Is the Force Awaken TIEs different than the Core TIEs in stats or just another color scheme? Because if it's just a color scheme you can point at the three different colors of the Interceptors to say they are the same. If the stats aren't, then they should be counted as different ships.
It's a different ship.
They're similar in their maneuver dials, but the TIE/fo has a new loop maneuver on it's dial, and has a point of shields.
The fo also has all 2 distance maneuvers as green, where the standard TIE has the 2 hard turns as white maneuvers.
The fo loses the speed 3 K-turn in exchange for having the Segnor loops available.
And of course, new pilots.
Yea, if it has a unique dial, it is a unique ship. Now they might add in a rule that says for epic purposes they are the same, but go for it right now!
The new Force Awakens TIEs are totally different sculpts than the old-school TIEs. It's hard to tell from pictures but having them in-hand, you can see when you look closely.
I really hate that some of the best pilots/upgrade cards come packaged with the big ships. I'd love to just drop the money on FFG for a set of them all (say 3 copies of non-unique stuff) instead of combing through eBay and paying insane prices per card.
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there's actually a surprisingly low number of EPTs Youngster can gift to everybody
Marksmanship, Expose (lol), Daredevil (probably not a good idea), Expert Handling (maybe??)
Expose does seem a little less terrible when you potentially have Howlrunner around to make up for the action loss, but... someone else will have to do the math on that. Expert Handling lets you never have to worry about target locks again, but that isn't going to help against every list, exactly
Marksmanship seems like the one that works best? Especially with Wampa on board, those two have some nice synergy.
I really hate that some of the best pilots/upgrade cards come packaged with the big ships. I'd love to just drop the money on FFG for a set of them all (say 3 copies of non-unique stuff) instead of combing through eBay and paying insane prices per card.
I just really want to see Epic take off a bit more.
I don't need tournaments, but I would like to be able to box up my Corvette and bring it to pick-up game nights with the reasonable expectation that a couple of other people will be flying the huge ships.
The thing about Epic is that it doesn't need to involve fifteen ships to either side.
I can easily dump enough points into the Tantive to fly a three or four ship list at 300 points.
Re: Youngster
Here is a concept list for the Expose Swarm;
Lambda Shuttle
Emperor Palpatine
Youngster
Expose
Academy Pilot x4
This leaves you at 96 points, so you can then either take Sensor Jammer on the shuttle or bump the Academy Pilots to Obsidian Squadron pilots.
It ought to work well because not every TIE fighter is going to be using Expose every turn. Not all of them will always be in position to shoot, and the ones that are most likely to be shot at will probably want to focus or evade. But say two out of the five are in good position to Expose each turn - one of those extra dice is statistically likely to roll a hit, and Palpatine can turn the other into a crit.
As the article mentions, there is one other possibility for Youngster's EPT - Squad Leader.
Kinda weird. Could be good. Not sure off the top of my head what the best way to utilize it would be.
webguy20I spend too much time on the InternetRegistered Userregular
edited November 2015
It is totally time to pick up the SCUM starter and another star viper. Huge bang for your buck right there. you'll have some amazing imperial lists and a lot of useful SCUM ships.
Played two games with @crimsoncoyote in realspace today.
First game, his two TIE Phantoms and Lambda Shuttle picked apart my Firespray and mini TIE Swarm.
Second game, my Outrider and Falcon did a hell of a lot better and I beat his Jake Farrell, B-Wing, and Outrider.
Great games for suuuuure
The following people are amazing and I love them: Wildcat, Timspork, Kias, Denada, susan, Sharp101, [GHSC]Ryctor, Matev, Matrias, ItBurns, Slapnuts, Dayspring, see317, and the unknown poster that sent me a box of Death Company! If you get them as Santees you should buy them amazing things!
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AegeriTiny wee bacteriumsPlateau of LengRegistered Userregular
So I got an SCYK today. Why is it so terrible? It's rather tie fighterish and a couple of them have some nice traits. Is there something MLG pro X-Wing I am missing here?
The Scyk is two points more than a TIE fighter or Headhunter without actually giving you anything for those points.
So you can't really fly a swarm of them, and the named pilots are kind've bad in any case.
But they also suffer from the problems that the A-wing & TIE Interceptor originally had; they are so fragile that you need absolutely all of your actions just to keep them alive.
But unlike those ships the Scyk title does nothing to remedy this. You don't get multiple Modifications, you don't get multiple Elite Pilot Talents, and you don't get Autothrusters at all.
