"They make fun of everybody!" is and always will be the lazy, cowardly excuse of spineless douchebags who want to be able to say and do offensive, egregious shit to victimized, marginalized people without consequence.
It's not a credits system. You don't get to earn a pass to be misogynistic or transphobic or racist or whatever by making fun of white male republicans. I'm not saying there are things that are forbidden to be joked about, but for god's sake if you are going to make a joke you know fucking well is offensive it ought to at least be funny instead of "lol married women are vacuous whores, m i rite fellas?"
And a lot of time, that's the joke in GTA V. The punchline is "women are whores", "liberals are pussies", "republicans are morons". That's the joke. The joke is an insult to a group. It's the laziest form of "comedy" possible and it's the least responsible when you just shotgun blast it at random.
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UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
Not that those lines aren't terrible, but GTA is an equal opportunity abuser to everyone's sensibilities. White people, black people, rich people, poor people, gay people, addicts, police, animal lovers, etc.
To point out that the morally degenerate characters in the game (who already hate everyone) make snide remarks about transexuals is a bit redundant.
the problem with "equal opportunity harassment" is that not all populations are equal in power, and even if the treatnment of trans folks is only as bad as the treatment of rich white cis men (which I don't believe to be true in this case), the effect is made that much worse because it's added to all the other bullshit trans folks need to deal with on a daily basis. Like, they have it hard enough already, why make it harder?
Not that those lines aren't terrible, but GTA is an equal opportunity abuser to everyone's sensibilities. White people, black people, rich people, poor people, gay people, addicts, police, animal lovers, etc.
To point out that the morally degenerate characters in the game (who already hate everyone) make snide remarks about transexuals is a bit redundant.
no
Please explain why.
Like I said, that humor really is terrible. It's not funny.
But it really just seems like more of the same over the top and juvenile stupidity that is all throughout the game. Why is this particular thing so much worse? I'm interested.
Or have I misread your "no"? Are you saying that all of the humor is terrible and the transphobic stuff is just another piece of garbage in the trash sandwich that is GTA's humor?
being an "equal opportunity abuser" does not make anything better
not that gta actually is an "equal opportunity abuser" because it is quite benevolent in its portrayal of cis people and this is its only portrayal of trans people
Not that those lines aren't terrible, but GTA is an equal opportunity abuser to everyone's sensibilities. White people, black people, rich people, poor people, gay people, addicts, police, animal lovers, etc.
To point out that the morally degenerate characters in the game (who already hate everyone) make snide remarks about transexuals is a bit redundant.
no
Please explain why.
Like I said, that humor really is terrible. It's not funny.
But it really just seems like more of the same over the top and juvenile stupidity that is all throughout the game. Why is this particular thing so much worse? I'm interested.
Or have I misread your "no"? Are you saying that all of the humor is terrible and the transphobic stuff is just another piece of garbage in the trash sandwich that is GTA's humor?
being an "equal opportunity abuser" does not make anything better
not that gta actually is an "equal opportunity abuser" because it is quite benevolent in its portrayal of cis people and this is its only portrayal of trans people
i dunno, portraying most of its characters (who are all cisgendered) as whoremongering, vicious, misogynistic assholes ain't exactly benovolent
but with the power dynamics between cis and trans so completely out of whack that's hardly relevant
like there are numerous radio ads that basically call all women (married women especially) vapid, self-absorbed, materialistic skanks who are basically to blame for everything men do wrong
is everyone getting this cutscene when they die in gta online
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UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
it's like
great, you're shitting all over everybody, and you think that makes it fair
except some of the people being shit on kind of deserve it
and most of them are comfortable enough that they can take a bit of shit and it's not really going to hurt them in any meaningful way
but some of the people being shit on? They're being shit on by large portions of society already, so for them to be additionally shit on by something they turned to for entertainment, maybe a bit of escapism from a life in which being shat on is all too commonplace? That really sucks.
in general, the trick to any kind of racist, sexist, or any other kind of hateful joke that you are trying to tell is to make it clear you're telling a joke and to make it actually funny.
the audience, in the end, should be A) laughing and not doubting whether or not you're actually a bigot
if you can't do A and B, then you should leave "edgy" comedy alone
GTA V can rarely do either, let alone both, and both is necessary.
