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[Kerbal Space Program] OLD THREAD! Periapsis too low! Abandon ship!

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Posts

  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    $16 was finally enough to make me take the plunge.

    Let's kill some Kerbals.

    SceptreZilla360Commander ZoomDaedaluscrimsoncoyoteGnome-InterruptusHyphyKezzy
  • DacDac Registered User regular
    Welcome to perhaps one of the best value-for-money videogames out there.

    Steam: catseye543
    PSN: ShogunGunshow
    Origin: ShogunGunshow
    ElvenshaeNotoriusBENDrovekSceptreStrikorEvigilantDhalphirZilla360Al_watCommander ZoomcrimsoncoyoteDissociaterHyphyKezzy
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Holy shit this game is awesome.

    No failures at the launch pad yet, only failures to accurately judge how far i'm able to get with the fuel I have available. Did salvage an orbit attempt into an impromptu vacation in what looked like New Zealand, though.

    DhalphirZilla360Elvenshae
  • PA DallasPA Dallas Registered User regular
    Kerbal rocks. Been playing the hell out of the demo. Made myself a deal that if I can get to the Mun and back I'll buy the full version. Doing pretty good so far, got myself into a sweet 25K orbit around the Mun. At this point I did a quicksave and went in for a landing. Let's just say that Jeb is now a crater and leave it at that. :) Found out the hard way that quickload isn't working right on my Mac so I'm going to have to start all over. :(

    I saw a werewolf drinkin' a pina colada at Trader Vic's.
    And his hair was perfect.
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  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    I got a pretty good idea of what I was in for when the Mun tutorial didn't give me enough fuel to get myself into orbit around it.

  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Scanning for sweet, sweet Kethane goodies.
    D3E77144FED0CCF2A99397CC4A98BC728E97A2BD

    Zilla360Elvenshaecrimsoncoyote
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    I got a pretty good idea of what I was in for when the Mun tutorial didn't give me enough fuel to get myself into orbit around it.

    The Mun tutorial ship almost certainly has enough fuel to get into orbit, you may have been flying inefficiently. But I can't recall precisely.

  • webguy20webguy20 I spend too much time on the Internet Registered User regular
    yea, between this game and minecraft I have gotten so much game for for so little dollar.

    Steam ID: Webguy20
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    InfamyDeferredZilla360ElvenshaeVedicIntent
  • SorensonSorenson Registered User regular
    Oh wow, had a killer asteroid coming in that intersected Minmus who whipped the fucker into a stable outer-reaches orbit. Minmus, you are the good moon, not like your cragass layabout brother with his uneven surfaces and inferior science-to-effort ratio.

    SceptreZilla360StrikorElvenshaeInfamyDeferredGnome-InterruptusHyphyKezzyAnti-Sean
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Now to figure out how to get this communications satellite into geostationary orbit.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Geostationary orbit is around 2400kms

  • FiskebentFiskebent DenmarkRegistered User regular
    I did the math once and dug out my notes. Geostationary orbit is at 2,868,750 meters and you need to go 1009.019 m/s.

    steam_sig.png
    Zilla360
  • Zilla360Zilla360 21st Century. |She/Her| Trans* Woman In Aviators Firing A Bazooka. ⚛️Registered User regular
    Mini shuttles are neato!
    1024x768.resizedimage
    1024x768.resizedimage
    1024x768.resizedimage
    1024x768.resizedimage
    I may have sliiightly overshot the KSC runway...
    1257EE6F68183C7CEBEC3241ADF74B2B69379BE8
    I knew I'd mess it up, so I dropped everyone else off at the station beforehand, leaving 'Danger Zone' Dilfen as skeleton crew, to get the bird home...
    1024x768.resizedimage
    Turns out it was a good idea. He didn't disappoint, as somehow the cockpit survived a 45mph altercation with a hill...

    NH844lc.png | PSN | GACSALB.jpg My Blog |🏳️‍⚧️♥️
    Commander ZoomDhalphirStrikorDaedalusElvenshaecrimsoncoyoteElbasunuGnome-InterruptusHyphyKezzy
  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    I've been looking at that mod for a while now. I think I'll need to make a custom texture / registry for it, though: Ranger 3.

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    Steam, Warframe: Megajoule
  • DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    I was using that mod for a little while, and it was really well put-together and easy to fly, but the fact that the shuttle pieces didn't really plug in to any other parts in the game bothered me. It's like a Lego set that comes with a couple of those big ultra-specifically shaped blocks.

    So now I'm using this and I'll make my own shuttle. Still need to get the hang of landing reliably, though.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Yeah I preferred the challenge of making my own shuttle with B9 parts.
    M0q6qyD.png
    vchRUVy.png

    Zilla360HyphyKezzy
  • DaedalusDaedalus Registered User regular
    I just wish the B9 landing gear was as forgiving as the KSO gear.