So you can't safely spend many points on them.
The lack of a hard-3 on the maneuver dial is just icing.
The combination of the cannon slot, the K3/K5, and the green 1-bank is simply incredible though. It probably won't take more than one or two new cards to bring the Scyk to tournament tables, and it is certainly viable for casual games.
I think right now the thing to do is to fly two heavy Scyks together. One with a Mangler Cannon and one with an Ion Cannon.
Comes out to a minimum of 39 points. Not so bad if you think of a TIE Defender + Mangler, which comes to 34.
So instead of the white K-turn 4 you get an extra cannon, an extra modification slot (Hull Upgrades for both gives a good return on investment), an extra shot each turn, white hard turns, and the 3k and 5k.
5 points for all of that is pretty badass. And the truth is, most of those things are exactly what the TIE Defender needs anyway.
The problem here is the base Scyk does not fit into any of those roles, and its upgrades are very limited.
It has the stats of a jouster or arc dodger, but it's dial isn't as good as the other arc dodgers and it only has BR to help it get out of arc. And it can't take any upgrades that help with that (ok it could take engine upgrade, but that's just way too expensive). Scum already has a GREAT Arc-Dodger in the Starviper, especially a Virago. Also when comparing ship to ship with the rebel arc-dodger, after the fix to it, the cheap A-wing is 1 point more for a MUCH better dial, and an extra shield, and a missile slot costs it the same as the Heavy Scyk. It gets even worse with the next step up that can take an EPT, the Green Squad A-Wing is the SAME PRICE as the TPV with the only improvement being higher PS.
And as far as a jouster, why would you pick the base Scyk when scum can take the z95. It's cheaper, and it has one more shield, which makes it a better jouster. But still, as a cheap ship, you might be tempted to run a swarm. There is one non-Syck scum pilot that makes you want to take a swarm(Xizor) and a couple upgrades that makes swarms dangerous(feedback array, hot shot turret) but you want extra shield of the Z95 over the Scyk for Xizor, and the Scyk can't even TAKE illicit upgrades. Also in comparison to the other factions it's really hard to make scum swarms work. Imperials have several ships and abilities that make swarms better, Rebels have a few support ships and a really cheap-for-its-toughness jouster (B-wing) that makes the choice on who to shoot really hard. Scum has one pilot that makes swarms better(Serissu) and if you look in that article, the suggestion is to take her with ... Z95s.
Now when it first came out there was one situation to take it as a jouster: Heavy scyk with a mangler cannon. At 20 points you try to stay at range 3 and roll your 3 reds with no extra defense dice(since it is not a primary) and an auto upgrade to a crit. In return you are rolling 4 green against a primary shot back, not bad. You could take 5 of those or 4 plus an un-upgraded Serissu. But now that the next wave dropped, you can take a MUCH better Jouster at the same price (Kihraxz) that has an almost identical dial, exchanges a green for 2 extra hull, and gains a missile and an illicit slot for the loss of an evade and BR action. Also TLT makes sitting back at range 3 for defense a terrible idea, you are only rolling 3 green, which be the math means 1 damage from each TLT a turn, and you start losing sycks really fast.
So, it's not that the Syck is in and of itself a terrible ship, there are just better choices for the two roles it could fill already available to scum. It is very similar to the Pre-Raider Tie Advanced, it needs a fix, and there are several things they could do that would make it worthwhile to take.
So I decided to grab a whole bunch of this due to movie hype.
Currently have just the normal starter set but have on the way:
Rebel Aces
Force Unleashed Starter (two sets of rulers seems mandatory for not hating yourself)
Y Wing
Tie Bomber
Kinda curious if there's a good Imp buy to add some variety on that side. Also with those sets (and maybe one additional Imp ship) what would be two good 'starter' lists that don't do anything too fancy for me to teach the game to people with.
Yeah, was looking at that but was curious if there were any more distinct/unique looking ships for the IMPs I'm forgetting. While I like the TIE swarm aesthetic it'd be nice to have a center piece that wasn't just slim TIE, normal TIE and fat TIE.
So I decided to grab a whole bunch of this due to movie hype.
Currently have just the normal starter set but have on the way:
Rebel Aces
Force Unleashed Starter (two sets of rulers seems mandatory for not hating yourself)
Y Wing
Tie Bomber
Kinda curious if there's a good Imp buy to add some variety on that side. Also with those sets (and maybe one additional Imp ship) what would be two good 'starter' lists that don't do anything too fancy for me to teach the game to people with.