I honestly didn't find the story even remotely funny when it "tried"
Huge parts of the game made me very uncomfortable at parts that it seemed like the majority of the target audience was supposed to laugh at.
It's not like they can't make a game with interesting characters with interesting relationships to eachother.
But even then they only ever have psychopathic mass murdering men waxing poetic about their morality or lack therof in between shooting sprees and radio jokes about "liberals and conservatives" and always always poking fun at victimized people on the radio stations and side missions.
To those who have finished the single-player: what sort of optional stuff is there? I would have no idea about this Epsilon thing with Michael if I hadn't read our last thread. Do Trevor and Frank have secret missions like Michael?
There is a fair amount of stuff to do, but to be honest, its pretty low key and/or short. The Epsilon missions are okay, but there is nothing like that for Trevor or Franklin.
There are the four alien spacecraft to find and see, and the mystery of Mount Chiliad to be solved, but I've come up against a brick wall with that (like most people)
in general, the trick to any kind of racist, sexist, or any other kind of hateful joke that you are trying to tell is to make it clear you're telling a joke and to make it actually funny.
the audience, in the end, should be A) laughing and not doubting whether or not you're actually a bigot
if you can't do A and B, then you should leave "edgy" comedy alone
GTA V can rarely do either, let alone both, and both is necessary.
They key to A, or at least the best way to not be a bigot in comedy, is choosing the right target. Jokes about racism work best when you're targetting racists, not minorities. Hell, Louis C.K. has come the closest to anyone I've heard to making a good, or at least not-shit rape joke, and he does so by making sure he's mocking rapists, not their victims.
If Rockstar really wanted to tell a joke involving trans folk, they should have found a way to make transphobes the butt of the joke. I have serious doubts whether it's possible to tell a funny, not harmful joke on the subject at all at this time, and it's definitley beyond Rockstar's writing staff, but at least they'd have been punching in the right direction.
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turtleantGunpla Dadis the best.Registered Userregular
The news story about crowdfunding kinda really bugged me.
A) it's not funny to insinuate everyone that uses crowdfunding websites is a lazy cheapskate who wants to cheat people out of their money, and I don't know if R* is really in the position to make that "joke" in good faith seeing as they had the biggest budget ever for making this game.
I decided to close GTA Online when it froze on a loading screen, when I tried again later my character had become an inhuman hairless monster wearing headphones.
To those who have finished the single-player: what sort of optional stuff is there? I would have no idea about this Epsilon thing with Michael if I hadn't read our last thread. Do Trevor and Frank have secret missions like Michael?
There is a fair amount of stuff to do, but to be honest, its pretty low key and/or short. The Epsilon missions are okay, but there is nothing like that for Trevor or Franklin.
There are the four alien spacecraft to find and see, and the mystery of Mount Chiliad to be solved, but I've come up against a brick wall with that (like most people)
Wait a sec what's
the mystery of Mt. Chiliad
There's the mural inside the cable car station at the top of Mount Chiliad, and scratched into the back panel of the viewing platform is the message "Come back when your story is complete", and underneat the viewing platform is the symbol painted at the top of the mural.
There's a lot of speculation, that it leads to a jetpack as that is also pictured in the mural.
Silmaril on
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ArtreusI'm a wizardAnd that looks fucked upRegistered Userregular
While we're on the "stuff that makes me kind of uncomfortable in this game" train
the "kill yourself" option in GTA Online where you just shoot yourself in the head with a pistol kind of makes me uncomfortable
Posts
Like whored mode and anything to do with Zimos
also the dildo bat
It's not a credits system. You don't get to earn a pass to be misogynistic or transphobic or racist or whatever by making fun of white male republicans. I'm not saying there are things that are forbidden to be joked about, but for god's sake if you are going to make a joke you know fucking well is offensive it ought to at least be funny instead of "lol married women are vacuous whores, m i rite fellas?"
