Arthas never even became the head of the humans, really, much less the whole Alliance. Also, Arthas wasn't really acting on his own volition. He was a bit...dominated?
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Lord DaveGrief CauserBitch Free ZoneRegistered Userregular
The Alliance sure gets pissy about Garrosh, considering they're the faction of friggin' Arthas
Preeeeeetty sure Arthas wasn't the head of the Alliance when he went on his continent-wide killing spree.
Sure, disown Arthas the moment he starts doing purges and regicides. It's cool, we'll kill him for you like 20 years later because you've been busy dicking around.
Garrosh does a little bit of the same thing, we deal with it ourselves AGAIN, and Doctor Anime Hair is all I WILL END YOU
Well he was King of Lordaeron, before Lordaeron turned to shit. He was technically the leader of the Alliance of Lordaeron (the predecessor to the current Alliance) but he was busy plaguing up Lordaeron to care about it. Then he attacked Quel'Thalas and basically broke the Alliance of Lordaeron.
IIRC the Alliance of Lordaeron was the Seven Kingdoms of humans (Azeroth/Stormwind, Lordaeron, Stromgarde, Kul Tiras, Gilneas, Dalaran, and Alterac), Quel'Thalas, Khaz Modan/Ironforge, Gnomeregan (maybe?), and Tol Barad.
The current Alliance is missing a bunch of the dead human kingdoms, Dalaran (due to its neutrality, though that's changing), Quel'Thalas and Tol Barad. It also added the Night Elves and Draenei.
Are we just goofing around or is this a serious argument?
Alliance aligned Arthas "dies" when he claims Frostmourne and loses his soul. He doesn't serve the interest of the Alliance kingdoms anymore, he serves the Lich King. Death Knight Arthas is aligned with the Scourge. He's the protagonist of the Scourge campaign, he commands Scourge troops, he wields the Scourge banner.
The Alliance had already splintered long before Arthas destroys Lordaeron, after that it's only regional commanders like Jaina or Garithos that claim any kind of authority to act in the name of the Alliance. In fact, there's no centralized leader at all until Varian becomes Supreme Commander during the Pandaria campaign.
Garrosh, on the other hand, is appointed Warchief of the entire Horde, and wields total authority during the Cataclysm and the start of MoP. That is, until he starts waving his dick around and all the non-racist orcs decided that maybe enough's enough. Vol'Jin and the Darkspear rebellion aren't even officially Horde until they depose Garrosh and reclaim the position of Warchief.
Are we just goofing around or is this a serious argument?
Alliance aligned Arthas "dies" when he claims Frostmourne and loses his soul. He doesn't serve the interest of the Alliance kingdoms anymore, he serves the Lich King. Death Knight Arthas is aligned with the Scourge. He's the protagonist of the Scourge campaign, he commands Scourge troops, he wields the Scourge banner.
The Alliance had already splintered long before Arthas destroys Lordaeron, after that it's only regional commanders like Jaina or Garithos that claim any kind of authority to act in the name of the Alliance. In fact, there's no centralized leader at all until Varian becomes Supreme Commander during the Pandaria campaign.
Garrosh, on the other hand, is appointed Warchief of the entire Horde, and wields total authority during the Cataclysm and the start of MoP. That is, until he starts waving his dick around and all the non-racist orcs decided that maybe enough's enough. Vol'Jin and the Darkspear rebellion aren't even officially Horde until they depose Garrosh and reclaim the position of Warchief.
Yeah, our historians will come up with some similar excuse later, they're busy right now though. :rotate:
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Lord DaveGrief CauserBitch Free ZoneRegistered Userregular
The only one who ever liked Garrosh in the first place was Thrall, and the Alliance fuckin' LOVED that guy, so...
Have the writers ever said whether this was where they planned to take Garrosh or not? I always wonder whether they thought he'd be liked as a hardass or get redeemed or something, but instead ended up with the entire fanbase hating him and rolled with it.
It feels to me like they overdid it with Garrosh in WotLK to the point everyone started hating him and then they fucked him up more in Cata so they just said fuck it and made him a full on villain in MoP. I don't think for a second that they planned for him to be a full on villain when they first introduced him in TBC.
Are we just goofing around or is this a serious argument?
Alliance aligned Arthas "dies" when he claims Frostmourne and loses his soul. He doesn't serve the interest of the Alliance kingdoms anymore, he serves the Lich King. Death Knight Arthas is aligned with the Scourge. He's the protagonist of the Scourge campaign, he commands Scourge troops, he wields the Scourge banner.
The Alliance had already splintered long before Arthas destroys Lordaeron, after that it's only regional commanders like Jaina or Garithos that claim any kind of authority to act in the name of the Alliance. In fact, there's no centralized leader at all until Varian becomes Supreme Commander during the Pandaria campaign.
Garrosh, on the other hand, is appointed Warchief of the entire Horde, and wields total authority during the Cataclysm and the start of MoP. That is, until he starts waving his dick around and all the non-racist orcs decided that maybe enough's enough. Vol'Jin and the Darkspear rebellion aren't even officially Horde until they depose Garrosh and reclaim the position of Warchief.
Yeah, our historians will come up with some similar excuse later, they're busy right now though. :rotate:
Yes, let me know when Horde historians re-discover how to rub two sticks together to make fire.
