a potential problem developing around CP2, as the run distances have grown that path along the train tracks has started to turn into a no man's land. I'm thinking about adding a random building in there somewhere to improve the cover.
This is actually fake. If you look in his console, there's stuff in there that shows he is using a charge turn script. ("Advanced Joystick Settings Initialized") I assume that this is supposed to be some kind of a prank, hoping this doesn't backfire too hard on him or Valve.
Why on earth would he bother with a prank like this? It has no punchline and it's just confusing most people who watch it and tricking them into having a higher frame rate.
I think it's an early april fools
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
It's actually not too bad. Just a lot of tedious data entry to teleport all the named bots in place and turning off and on a shit load of spectator cameras.
Turns out STAR_'s video wasn't fake after all. Apparently he can't figure out how to disable the controller stuff in his console after doing a video with a controller 2 years ago. He did a live demo during his stream last night to show people he wasn't lying. http://www.twitch.tv/ster/c/3909194
Shortytouching the meatIntergalactic Cool CourtRegistered Userregular
well the question I have with star's demoknight video is less about whether he's lying (it does not seem he was) but more about whether the fact that the controller stuff actually matters
because the fact remains that all he did was increase FPS and was able to turn faster
well the question I have with star's demoknight video is less about whether he's lying (it does not seem he was) but more about whether the fact that the controller stuff actually matters
No, it doesn't matter because and it's super easy to reproduce. I tried it earlier tonight, same basic test he did. I've never, ever plugged a controller into TF2 and I don't get the messages he does in the console.
a) Start tf2
b) Bring up console, type "fps_max 30"
c) Bind a key to right, eg "bind x +right" or whatever you fancy.
d) Run "map pl_upward" and pick demo on red team. Right click and press x at the same time.
e) Disconnect, type "fps_max 0" into console.
f) Reload upward, retry test.
On my particular computer I was getting 500 fps and could do a full 180. At 30 fps I ran into the arrow sign just like star did.
The building is necessary to prevent an absurd sniper line of sight. But it also creates another problem. I might fix it by making the building more of a tower so you can't stand on it:
Line of sight from spawn is super restricted now.. this is the only sniping angle that I think exists.
The other route enters in here, opens up when your team is down to its last control point. I don't really like this and might delete it in favor of the "high road" that Crash suggested.
This is where that door goes:
And last, the new supersized center control point. I still worry it's too cramped but I think it's fun to fight in so hopefully it works out. You can also see the random structure I threw in on the left edge, just to compress things down a bit. I did put a nobuild up there but left it otherwise unclipped.
+1
turtleantGunpla Dadis the best.Registered Userregular
Heh, got done playing wow with my brother, look at my steam friends list and 6 people are in TF2. Thought I missed a surprise HONC night, but nope, everybody just decided to pub at the same time.
I pubbed with none of you. It was 3 back to back competitive 5cp maps that all ended in stalemates followed by a decent round of Upward. I've never hated 5cp more than that in awhile.
Posts
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
This guy sums it up pretty well:
(but I'd very much like to see a TF2.5 when their new engine is done, which is something I could definitely see them doing as a sort of tech demo thing that everyone can try)
i.e. the entire free-to-play model that is now standard industry wide
If they weren't making money off of a game, they wouldn't still be updating them regularly. Portal 2 (which also had hats) only saw the one post-launch DLC update before they released the level creator and left any further updates up to the community; if Valve were selling lots of P2 hats (or, like, any P2 hats at all) I'm sure they'd still be releasing a new DLC pack each year.
a product does not necessarily have to be profitable monetarily for them to support it, as long as it's providing other value
that said I don't believe that TF2 isn't profitable
they aren't spending much money on it, especially lately, and at this point all it's doing is collecting hat money
They've got a few servers, but it's nothing like say an MMO has to deal with
they occasionally release patches, but it's not like they've got any kind of major staff to pay to maintain it
they host downloading the free client it on their own very profitable service, so it's really a drop in the bucket there
Meanwhile they charge 10 bucks a hat. Or better yet, sell keys for stranges, items that people pay cash dollars for which are functionally identical to what's already in the game, except it has a kill counter!
