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[Internet Policy] - Restricting the series of tubes

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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    discrider wrote: »
    What we need is for universities to set up some kind of private network for the fast transmission of scientific data and research.

    They did, Internet2 is not for us plebs though

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    EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    We in academia like to call it the Winternet

    Because its full of win and its currently winter

    Soon it will be called the Springnet because its just a series of slinkeys

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Comcast acted immediately yesterday to change things, expect shenanigans if you are one of their customers.

    Jon Henshaw is a tech analyst.

    For those who can't see the embed, after the FCC did its thing yesterday Comcast immediately removed lines from its Net Neutrality page. Basically everything that describes what Net Neutrality is. Their PR department put out a statement that I haven't bothered to look up because the fact of the matter is Comcast lobbied for this shit.

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    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    On the bright side, the value of my old CD and DVD collection is looking to increase. I doubt the glorious digital only future is going to fare well in the face of unbridled greed from America’s cable companies.

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    Caulk Bite 6Caulk Bite 6 One of the multitude of Dans infesting this place Registered User regular
    On the bright side, the value of my old CD and DVD collection is looking to increase. I doubt the glorious digital only future is going to fare well in the face of unbridled greed from America’s cable companies.

    Yeah, I've not been too trusting of the whole digital only thing for a while.

    jnij103vqi2i.png
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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    On the bright side, the value of my old CD and DVD collection is looking to increase. I doubt the glorious digital only future is going to fare well in the face of unbridled greed from America’s cable companies.

    Yeah, I've not been too trusting of the whole digital only thing for a while.

    I eagerly await the daily Penny Arcade Forums telegraph digest.

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    DedwrekkaDedwrekka Metal Hell adjacentRegistered User regular
    Can states make their own ISPs? Instead of being bound to the private companies to do their terrible work? Like, I know some cities have their own. Can a state lay its own fiber optic network and connect everyone to the internet that way? That way they can make and follow their own net neutrality rules?

    It's important to point out that a lot of the cable laid is laid under either direct contract by the states and by the federal government or in exchange for tax breaks.

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    ApogeeApogee Lancks In Every Game Ever Registered User regular
    edited December 2017
    hippofant wrote: »
    On the bright side, the value of my old CD and DVD collection is looking to increase. I doubt the glorious digital only future is going to fare well in the face of unbridled greed from America’s cable companies.

    Yeah, I've not been too trusting of the whole digital only thing for a while.

    I eagerly await the daily Penny Arcade Forums telegraph digest.

    Dear Gabe & Tycho STOP
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    Apogee on
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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Apogee wrote: »
    hippofant wrote: »
    On the bright side, the value of my old CD and DVD collection is looking to increase. I doubt the glorious digital only future is going to fare well in the face of unbridled greed from America’s cable companies.

    Yeah, I've not been too trusting of the whole digital only thing for a while.

    I eagerly await the daily Penny Arcade Forums telegraph digest.

    Dear Gabe & Tycho STOP
    You are very great. 100,000 pesos. Come to Santa Poco put on show, STOP
    The In-famous El Guapo.

    Awesome stop
    Knight

    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited December 2017
    Cocks stop
    Dicks stop
    lol stop

    But seriously, this needs to be an issue, and while I am pointedly *not* calling for accelerationism, any bullshit the ISPs pull will just make it that much easier to point at and say "that fuckmuppetry is why we need to be in power, to get things back to sanity, rather than your $5 Netflix SuperPack surcharge".

    Forar on
    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
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    ButtcleftButtcleft Registered User regular
    Forar wrote: »
    Cocks stop
    Dicks stop
    lol stop

    But seriously, this needs to be an issue, and while I am pointedly *not* calling for accelerationism, any bullshit the ISPs pull will just make it that much easier to point at and say "that fuckmuppetry is why we need to be in power, to get things back to sanity, rather than your $5 Netflix SuperPack surcharge".

    they wont do anything for at least 6 months to let the shit die down if they have a modicum of intelligence anywhere.

    then it'll be a slow ramp up over like the next year afterwards.

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    tbloxhamtbloxham Registered User regular
    Buttcleft wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Cocks stop
    Dicks stop
    lol stop

    But seriously, this needs to be an issue, and while I am pointedly *not* calling for accelerationism, any bullshit the ISPs pull will just make it that much easier to point at and say "that fuckmuppetry is why we need to be in power, to get things back to sanity, rather than your $5 Netflix SuperPack surcharge".

    they wont do anything for at least 6 months to let the shit die down if they have a modicum of intelligence anywhere.

    then it'll be a slow ramp up over like the next year afterwards.