Imperial list:
100 points
Gamma Squadron Pilot [Proton Torpedoes, Seismic Charges]
“Omega Ace” [Wired]
Omega Squadron Pilot [Weapons Guidance, Adrenaline Rush]
“Mauler Mithel” [Determination]
Black Squadron Pilot [Marksmanship] (
This is a simple list, with a few tricks. All your ships either move on 4 or 7, which makes it easy to move in concert. Omega Ace should using Target lock from long range and then focus the next turn to activate its ability as much as possible, Omega squadron should save the Adrenaline rush for a turn when you need to K-turn or S-loop and still use weapon guidance. Aside from the bomber who needs to target lock to use his torpedo, all your ships should be Focusing each turn.
Rebels:
99 points
Blue Squadron Pilot (22)
“Dutch” Vander [R2 Astromech, Ion Cannon Turret] (29)
Blue Squadron Novice [BB-8] (26)
Rookie Pilot [R5-X3] (22)
Another simple list, only trick here is Dutch with a turret, and giving out a free Target lock to one other ship a turn.
Before you buy anything else, you really need to buy the expansion packs of the ships that come in the starters, so right now, an X-wing and a Tie fighter, and as soon as they come out the new Ep. VII ships. The upgrades in those expansions are great, and really kind of assumed. When building these lists I was often stymied by not being able to do things that I considered very standard.
With a Tie fighter for example you could run this list... which is just much better:
99 points
“Howlrunner” [Determination] (19)
Black Squadron Pilot (14)
Black Squadron Pilot (14)
Omega Squadron Pilot (17)
Omega Squadron Pilot (17)
those lists are pretty solid but I don't think they have access to Push the Limit with those ships. Maybe swap 'wired' over to Omega Ace and give the Black Squadron pilot Marksmanship?
Going to disagree about that last bit.
At this point the TIE fighter and X-wing standalones are kinda superfluous. In two years of competitive play, I've never felt the need to own either.
The pilots they come with are pretty cool, but unless you specifically want to fly a TIE swarm there is no reason to buy the TIE standalone. Biggs & Wedge are dear to me, but Luke is pretty much the X-wing ace and he comes in the core.
Like, which cards come with which pieces? If that's it, then the X-Wing Squadron Builder tool tells you for each pilot and upgrade where you can get them:
Also, @Albino Bunny , for your first "Teaching This Game to People" list (once you've gone over the basic turn sequence a bit), I recommend something like the following:
Rebels / Resistance (53)
Rookie Pilot (X-Wing) (PS 2)
Blue Squadron Novice (T-70 X-Wing) (PS 2)
2x Proton Torpedoes (one each to the above)
Empire / First Order (56)
Academy Pilot x2 (TIE Fighter) (PS 1)
Zeta Squadron Pilot x2 (TIE/fo Fighter) (PS3)
It uses only cards from the original and Force Awakens starters, lets you see the interaction between ships of different pilot skill levels, provides a couple tricks to play with (torpedoes for the Rebels, varied maneuver dials and action options) without being complicated ...
The mentioned Squad builder is very useful: http://xwing-builder.co.uk/
It will tell you where the upgrade if from, and if you make an account you can upload what ships you have and it will grey out upgrades you don't have access to while making a list.
And if you want more detail about what you get when you buy something there is the Wiki: http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/X-Wing_Miniatures_Wiki
If you scroll down on the front page it has links to details about every ship in order of release.
Posts
I'm sure they count as separate ships
It's a different ship.
They're similar in their maneuver dials, but the TIE/fo has a new loop maneuver on it's dial, and has a point of shields.
The fo also has all 2 distance maneuvers as green, where the standard TIE has the 2 hard turns as white maneuvers.
The fo loses the speed 3 K-turn in exchange for having the Segnor loops available.
And of course, new pilots.
Yea, if it has a unique dial, it is a unique ship. Now they might add in a rule that says for epic purposes they are the same, but go for it right now!
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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Marksmanship, Expose (lol), Daredevil (probably not a good idea), Expert Handling (maybe??)
Expose does seem a little less terrible when you potentially have Howlrunner around to make up for the action loss, but... someone else will have to do the math on that. Expert Handling lets you never have to worry about target locks again, but that isn't going to help against every list, exactly
Marksmanship seems like the one that works best? Especially with Wampa on board, those two have some nice synergy.
I just really want to see Epic take off a bit more.