This is actually fake. If you look in his console, there's stuff in there that shows he is using a charge turn script. ("Advanced Joystick Settings Initialized") I assume that this is supposed to be some kind of a prank, hoping this doesn't backfire too hard on him or Valve.
There's a female professional player known for doing insane dumb charge stunts out there whose name I can't remember
Edit: Source
hate playing against them
THIS SHIT WAS COMPLICATED AND A PAIN IN THE ASS
Two new routes I'm considering for access to CP2:
Yellow already exists but may be deleted if I pick one of the other routes because it doesn't seem to do much to improve access. Purple would be a low cliff route that comes up on the other side of the point. It would be fairly well covered like that cliff route near the CP2 on Upward. Cyan would cut in through the building and give access to the room right behind the point.
I can't decide which idea would work the best, what do you nerds think?
What if you made an upper route above the cyan line with a drop down just before the point around the corner? It'd give defenders a higher route option and jumpers could get up there for another route towards final, maybe?
Why on earth would he bother with a prank like this? It has no punchline and it's just confusing most people who watch it and tricking them into having a higher frame rate.
Not gonna happen. :rotate:
One of my main goals for the map was single spawn rooms and short runs. The short runs are slowly disappearing, the map has grown enough that from round start scouts get to the center point at 9:33 (so once you subtract the 5 second freeze it's about a 22 second run). But the single spawn room is still there and I think it's working okay.
Yeah, I think I like that. That provides three distinct routes for both teams to fight over. Now to decide if cyan "stays high" with a drop like Crash suggested.
That also generates some new options with the cave that yellow is currently using, some of which might be fun.
It's tough finding that sweet spot where snipers can be effective without dominating the map. My plan was to have sniper fights between snipers standing on the balcony against snipers on that little structure on the cliff and I'd like to find a way to keep that but it hasn't yet worked out that way.
Worst case, that archway will become more of a wall with a walking route along the cliff, which would completely change the feel of that chokepoint but would certainly fix the sightline issues.
There's also a potential problem developing around CP2, as the run distances have grown that path along the train tracks has started to turn into a no man's land. I'm thinking about adding a random building in there somewhere to improve the cover.
Basically, fuck snipers.
What is the map for? Some kind of hat demo screenshot generator or something?
I think it's an early april fools
Then why the heck did they ring you up?
Seems like a heap of entity work, I'd take one look at a project like that and run away because fuck entities.
It's actually not too bad. Just a lot of tedious data entry to teleport all the named bots in place and turning off and on a shit load of spectator cameras.
http://www.twitch.tv/ster/c/3909194
That'll reset everything to whatever Valve thinks is a safe default.
because the fact remains that all he did was increase FPS and was able to turn faster
this is still ridiculous
No, it doesn't matter because and it's super easy to reproduce. I tried it earlier tonight, same basic test he did. I've never, ever plugged a controller into TF2 and I don't get the messages he does in the console.
a) Start tf2
b) Bring up console, type "fps_max 30"
c) Bind a key to right, eg "bind x +right" or whatever you fancy.
d) Run "map pl_upward" and pick demo on red team. Right click and press x at the same time.
e) Disconnect, type "fps_max 0" into console.
f) Reload upward, retry test.
On my particular computer I was getting 500 fps and could do a full 180. At 30 fps I ran into the arrow sign just like star did.
Because if you call bollocks blindly and happened to be right, you're suddenly really internet cool.
The building is necessary to prevent an absurd sniper line of sight. But it also creates another problem. I might fix it by making the building more of a tower so you can't stand on it:
Line of sight from spawn is super restricted now.. this is the only sniping angle that I think exists.
The other route enters in here, opens up when your team is down to its last control point. I don't really like this and might delete it in favor of the "high road" that Crash suggested.
This is where that door goes:
And last, the new supersized center control point. I still worry it's too cramped but I think it's fun to fight in so hopefully it works out. You can also see the random structure I threw in on the left edge, just to compress things down a bit. I did put a nobuild up there but left it otherwise unclipped.
All brawlers welcome