    I said earlier that I expect they will go after the 'provider' side first, to let themselves get the profits and make the additional costs you'll start to see confusing. For example, if they go bill google then what will google do? Put on more commercials or something. Will you really notice immediately other than its a bit more shitty?

    "That is cool" - Abraham Lincoln
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    KhavallKhavall British ColumbiaRegistered User regular
    Yeah, it's not going to be the case where tomorrow Comcast will announce that access to google will cost an extra $5/search.

    It's going to be like what Telus did in Vancouver recently that basically ended with my internet bill being $15/mo extra for what I was already getting, by making tiny incremental changes right up until the big one.


    In fact, if the telecoms are smart about it, they'll basically do the following:
    Step 1: Exclude certain sites from data caps while low-key extorting the companies themselves. Customers rejoice! This is what they tried to tell you they wanted to do! It's just better for you!
    Step 2: Begin adding/lowering data caps, but don't actually enforce them. Just send an email or have a monitoring that says "Hey you've used 20GB of non-facebook data!"
    Step 3: Slash prices across the board, but add "fast-lane" packages, that include the sites that they also happen to be extorting on the back end. ALSO lower data caps some more, but hey, the fast-lane sites are unlimited, and we don't care if you go over still! Again, this is just what they said was the point of getting rid of net neutrality! Geez you people who panicked!

    Now about 6-9 months have passed at this point, maybe more. All the fears are going away, people are starting to understand the new way the internet works.

    Wait another 3 months or so, continue extorting companies, because, well, why not. Get people really good and used to their new packages with fast-lanes and low data caps, get them locked into multi-year contracts, that sort of thing.

    Step 4: Start enforcing data caps. You go over your 100GB/mo of internet? Well, you can upgrade your package, which includes more data, or you can pay an extra $25/mo for no data cap(putting you exactly where you were a year ago except with $25/month tacked on to your bill for no reason). AND/OR just get the $10/mo fast lane unlimited packages that you use! Of course, these packages will coincidentally not overlap in great ways. Maybe there's "Internet essentials" with facebook, twitter, google, email. Then there's "Socialite" with instagram, twitter, snapchat. Then maybe "Internet personalities" with Youtube, Twitch. Oh that's different than "Movies and TV" with Netflix and Hulu.

    So a year after NN repeal, you're now paying like $25-50/month extra on exactly what you were getting before except maybe instead of incremental increases in speed with technology, now you're only getting those speed increases on the stuff you're paying for. But it was improvements, or at the very least bad stuff that nobody really cares about. It was getting better right until suddenly it collapsed, but by that point everyone's in too deep to care that much.

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    KrieghundKrieghund Registered User regular
    Just curious here. How much money does Google have on hand? Compared to Comcast, say. How could Google indirectly or even directly screw with Comcast if they decided to? Like hostile takeover attempt that costs a ton of money for Comcast to defend against as making a point to not screw with Google?

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    38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    Telecoms aren't smart though, they are greedy. They are already in a monopoly. They didn't spend all this lobbying money to sit around and not take advantage. The shareholders wouldn't like that. See that Comcast post above.

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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Krieghund wrote: »
    Just curious here. How much money does Google have on hand? Compared to Comcast, say. How could Google indirectly or even directly screw with Comcast if they decided to? Like hostile takeover attempt that costs a ton of money for Comcast to defend against as making a point to not screw with Google?

    doesn't matter because google loves this.

    google was already fairly locked in, but a relatively small fee for making them more or less immune to start up competition for all time? that's value.

    do no evil was always a lie.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    DacDac Registered User regular
    Buttcleft wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Cocks stop
    Dicks stop
    lol stop

    But seriously, this needs to be an issue, and while I am pointedly *not* calling for accelerationism, any bullshit the ISPs pull will just make it that much easier to point at and say "that fuckmuppetry is why we need to be in power, to get things back to sanity, rather than your $5 Netflix SuperPack surcharge".

    they wont do anything for at least 6 months to let the shit die down if they have a modicum of intelligence anywhere.

    then it'll be a slow ramp up over like the next year afterwards.

    See: microtransactions in gaming and how that was ramped up over a decade.

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    MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    Dac wrote: »
    Buttcleft wrote: »
    Forar wrote: »
    Cocks stop
    Dicks stop
    lol stop

    But seriously, this needs to be an issue, and while I am pointedly *not* calling for accelerationism, any bullshit the ISPs pull will just make it that much easier to point at and say "that fuckmuppetry is why we need to be in power, to get things back to sanity, rather than your $5 Netflix SuperPack surcharge".

    they wont do anything for at least 6 months to let the shit die down if they have a modicum of intelligence anywhere.

    then it'll be a slow ramp up over like the next year afterwards.

