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Questions to Cover Before Marriage [LGBT]
nakirush
Registered User regular
Registered User regular
Hi all,
I am a recently engaged gay man and with the wedding approaching, I want to make sure my partner and I go the extra mile to ensure we have a strong foundation to base our marriage on. I remember reading about or seeing a book on essential questions that every couple should discuss before the big day, but I can't seem to find it anywhere. Ideally it would be great if it was formatted in such a way that we could cover a topic every couple of days over dinner. It would be even better if it was specifically targeted for gay or LGBT couples.
Help appreciated!
Thanks!
I am a recently engaged gay man and with the wedding approaching, I want to make sure my partner and I go the extra mile to ensure we have a strong foundation to base our marriage on. I remember reading about or seeing a book on essential questions that every couple should discuss before the big day, but I can't seem to find it anywhere. Ideally it would be great if it was formatted in such a way that we could cover a topic every couple of days over dinner. It would be even better if it was specifically targeted for gay or LGBT couples.
Help appreciated!
Thanks!
0
Posts
FINANCIAL PLANNING - debt amounts for both of you, investments, retirement etc. etc. - Make sure you're both on the same page as to how it will work and how it's split
Life Goals - Does someone want to go back to school? What's your 5 year plan? 10? 20?
Kids - Do you want them?
This is some of the basics. There's also general relationship things around what is and isn't acceptable behavior or speech and how you should handle disagreements, but it really depends on the couple.
With that said, there are a few big issues that any couple considering marriage needs to consider.
1) Do you want to have/adopt children? This is one of the biggest questions, and if the two of you are not in agreement now this can cause your marriage to fall apart down the road if both of you are still at odds.
2) Are the two of you comfortable with the amount of influence (or lack thereof) each person's family has on your life? Again, talk this out because it's better to figure this out now then to steadily learn over the next couple of years that the opinions of your significant other's parents are more important than your opinions.
Examples:
Debt - how to split income and bills and how to give the couple spending money, as well as the individual. Do you each hold a separate account and pay into a joint account for bills and future spending (like a house) or do you pool it all together and pay out to each person to spend a month? Or neither?
Kids - little things like "if we have a girl, do we pierce her ears or wait until she's older?" or "if we have a boy, do we get circumcision" are stuff large fights get caused over nowadays. How many do you have? Do you adopt or try to find a way to have a biological kid with sperm donation and a friend?
Religion - I assume at this point religion would be something agreed upon by both parties. Though if you have a child, would you practice or not? Or would it just be for special occassionas? What about none at all?
None of which answers your question about the book you remember. Sorry. Please do get a book, or at least download a few online, because they all include stuff I would never have thought of. (What part of your family income should be given to to charity? What would you consider grounds for divorce?)
I'm a firm believer in the pre-nup and in all honesty if that's not something you can sit down and talk seriously about, then you probably aren't really ready to be married.
"The Hard Questions: 100 Essential Questions to Ask Before You Say "I Do" "
http://www.amazon.com/dp/1585420042/?tag=tangomagcom-20
We've been very straightforward with talking about religion, kids, and money since the beginning so I feel very comfortable with that aspect of our relationship. Communication has always been open and respectful. There is nothing in my mind that makes me doubt our decision or match, but am more curious to go through this book to find anything we may not have thought of before.
As far as significant items unique to our relationship that may give you some insight or other areas to consider:
I would wonder if he is okay with being with a closeted person, but I assume you've talked about that a bunch. I'm not really convinced that that won't come to a head at some point, so I'd probably try to air that as much as possible, since you're going to be making a family together. How are you going to explain those grandbabies to your parents? You are going to be putting the both of you through some real challenges on that, so you really need to make sure you're a unified front on that. It might be obvious that I don't think this is going to work with remaining closeted at all, but if you're gonna try, he is going to have to have absolutely no qualms about it, and I find that hard to envision.
Oh yeah, that brings up a few additional issues.
You say you are getting married, and just to confirm, you are in a state that authorizes a marriage between any consenting adults, right? If so (and I assume so) that makes the following much easier because as the spouse you automatically get a say in most issues (but not all, check with a lawyer (not me) regarding things like power of attorney should one of you become incapacitated).
1) Figure out end of life concerns. The age gap between the two of you means that this is an issue that needs to be addressed, and there isn't always a guarantee that being married will shield you from family interference in these decisions (just look at the Terri Schiavo debacle).
2) Get that will drafted, witnessed and notarized. Now.
@Djeet and @DoctorArch - Great insight, thank you! We are in California, so it will be a legally recognized marriage. We are in the process of re-writing our wills. A pre-nup will, of course, be in the mix. As for retirement, we are shooting for ten years and should be able to both comfortably retire at that point or be in a position where I can continue working for myself with a flexible work schedule. We travel quite often as it is and plan to continue to do so as it is something important to both of us.
I think I would be, like, double-disowned if I kept a grandchild secret from my parents, but hey, families are different. (Edited to add: I'm not shocked if you prefer to keep your theoretical future child away from your lesbian-daughter-disowning parents.)
They're going to visit. Or they're going to want to visit and will demand a reason why they can't.
Is your husband actually going to pretend while they're there that he's what, a neighbor? Roommate? Always out of town?