And a lot of time, that's the joke in GTA V. The punchline is "women are whores", "liberals are pussies", "republicans are morons". That's the joke. The joke is an insult to a group. It's the laziest form of "comedy" possible and it's the least responsible when you just shotgun blast it at random.
the problem with "equal opportunity harassment" is that not all populations are equal in power, and even if the treatnment of trans folks is only as bad as the treatment of rich white cis men (which I don't believe to be true in this case), the effect is made that much worse because it's added to all the other bullshit trans folks need to deal with on a daily basis. Like, they have it hard enough already, why make it harder?
being an "equal opportunity abuser" does not make anything better
not that gta actually is an "equal opportunity abuser" because it is quite benevolent in its portrayal of cis people and this is its only portrayal of trans people
it wasn't as cathartic as it ought to be because i'm not a vengeful person by nature and it doesn't result in anything consequential
Tried this but the missions wouldn't start.
i dunno, portraying most of its characters (who are all cisgendered) as whoremongering, vicious, misogynistic assholes ain't exactly benovolent
but with the power dynamics between cis and trans so completely out of whack that's hardly relevant
there's no punchline
they just say it outright
that's the "joke"
UH
is everyone getting this cutscene when they die in gta online
great, you're shitting all over everybody, and you think that makes it fair
except some of the people being shit on kind of deserve it
and most of them are comfortable enough that they can take a bit of shit and it's not really going to hurt them in any meaningful way
but some of the people being shit on? They're being shit on by large portions of society already, so for them to be additionally shit on by something they turned to for entertainment, maybe a bit of escapism from a life in which being shat on is all too commonplace? That really sucks.
hahahah yeah
the audience, in the end, should be A) laughing and
if you can't do A and B, then you should leave "edgy" comedy alone
GTA V can rarely do either, let alone both, and both is necessary.
Huge parts of the game made me very uncomfortable at parts that it seemed like the majority of the target audience was supposed to laugh at.
It's not like they can't make a game with interesting characters with interesting relationships to eachother.
But even then they only ever have psychopathic mass murdering men waxing poetic about their morality or lack therof in between shooting sprees and radio jokes about "liberals and conservatives" and always always poking fun at victimized people on the radio stations and side missions.
Chop don't get paid, Chop a intern
Follow me on Twitter??
I know its one of the cruder lines
But the hardest I think I laughed in the whole game is the end of Lamar's speech when he's busting down Franklin
The way he delivers 'Nword' is just so incredibly perfect
Edit: Didn't know we couldn't use it even in quote, sorry.
When at least call of duty is adding women soldiers and avoids taking a shit on minorities when they can.
Well, I guess call of duty does shit on anyone that isn't a part of NATO huh?
But still, the hypocrisy is staggering.
Wait a sec what's
that bit is fucking hilarious, his voice actor just nails it
Follow me on Twitter??
Video itself is fine but audio is NSFW
does he
does he want to fuck me
Follow me on Twitter??
This and the Employee of the Month stuff are close to my favorite parts of the game
god, Lamar needs more screen time
Follow me on Twitter??
They key to A, or at least the best way to not be a bigot in comedy, is choosing the right target. Jokes about racism work best when you're targetting racists, not minorities. Hell, Louis C.K. has come the closest to anyone I've heard to making a good, or at least not-shit rape joke, and he does so by making sure he's mocking rapists, not their victims.
If Rockstar really wanted to tell a joke involving trans folk, they should have found a way to make transphobes the butt of the joke. I have serious doubts whether it's possible to tell a funny, not harmful joke on the subject at all at this time, and it's definitley beyond Rockstar's writing staff, but at least they'd have been punching in the right direction.
A) it's not funny to insinuate everyone that uses crowdfunding websites is a lazy cheapskate who wants to cheat people out of their money, and
It's like a millionaire making fun of food banks.
deep, man
I did think about keeping it for a moment.
like he doesn't really give a shit about being employee of the month, it's the principle of not winning and being first at something that galls him
There's a lot of speculation, that it leads to a jetpack as that is also pictured in the mural.
the "kill yourself" option in GTA Online where you just shoot yourself in the head with a pistol kind of makes me uncomfortable
Why is this an option
like, what purpose does it serve
like someone kills an idler, the other players then get extra money for killing the bad sport