    See: microtransactions in gaming and how that was ramped up over a decade.
    I saw this elsewhere. It's apparently one of Slovenia's ISP's "non-net-neutrality" packages.

    https://i.kinja-img.com/gawker-media/image/upload/c_fit,fl_progressive,q_80,w_636/fqgickisipsd5ssnockq.png

    It's pretty f'n egregious. And as you said, it'll start out small, and build up.

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    Mr KhanMr Khan Not Everyone WAHHHRegistered User regular
    Krieghund wrote: »
    Just curious here. How much money does Google have on hand? Compared to Comcast, say. How could Google indirectly or even directly screw with Comcast if they decided to? Like hostile takeover attempt that costs a ton of money for Comcast to defend against as making a point to not screw with Google?

    Comcast's terrestrial business is an albatross for a company like Google. Google Fiber is odd enough on its own, through it you balloon the size of the company and incur massive and ongoing infrastructural costs.

    Obviously somebody's got to lay the lines, but Silicon Valley is going to stay well away from that.

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    iTunesIsEviliTunesIsEvil Cornfield? Cornfield.Registered User regular
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Krieghund wrote: »
    Just curious here. How much money does Google have on hand? Compared to Comcast, say. How could Google indirectly or even directly screw with Comcast if they decided to? Like hostile takeover attempt that costs a ton of money for Comcast to defend against as making a point to not screw with Google?

    doesn't matter because google loves this.

    google was already fairly locked in, but a relatively small fee for making them more or less immune to start up competition for all time? that's value.

    do no evil was always a lie.

    Ehhhhh, kinda, sorta, maybe?

    The bolded I have no trouble believing, but I'm not sure Google's gonna "love" this. Google displays a user's search-results, user clicks a result, said result/site doesn't work the way user wants, user says "well clearly Google gave me a shitty result!"

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    SpaffySpaffy Fuck the Zero Registered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    It ignores the fact the net neutrality rules were put in place because providers started selectively throttling websites. They were put in place as a reaction to something that was being done.


    Also, the fact that a US Sentaor (even if it is Ted Cruz, a man hated by his own party) is using the word "snowflake" makes me weep for the level of discourse in this country.

    Where can I read more about this?

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Telecoms have been avoiding building and upgrading infrastructure they've promised to have finished with years ago.

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    LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    Spaffy wrote: »
    LostNinja wrote: »
    It ignores the fact the net neutrality rules were put in place because providers started selectively throttling websites. They were put in place as a reaction to something that was being done.


    Also, the fact that a US Sentaor (even if it is Ted Cruz, a man hated by his own party) is using the word "snowflake" makes me weep for the level of discourse in this country.

    Where can I read more about this?

    There's probably more examples than this, but it's the one I remembered off the top of my head.

    https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/02/netflix-performance-on-verizon-and-comcast-has-been-dropping-for-months/

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    Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    Spaffy wrote: »
    LostNinja wrote: »
    It ignores the fact the net neutrality rules were put in place because providers started selectively throttling websites. They were put in place as a reaction to something that was being done.


    Also, the fact that a US Sentaor (even if it is Ted Cruz, a man hated by his own party) is using the word "snowflake" makes me weep for the level of discourse in this country.

    Where can I read more about this?

    There's probably more examples than this, but it's the one I remembered off the top of my head.

    https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/02/netflix-performance-on-verizon-and-comcast-has-been-dropping-for-months/

    Also https://www.cultofmac.com/210634/att-gives-facetime-over-cellular-back-to-everyone-except-those-with-grandfathered-unlimited-data/

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    PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Mr Khan wrote: »
    Krieghund wrote: »
    Just curious here. How much money does Google have on hand? Compared to Comcast, say. How could Google indirectly or even directly screw with Comcast if they decided to? Like hostile takeover attempt that costs a ton of money for Comcast to defend against as making a point to not screw with Google?

    Comcast's terrestrial business is an albatross for a company like Google. Google Fiber is odd enough on its own, through it you balloon the size of the company and incur massive and ongoing infrastructural costs.

    Obviously somebody's got to lay the lines, but Silicon Valley is going to stay well away from that.