    On a related note, is there an ejection seat mod anywhere?

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Daedalus wrote: »
    I just wish the B9 landing gear was as forgiving as the KSO gear.

    On a related note, is there an ejection seat mod anywhere?

    I've seen scott manley use one, I think in Reusable Space Program, but I don't know what the mod is or if it's still updated.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Zilla360Elvenshae
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Geostationary orbit plans on hold. New goal is to figure out how to reliably take off in a particular trajectory each time. Takeoffs are barely controllable and I still haven't quite figured out what that blue and orange ball means, or what direction to aim at on it to go a particular direction. I mostly just use planned maneuvers in space and point at the blue target but I can't seem to figure out how to plan all that out at launch.

    Running out of science to do on Kerbin as well. Maybe I should make a plane and try to find more biomes.

  • ShogunShogun Hair long; money long; me and broke wizards we don't get along Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Geostationary orbit plans on hold. New goal is to figure out how to reliably take off in a particular trajectory each time. Takeoffs are barely controllable and I still haven't quite figured out what that blue and orange ball means, or what direction to aim at on it to go a particular direction. I mostly just use planned maneuvers in space and point at the blue target but I can't seem to figure out how to plan all that out at launch.

    Running out of science to do on Kerbin as well. Maybe I should make a plane and try to find more biomes.

    Blue is sky orange is ground. If you're ever in atmosphere and the orange side is on the top then you're not going to space today. When attempting to achieve orbit you want to make your turn on the 90 degree heading (east) to maximize your delta-v via Kerbin's gravitational assistance.

    ElvenshaeZilla360Gnome-InterruptusCommander Zoom
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    To further expand:

    Go straight up for the first 10-12km
    Then flip to a 45 degree on the 90 heading to start your parabolic arc
    Switch to the orbital view, and watch until your Apoapse is ~90km and cut engines.
    Once your Apoapse is ~90km, change your coarse so it is on the horizon line at the 90 heading (line between the blue/orange) and then full throttle to circularize orbit.

    steam_sig.png
    MWO: Adamski
    Commander Zoom
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Scott Manley has done a few videos talking about initial lift off technique and setting up initial stable orbit. I also watched a video a long time ago that describes a really good, but fiddly technique.

    Basically, yeah, vertical climb to about 10,000 meters. Start leaning in the direction you want to go (Easiest is equatorial in the direction of planetary rotation. Basically, the 90 degree mark on your nav ball). The fiddly technique is to control your attitude and thrust to keep your apoapsis only a few seconds in front of you, 10 or so, and gradually move towards a horizontal attitude. The great thing about this technique: It's very fuel efficient, and when you're done (If you've done it right), you will have a circularized orbit with no further maneuvers necessary. The not so great thing: It's really easy to mess it up and not go to space today. :P

    Gnome's way is basically the easiest while also being not terribly inefficient.

    The way I do it now is in stages. 10km vertical, then nose over to 45 degrees. Once my apoapsis is about 1 min in front, I bring my nose down to about 60 degrees. As I get close to my target altitude, I bring it down further, usually just above horizontal until my apoapsis is at my target orbital altitude.

    Gnome-InterruptusZilla360Commander Zoom
  • ElvenshaeElvenshae Registered User regular
    edited April 2014
    To further expand:

    Go straight up for the first 10-12km
    Then flip to a 45 degree on the 90 heading to start your parabolic arc
    Switch to the orbital view, and watch until your Apoapse is ~90km and cut engines.
    Once your Apoapse is ~90km, change your coarse so it is on the horizon line at the 90 heading (line between the blue/orange) and then full throttle to circularize orbit.

    This'll work, yeah.

    I like to actually start turning, slowly, at about 5k-7k, so that I'm already at 45* when I hit the 10k-12k region, and then slowly kick over to a flat trajectory as I continue to climb.

    This is way easier with MechJeb's SmartAss, where you can enter a heading and an inclination and it'll do its best to hold it there, but you can do it manually, as well.

    I also try to keep my apoapsis about 30s in front of me, if I can - you improve your fuel efficiency when moving the periapsis (the point in your orbit which is on the opposite side of your apoapsis, and which starts out deeeeeeeep inside Kerbin) the closer to your apoapsis you're burning.

    The main point to remember, when it comes to orbits, is that they aren't really about going up; they're about going sideways really, really fast. The only reason you need to go up is to get yourself out of the atmosphere, because atmosphere = drag, drag = slowing down, slowing down = hard to go sideways really, really fast.

    That's why you can have a stable orbit at about 5km over the Munar surface, but you need to be at 70+km above Kerbin.