I don't need tournaments, but I would like to be able to box up my Corvette and bring it to pick-up game nights with the reasonable expectation that a couple of other people will be flying the huge ships.
The thing about Epic is that it doesn't need to involve fifteen ships to either side.
I can easily dump enough points into the Tantive to fly a three or four ship list at 300 points.
Re: Youngster
Here is a concept list for the Expose Swarm;
Lambda Shuttle
Emperor Palpatine
Youngster
Expose
Academy Pilot x4
This leaves you at 96 points, so you can then either take Sensor Jammer on the shuttle or bump the Academy Pilots to Obsidian Squadron pilots.
It ought to work well because not every TIE fighter is going to be using Expose every turn. Not all of them will always be in position to shoot, and the ones that are most likely to be shot at will probably want to focus or evade. But say two out of the five are in good position to Expose each turn - one of those extra dice is statistically likely to roll a hit, and Palpatine can turn the other into a crit.
As the article mentions, there is one other possibility for Youngster's EPT - Squad Leader.
Kinda weird. Could be good. Not sure off the top of my head what the best way to utilize it would be.
@webguy20's gift
And all my ships together
Origin ID: Discgolfer27
Untappd ID: Discgolfer1981
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
First game, his two TIE Phantoms and Lambda Shuttle picked apart my Firespray and mini TIE Swarm.
Second game, my Outrider and Falcon did a hell of a lot better and I beat his Jake Farrell, B-Wing, and Outrider.
Great games for suuuuure
So you can't really fly a swarm of them, and the named pilots are kind've bad in any case.
But they also suffer from the problems that the A-wing & TIE Interceptor originally had; they are so fragile that you need absolutely all of your actions just to keep them alive.
But unlike those ships the Scyk title does nothing to remedy this. You don't get multiple Modifications, you don't get multiple Elite Pilot Talents, and you don't get Autothrusters at all.
So you can't safely spend many points on them.
The lack of a hard-3 on the maneuver dial is just icing.
The combination of the cannon slot, the K3/K5, and the green 1-bank is simply incredible though. It probably won't take more than one or two new cards to bring the Scyk to tournament tables, and it is certainly viable for casual games.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
I think right now the thing to do is to fly two heavy Scyks together. One with a Mangler Cannon and one with an Ion Cannon.
Comes out to a minimum of 39 points. Not so bad if you think of a TIE Defender + Mangler, which comes to 34.
So instead of the white K-turn 4 you get an extra cannon, an extra modification slot (Hull Upgrades for both gives a good return on investment), an extra shot each turn, white hard turns, and the 3k and 5k.
5 points for all of that is pretty badass. And the truth is, most of those things are exactly what the TIE Defender needs anyway.
https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2015/2/19/it-is-the-future-you-see-wave-6/
Turrets beat Arc-Dodgers beat Jousters beat Turrets ...
The problem here is the base Scyk does not fit into any of those roles, and its upgrades are very limited.
It has the stats of a jouster or arc dodger, but it's dial isn't as good as the other arc dodgers and it only has BR to help it get out of arc. And it can't take any upgrades that help with that (ok it could take engine upgrade, but that's just way too expensive). Scum already has a GREAT Arc-Dodger in the Starviper, especially a Virago. Also when comparing ship to ship with the rebel arc-dodger, after the fix to it, the cheap A-wing is 1 point more for a MUCH better dial, and an extra shield, and a missile slot costs it the same as the Heavy Scyk. It gets even worse with the next step up that can take an EPT, the Green Squad A-Wing is the SAME PRICE as the TPV with the only improvement being higher PS.
And as far as a jouster, why would you pick the base Scyk when scum can take the z95. It's cheaper, and it has one more shield, which makes it a better jouster. But still, as a cheap ship, you might be tempted to run a swarm. There is one non-Syck scum pilot that makes you want to take a swarm(Xizor) and a couple upgrades that makes swarms dangerous(feedback array, hot shot turret) but you want extra shield of the Z95 over the Scyk for Xizor, and the Scyk can't even TAKE illicit upgrades. Also in comparison to the other factions it's really hard to make scum swarms work. Imperials have several ships and abilities that make swarms better, Rebels have a few support ships and a really cheap-for-its-toughness jouster (B-wing) that makes the choice on who to shoot really hard. Scum has one pilot that makes swarms better(Serissu) and if you look in that article, the suggestion is to take her with ... Z95s.