    Google actually owns a ton of fiber links, but yeah running last-mile stuff is way beyond their wheelhouse

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    HenroidHenroid Mexican kicked from Immigration Thread Centrism is Racism :3Registered User regular
    Christ you know what I just thought about?

    Any place you go to that offers free WiFi can get insanely jacked up by the partitioning of the internet.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Donnicton wrote: »
    So if you want to see a video of Ajit Pai being a giant asshole and mocking the internet, here he is.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LFhT6H6pRWg

    You know, just in case you might have thought he still somehow hasn't shown his full contempt for the American people yet.

    Oh, so... uh, followup events about this one.





    Apparently Pai didn't license his use of Harlem Shake from Baauer for his Net Neutrality video. And since the video may count more as an ad than a parody, Baauer is fully intending to bring the legal hammer on him.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    edited December 2017
    And for this weekend's events, we have Mark Hamill tearing into Ajit Pai, Ted Cruz attempting to insult Hamill's intelligence with a Star Wars analogy, and then Mark Hamill calling out Ted Cruz





    Today was a day.

    Donnicton on
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    38thDoe38thDoe lets never be stupid again wait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered User regular
    I can't figure out what analogy Ted Cruz is even trying to make. Vader is giant corps or Vader is the FCC? The previous FCC chair would make the most sense for Vader as far as establishing net neutrality, but I'm lost.

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    mrondeaumrondeau Montréal, CanadaRegistered User regular
    38thDoe wrote: »
    I can't figure out what analogy Ted Cruz is even trying to make. Vader is giant corps or Vader is the FCC? The previous FCC chair would make the most sense for Vader as far as establishing net neutrality, but I'm lost.
    Vader is part of a government, and therefore evil. Net neutrality prevents corporations from doing whatever they want, and therefore evil. No need to think any further than that for Ted Cruz.

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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited December 2017
    38thDoe wrote: »
    I can't figure out what analogy Ted Cruz is even trying to make. Vader is giant corps or Vader is the FCC? The previous FCC chair would make the most sense for Vader as far as establishing net neutrality, but I'm lost.

    That Palpatine used the greed of the Trade Federation to manipulate them into invading Naboo and turn the Galactic Republic into the Sith-ruled Galactic Empire, I assume.


    I'm pretty sure the Jedi didn't have any corporate sponsors.

    hippofant on
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    DedwrekkaDedwrekka Metal Hell adjacentRegistered User regular
    38thDoe wrote: »
    I can't figure out what analogy Ted Cruz is even trying to make. Vader is giant corps or Vader is the FCC? The previous FCC chair would make the most sense for Vader as far as establishing net neutrality, but I'm lost.

    Something something, big government is evil, something something

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    hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    Also, that he's fucking bad at Math

    Alphabet (Google): $167B in total assets
    Netflix: $14B
    Facebook: $65B

    Verizon: $244B
    AT&T: $403B
    Comcast: $181B

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    HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    Dedwrekka wrote: »
    38thDoe wrote: »
    I can't figure out what analogy Ted Cruz is even trying to make. Vader is giant corps or Vader is the FCC? The previous FCC chair would make the most sense for Vader as far as establishing net neutrality, but I'm lost.

    Something something, big government is evil, something something

    Something something Ted Cruz is a dumbass something something

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    silence1186silence1186 Character shields down! As a wingmanRegistered User regular
    Ted Cruz is dumb and bad at metaphors. I don't think there's more to it than that.

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    L Ron HowardL Ron Howard The duck MinnesotaRegistered User regular
    Someone should tell him that Darth Vader and the Internet are two separate things, and Star Wars is a movie and not real life. I can't wrap my head around what he's trying to say.

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    jungleroomxjungleroomx It's never too many graves, it's always not enough shovels Registered User regular
    Ted Cruz is dumb and bad at metaphors. I don't think there's more to it than that.

    Didn't he fuck up green eggs n ham during the ACA?

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Someone should tell him that Darth Vader and the Internet are two separate things, and Star Wars is a movie and not real life. I can't wrap my head around what he's trying to say.

    Darth Vader is big government and Net Neutrality is a power grab by government to rule over the people and that's why big corporations supported it, so Net Neutrality had to go so that.... big corporations... could be more free...

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    LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    Ted Cruz is dumb and bad at metaphors. I don't think there's more to it than that.

    I just don't understand why he is even getting involved publicly. It's hugely unpopular and he doesn't have to actually do anything to get rid of it. Just sit back, relax, and watch Pai take the hit.

    He's taking a political hit for no reason. Is he just afraid that Pai is stealing his reputation as biggest asshole in Washington.

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