    Elvenshae on
    Zilla360
  • TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Geostationary orbit plans on hold. New goal is to figure out how to reliably take off in a particular trajectory each time. Takeoffs are barely controllable and I still haven't quite figured out what that blue and orange ball means, or what direction to aim at on it to go a particular direction. I mostly just use planned maneuvers in space and point at the blue target but I can't seem to figure out how to plan all that out at launch.

    Running out of science to do on Kerbin as well. Maybe I should make a plane and try to find more biomes.

    Blue is sky orange is ground. If you're ever in atmosphere and the orange side is on the top then you're not going to space today. When attempting to achieve orbit you want to make your turn on the 90 degree heading (east) to maximize your delta-v via Kerbin's gravitational assistance.

    To elaborate, the little green circle is your velocity vector (also called your prograde vector), it tells you which way your ship is traveling. The green circle with the X in the center is the opposite of that (your retrograde vector) so if you want to slow down then you would point yourself in that direction and burn.

    The basic recipe for achieving orbit in KSP unmodded is this:
    1. Burn straight up until you hit ~10km. Throttle back if you start going faster than 250m/s.
    2. At 10km, turn your ship eastward (pointing towards the 90 degree marker on the navball) at about a 45 degree angle (halfway between the straight up point and the horizon on the navball). Throttle up to max if you haven't already.
    3. At about 30km, press M to go to the planetary map and examine your projected path. Mouse over the little "AP" sign to see your apoapsis, the highest point in your trajectory. Kill your throttle once this AP gets to about 75km (70km is where Kerbin's atmosphere ends, but you want a bit of leeway).
    4. Once you're above 70km, point your ship directly east (right on the horizon, should be pretty close to where your prograde vector is pointing) and burn. Keep burning and watch as your projected path expands farther and farther, until eventually it loops around the entire planet. Keep burning to see your periapsis, the low point in your orbit. to achieve true orbit you need your periapsis above 70km, or your ship will hit the atmosphere and start slowing down.

    It's in spoilers just in case you really want to figure this stuff out for yourself, but it's not a secret or anything.

    ElvenshaeZilla360Commander ZoomJacoby
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Thanks guys, helps a lot.

    I need to get better at designing my rockets now, because occasionally i'll go into a spin during initial ascent. No horrible crashes and burns yet though.

  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Thanks guys, helps a lot.

    I need to get better at designing my rockets now, because occasionally i'll go into a spin during initial ascent. No horrible crashes and burns yet though.

    Hit 't' to turn on your SAS flight stabilization system. This will try to keep your ship flying straight.

    You can improve how strong your SAS system is by adding things like tailfins / stabilizers / RCS thrusters / etc.

    steam_sig.png
    MWO: Adamski
    ElvenshaeCommander Zoom
  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Dac wrote: »
    What I've been doing is putting a lab on wheels on the Mun. It also has a ridiculously huge nuclear plant and electricity generator on it because ... I don't know. Coolness reasons? I use mechjeb to set waypoints for it to drive to (Jeb does the driving in my mind, mechjeb is just used because fuck having to play desert bus on the Mun). Drive to new biome, do the experiments, then have Jeb get out and collect the data while Bill and Bob clean out the goo container and materials bay. After hitting a few biomes and collecting a lot of data, I send an unmanned probe and land it near the lab. Jeb again gets out to take all the data to the probe, stuffs it in an empty pilot's container, and sends the probe back to Kerbin.

    How do you avoid crashing and burning on the weirdly slippery terrain? Even on flat ground on the Mun I often had trouble with landers.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
  • DacDac Registered User regular
    Mostly by going slow. The large nuclear reactor actually serves the purpose of providing enough weight that the wheels bite. If I'm being safe in my rover settings, I usually set it to around 7.5m/s. Any faster and I'm likely to Dukes of Hazard off little slopes.

    Even so, I stop occasionally to do quick saves, because I have come back after a half an hour to find my intricately plotted, 'safe' course put the Mobile Lab on its side because there was a wrinkle in the terrain I didn't see.

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  • Zilla360Zilla360 21st Century. |She/Her| Trans* Woman In Aviators Firing A Bazooka. ⚛️Registered User regular
    Has this been posted yet? In any case it deserves a re-post.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-ca8AYblFg

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  • PA DallasPA Dallas Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Thanks guys, helps a lot.

    I need to get better at designing my rockets now, because occasionally i'll go into a spin during initial ascent. No horrible crashes and burns yet though.

    Go on YouTube and look for Scott Manley, his videos are awesome. I found 2 videos that were really helpful when I was starting out. They're called how to get to the Mun and back using demo parts. Of course I had to "improve" his design by adding a crap ton of solid fuel boosters to it. :)

    I saw a werewolf drinkin' a pina colada at Trader Vic's.
    And his hair was perfect.
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    ElvenshaeZilla360
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

  • ShogunShogun Hair long; money long; me and broke wizards we don't get along Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    InfamyDeferredElvenshae
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    Aha, yes. There they are, thanks. I didn't get any science from them, but at least I cleaned up the oceans.