Now when it first came out there was one situation to take it as a jouster: Heavy scyk with a mangler cannon. At 20 points you try to stay at range 3 and roll your 3 reds with no extra defense dice(since it is not a primary) and an auto upgrade to a crit. In return you are rolling 4 green against a primary shot back, not bad. You could take 5 of those or 4 plus an un-upgraded Serissu. But now that the next wave dropped, you can take a MUCH better Jouster at the same price (Kihraxz) that has an almost identical dial, exchanges a green for 2 extra hull, and gains a missile and an illicit slot for the loss of an evade and BR action. Also TLT makes sitting back at range 3 for defense a terrible idea, you are only rolling 3 green, which be the math means 1 damage from each TLT a turn, and you start losing sycks really fast.
So, it's not that the Syck is in and of itself a terrible ship, there are just better choices for the two roles it could fill already available to scum. It is very similar to the Pre-Raider Tie Advanced, it needs a fix, and there are several things they could do that would make it worthwhile to take.
Certain ships are very good at standing-off out at range 3.
Currently have just the normal starter set but have on the way:
Rebel Aces
Force Unleashed Starter (two sets of rulers seems mandatory for not hating yourself)
Y Wing
Tie Bomber
Kinda curious if there's a good Imp buy to add some variety on that side. Also with those sets (and maybe one additional Imp ship) what would be two good 'starter' lists that don't do anything too fancy for me to teach the game to people with.
On my phone so I'll have to post specifics later, but someone will probably beat me to it
http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Advanced_Expansion_Pack
and the tie punisher, aka two tie bombers duct-taped together, which would give you a lot of fun options for ordinance
http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/TIE_Punisher_Expansion_Pack
but yeah if you're playing imperials your options are all various sizes/shapes of ties, the Lambda shuttle, and Decimator basically
I don't think anyone knows definitively, but I don't see the empire getting any more of em'
the Firespray feels like a one-off at this point
Imperial list:
Gamma Squadron Pilot [Proton Torpedoes, Seismic Charges]
“Omega Ace” [Wired]
Omega Squadron Pilot [Weapons Guidance, Adrenaline Rush]
“Mauler Mithel” [Determination]
Black Squadron Pilot [Marksmanship] (
Rebels:
Blue Squadron Pilot (22)
“Dutch” Vander [R2 Astromech, Ion Cannon Turret] (29)
Blue Squadron Novice [BB-8] (26)
Rookie Pilot [R5-X3] (22)
Another simple list, only trick here is Dutch with a turret, and giving out a free Target lock to one other ship a turn.
Before you buy anything else, you really need to buy the expansion packs of the ships that come in the starters, so right now, an X-wing and a Tie fighter, and as soon as they come out the new Ep. VII ships. The upgrades in those expansions are great, and really kind of assumed. When building these lists I was often stymied by not being able to do things that I considered very standard.
With a Tie fighter for example you could run this list... which is just much better:
“Howlrunner” [Determination] (19)
Black Squadron Pilot (14)
Black Squadron Pilot (14)
Omega Squadron Pilot (17)
Omega Squadron Pilot (17)
Scimitar Squadron Pilot [Seismic Charges] (18)
At this point the TIE fighter and X-wing standalones are kinda superfluous. In two years of competitive play, I've never felt the need to own either.
The pilots they come with are pretty cool, but unless you specifically want to fly a TIE swarm there is no reason to buy the TIE standalone. Biggs & Wedge are dear to me, but Luke is pretty much the X-wing ace and he comes in the core.
Is there any like, set review sites or similar I could skim through?
Like, which cards come with which pieces? If that's it, then the X-Wing Squadron Builder tool tells you for each pilot and upgrade where you can get them:
http://xwing-builder.co.uk/build
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
It uses only cards from the original and Force Awakens starters, lets you see the interaction between ships of different pilot skill levels, provides a couple tricks to play with (torpedoes for the Rebels, varied maneuver dials and action options) without being complicated ...
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
Imperial guide:
http://www.d20radio.com/main/?p=1037
Rebel guide:
http://www.d20radio.com/main/?p=1057
Scum Guide:
http://www.d20radio.com/main/?p=1069
The mentioned Squad builder is very useful:
http://xwing-builder.co.uk/
It will tell you where the upgrade if from, and if you make an account you can upload what ships you have and it will grey out upgrades you don't have access to while making a list.
And if you want more detail about what you get when you buy something there is the Wiki:
http://xwing-miniatures.wikia.com/wiki/X-Wing_Miniatures_Wiki
If you scroll down on the front page it has links to details about every ship in order of release.