Garrosh wan Varien were basically Blizzard's way of reigniting the "Horde/Alliance are seriously at war you guys" aspect of the story that was previously getting kinda dumb in the wake of Black Dragons and the Scourge and Old God's and the Burning Legion. Except nobody like Garrosh or Varien. They toned Varien down, and I suspect they would have done the same to Garrosh if people didn't already dislike him for replacing Thrall and killing Cairne. Varien didn't really have a beloved predecessor. (Though I mostly played Horde; maybe Bolvar was really well liked?)
Bolvar was kind of a nobody. He was liked a little because of that one quest where he wrecks a bunch of black dragons in the Stormwind throne room, but otherwise I don't think people really cared about him. When he turned up at the Wrathgate, I was kinda like "Oh so that's where he went after Varian came back".
To me, Garrosh was a case of the awful idea that there needs to this fucking "War in Warcraft" bullshit that annoys the hell out of me. All of Cata was about rising up against a higher power that threatened to literally destroy the world (Deathwing and his followers) and they spent so much of it focusing on this fucking Horde vs Alliance bullshit that was badly shoehorned in because they felt that characters acting rationally was a dumb thing to do.
Wrathgate was Putress, but Garrosh damn near doomed the planet when he pissed off the Alliance and both factions refused to help out in Ulduar. This is also partly due to King Chin's stubbornness too.
Then there was the giant airship fight outside of the citadel of the one of the biggest baddies in the world. And the little spat both factions had in the tournament.
Basically both factions are retarded for ever fighting in the circumstances that turn up. The Horde moreso whenever Garrosh was in charge.
Speaking of Putress, I only recently quested enough in Dragonblight to get to that cutscene with Putress (working on Loremaster), and I was pretty bummed that I missed my chance to follow up on that questline.
Yeah, the fact that they removed the Battle for the Undercity fight was dumb. It was also a point where a lot of people were all "What the fuck is up with this king dude being all pissy?"
Oh, some stuff happened with him outside of the game.
As a guy who actually followed the very early issues of the WoW comics, all about Varian smoldering with his generic rage, I would have LOVED to play that story out to its fullest.
Alas.
I actually still have a bunch of those issues, too!
Yeah, the fact that they removed the Battle for the Undercity fight was dumb. It was also a point where a lot of people were all "What the fuck is up with this king dude being all pissy?"
Oh, some stuff happened with him outside of the game.
Wow, they removed that? That was a pretty cool thing.
I just, I just want something for the knights of the ebon blade. like anything. Really Sylvanas is like lich king 2.0 almost and us deathknights are like yeah what ever.
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Preeeeeetty sure Arthas wasn't the head of the Alliance when he went on his continent-wide killing spree.
Sure, disown Arthas the moment he starts doing purges and regicides. It's cool, we'll kill him for you like 20 years later because you've been busy dicking around.
Garrosh does a little bit of the same thing, we deal with it ourselves AGAIN, and Doctor Anime Hair is all I WILL END YOU
He was one step removed though!
And technically he was for like a second after he killed daddy dearest
IIRC the Alliance of Lordaeron was the Seven Kingdoms of humans (Azeroth/Stormwind, Lordaeron, Stromgarde, Kul Tiras, Gilneas, Dalaran, and Alterac), Quel'Thalas, Khaz Modan/Ironforge, Gnomeregan (maybe?), and Tol Barad.
The current Alliance is missing a bunch of the dead human kingdoms, Dalaran (due to its neutrality, though that's changing), Quel'Thalas and Tol Barad. It also added the Night Elves and Draenei.
Alliance aligned Arthas "dies" when he claims Frostmourne and loses his soul. He doesn't serve the interest of the Alliance kingdoms anymore, he serves the Lich King. Death Knight Arthas is aligned with the Scourge. He's the protagonist of the Scourge campaign, he commands Scourge troops, he wields the Scourge banner.
The Alliance had already splintered long before Arthas destroys Lordaeron, after that it's only regional commanders like Jaina or Garithos that claim any kind of authority to act in the name of the Alliance. In fact, there's no centralized leader at all until Varian becomes Supreme Commander during the Pandaria campaign.
Garrosh, on the other hand, is appointed Warchief of the entire Horde, and wields total authority during the Cataclysm and the start of MoP. That is, until he starts waving his dick around and all the non-racist orcs decided that maybe enough's enough. Vol'Jin and the Darkspear rebellion aren't even officially Horde until they depose Garrosh and reclaim the position of Warchief.
art has the end of us all in its sights
We could give it a shot again if cool dudes show up
And then some Alliance dingus will yell at us like we didn't just solve the problem ourselves
Where my dragons at
Plus, tired
Yeah, our historians will come up with some similar excuse later, they're busy right now though. :rotate:
Yes, let me know when Horde historians re-discover how to rub two sticks together to make fire.
To me, Garrosh was a case of the awful idea that there needs to this fucking "War in Warcraft" bullshit that annoys the hell out of me. All of Cata was about rising up against a higher power that threatened to literally destroy the world (Deathwing and his followers) and they spent so much of it focusing on this fucking Horde vs Alliance bullshit that was badly shoehorned in because they felt that characters acting rationally was a dumb thing to do.
Dude was bloodthirsty as fuck, even before Wrath began.
Because he was the son of his best friend evar and he hoped that the responsibility and faith put in him would help straighten him out.
Then there was the giant airship fight outside of the citadel of the one of the biggest baddies in the world. And the little spat both factions had in the tournament.
Basically both factions are retarded for ever fighting in the circumstances that turn up. The Horde moreso whenever Garrosh was in charge.
Oh, some stuff happened with him outside of the game.
Alas.
I actually still have a bunch of those issues, too!
Wow, they removed that? That was a pretty cool thing.