How's that going to look to your kids? They won't notice it while they're toddlers, but a few years they'll pick it up on it pretty quickly that hey - one of our daddies doesn't want to be a daddy when the grandparents are here, or they'll pick up on the message you've said here "lying to people is okay if we get money out of it", is that a message you want to instill in them? Because that's the message they'll pick up.
It's also not unheard of for grandparents to move to be closer to their grandkids, what do you do if that happens?
If you are planning on trying to keep your parents from knowing you have kids or a husband, what happens if they call and either your hubby or, more telling, your kids answer the phone? What are you going to do when your kids will hear you tell your grandparents that they're just some visiting kid, and aren't really yours?
I could see keeping it a secret maybe working in a soap opera or romcom, but in real life, they're likely going to want to be involved in your kids lives and by extension be more involved in yours, or they're going to find out you were hiding it and demand to know why.
Planning on having kids, even getting married, and still staying in their will by the parameters you've described does not sound realistic.
Looking at another issue:
You're aiming at a retirement in 10 years.
Okay, what about your kids? By your timeline they're going to be around 5-8 years old at that time. Guess you're going to be retiring but aren't going to be doing any real travelling by yourselves for another 10-13ish years after retirement?
What about if your kids aren't ready to be on their own by 18? What happens then?
You may not be able to actually travel for more than a week, mayyybe two by yourselves for the retirement until your husband is in his late sixties, early seventies? Is that okay with him?
I just get the impression that while you two have sorted out your finances pretty well, you really really haven't considered how children will affect the lifestyles you've become accustomed to.
Also, that's quite an early retirement for you, if you're planning on having a child. The child will be very young when you and your partner have retired, and will you be be able to live a comfortable life style with no income?
I also second the question about traveling. Age does catch up quickly, and being on the go doesn't not bode well on an aging body.
This last piece depends on the state. Marriage benefits will not always apply to same sex marriages/unions, example health coverage from a job. Depending on the state, there are also additional taxes that will need to be paid and filed. I'm not saying, don't get married, but be prepared for additional expenses that may come up.
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I wish you luck. Learning to live with another person, even one you love, is extremely difficult. You will be happier for it, but like all things of value love requires work.
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If he doesn't, and you do get divorced, I'm guessing that he would have no legal obligation to take care of the child, you mentioned pre-nup, but this is another thing entirely, making sure he's legally obligated to take care of the child as well.
If you are "not that close" to the point where likely they'll live the rest of their lives without knowing you're married, there's a good chance you aren't making the final draft of the will anyway.
Ignoring the grandparent-grandchild relationshippy stuff, one issue that does not appear to have been considered by the OP is this bit here.
When kids are the in the picture, it's less about you and coming out and more about the impact not coming out has on them. And they may not even take away a message as specific as "lying is okay if we get money out of it" (though they might). The message that they are more likely to take away are: it's okay to lie to your parents, and there's something wrong with being gay.
As an adult, you get to pick and choose what your parents know and don't. But for a kid, these are examples that if set from young, WILL bite you in the ass when they become teenagers.
How, for example, do you teach your kids healthy assertiveness when you haven't even modeled it for them within the bounds of your own family? Or teaching them that it's okay to be themselves?
I'm aware you have perfectly good reasons not to come out now, and coming out is different for everyone. But once kids are in the picture, the parameters shift. It's now being aware that your kids will learn from the examples you set more than they will learn from the words you choose.
Is a will worth risking this?
Beside talking about the big things as @bowen stated, I really feel the best way to ensure a strong foundation is to live together before the marriage.
It will give you a chance to deal with the issues newlyweds bicker about before your married.
I am not seeing how you and your future husband will manage having children while you are still not out to your family. Are you going to keep your children a secret from your parents?
If your children have a relationship with your parents they will "out you" when they talk about their home life and having two dads. What @Vivixenne is right on the money, hiding your orientation from your children might make them think that it is shameful to be gay. Kids even at a young age are more perceptive and sensitive then we give them credit for. You need to do everything you can to raise strong, confident children because they may deal with teasing and bullying for having gay parents.
It sounds like you parents are unsupportive, I am sorry to hear that. If you did decide to come out to them, they might come around later when you guys have kids. In a best case scenario coming out to them might also make them reevaluate their relationship with your sister that they have cut ties with.
I have some pretty terrible family members as well, I've never had to deal with homophobia directly (though they are quite homophobic) but I have had to deal with racism. I have cut quite a few people out of my life because I don't want to pretend to be someone I'm not to avoid conflict. I feel that I am a good person, I have little to be ashamed of, but best of all I don't care what people who don't really love/respect me think of me. I learned to have confidence like this from my mother, who cut her (also wealthy) abusive parents out of her life when I was a child.
Before you have children please think about how they will view you pretending to be someone you are not, how will it affect them?
I'm sorry that you even have to deal with hiding something so central to your identity at all. It is completely unfair to have parents who think they can hold their love hostage.
I wish you and your fiancé a lifetime of happiness together, best of luck!
The advice about coming out with a child in the picture is definitely food for thought and I will be bringing it up with my fiance. I completely agree with what has been said here about role-modeling good behaviors for our child. At this point it is just a matter of timing. Personally, I would rather do it after we are married and I am out of school. I know it will be a big fit of drama and will put me in a bad place that I don't want to deal with between our wedding planning and full time student work.
My partner and I have been living together for three months. The only issues we've had come down to our own little OCD ticks and we've learned to work with each other on those. I can happily say that we are both very good at communicating our needs and expectations and talking them out together.