    It also happened with my second attempt. I need to figure out how to land where I want to.

  • ShogunShogun Hair long; money long; me and broke wizards we don't get along Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    Aha, yes. There they are, thanks. I didn't get any science from them, but at least I cleaned up the oceans.

    It also happened with my second attempt. I need to figure out how to land where I want to.

    Keep in mind that vanilla Kerbin's atmosphere is actually pretty thick and soupy. Lotta drag as you're traveling through it. There is nothing wrong with landing in the water as long as nothing is moving too quickly when it hits the water's surface. If you can recover the craft or the parts intact you should get your science back from them. Did you actually use the experiments out in space or near the moon?

  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    Aha, yes. There they are, thanks. I didn't get any science from them, but at least I cleaned up the oceans.

    It also happened with my second attempt. I need to figure out how to land where I want to.

    Keep in mind that vanilla Kerbin's atmosphere is actually pretty thick and soupy. Lotta drag as you're traveling through it. There is nothing wrong with landing in the water as long as nothing is moving too quickly when it hits the water's surface. If you can recover the craft or the parts intact you should get your science back from them. Did you actually use the experiments out in space or near the moon?

    I did, yeah. High Mun orbit and low Mun orbit. 75 science each, lost at sea :(

    What happens is I land in the water and they snap off and sink to the bottom. Then when I recovered no science recovery message came up, it just removed it from the map. If I was on land it'd be fine, i've got those little leg thingies. Those snap off in the water too, though. Only the module seems to float.

    At least I had the goo containers and crew/eva reports so it wasn't a total loss.

    Plus I actually made it to the goddamn Mun.

    Commander ZoomZilla360
  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Thanks guys, helps a lot.

    I need to get better at designing my rockets now, because occasionally i'll go into a spin during initial ascent. No horrible crashes and burns yet though.

    If you haven't had a horrible crash and burn, you're doing great. A decent chunk of my designs explode on liftoff.

    Elvenshae
  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    Aha, yes. There they are, thanks. I didn't get any science from them, but at least I cleaned up the oceans.

    It also happened with my second attempt. I need to figure out how to land where I want to.

    Keep in mind that vanilla Kerbin's atmosphere is actually pretty thick and soupy. Lotta drag as you're traveling through it. There is nothing wrong with landing in the water as long as nothing is moving too quickly when it hits the water's surface. If you can recover the craft or the parts intact you should get your science back from them. Did you actually use the experiments out in space or near the moon?

    I did, yeah. High Mun orbit and low Mun orbit. 75 science each, lost at sea :(

    What happens is I land in the water and they snap off and sink to the bottom. Then when I recovered no science recovery message came up, it just removed it from the map. If I was on land it'd be fine, i've got those little leg thingies. Those snap off in the water too, though. Only the module seems to float.

    At least I had the goo containers and crew/eva reports so it wasn't a total loss.

    Plus I actually made it to the goddamn Mun.

    Add some radial parachutes to your Science Jr and that will fix the problem. (The problem being that in Vanilla KSP the joints are incredibly weak and things fall off too easily).

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    MWO: Adamski
  • ShogunShogun Hair long; money long; me and broke wizards we don't get along Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Shogun wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    Mun orbit and safe return!

    Then I landed in the damn ocean and lost my Science Jrs.

    did they explode or just fall off in the water? If they fell in the water go to the satellite dish tracker thing. Check under the debris field and you might still be able to recover them from the water.

    Aha, yes. There they are, thanks. I didn't get any science from them, but at least I cleaned up the oceans.

    It also happened with my second attempt. I need to figure out how to land where I want to.

    Keep in mind that vanilla Kerbin's atmosphere is actually pretty thick and soupy. Lotta drag as you're traveling through it. There is nothing wrong with landing in the water as long as nothing is moving too quickly when it hits the water's surface. If you can recover the craft or the parts intact you should get your science back from them. Did you actually use the experiments out in space or near the moon?

    I did, yeah. High Mun orbit and low Mun orbit. 75 science each, lost at sea :(

    What happens is I land in the water and they snap off and sink to the bottom. Then when I recovered no science recovery message came up, it just removed it from the map. If I was on land it'd be fine, i've got those little leg thingies. Those snap off in the water too, though. Only the module seems to float.

    At least I had the goo containers and crew/eva reports so it wasn't a total loss.

    Plus I actually made it to the goddamn Mun.

    Are these science jrs hanging off the side? You can remove the data from them after you have performed the experiment with an EVA'd kerbal and then drop the weight if you have radial decouplers.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Yeah there is really no reason to ever bring back anything but the pod.

This discussion has been closed.